Return to Transcripts main page


Trump Again Says He's The Least Racist Person There Is; Phone Designer Consumers Need Tools And Controls; Breaking Down Tech's Addictive Allure; Korea Talks; Panic in Hawaii; California Mudslides. Aired 2-3a ET

Aired January 15, 2018 - 02:00   ET





DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: No, I'm not a racist. I am the least racist president you've ever interviewed.


CYRIL VANIER, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): Yep, you heard that right. This is what Americans are waking up to on the day they celebrate Dr. Martin Luther King Jr., the leader of the civil rights movement.

NATALIE ALLEN, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): On the Korean Peninsula, a second meeting between North and South Korean officials. We'll have the latest live from Seoul for you.

VANIER (voice-over): Also coming up in the show, are you addicted to your cell phone?

One of the creators behind the iPhone says the technology can be like a drug.

ALLEN (voice-over): I'm sorry, did you say something?


ALLEN (voice-over): Just kidding. OK, yes.

Welcome to our viewers here in the U.S. and around the world. I'm Natalie Allen.

VANIER (voice-over): And I'm Cyril Vanier. You're watching CNN NEWSROOM. Thanks for being with us.


VANIER: First we begin with breaking news out of Indonesia, though. A floor has collapsed inside the building of the Jakarta stock exchange. Officials say it happened in the middle of the day in a space where tourists usually gather near an entrance.

ALLEN: It's unclear what caused this floor to collapse or if there are any casualties. But a source says most people have been rescued. We'll bring you more on this story as soon as we get it. We continue to follow any more developments.

Well, in the U.S., Monday is Martin Luther King Jr. Day. And on this holiday, to honor the civil rights icon, many Americans will wake up to this quote from their president.

"I am not a racist," as you just heard.

VANIER: Of course that comes after days of controversy since Donald Trump reportedly used a slur referring to several African nations. Now the president is defending himself. Here is Boris Sanchez with more.


BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: President Trump taking time before dinner to answer questions from reporters, alongside House Majority Leader Kevin McCarthy of California, on Sunday night.

The president making news on several fronts, answering some uncomfortable questions; specifically, whether he is a racist after it was reported on Thursday that several remarks that the president made, specifically about African nations and Haitian immigrants to the United States, drew ire from both Democrats and Republicans.

Listen to the president's response.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: No, no, I'm not a racist. I am the least racist person you have ever interviewed, that I can tell you.

SANCHEZ: The president also addressed the potential for a looming government shutdown as that Friday night deadline approaches for lawmakers to come up with a budget deal. He said that there should not be a shutdown but that he wasn't sure if one might happen or not. Listen to more of what the president said.

TRUMP: I don't know if there will be a shutdown; there shouldn't be, because, if there is, our military gets hurt very badly. We cannot let our military be hurt.

SANCHEZ: Now getting back to those reported comments that the president allegedly made during a meeting with lawmakers at the White House on Thursday, when discussing immigration, there is some division among lawmakers about what the president actually said.

Some Republicans like Senators Tom Cotton and David Perdue initially said that they couldn't recall what the president said during the meeting. On Sunday both of them are outright denying that the president ever said those derogatory remarks about African nations or about Haitians. Others, like Republican Senator Lindsey Graham, said in a statement

that he confronted the president about his remarks, though he didn't specify what those remarks were. Reportedly, he did tell fellow Republican Senator from South Carolina, Tim Scott, that the reports about the president's conversation was accurate.

Beyond that you also have Senator Dick Durbin, confirming that the president made those remarks and saying that they were hate-filled. All of that, the backdrop of this, not only a disagreement what the president said but also on policy, with the government shutdown looming on Friday, we could potentially see some kind of deal from lawmakers to keep the government funded or a stopgap bill that would keep the government funded and punt on this conversation about DACA and immigration.

Or we could see a government shutdown if some Democrats follow along, as they have promised to not vote on any kind of budget without a solution to the issue of DREAMers being included -- Boris Sanchez, CNN, traveling with the president in West Palm Beach, Florida.


VANIER: Let's bring in Steven Erlanger, chief diplomatic correspondent for "The New York Times."

So Steven, the president said a few hours ago, you heard him, "I'm not a racist." And he offered no further explanation. Your thoughts on Mr. Trump's defense.

STEVEN ERLANGER, "THE NEW YORK TIMES": (INAUDIBLE) the president say I'm not a racist?

That would be one of the incidents. Look, there are people lying here. Let's be honest.



ERLANGER (voice-over): Democrats are lying. But someone's lying about what the president said. But let's think about the meaning of what he said. Whether he said S-house --


ERLANGER: -- or S-hole really doesn't matter. What matters is the temperament behind it and the meaning behind it. And the meaning behind it is, I want people from nice, white European countries like Norway. And I don't want poor black people. That's the implication of what he said.

Now does that make him a racist?

Not necessarily. It certainly gives you an idea of what he would like for immigration.

VANIER: Listen to what Congressman John Lewis said on Sunday morning.


REP. JOHN LEWIS (D), GA.: We've come so far. We've made so much progress. And I think this man, this president is taking us back to another place.

GEORGE STEPHANOPOULOS, ABC HOST: Do you think President Trump is a racist?

LEWIS: I think he is a racist.

STEPHANOPOULOS: How do you explain it or what do we do about it?

LEWIS: We have to stand up. We have to speak up and not try to sweep it under the rug.


VANIER: Stephen, despite all the previous controversies, dating back to Mr. Trump's campaign and even before then, there has never been as many people unequivocally and publicly calling the president a racist.

Politically speaking, do you think he can ever get out from under this?

ERLANGER: I think he has a lot of trouble. It's a very divided country. His base is a minority. Let's not forget. He was very lucky to win the election, though he certainly won it. And Americans reelected a Republican House and a Republican Senate.

Let's see what happens in the midterms. I think his reputation is getting solidified as someone who is -- put it in the old way, economical with the truth. This is a classic media strategy. You defend yourself by attacking others. You deny you say something that you might have said.

I mean, Trump has always dealt with the press as a way to enhance his own view of himself. Even when he was a builder in New York, he told one person to say a building was X number of stories rather than the real number of stories because he said the press would believe it. Now this is what he is doing.

What worries me a little bit is you have to hope that Congress holds to its own principles. But clearly there is sycophancy going on here. There is a lot of fear among Republicans heading towards the midterms that the president's going to drag them down.

And you have Trump loyalists, who are now pretending they didn't hear anything of any kind. You have to admire a bit Lindsey Graham for at least standing up at the time and saying, this is not my America, Mr. President.

Again, I would say the actual words he used are not the point. We shouldn't be fighting over those words. What we should be thinking about is the habit of mind and the attitudes that led to the expression, that led to the view of the president about immigration and his notion of the country that he is leading.

VANIER: So, Steven, in that case, let's talk about the policy for a moment. Just before that whole controversy erupted, a bipartisan initiative to reform the U.S. immigration system was put to the president. And it was a comprehensive reform deal, DREAMers, a lot of re-visas, everything.

Has all of that been derailed now?

ERLANGER: Well, it may be. I hope not just because there are a lot of people's lives at stake and futures at stake. Politically, one can view the program as good or bad. But at this point, people's lives are really on the line.

Now there is a negotiation going on. Politics is always about negotiations. And, you know, this is clearly what the White House is doing, which is they want to put DACA in a big negotiation to get other things done.

You have the government shutdown coming. I mean, there are lots of things to trade at this point.

But ideologically, there is no question that President Trump doesn't like the DACA program and wants to end it. He is having trouble with the courts, as he had trouble with the courts on his effort to ban Muslims or certainly people from mostly Muslim countries, to be fair.

But this is, you know, you can argue this is the platform on which he was elected. So basically, you just have a political fight. And I hope, like good political fights, they come out with some kind of compromise. Otherwise, everything gets blocked.

VANIER: All right, Steven Erlanger, chief diplomatic correspondent for "The New York Times." Thanks for coming on the show.

ERLANGER: Thanks, Cyril.

ALLEN: We turn to Hawaii, where officials have a simple yet disturbing explanation for the message sent out to everyone warning of incoming missiles. They say an employee just pushed the wrong button during a routine drill.


VANIER: Panicked tourists and residents raced to find shelter anywhere they could. You see what it looked like there. It took officials 38 minutes to correct that mistake. In the hours after the alert, Internet searches for "how to survive a nuclear missile" spiked in the U.S.

ALLEN: Sara Sidner is in Hawaii. She has details on what's being done to make sure a false alert like that never happens again.


SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: We are told that the person responsible for pressing that button, so to speak, and sending that erroneous message out to the population here in Hawaii, that did create panic and fear, has been reassigned for the time being as the investigation is underway but not fired.

Now we spoke at length to the emergency management agency administrator, who apologized for what happened, said it was his mistake, it was his department that made the mistake but that they are going to make changes. They have already made changes.

First of all, they're able to now send out a false alarm warning faster than they did before it took them 38 minutes this time. A lot of time for people to be worrying and panicking.

And second, that a second person will be responsible for approving whether or not a message is sent out. Those are the things that have been done immediately as this investigation continues.

But the population here, there was fear. Even a state representative, who is very familiar with how things works, that's because the population here knows that if, indeed, North Korea were to fire a missile, from launch to the time of impact here in Hawaii, is just some 20 minutes.

The population would have about 15 minutes to try and get out of the way, to try to get to shelter and to try to save themselves.

So there is a bit of a heightened awareness about this, with all the rhetoric that was going on between President Trump and Kim Jong-un of North Korea. At this point in time, they want everyone to know that this was a false alarm. And they say it will never happen again -- Sara Sidner, CNN, Honolulu.


VANIER: Round two: North and South Korea meeting again after more than two years without direct discussions. Pyongyang says it is trying to improve relations with its southern neighbor. But as for thinking this could move the needle on its nuclear program, no. The North has made very clear that it will not negotiate its nuclear weapons.

ALLEN: North Korea also says sanctions had nothing to do with why they agreed to talk. For now, both sides are focusing on how the North will participate in the Winter Olympics next month in South Korea. For the very latest, we're joined by CNN senior international correspondent, Ivan Watson, who is monitoring things for us from Seoul.

Anything more we're learning about these current meetings, Ivan?

IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, we learned from the South Korean unification ministry that North Korea has basically said it would be willing to have another round of discussions to take place on Wednesday, January 17th, at the peace house. That's also within this compound on the demilitarized zone, where

today's working level discussions are taking place. And Wednesday's proposed talks would be at a high level, unlike the talks that are taking place today.

So we're getting into a rhythm of diplomacy here that was opened up last Tuesday, with the first face-to-face talks in some two years and is now progressing to essentially now work out the nuts and bolts of trying to get a North Korean delegation to the upcoming Winter Olympics, which will be held here in South Korea in PyeongChang, starting in February.

The talks that are taking place today are not at the ministerial cabinet level. They're kind of lower level officials, who come from various cultural organizations from North and South Korea.

Among the people gathered is a woman named Chun Sun Wol (ph) from North Korea. She is the leader of something called the Moranbong band. That's an all female performance musical group with singer and dancers and instrumentalists and that suggests that North Korea would like to send that band to the Winter Olympics, in addition to the tae kwon do demonstration team, the cheerleaders, the North Korean journalists, the art troupe that are all also supposed to be attending.

A total of two North Korean athletes, who are actually qualifying for the sport's event, part of today's discussions are revolving around where to put the stage for the performance group that is planned to come from Pyongyang -- Natalie.

ALLEN: So, Ivan, this next stage of meetings that you say will involve higher level officials, what does South Korea plan to bring to the table?

Do we know?

WATSON: Well, possibly one of the things that they could bring would be their proposal that was brought up at the initial round of talks last Tuesday, which was to resume reunions between relatives, who have been separated for more than half a century by the demilitarized zone, the holdover --


WATSON: -- of the Korean War of the 1950s. Now when relations were better between Seoul and Pyongyang, there were these emotional meetings taking place, in some cases between siblings who hadn't seen each other for decades. Again, highly emotional.

Now what we have heard from the South Koreans is that, in response to this proposal last Tuesday, the North Koreans raised an entirely separate issue, that being the defection of April of 2016 of 13 workers from a North Korean restaurant in China to South Korea.

Twelve waitresses and one man who was working at that restaurant, which Pyongyang -- it was highly embarrassing for the North Korean regime. And they subsequently accused the South Korean intelligence agency of kidnapping all 13 people, a charge that the South Koreans have denied.

So it goes to the fact that there seems to be some negotiation, some bargaining underway about something as seemingly benign as trying to reunite long lost families divided by the war -- Natalie.

ALLEN: Always more complicated than we could even imagine. Thank you so much, Ivan Watson for us there in Seoul.

VANIER: Next up on CNN, every minute counts. Rescuers in California are hoping to find people who went missing days ago after deadly mudslides.

ALLEN: And we will show you how passengers reacted seconds after their plane, right there, skidded off its runway in Turkey nose-down toward the sea.






VANIER: Rescue workers in Southern California are still combing through the wreckage after last week's mudslides, searching for survivors. But there is not much hope left at this stage.

ALLEN: Right; 20 people are now confirmed dead and at least four still missing. Thousands gathered Sunday for an emotional candlelight vigil to honor the victims. CNN's Paul Vercammen has more now from California.


PAUL VERCAMMEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: A week after this mudslide, they're now calling it more of a search and recovery. And look over here. You can understand why.

How could anyone survive this?

This is the 101 Freeway, that critical artery that links Los Angeles and San Francisco. And to the north of here, as this cleanup continues, they are complaining because the businesses there are open.

This is a heavily, heavily relied-on tourism region. As far north, more than a hundred miles in Morro Bay (ph), a shop owner saying we are giving kayak tours. You can come up here. We've heard this from hotels, from restaurants. But it's inaccessible. And they say they just need the business. They need this freeway back open.

And take a look at the hard work that has been going on over here, working to clear up the other side of the 101. We can see them reckoning with all of this mud. And they were thanking all of these first and these second responders throughout this area and in Montecito because they have been working 12-hour shifts, 24 hours, all weekend long.

And they're getting creative.

How do you reckon with all this mud?

And how do you reckon with a boulder that weighs multiple tons?

In one estimate they say that there are some boulders that might weigh 20 tons. We saw them sink holes, drill holes into these massive boulders all along Highway 192. And the creeks they were compromising, the bridges, they're worried about more rain to come.

After they sunk in the holes, drilled the holes, they were going to put in a special agent. And this agent can dissolve the boulders in 24 hours. So one massive rock could become broken into seven pieces in no time. That's the kind of stuff they are reckoning with in what has been just a heartbreaking week in Montecito.

I'm Paul Vercammen. Now back to you.


ALLEN: Well, I'm not expecting them to say they can dissolve a boulder.

VANIER: I had no idea.

ALLEN: All right. Well, way to go, workers. They need some of that.

Well, we're going to turn to another part of the country. The next storm to make its way across the U.S. could drop a lot of snow and ice on a lot of people.


VANIER: Yesterday we reported on a passenger jet that skidded off a runway at a Turkish airport. Now we're getting stunning new images.

ALLEN: If they could get any more stunning than the one we've seen, that one right there, 168 --


ALLEN: -- people were on board that airplane when this happened Saturday. You can see the plane's nose dangerously close to the Black Sea.

VANIER: A passenger took this video of passengers moments after the incident happened and Pegasus Airlines fortunately is able to report no one was hurt in this incident.

ALLEN: That's amazing. The only reason it didn't plunge into the sea apparently, according to reports, is that the wheels of the airplane got stuck in the mud. Let's hear it for that. Gosh.

Officials in Florida are praising a shuttle boat captain, whose quick thinking saved the lives of all 50 people on board. The shuttle was heading to a casino boat, when a fire started about a half a mile from shore. The captain turned the boat around as soon as he noticed the flames.

VANIER: And that's what made it easier for emergency workers to reach people who jumped overboard then to escape those flames; 15 passengers suffered injuries, including smoke inhalation.

ALLEN: Coming up here, he has come under criticism at home and abroad. What South Africa is doing about President Trump's purported vulgar remarks. That's ahead here as we push on. You're watching CNN NEWSROOM.




VANIER: Welcome back, everyone. Good to have you back with us. I'm Cyril Vanier from CNN HQ here in Atlanta.

ALLEN: I'm Natalie Allen. Let's update you on our top stories this hour.



VANIER: Alike most things in politics these days, the Democrats and the Republicans don't agree on what he said or if he even said it. Democratic Senator Dick Durbin laid out the words of the president reportedly said and Republican Senator Lindsey Graham basically agreed. However, two other senators, Tom Cotton and David Perdue seem to alter their stories going from, we can't remember if he said that to a more emphatic denial that he actually said that.


GEORGE STEPHANOPOULOS IS THE CHIEF WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT, ABC NEWS: Are you saying the president did not use the word that has been so widely reported?

SEN. DAVID PERDUE, (R) GEORGIA: I'm telling you he did not use that word, George. And I'm telling you it's a grossness representation, how many times you want me to say that?

SEN. TOM COTTON (R), ARKANSAS: I didn't hear that word either, I certainly didn't hear what Senator Durbin has said repeatedly.

SEN. JEFF FLAKE (R), ARIZONA: All I can say is I was in a meeting directly afterwards where those who had present into the press and our proposal spoke about the meeting and they used -- said those words were used before those words went public. So that -- that's all I can tell you is I heard that account before the account event went public.


VANIER: But well it should not come as a surprise that the reported comments did not go over well in Africa. South Africa is among the latest country to react that says it's lodging a formal complaint with the U.S. Embassy. CNN's David McKenzie is Johannesburg. He joins us live. David, tell us more about the Reaction where you are, not just the government but also how people -- how South Africans deal about this?

DAVID MCKENZIE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well thorough, I think people across the continent kind of lead the way and then the African government and African Diplomat followed by --following closely this controversy and now piling on as it were against the president's comments and the Diplomatic cause. So as you see it today the South African Department of International Relations Corporation will be hauling into the head of the embassy for what is the scene why it is addressing down, asking them to explain the comments attributed to President Trump. There is a big debate in the U.S. of whether these comments were racist or even whether the President of the United States is the racist. Fall less debate on the African continent that I have seen. The assumption from any Africans on social media and those people I'm speaking to from across the continent is that the president is the racist and this is just the latest comment attributed to him that really convinced the mind of Africans. This is the very challenging moment for American Diplomats on the country as illustrated by that latest move by the South African government. Cyril?

VANIER: Yes. How do you think ultimately this ends up impacted U.S. Relations on the African continent I mean beyond the symbolic, beyond calling, you know, calling in the number two of the embassy?

MCKENZIE: Well, a lot of it is symbolic including that move as you say, whether it's a long-term reaction or just another controversy that will fade away, it remains to be seen, Cyril. But there is a sense I'm sure and I'm from -- officials I've spoken to hope the last few months. From the American side that the president isn't helping their actions within the African context because every time something like this comes out as leak, it makes their work more difficult in the countries where they have good relations and tricky relations. It also worth remembering that the U.S. Ministry is heavily involved in parts West and East Africa. And they really depend on African counterparts to help them in the fight against terror particularly. So this all really doesn't help the U.S. when it comes to working on the African continent, Cyril?

VANIER: It's CNN's David McKenzie in Johannesburg. Thank you very much.

ALLEN: Meantime the Palestinian Authority President says Mr. Trump's Middle East Peace Plan is not a deal of the century but it's the slap of the century and Palestinians will return it. In a meeting of senior Palestinian officials, Mahmoud Abbas seems to confirm reports. The Trump administration is signaling that the town of Abu Dis should be the capital of a future Palestinian state.

VANIER: President Trump's recognition of Jerusalem is Israel's capital has angry Palestinians who want East Jerusalem for their capital. Mr. Abbas said the move disqualified the U.S. from any leading role in future peace talks.

[02:35:02] ALLEN: For more, Oren Liebermann joins us now from Jerusalem. The anger, Oren on the part of the Palestinians understandable and certainly no surprise.

OREN LIEBERMANN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Exactly. We haven't seen a speech that was this define from Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas in years it seems and much of that anger perhaps naturally was directed two countries. First, Israel who accused of violating and ignoring the Oslo Accords which is the bedrock of relations between Israelis and Palestinians and second he turned this anger to the United States who he once again absolutely rejected as a mediator in a peace process. He also singled out two specific members of the Trump administration for added criticism. First, U.S. Ambassador of the United Nations, Nikki Haley and then U.S. Ambassador of to Israel, David Friedman, those two have been openly critical of the Palestinians. What was interesting though is he didn't stop there with criticizing other countries. Abbas then went onto criticized the Arab states saying, we don't interfere on your affairs, stay out of ours basically and that appears to be a reference although he didn't mention any countries to Saudi Arabi which is working hand in hand with the Trump administration on an Israeli-Palestinian peace deal. Abbas directly rejecting whatever it is that the U.S. would put on the table, that peace plan had been largely mysterious but Abbas appeared to confirm part of it when he said the U.S. was proposing Abu Dis as a Palestinian capital. That's not part of East Jerusalem, it's a neighborhood of Palestinian neighborhood that's near Jerusalem but that's not what the international consensus is on what our future Palestinian state should look like. Natalie, the queen now is what follows this very hard rhetoric, this powerful language that comes from Abbas. He didn't make any decisions, he doesn't have the authority to do that. Now is the second day of the central council meeting this is where the decisions are made and the question is will there be any strong decisions to follow-up on what was a very strong speech.

ALLEN: All right. We'll wait and see. Oren Liebermann for us in Jerusalem. Thanks, Oren.

VANIER: And when we come back after the break. Pope Francis is on his way to South America ahead. The controversies that await him in Chile and Peru, stay with us.



[02:40:17] ALLEN: All right. We have a live video here that is the pope taking off for South America, the six-day tour will take him to Chile and Peru. This will be his first trip to Chile since he became pope. VANIER: Worshippers gathered in Chile's capital Santiago Sunday for a

vigil before his visit. Now he is very popular there still not everyone is happy to see him. Here is why, with CNN's Rafael Romo.


RAFAEL ROMO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Homemade firebombs exploded before dawn Friday at three churches in Chilean capital. Police say no one was hurt and the damage was minor. But the vandals threw pamphlets as they fled. One dread, Pope Francis, the next bomb will be in your robe. The incident came just days before he come to visit to arrive for a weeklong trip to Chile and Peru. The violence, a reminder of struggles both countries have faced with the Catholic Church.

JAMIE HUERTA, PAPAL MASS PARTICIPANT (via translator): We have to recognize that the church in Chile has suffered the shocks of scandals, of cover-ups and therefore we Catholics have pending issues to settle and tackle.

ROMO: In 2015 the pop appointed a bishop accused of protecting alleged pedophile while the bishop denied any wrongdoing, demonstrations are planned in Santiago, Tuesday.

JOSE ANDRES MURILLO, FOUNDATIONS FOR TRUST, PRESIDENT (via translator): The pope today represents what we thought was an organization that was going to support those of us who accused a priest of sexual abuse and yet they did the exact opposite. Supporting the image of the church its reputation and the aggressors.

ROMO: Another issue the rights of indigenous people who have protested what they see as a history of oppression closely tied to the Catholic Church.

AUCAN HUILCAMAN, COUNCIL OF ALL LANDS, SPOKESPERSON (via translator): It is not enough for the pope to say my peace, I give you. Because their peace has been disposition, submission, evangelization, domestication.

ROMO: Despite the church's controversies, Francis is a much-loved pope and the first from Latin America where many followers eagerly await his arrival, Monday.

SISTER BEATRIZ SANDOVAL, SISTER OF THE CENTER OF MARY SCHOENSTATT (via translator): I hope the pope gets here as soon as possible. I wish he was staying much longer.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (via translator): We welcome the pope who we are in need of here. People are in really bad shape. There's a lot of robbery. A lot of bad things, so we need some spirituality.

ROMO: Something the pope says he plans to deliver.

POPE FRANCIS, CURRENT POPE OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH: Brothers and sisters of Chile and Peru, I greet you with affection. I want to share your joys, sorrows, difficulties, and hopes. I want to tell you that you are not alone and that the pope is with you. That the whole church embraces you, that the church sees you.

ROMO: It is a message the inmates of a women' prison in Santiago hope to hear firsthand. Clapping and singing they rehearse for a live performance in front of Pope Francis during his visit there.

MARGARITA BERNAL, CHOIR PARTICIPANT: It is a very beautiful and happy occasion. Because it was done here by the women who are deprived of their freedom, I am excited to know that the pope is coming. I feel blessed.

ROMO: Rafael Romo, CNN.


VANIER: And after the break why a Silicon Valley Veteran says giving your kid a smartphone is like giving them a bottle of alcohol. And by the way, he should know he helped create the iPhone. And see you on the other set.


[02:45:56] PEDRAM JAVAHERI, CNN WEATHER ANCHOR: Weather Meteorologist Pedram Javaheri, tracking a wintry set up across portions the Midwestern of the great lakes of United States. All of the State of Illinois and the State of Indiana as well, under a winter weather advisories. In fact, all together, 60 million people from the north toward the south underneath winter weather alerts. And could see even some flurries and certainly ice from San Antonio up towards Dallas, Texas. We're pushing a lot of the activity well to the south here as the front skirts to the south.

You get a little rigid that build back behind the kind of reinforcing the shot of cooler and also the disturbance with the down toward the south. Snow showers initially not a major player but as we go in towards the latter portion of Tuesday into Wednesday, expect maybe five to ten centimeters. Certainly, we've seen far worse conditions but you put this down on major hubs like Chicago's O'Hare could be problematic.

Down toward the south, and it's all about the (INAUDIBLE), San Antonio towards Austin, less than a half centimeter of accumulation with still with (INAUDIBLE) back it could be make a dangerous go.

They going to three below for high as Chicago, 16 above in San Francisco. The cold air once again where it likes to be settled right around the northern and central of United States. We think some relief in store going in toward this weekend. Dallas rebounds tremendously going into this weekend.

But Atlanta, how about this? One of the cooler high temps you'll see of the season. But turn up stands about to below before warming up to 17 above by Sunday afternoon. Down with the Caribbean, San Juan morning showers. Caracas comes in with p.m. showers, 30 degrees for a high temp.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) VANIER: Welcome back. So, if you have one of these, you probably carry it around all day and used it all the time. You probably no longer even notice how much you use it.

ALLEN: It's awesome.

VANIER: Or not.

ALLEN: One of the people responsible for the iPhone says, the device he helped create can be as addictive as alcohol, and it's past time to start thinking about it. Former Apple Exec. Tony Fadell, spoke with our Laurie Segall.


LAURIE SEGALL, CNN SENIOR TECHNOLOGY CORRESPONDENT: You had a very integral role in creating the iPhone.

TONY FADELL, FORMER SENIOR VICE PRESIDENT, IPOD DIVISION, APPLE INC: Right, I was one of the team -- well, one of the leaders of the team to create the device.

SEGALL: At the time, were you thinking about screen time and addiction? Where any of those conversations happening behind closed doors at Apple?

FADELL: Absolutely not. We were just taking something that people used about regular basis, their laptops, their phones, whatever we putting it together. We never thought that this was going to be what it is today.

SEGALL: You, as someone who had firsthand experience creating the iPhone, a device that I myself and many other people I know are addicted too. What do you mean when you say this is the moment of unintended consequences?

FADELL: Well, if we look back 11 years ago, was the introduction of the iPhone. And now we have a device in our pockets at all times. Right there we choose beyond our bed stands too. So, when you put all of these things together, this is the unintended consequences that allow these products to become so important in our lives that is hard for us to put them down.

SEGALL: This is definite a Silicon Valley-size problem, how do you fix it?

FADELL: To know you're addicted, you have to have some kind of way to measure what you do. We have scales for our physical life, we can weigh ourselves. We have no scales for our digital life.

The companies like Apple, Google, Facebook, all this, they collect all these usage information. They know what we're doing but we don't have that information back. Then, we need controls to allow us just like we do in the physical world to set goals, but we need those tools and controls at the operating system level. SEGALL: That's an interesting point. I mean, this idea that there'll be even alert for -- an alert for digital consumption, that's what you're talking about.

FADELL: Exactly, and some people won't want any of them and some people will.

SEGALL: How do you negotiate the business decision and also the ethical obligations?

[02:50:03] FADELL: Give the tools to the people who want them. Just maybe they're going to spend less time, but maybe these people are going to be more healthy and live longer. So, you can actually buy more devices for another 10 years. But until we have these tools and controls, there's things that we can do as individuals. Would you put a bottle of alcohol next to your kid's bed?

SEGALL: No, no, no, I wouldn't. I wouldn't, Tony.

FADELL: If for you leave them with devices all night long in their bedroom, isn't that almost the same?

SEGALL: But the difference is as we didn't realize that our smartphone was the equivalent of a bottle of alcohol.

FADELL: Correct, but there are simple things we can do. Don't allow strung on the appetite even when you're eating.

SEGALL: Is it too late to the put the genie back in the bottle?

FADELL: No, it's never too late, we have to be optimistic.

SEGALL: They know Steve Jobs is your mentor, what do you think he thinks about this moment?

FADELL: When he initially started Apple, he said he wants to make the computer for the rest of us. That dream has come true. If he was here today, I'm sure he would be saying many the same things. And Apple still doing that wants to do the right thing for their customers.


VANIER: Let me bring in, Nir Eyal. Very happy Nir that we're talking about this today. You're an expert in how psychology business and technology intersect. So, you're the perfect first that be talking about this. You're also the author of the best-selling book, Hooked: How to Build Habit-Forming Products. Nir, are smartphones bad for you?

NIR EYAL, AUTHOR, HOOKED: You know, that's a question that the answer to is the answer to a lot of things in life. For that, the answer is, it depends. There is no easy answer to the question of "Is it bad for you?" because, like any tool, it's how you use it. Are hammers bad for you? Well, if you use them to build a house, they're fantastic. If you use it to bash someone's brains in, they're very bad. So, it's really about the technology is used.

VANIER: Well, what this is what scares me, I get the announced you with the hammer. What scares me is that we find out in 20 years' time -- and I say this as a parent of young children who are always, you know, asking for the iPhone. That we find out in 20 years' time that this is the next cigarette. Because it's so addictive because it's got negative effect, etcetera, etcetera. And we don't know it yet, but, you know, a generation will have been adversely impacted by the time we find out.

So, I supposed that's my question is. Is this the next cigarette?

EYAL: Well, it's not the next cigarette -- and that -- it's -- there's no barrier that is being crossed into the body. So, as bad as this technology potentially could be for us, you know, we got to put this in perspective, we're not free based in Facebook, we're not injecting Instagram here, these are behaviors.

And look, some people do have behavioral addiction, right? People gamble obsessively, people has sex addictions, people have food addictions. It doesn't necessarily need to be a drug that addicts us because people can be addicted to virtually anything. Now, what's difference here is these technologies are designed to keep us coming back.

VANIER: As users, is there anything that we need to know? Is there anything that we should be doing? Because in your talks, you explain that a lot of the applications, a lot of the services, the Facebook, the Twitters, the Instagrams, etcetera. They are designed -- as you just said, to keep people coming back.

Because there's that trigger, and I really encourage people from doing read your book and listen to your talk. There's a trigger, and people keep coming back to it because they want that reward.

Is there something that we need to sort of know perhaps? Not on moderate are used but to use it better in a way at least that it is not harmful.

EYAL: All right. So, there's two things I want people to know. Number one is that this is not an accident, right? The fact that these products are designed to keep you coming back is not a mistake if found an accident. You need to realize that these products are built by people who understand what makes you click and what makes you tick better than you understand yourself.

That being set the worst take away from this is that you think you're powerless. You know, there's been several studies done on addicts of hardcore drugs and alcohol that find that people who believe that they are powerless to resist temptation are the most likely to relapse.

So, the most important thing you can take away is number one, yes, these products are potentially addictive. But number two, there is so much you can do to resist that addiction just to put the technology displace. One of the most simple things you can do is to get control of those triggers. You know, two-thirds of people who own a smartphone never bother to change the notification settings on their phone, that's ridiculous. It will take 15 minutes, block that thing that keeps bringing you back to Facebook so that you can check it on your schedule, not on Facebook schedule. This is really, really simple stuff that all of us can do, and you know what? There's nothing those tech makers can do to stop us.

VANIER: All right, I'm blocking that thing after this interview. Well, last question, I've heard you say, all of this kind of technology can also actually be used for the better good, for the greater good. And help us life live happier more contented lives. Why you say that?

[02:55:07] EYAL: Absolutely. So, there is no way to separate what makes a product potentially addicted from what makes it good. And fond to use and user-friendly. I mean the reason that we find ourselves so engaged by this product is because they are designed so well we want to use them.

Now, that's not necessarily a problem, that's what we call progress. I mean, think about it for a minute. Do we want these products to be hard to use? To be things that we don't enjoy using? Of course not, that's ridiculous. It's up to us to take these technologies and make sure we use them responsibly.

And look, there will be an adjustment period where we need to figure out how to make sure we can control these technologies so that they don't control us.

VANIER: Nir Eyal, I'm so happy we spoke to you today. Thank you very much. Fascinating perspective there. Have a great day, thanks.

EYAL: Thank you.

ALLEN: All right, the commercial break, I'm going to take up all the silly Instagram. Instagram notices who cares. Thanks, Cyril, for that. Thanks for watching this hour, we'll be right back with our top story.


DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: You know, I'm not a racist. I'm the least racist person you have ever interviewed.

ALLEN: And that's the latest from the U.S. President on the topic on this.