Return to Transcripts main page


Trump to Meet with British PM; Trump on Torture Tactics; Trump's Refugee Ban; Interview with Gold Star Father Khizr Khan; Adding Iron to Your Diet; Remembering Mary Tyler Moore. Aired 8:30-9a ET

Aired January 26, 2017 - 08:30   ET



[08:30:18] CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: President Donald Trump bringing back a familiar message from his campaign, talking about what he would have done in Iraq. Listen.


DAVID MUIR, ABC NEWS: You brought up Iraq, and something you said that could affect American troops in recent days. You said, "we should have kept the oil, but, OK, maybe we'll have another chance." What did you mean by that?

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Well, we should have kept the oil when we got out. And, you know, it's very interesting. Had we taken the oil, you wouldn't have ISIS, because they fueled themselves with the oil. That's where they got the money.

MUIR: So you believe we can go in and take the oil?

TRUMP: We should have taken the oil. You wouldn't have ISIS if we took the oil.


CUOMO: The question isn't whether he believes it, the question is why he believes he should break international law, because that's what taking the oil would amount to.

So, how are these comments playing to an international stage? Here to give us "The Bottom Line" is CNN's chief international correspondent Christiane Amanpour.

You are here, obviously, for the big event. The U.K. prime minister here today addressing the GOP in Philadelphia. Tomorrow she meets with the president. What will be on the table?

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know, she was going to come to try to, a, bolster the special relationship, have that feather in her cap, being the first foreign leader to actually meet with the president, and try to bolster her hand in Brexit negotiations with the promise from the president to give a speedy and great new fair trade deal with the U.K. But, she's also, obviously, going to have to deal with the fallout from the comments that President Trump made in his interview last night, particularly torture. The Brits have already said and they've said over and over again we do not approve, we do not commit those kinds of inhumane actions. And, besides, it doesn't work. Black sites, that's causing a huge amount of, you know, upheaval around the rest of the world as well. People don't like it.

And just remember, cast your mind back to the early 2000s where this was routine under the Bush administration and what it did for America's relations with the rest of the world. It put them right down into the gutter. And it took a long time to bring those relations back out. So this is sort of, we've been there before, but we don't want to go there again.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: Let's talk about that. What has the fallout been from President Trump's words about, yes, that he thinks that waterboarding is effective. Some people that he's spoken to believe that it's effective and he may want to bring it back?

AMANPOUR: Well, see, I think you discussed that earlier, that, you know, it depends on who he's talking to when maybe. I don't know what goes into his thinking. But what I do know is that he did say, and General Jim Mattis is a very upstanding, experienced marine commandant who's now the defense secretary and he explained in chapter and verse that actually, when you want important information, it is better to try to be the guy's best friend. You have to do it, as he said, with cigarettes and beer.

But I also talked to General Petraeus, who's had, as he told me, more enemy combatants under his capture in Iraq and Afghanistan than any commander in American history. And chapter and verse he told me that this torture, a, it's immoral, but, b, it doesn't work. And even if it works in a teeny, weenie little way, it is not enough to get the kind of value you need from detainees, and it is not enough to bear the cost of the damage it does to American upstanding moral values. But even on the ground, to the kind of blowback it could have to American troops and the other American citizens around the world. It is just not worth, they have discovered, the actual pain of committing that kind of illegal action.

But he did say, and this is important, that one day politicians will have to revisit the idea of an, you know, an hour, there's a ticking time bomb, something's going to happen, you've got the guy.

CUOMO: What will you do?

AMANPOUR: That is a different political conversation. It's not about capturing, you know, detainees, putting them in Guantanamo and then trying to get what you can out of them.

CUOMO: The role of NATO in the discussion.


CUOMO: John McCain, obviously the senator from Arizona, provided as context perhaps for this coming meeting that we have to remember that NATO's, you know, article triggering community action has only been used since 9/11 to help the United States.


CUOMO: That these people went and sacrificed their blood and treasure for us. NATO matters.

AMANPOUR: Exactly right. And again, I think the people of the United States need to understand that NATO is not some, you know, American- led sugar daddy, right? It is America performs a lot of the heavy lifting, and it is absolutely true that the other companies must step up and pay their required contribution to NATO. Absolutely true. And actually other countries are beginning to realize that they've got to do that. That's the good thing. And that's the good threat that they need to know.

But NATO is not just a transactional mercantile alliance. It is about decades of building the kind of diplomacy, the kind of, you know, shared values, shared sort of diplomatic desires and war and peace in the rest of the world with their alliances. So it's incredibly difficult to get that kind of fantastic alliance, and it's incredibly important to try to keep it.

[08:35:05] And, you know, the president used the word "obsolete," and I think he meant because he felt that it didn't fight terrorism. But as you've just pointed out, of course it does, having invoked its only -- only invoked its Article 5, one for all and all for one, after 9/11, for the United States, not for one of the European countries, it was for the United States. And NATO soldiers bled or died for the United States. And so they have been fighting terrorism, al Qaeda, ISIS, all the others in, you know, in places like Afghanistan, Iraq and where all the countries are deployed. So that's really an important fact.

CAMEROTA: Christiane, great to talk to you. Thanks so much for being here and previewing everything. It will be very interesting to see what happens when Theresa May and the president meet.

AMANPOUR: Those are going to be very important on her list, yes.

CAMEROTA: Absolutely. Thank you.

AMANPOUR: Yes, thank you.

CUOMO: It's like having a charming encyclopedia in your midst when you visit us.

AMANPOUR: Awe, well happy to be here.

CAMEROTA: Fantastic. Come back any time.

All right, Khizr Khan, as you'll remember, held up his Constitution in protest of Mr. Trump's proposed Muslim ban. That was at the Democratic National Convention. Now President Trump has a plan to ban refugees. So this gold star father will join us live, next. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)


TRUMP: You know, it's like the Muslim ban, but it's countries that have tremendous terror, and it's countries that people are going to come in and cause us tremendous problems. Our country has enough problems without allowing people to come in who, in many cases or in some cases, are looking the do tremendous destruction. You look at what's happened --

[08:40:09] MUIR: Which countries are we talking about?

TRUMP: I have a whole list. You'll be very thrilled.


CAMEROTA: That's President Trump explaining his executive order to temporarily ban refugees, the one that he wants to sign. The draft of it has been obtained by CNN. It shows that President Trump is considering a ban on refugees trying to enter the U.S. for up to four months. There will also be a 30-day ban on individuals traveling from these, on your screen, quote, "terror prone countries."

Let's discuss this with Khizr Khan. He, of course, is the gold star father of fallen U.S. Army Captain Khan.

Mr. Kahn, thank you very much for being here with us. What did you think when you heard of Mr. Trump's new plan to ban people coming in from his so-called terror-prone countries?

KHIZR KHAN, GOLD STAR FATHER: Alisyn, I am saddened to hear of this. We were hoping that this xenophobic rhetoric will end with campaign, but it has continued because this administration has surrounded itself with the people that are utterly racist and xenophobic.

Let me explain briefly to you that the vetting process that is in place for -- from refugees from war-torn Syria. You ask any intelligence policy leader, they will tell you that it has worked very well in favor of the United States and for its safety and security. So to tell us that this vetting process needs to be changed now is misleading. Banning Muslims from certain countries is a pretext to Muslim ban, which is against the immigration policy of this country which says that no person will be banned entering this country because of their religious faith.


KHAN: In addition to that, millions of Muslims that live in this country are so disheartened and feel alienated. We are the first defense. Two previous administrations, President Bush, President Obama and their administrations have worked with Muslims in the United States to deter, to prevent terrorism, home grown terrorism.

CAMEROTA: Yes. KHAN: How is Trump going to deal with that with this alienation that his statements that this -- this one-week-old government by anecdotes, by wrong anecdotes, anecdotes that work against the safety and security of the United States. I am concerned. I am concerned on behalf of America, on behalf of my country, on behalf of my Constitution, and the values of this Constitution. Every step that Trump has taken thus far is at best anecdotal, at best doesn't work the way he had propagated, the way he had campaigned.

CAMEROTA: I hear you, Mr. Khan, and I do want to talk to you about the morale of Muslims here in this country and beyond and what it does to have your president talk about these things. He was asked about what effect he thought that this would have on Muslims around the world. Let me play for you what he told ABC.


MUIR: Are you at all concerned it's going to cause more anger among Muslims around the world?

TRUMP: Anger? There's plenty of anger right now. How can you have more?

MUIR: You don't think it will exacerbate the problem?

TRUMP: Look, David, David, I mean I know you're a sophisticated guy. The world is a mess. The world is as angry as it gets. Well, you think this is going to cause a little more anger? The world is an angry place.


CAMEROTA: Mr. Khan, what do you say to his reasoning there?

KHAN: Alisyn, listen to the rhetoric. Listen to what it will do. Instead of reducing that anger, instead of thoughtfully, instead of patriotically in favor of America, reducing that anger within the United States and outside the United States, this executive order, this -- these executive orders and this rhetoric further endangers my country, endangers the safety of my country. I do not know how to reach Trump, how to convince him that he needs to be thoughtfully thinking, resolving. The election is over. This rhetoric -- xenophobic rhetoric should be put behind. We should thoughtfully be dealing with the security issue, the safety issue of my country. And Muslims are at the front line. Patriotic Muslims within the United States feel alienated. And if they are alienated, they will not be as supportive of his policies, as supportive of the security and the threats that -- that loom within our country. He should be reaching out to Muslims. He should be reaching out joining hands to deal with the safety of the United States.

[08:45:27] CAMEROTA: Mr. Khizr Khan, we appreciate your words and we appreciate your family's sacrifice. Thank you for being on NEW DAY.

KHAN: Thank you, Alisyn.


CUOMO: All right, we've lost another legend, Mary Tyler Moore, gone after 80 years on this earth. Up next, former talk show host Dick Cavett shares memories about what made Mary Tyler Moore one to remember.

CAMEROTA: But first, iron, of course, is an essential mineral, especially for women who tend not to get enough of it. CNN's senior medical correspondent Elizabeth Cohen shows us simple ways to pump more iron naturally into your diet in today's "Food and Fuel."


ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Meat and fish are great sources of iron, but they're not the only ones out there. Lentils, for example, are packed with iron. One cup gives women more than a third of what they need every day and gives men almost all the iron that they need in a day.

Spinach is another great source of iron, but it's better to eat it cooked. Your body can absorb the iron better than if you eat it raw.

One surprising source of iron is dark chocolate. Look for at least 70 percent cacao. Just a one-ounce serving goes a long way with about 19 percent of your daily value of iron.

Now, try to eat some vitamin c when you eat any of these foods. It helps your body absorb almost twice as much iron.



[08:50:51] (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (singing): You're going to make it after all.


CUOMO: Ah, everyone remembers that iconic throw of the hat. The world remembering America's sweetheart, Mary Tyler Moore. She was a pioneer. She blazed a trail for so many women along the way and she introduced our culture to ideas that we were not comfortable with at that time.

Let's discuss her life and legacy with former talk show host Dick Cavett.

In truth, Dick, we're not comfortable with some of those ideas today, let alone back then during the show.

DICK CAVETT, FORMER HOST, "THE DICK CAVETT SHOW": Yes, there were -- yes, that's how startling they were then. Would you agree, both of you --

CUOMO: Yes. CAVETT: That if you had to put your finger on one thing that Mary did, and it was remarkable for the time, it told women it's OK not to be married.

CAMEROTA: Yes, that's it.

CAVETT: You can have a life.

CAMEROTA: That was it.

CAVETT: She wanted a husband, of course, as they say any woman does, which is also ridiculous. And -- and there were hints that she was sexually active as a person in the -- in the show. But she got on. You can get on. I'm sure we're both attractive and less attractive. But, my God, Mary is getting through, why can't I?

CAMEROTA: Yes, and she got gratification from her job. She liked her career. She had an exciting life. She had girlfriends.


CAMEROTA: I mean this was the modern woman at that time. And all of us little girls did watch this with great interest.

CAVETT: I'm glad to hear that confirmed. Surely one of the greatest six words from two people ever in the history of the media is when Ed Asner said to her, "you've got spunk," and Mary beamed, and he said, "I hate spunk."

CAMEROTA: That is great.

CAVETT: I don't know if my friend David Lloyd (ph) wrote that line or not, but he did write the great chuckles the clown episode and won an Emmy for it.

CAMEROTA: Well, we have a clip of that. Let's listen to that moment of --

CAVETT: Oh, do you. A lesson in comedy.

CAMEROTA: OK, here you go.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You feel like laughing, don't you? Don't try to hold it back. Go ahead, laugh out loud. Don't you see, nothing would have made Chuckles happier. He lived to make people laugh. Tears were offensive to him, deeply offensive. He hated to see people cry. So -- so go ahead, my dear, laugh for Chuckles.


CAVETT: Can you believe -- in comedy school they ought to teach that show to students and say aim for this.

I think I may have given Mary one of the biggest laughs of her life, which is egomaniacal to say. She used to come out -- on Long Island she had a house out there and we would go western riding in the hills of Montuck (ph). I failed to synch my saddle properly and it let go as we were cantering. And I turned all the way and was hanging underneath the horse.


CAVETT: Keaton Chaplin (ph) would have envied it. Mary laughed so hard she had to get off the horse and lie down.


CAVETT: And she said, Dick, thank you, I now know you can die laughing.

CAMEROTA: That's fantastic.

CAVETT: Not my favorite moment of my own past, but terrific.

CAMEROTA: And so was she as likable -- I mean her -- the characteristic everybody says is on screen, she was such a likable character, and in real life, was she that person?

CAVETT: Absolutely. Yes. And her -- she had a man's gutsy laugh that she had to inhibit in public because it was so funny. She thought -- once she said -- when she was starring in do Robert Redford's movie, she said, you know, I've got to do this. I am so damn sick of being perky.

CUOMO: Well, you do get stuck in a successful character very often.


CUOMO: Do you think that she was aware of her own significance?

CAVETT: You never know. You know, you meet great icons of comedy and acting and so on and you find that they're trembling and insecure on stage and will say, was I all right? I think Mary knew dam well she was -- she certainly knew she was successful and that she was rich and that she was funny and that she survived many things in her own life that would kill an ordinary man or woman. And I think so. I think so. But she said, I've got to keep the actor in me alive. And that's what she meant by, I want to do something unperky. And she did that move and she --

[08:55:26] CAMEROTA: "Ordinary People."

CAVETT: Say what?

CAMEROTA: The move -- you're referring to "Ordinary People."

CAVETT: "Ordinary People," Yes, thank you for being my memory.

CAMEROTA: Right, which was -- well, it was a darker -- a darker character. A darker plot line.

CAVETT: She played a murderess in a rarely seen movie.


CAVETT: And that was supposed to -- yes, it was called "Like Father Like Son" or "Mother Like Son." Mom was a he killer. And we saw that there was much, much more to Mary than just -- you know, I never saw "The Mary Tyler Moore" show when it first ran.


CAVETT: I thought, that sounds like something for girls. That's how advanced I've become now.


CAVETT: And then I saw every single episode in rerun and have a closet full of them on VHS.

CAMEROTA: Yes, it -- it --

CAVETT: But Mary was fun to be around. She was a great laugh. She hated her smile. She said this acre of teeth that I show --

CAMEROTA: Oh, my gosh. Well --

CAVETT: Someone's (INAUDIBLE) snap a picture of us together and I said --

CUOMO: Luckily we were the ones who got to judge how she looked, not her.

CAVETT: Yes, right.

CUOMO: What do you want people to remember about her as we close?

CAVETT: Well, she about took a picture when we were together once and she said, Dick, please, tell me not to smile.

CAMEROTA: Oh, my gosh. We loved that smile.

CAVETT: (INAUDIBLE) not to smile.

I'm sorry, what did you say, Chris?

CUOMO: What should people remember about her?

CAVETT: Her fabulous talent. The fact that she was a brave woman who got through a lot and that she helped women say, I can get through, too. This is believable. She does. And where do you suppose that tamashanter (ph) is?

CAMEROTA: Dick Cavett, thank you. Thanks so much for sharing all of your thoughts with us. Great to have you.

CAVETT: Oh, I can stay another hour.

CAMEROTA: Oh, please do.

CUOMO: Good.

CAMEROTA: It won't be on TV, but, please do.

"NEWSROOM" with Carol Costello begins after this very quick break.