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Winners, Losers of Trump's 20 Percent Mexico Tax; Is Cable News Shaping Trump's U.S. Policy; Interview with Cher at Women's March. Aired 2:30-3p ET

Aired January 27, 2017 - 14:30   ET


[14:30:00] BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Let's talk about said buffet with CNN's business correspondent, Richard Quest, host of "Quest Means Business"; and business analyst, Dylan Ratigan.

Gentlemen, wonderful to see you.


BALDWIN: Mr. Quest, first to you.

Explain. When people think, great, this is a 20 percent tax of goods coming from Mexico to the U.S., maybe people think that, OK, Mexico would be paying. But, no, it would ultimately mean the American companies would be paying --



BALDWIN: -- and we would be paying higher prices.

QUEST: Correct. Whoever is importing the goods would pay the tax. Even if it was on the other side. Whichever way you slice this avocado, if it's going to cost -- which is what the Mexicans have been talking about -- using as an example --

BALDWIN: Or Coronas like Senator Graham.

QUEST: Right. If it's 20 percent on the price, that is going to feed through the supply chain to the ultimate purchaser, which may well be the American consumer.

The only caveat to that is if it's not a tariff but some form of border adjustment tax.

RATIGAN: We're really deep in the weeds.

BALDWIN: Are you really want to get --


QUEST: On a Friday afternoon. But the reason that might not filter through is because of a corresponding cut in corporate tax of roughly the same amount, so one would equal the other out. That's the difference between the president's position, if it's a tariff, and the Republican Congress' position, a reform of the entire corporate tax system.


BALDWIN: It would ultimately be me, the American consumer.

QUEST: Yeah. Your eyes are glazing over.


RATIGAN: No, no. I mean, this is -- we don't know -- we do not know, is the president --


RATIGAN: There's a bigger picture here, which is, this is, as I think was said, this was for them a buffet of options.



RATIGAN: This buffet of options is tied to one of the most rhetorically powerful policy promises of a presidential campaign that has to be seen in the context of everything that's happened in the past seven or 10 days.

What I offer as a perspective is the following. If you have seen the movie "Goodwill Hunting," you have seen Ben Affleck, be sent by Matt Damon to the government office to basically, behave nonsensically in the government office to get a rise out of the government. Hear me out. I believe this president, not knowingly, not wittingly, was sent, like Ben Affleck was sent to the government.

BALDWIN: Which president?

RATIGAN: President Trump has been sent as if he was Ben Affleck in "Goodwill Hunting" ad he is in there contradicting himself perpetually, that's his positive outcome, because the ultimate intention underlying not only his presidency but the people around him is to conclude a period of control over the DNC and RNC. And Donald Trump is not a solution. He is a tire iron in the bicycle wheel of American government. And analyzing the chaos of that tire iron in the bicycle wheel can be interesting.


BALDWIN: Doesn't he function best sometimes in the crazy.

RATIGAN: The question is, what happens when he's done. What happens is this is going to end. And we're going to need a system of government that's not going to be going back to the DNC picking another candidate and we're in the process of living through this.

QUEST: To the tire iron, and taking it further --


QUEST: -- you have to remember the U.S. government is a fairly efficient machine. What it does, it does it extremely well.

RATIGAN: You mean processing Medicare, Social Security checks.

QUEST: Everything. Just defense, Social Security whatever, as a size and scale, it's remarkably efficient for what it does.

Now what the president is doing on a variety of issues is basically taking sand and pouring it into the works. Your tire iron, I say sand.

RATIGAN: Same intention.

QUEST: The idea is to disrupt. The idea is to change. But the process of pouring sand and making these monumental changes so fast, which may very appealing.

RATIGAN: Which may not even happen. They're rhetorical.


QUEST: The ship is going to start to rock very noticeably and unless somebody starts --


BALDWIN: But you're still not telling me who pays for this built and who pays for it.

RATIGAN: The wall may never get built.


RATIGAN: And if the wall does get built, it may not even help and may not even help.


QUEST: Building the wall is not the difficult bit.


BALDWIN: But paying.

QUEST: Even that's not the difficult part. You see what money is in the teapot and you rob Peter to pay Paul. And if you look at the executive order, is says look at every possible funding options. So, paying for it's not difficult.

BALDWIN: Go ahead, Dylan.

RATIGAN: I would say the opportunities, the challenges are a litany and the unique opportunity for folks in the media or who has a public voice as a leader of any kind is to remain extremely calm an observe what is happening, which is what we have seen a tire iron, sandbag, whatever it is, this is not a Republican, this is not a Democrat, this is not a traditional political event we are witnessing. This is a decline. This is a rejection of the legacy and to deny that the legacy has been rejected and count the tick-tocks of each executive order as if he may or may not do this, actually plays into what they want because they want you chasing -- what is this? What is this? They took this back.

If you say, no, no, you're Ben Affleck, saying you have $200 in your pocket and they say, you've already got the job. You're not in a rational engagement. Then you marshal the intellectual, spiritual, emotional and communication resources of world leaders, media leaders, intellectual leaders to remain calm and observe the news of the day, that the American political legacy has been thrown into a state of disruption. I won't offer an adjective beyond that. And it would be necessary opportunity at this moment is to focus on how we are going to move forward with a new system that I think is, I like what you're thinking, Mr. Trump, but you haven't done far enough.


RATIGAN: We need 10,000 new candidates.

QUEST: We saw that perfectly today with Theresa May, the British prime minister. She elegantly steered this course of, nice, Mr. President, I agree with you, Mr. President. But I don't agree with you. And, by the way, you do support NATO after all.


RATIGAN: And to play through as opposed to buying into the emotional chaos, even though it was -- like, I can't believe you do that, how could you to that. We have a responsibility for our own well-being to look past that.

BALDWIN: Dylan and Richard, thank you.

It may or may not happen, be calm, I think it's what --


RATIGAN: Be calm and understand what is happening in this transitional moment, and what's the next system going to be of American government. In candidate selection. I'm not saying we're not going to be a democracy. We need candidates. Just saying.

BALDWIN: Thank you. Thank you.

Next here, several of President Trump's tweets have been -- curious timing related to some cable news shows. Question: Are TV networks helping dictate some of his policies and tweets? More on that.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) [14:41:38] BALDWIN: Question: Is cable news, cable news, shaping U.S. policy? It's a good question considering what we have seen during President Trump's first week.

Listen to the tread here. Bill O'Reilly, on FOX News, did a story on Chicago, laying out the crime statistics, calling for federal aid. After the show, this tweet from Trump, "If Chicago doesn't fix the horrible carnage going on, 228 shootings in 2017 according to killing, I will send in the feds."

Then, the next night, on ABC -- watch.


DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: That speech was a homerun. See what FOX said. They said it was one of the great speeches. You and other networks covered it very inaccurately. I hate to say this to you, and you probably won't put it on, but turn on FOX, and see how it was covered. You and some other networks tried to downplay that speech, and it was very, very unfortunate that you did.


BALDWIN: Exhibit B, following morning, FOX aired a critique of Chelsea Manning's critique of President Obama, describing Manning as an "ungrateful traitor." 15 minutes later, this tweet from Trump, "Ungrateful traitor. Chelsey Manning, who should have never been released from prison, is now calling President Obama a weak leader. Terrible."

We've got to talk about this. Bill Carter is with me, CNN media analyst; and Kristen Soltis Anderson, columnist with the "Washington Examiner," and a Republican strategist and pollster.

So great to have you on.

Bill, to my points.


BALDWIN: I don't think the timing is a coincidence. Obviously, he watches a lot of TV and FOX, thus is U.S. policy being shaped by cable TV news?

CARTER: May not be shaped but he's reacting to it. It's not unusual. Mr. Trump has always been sort of brought into what he feels people are talking about him. In New York, when we covered things about Donald Trump, you would likely hear from him because he played close attention to people talking about him.

BALDWIN: He's always been like that.

CARTER: I used to write piece, and he'd have a handwritten note sent back to me on the actual clip. So, he pays very close attention. And FOX is very friendly territory for him, so he watches a lot. And when they make a point that he thinks is a valid, he'll tweet. People read the tweet and people follow that up in some fashion. It'll be interesting to see if he then takes action.


BALDWIN: Kristen, same question, what do you think?

KRISTEN SOLTIS ANDERSON, COLUMNIST, WASINGTON EXAMINER: I think when it comes to FOX or any media outlet, there are lots of voices within any particular media outlet. In FOX, you have Sean Hannity who is extremely friendly, I think, at one point, advising him through a tough campaign, and others that shoot straight and are trying to cover the true story. So, I hate to cast any network as pro or anti. But if you are a guest on a program or just an average pundit going on TV, because the president's consumption is so cable news-heavy and kind of learning on the fly, what it is he thinks about different issues and very impulsive willing to act very quickly. It sort of puts a lot of pressure on those to know that the president could be watching you on Air Force One and making police as a result.

[14:45:18] BALDWIN: Let me staying with you. I think it's great the White House is allowing more conservative voiced in the White House briefing room. I think the more voices, the more ears, the better off we all are.

But I'm wondering, "Washington Examiner," a conservative paper, he seems to -- his whole team seems to have declared this one-sided war on almost all media. Do you feel that?

SOLTIS ANDERSON: I haven't particularly felt that but I'm writing from the right side of the aisle I'm not a cheerleader for the president for sure but I think you have always had Donald Trump at war with the media, he loves conflict, thrives off of it. Barack Obama had conflict with FOX. So, I think the idea of a politician declaring war on media isn't anything new and for Steve Bannon saying it's time that the media listen a little bit more because he doesn't feel they have acknowledged that they have got things wrong and that a lot of people like Donald Trump and he feels like the media doesn't give him credit for the fact that he won and the fact that a large part of America really do like his message.

BALDWIN: Bill, I disagree on the note that, yes, maybe President Obama didn't feel so friendly against FOX, but he didn't constantly bring it up.

CARTER: Yeah, he didn't say they were disgusting and dishonest. Listen, when you tell the media to shut-up, there are places like North Korea, we don't do that. Nobody is doing to tell us to shut-up and by the way we can also say there's plenty of opposition to every president so for the media to say -- they are your adversary, and particularly true now, because the Democrats don't have any particular power. Bannon is right in one way, they can speak truth to power, that's supposed to be their job and he's trying to intimidate them and delegitimize it.

BALDWIN: Yeah, not shutting up.

Bill Carter, Kristen Soltis Anderson, thank you so much. Coming up next, millions of women march in protest to Mr. Trump's

agenda, but what's next for the movement? I was there on Saturday. We talk to the one and only Cher. Her thoughts, next.


[14:49:48] BALDWIN: This Sunday marks the 23rd annual Screen Actor Guild Awards. "Manchester by the Sea" leads the list, and Casey Affleck is up for best actor. You can watch live on our sister stations, in L.A., TBS and TNT, live Sunday, 8:00 p.m. eastern.





BALDWIN: Love that. Starting today, I wanted to start a national conversation with women. Women make a majority of this country and many don't feel empowered because of where they work or live or the political climate. We'll start with women you recognize but I want to hear from you. Maybe you marched on Saturday, maybe you are marching in Washington. But we have women sharing stories of what it's like to be an American woman.

Here is Cher. I caught up with her at the women's march last week in Washington.


BALDWIN: It's one thing to lift your voice, but to actually come to Washington, Cher. Why?

CHER, SINGER: Because I want to support the people now that will have no voice and that will be walked -- that will be stepped on and all of our rights will be taken away from us. We'll go back to the 50s. If they have their way we'll go back to a time where we had no rights, you know? And how can we go backwards, you continue go backwards.

I'm 70 years old.

BALDWIN: You're 70?

CHER: Yeah, I've been through 12 presidents. I know what it's like to have nothing. But that's another thing, I feel bad for his supporters, I know the pain that they're going through because I was very poor growing up and I know what it's like to have no one care, to have no one listen to you, and so we're marching for them, too, they just don't know it.

BALDWIN: You're marching for Trump supporters, too. They just don't know that. Now that I haven't heard.

CHER: Well you heard it now. BALDWIN: When you talk about the presidents -- and you're 70 years

young -- that's a whole different conversation. So many feel their rights aren't enough, but there was a day when --


CHER: When there was nothing, when there was nothing, if a husband raped his wife it wasn't rape. You know that rule of thumb thing came from you couldn't beat your wife with a stick larger than your thumb, so I don't want to go back there, I don't want to go back. They're doing it. They're doing it. They're taking us back and not just women, they're taking everybody's rights back. And you can't stand for it and we have to have a voice, we have to come out, not in violence but we have to come out and show them that we're not whiners that we're not crying and that we're going to make our presence known.

BALDWIN: Cher, people would say where were all these women a year ago, if they had shown up maybe we would have had a different outcome on November 8th.

CHER: Well I campaigned a lot and a lot of time with students and I said if you don't exercise your right and your responsibility, boy, you're going to see a hell like you never dreamt and you're going to lose your rights, your rights that you take for granted, but they weren't scared enough.

BALDWIN: The women, the young women weren't scared enough to do more?

14:55:51] CHER: Yeah, they thought it wouldn't make any difference that their vote wouldn't make any difference, that they want today protest and I said babe, a protest vote is a vote for him. And I just don't like him. I really just don't like him and I don't respect him and I've never heard anybody who lies like they're telling the truth. He's really good. He deserves an academy award.

BALDWIN: If he were standing right here, what would be the one thing you would say or ask of him.

I wouldn't ask anything of him because, whatever he said, I wouldn't believe it. And I don't know what I would say to him because he wouldn't listen and he would give you lip service.

BALDWIN: So you're giving up, four years, giving up?

CHER: No, no, absolutely not giving up. But I'm not going to talk to the person who is going to be doing it. If he were a better person we would be having this conversation, I don't believe he has a moral compass I feel if we stay united there's many groups you can join and many ways to make them keep hearing your voice. And all I pray for is that women stay united. And --

BALDWIN: Look into that camera, and what do you say to young women watching?

CHER: Don't give up. Stand and be counted or sit and be nothing.