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Identifying Threats in America; Trump Slams Schumer; Manafort Information Revealed; Terror Suspect Radicalized Domestically. Aired 8:30-9a ET

Aired November 1, 2017 - 08:30   ET


[08:30:00] CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: What do you do at that level of how you identify the threat and how you get the American people to perceive what the threat is?

JOSEPH GIACALONE, LAW ENFORCEMENT TRAINER: Well, it's about really getting the guys on the ground -- the guys and the girls on the ground, right, this investigation that the social media aspect of it. But, you know what, with all the information that we have out there, I mean our public is generally misinformed about a lot of things and people need to educate themselves about exactly what's going on. I mean this -- the YouTube videos, they -- and all the other way they are getting radicalized, I mean people have to identify these things. And if they have a family member who is, you know, taking all this stuff in all the time, I mean these are warning signs and maybe they need to talk to them and stuff.

CUOMO: But you remember what happened after 9/11, Jimmy.


CUOMO: You know, we had people beating up seiks (ph) in Brooklyn.


CUOMO: You know, seiks who are not Muslims, by the way. It was happening because, you know, you've got to calibrate your response to what is the threat and what do you do about it?

GAGLIANO: Yes. Chris, a big part of it is, you know, America is the melting pot, right? And as we've seen these type of attacks of recent in Belgium, in Germany, in London. The assimilation process there is not like it is in America. We do a lot better job here, I believe, in assimilation and outreach, the FBI, NYPD.

CUOMO: We were. We were.


CUOMO: You know, our politics are changing on this. This place is not putting its arms around people the way it used to. Culturally and politically it's changing. Is that the answer, though, what we're hearing, lock down the borders, only get in merit-based, have your travel bans. Would that stop it? GAGLIANO: Chris, you can look at the countries that are being proposed

for this travel ban and you can argue that. But you can also look at it from the perspective of, you know, are they really going after the largest Muslim country? No. The largest Arabic country? No.

We've got to be very, very careful with this knowing --

CUOMO: No Indonesia. No Saudi Arabia.

GAGLIANO: Absolutely. No Egypt.

We've got to be careful because, as you pointed out before, it's the messaging. And sometimes I think the part of that process is the poor messaging that goes out where people look at that and say, well, you're targeting us.

I mean Uzbekistan is not on the travel ban list. And, obviously, this guy was from Uzbekistan. Came here in 2010. A bit part of it, as we just said, it's assimilation. It's making sure that we don't allow -- not that we don't allow them, but that we don't have established enclaves, that people feel comfortable enough to expand, to enjoy the freedoms we have here and to assimilate theirselves in American society.

CUOMO: Asha Rangappa, when you hear about this and the larger policy discussion that has to be going on right now, what are the points of emphasis? What are the things that need to change, if anything?

ASHA RANGAPPA, ASSOCIATE DEAN, YALE LAW SCHOOL: Well, I think you identified some of it. This is about, you know -- there -- there is a broader characterization that we need to stop making into these stark terms that don't apply and get a little bit nuanced about how we're approaching it.

I just want to go back to James' point, which is I think a great one about assimilation and how those social networks for people who are here are so important in understanding and addressing this issue. And it relates to social media.

People spend about six and a half hours online every day. That's a huge amount of time. And that creates an opening for this kind of remote radicalization that we see going on with ISIS, and, you know, in other areas, too. We know even the Russians exploited that kind of focus that people have online to exploit division.

So, I think, you know, moving people away from their computer screens and creating actual social connections can go a long way, particularly for people who are feeling alienated and isolated and starting to cling and find the ideologies attractive. And I think that's where we need to move to.

I think mental health is also an issue. There is a pattern with lone wolf attackers that there is some mental health background. And, you know, that's also where family members who are the ones that are mostly in contact with them need to be able to identify this because, you know, these broader ways of addressing terrorism that we have, you know, identifying networks and using our communications based investigative techniques aren't going to work for someone who's sitting in their room and deciding to take this kind of action completely on their own.

CUOMO: Understood. Asha, James, Joe, thank you very much.

Alisyn, a quick moment of perspective. When 9/11 hit, I was here. We were doing reporting. But it was a personal hit for a lot of us as well. I got engaged -- Christina and I got engaged 11 days after because it was such a monumental thing, we figured the world would never be the same. It was time to live our lives. Last -- yesterday when this happened and I had to run down, my kids were scared. They're always scared. You know, we wind up running around in so many dangerous places. But their recognition and their perspective on this and how they weren't devastated and panicked. How they were like, how many? Are they OK? This is terrible. And then it was still Halloween. And while they were thinking about it, they wanted to get on with their life as well.

[08:35:03] And, man, it hit me, wow, how we've changed. How our recognition of what normal is, is so different than what it was just several years ago.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: I totally agree, Chris. I mean that's what the governor of New York just said, you know, terrorists, zero, New York wins. And that's because, you know, we all have now somehow incorporated the risk is real and we're going to live our lives anyway. And that's just such an important message.

Thank you very much for reporting from down there. We'll check back with you soon, Chris.

But, meanwhile, President Trump is blaming Senate Democratic Leader Chuck Schumer for the terror suspect being in America in the first place. We'll get reaction from the Democratic side, next.


CAMEROTA: The terror attack in lower Manhattan is the deadliest attack in New York since 9/11. President Trump is blaming Senate Democratic Leader Chuck Schumer for how the suspect was able to get into the U.S. in the first place. H's tweeted this morning, Senate Chuck Schumer helping to import Europe's problems said Colonel Tony Schaffer (ph). We will stop this craziness. That was about a segment, we believe, on Fox News this morning.

[08:40:07] Here is Chuck Schumer's response. I guess it's not too soon to politicize a tragedy.

Well, there you have it.

Joining us now is Democratic Congresswoman Jackie Speier of California. She's a member of the House Intelligence Committee.

Congresswoman, nice to see you. Sorry we have to talk about this terror attack. Is this Chuck Schumer's fault? REP. JACKIE SPEIER (D), CALIFORNIA: You know, Uzbekistan has been one

of our -- the countries that has been a partner with us in the fight against terror. So for the president to come out lashing out again, instead of trying to help the country heal and feel that we will somehow get this under control, is really quite disturbing. Again, he has a difficult time leading.

CAMEROTA: Look, here's what he tweeted before those tweets that I just read. The terrorists came into our country through what is called the diversity visa lottery program, a Chuck Schumer beauty. I want merit based. He's referring to this policy -- legislation that was proposed, I think Chuck Schumer sponsored it in 1990. It was bipartisan. It was bipartisan legislation and it was signed by George H.W. Bush. But last night on Fox, Sean Hannity blamed it on Chuck Schumer, or Mark Levin, who's a radio -- a right wing radio host on Hannity's program, blamed it on Chuck Schumer. And so is this where the president gets his policy ideas?

SPEIER: Well, it sure sounds like it. He is a premier blame gamer. And that is not the kind of person we want leading our country. You know, everywhere I go now, throughout the country, people say, can't you come together? Can't you work together? With a president who's constantly attacking both members of his own party and members of the other parties, that is very difficult to achieve.

CAMEROTA: Senator Jeff Flake just tweeted about all of this. I'm reading it for the first time and you're hearing it for the first time. Actually the gang of eight, including Senator Schumer, did away with the diversity visa program as part of broader reforms. I know, I was there.

I mean, listen, Jeff Flake, as you know, has begun -- has begun speaking out pretty vociferously. What are you hearing in the halls of Congress as opposed to whether or not more people, and not just Democrats and not just Jeff Flake and John McCain will speak out when they hear something that bothers them about something the president has said?

SPEIER: Well, I think that when the American people start to show that they don't have confidence in this president's leadership and it's reflected in their willingness to support the Republican who may be representing them in Congress, you're going to see members shifting. There's a lot of members here on the Republican side who are very disturbed by the president's approach, but they are fearful for their re-election bids. And that, frankly, is what motivates a great number of them.

CAMEROTA: I want to talk about the other news that happened today -- that happened this week, I should say, and that was Paul Manafort surrendering to the FBI for all of these, you know, it seems money laundering charges. And here is video of that from Monday.

CNN has reporting this morning about just how deep this went with Paul Manafort and the things that he's accused of. He had three different passports with three different numbers. He had applied for ten different U.S. passports over the course of the last ten years. He travelled to Ecuador, China and Mexico using a fake e-mail and fake phone account with fake names. He had money accounts in the Seychelles, the Grenadines, and Cyprus. He was -- apparently had millions of dollars' worth of stuff there.

Why do you make of why he was the Trump campaign chairman and whether or not they should have known about some of those things?

SPEIER: Well, clearly he wasn't vetted. It was basically on the recommendation of one of Donald Trump's good friends.

Paul Manafort has a long reputation working on campaigns, on presidential campaigns. But the fact that he is an outlaw to the extent that has been disclosed so far is deeply concerning, I think, to all of us. And I'm beginning to wonder if he wasn't an agent of Russia?

CAMEROTA: What does that mean?

SPEIER: Pardon me?

CAMEROTA: What do you mean by that?

SPEIER: Well, I -- there was such an interests in becoming chair, and such an interest in offering himself for free when he clearly had lots of financial troubles. And, you know, Russia is really good at ID-ing people who they can manipulate, who might have financial troubles. And he has had a relationship in the Ukraine. And that is, you know, very close to Russia, obviously. And I wouldn't be surprised if we find out down the road that there's more to this than like what meets the eye.

[08:45:10] CAMEROTA: We just had Congressman Jim Jordan on who said, look, all of this Manafort stuff, ancient business -- ancient history. This is from 2005 through 2015, before he went to work for the campaign. What do you say to that?

SPEIER: Well, what I say to that is, that's all part of one's history and one's reputation. And when we hire someone, we look at their record. We don't basically say, oh, well, that was yesterday. And I think that, you know, it is what the Republicans are using right now.

But let's remember that it was Papadopoulos who was working on the campaign, who has plead guilty, who has shown by e-mail now that he was in constant contact with Russian interests and was trying to set up a meeting with the president and the higher ups within the organization. So this whole issue of, was there coordination by the Trump campaign with Russia is starting to have legs.

CAMEROTA: Congresswoman Jackie Speier, thank you very much for being on NEW DAY. Great to talk to you.

SPEIER: Thank you, Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: Up next, terrorists using vehicles as deadly weapons. What can law enforcement do to prevent these kinds of attacks? We have a national security expert here next.


CUOMO: All right, we're in downtown Manhattan. This is the site of the deadliest terror attack since 9/11 here in New York. Eight people lost their lives, 13 injured, and there may be more. Authorities say some may have self-evacuated after coming into contact with this mad man and alleged terrorist and just jumped the curb in a pickup truck he had rented just hours earlier and did so much destruction. He found a spot along this west side of Manhattan here, just a block or so from where we are right now, where he had a path of about a mile before he ran into a school bus. What planning? What inspiration? That's all part of the investigation.

[08:50:09] But there's some larger considerations. So for that, let's bring in Lisa Monaco, CNN national security adviser, worked with the Obama administration in national security, homeland security.

Lisa, it's good to have you.

On the macro level, the president is saying, this is about you, Democrats, and a policy of admission into this country that is too permissive. The diversity visa that he says this man entered the country on, that's the problem. Lock down the border. Keep people like this out. You'll be safe. Your response?


Look, I think the first thing we should not do, less than 24 hours after this carnage, is politicize it. We should always be looking for ways to strengthen our vetting, to strengthen our borders, but we need to do so smartly based on intelligence and based on facts. And we will see what this investigation uncovers about when this individual was radicalized.

He's been here for several years. Almost ten years, it looks like, based on the information we have now. And we know that the Department of Homeland Security released an intelligence assessment just a few months ago, in March of this year, where they indicated that foreign- born U.S. based terrorists are more likely to have been radicalized here before they act.

So we will see what this investigation uncovers. But we should not be politicizing this. We need to be coming together as a country and showing the resilience that frankly New Yorkers are showing this morning.

CUOMO: What's the line between politicalization and just calling it for what it is? You know, he believes -- the president believes, and a big part of his party, and a big part of our population believes that we have entry problems and that's why we see these attacks from people who come from abroad, come here and go bad on the rest of us.

MONACO: But, look, again, the focus of national security professionals, of counter terrorism professionals, is not on the politics. And it shouldn't be on the politics. We need to be focused on the facts. We need to be focused on the intelligence that helps us constantly improve our vetting and our efforts to stop these attacks. The problem here is, Chris, what yesterday's attack reflects is the

morphing of the terror threat. The evolution from complex externally directed attacks, like we saw on 9/11, to the type of attack that this was yesterday where you have an individual, seemingly operating without others, although the investigation is ongoing, and taking upon themselves to likely be inspired and have been inspired by ISIS messaging to act wherever they are. This was the first vehicle attack that we've seen in this country, jihadi inspired vehicle attack. We've seen about 15 of those, though, across Europe and other places in the last several years. So this was the first time that this type of attack has come to the United States. And it really follows the ISIS playbook of inspiring people to act where they are.

CUOMO: Look, I hear you on the politics. I don't think it's a coincidence that the president of the United States didn't mention the ISIS affiliation to those who ambushed our soldiers in Niger and killed four of them because it didn't play to advantage. But this does play to advantage, and that's why he's mentioning it.

People are afraid here in the United States, and they're afraid specifically of Muslims. Not all Americans -- you have a lot of people who are able to draw a distinction between a radicalized population that is bastardizing, perverting a faith, and an entire faith of over a billion people. But it's politically salable. And the solution of this, Lisa, as you well know, is going to be found in politics. So what is the right direction to move in terms of fighting back against these types of attacks that we just saw right now?

MONACO: Well, one of the directions is to work within communities, and to not play into ISIS messaging. ISIS recruits individuals and mobilizes them to violence based on a message that says, we are in a clash of civilizations. That it's us against them. That there's a war of religion.

And any time we use messaging or play into that recruiting, we're doing their work for them. And we shouldn't be doing that. We need to be coming together and get information from communities, having communities come together to help us stop these types of attacks, because more than likely these types of attacks, these one-off individuals who are inspired to act, the information to stop those attacks is going to come from communities, from people who know these individuals and can work with law enforcement to stop it.

CUOMO: Extreme vetting, the travel ban expanding, is that a part of the answer, in your opinion?

MONACO: Again, we should always be looking for ways to strengthen our vetting. But the travel ban, which is a broad and wide -- cuts across a wide swath of countries, and is based on nationality and is not based on intelligence, is not the type of change that is going to help make us more safe.

[08:55:19] The extreme vetting, again, we should be try -- we should always be improving our vetting, but it needs to be based on intelligence. We need to learn lessons from this. And if there is anything to change in the vetting, we should address that. But more likely than not, as we're seeing the intelligence may reflect that this individual was radicalized here.

CUOMO: We hear from intel experts all the time that they don't look at who somebody is, they look at what they are in terms of their dispositions.

Lisa Monaco, appreciate your perspective. Thank you.

MONACO: Thanks.

CUOMO: And a big part of this story is about perspective. We have a loss of life. We have to care about that. There's an interconnectedness among all of us. When people lose their life, it's an injury to all of us.

And, also, there's symbolism to here in New York. You know, E.B. White wrote about it in 1949 in an essay, "Here is New York." It's just as true today. Show the tower. We are in the shadow of the World Trade Center, a place that stands as a symbol of resolve but also such profound victimization.

This is the deadliest terror attack in New York City since 9/11. That bears remembering. And, in fact, we should never forget.

We're going to take a break. When we come back, there is new information. Poppy Harlow, John Berman has it for you. Please, stay with CNN.