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PRIMETIME JUSTICE WITH ASHLEIGH BANFIELD

Dog a Man`s Best Friend and Defender; Decades of Search for a Serial Killer. Aired 6-8p ET

Aired February 27, 2018 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(JOINED IN PROGRESS)

[18:00:00] S.E. CUPP, HOST, HLN: OK. Crime and Justice with Ashleigh Banfield is up next.

ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, HOST, HLN: Good evening, everyone. I`m Ashleigh Banfield. And this is Crime and Justice.

In the business of TV news there are two kinds of stories that are show stoppers. Stories about heroes and stories about dogs. And when those two

subjects collide, grab your breathing bag and a shot of jack and prepare to soak in the most awesome thing of the day.

We have Officer Nick Carmack for you. The moment that his moment dispatches his latest call two guys in a stolen SUV. And you can`t see Shep, his K9

partner who is in the backseat but you can hear him because Shep knows they`re being called into action and She`s excitement is building.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Copy. We`re going to be 10-31. We`re going to be -- hold on a second. We`re going to be westbound on Peace from JR.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Westbound Peace and JR at 15.57.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: So it turns out that Shep has good reason to be that excited because the driver of a stolen vehicle is about to make a run for it which

leaves his boss, Officer Carmack with a big decision to make. He can cut off the car`s passenger and then just let the driver go or he can leave the

passenger and chase down the driver. Or he can do both.

But for that he needs the aid of his trusty K9. So, ladies and gentlemen, watch as Nick and Shep get right to work.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`re slowing down. We`re doing about 75. It looks like they are looking for place to bail. They`re going to bail. They`re opening

the doors. Stand by.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Seventy miles per hour. Possibly looking for place to bail at 15.58.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They just wracked into a full semi.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Don`t run. Get on the ground. Get him. Get him. Get him, Shep. Get him, Shep right now on your face. Right now! Get him, Shep. Get

him, Shep. Get him, Shep. Hands behind you right now. Hands behind you right now, bro.

Pasco I need a unit right now. I got -- I released my dog on the driver. I got the passenger trying to run. I got him to tape. Get him, Shep!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I was trying to get out the car.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m 10-4. I need somebody here now. I can`t see my dog. Get up. Let`s go. Let`s go. Let`s go. Run, let`s go. Shep! Where are they?

Where are you? I`m good. Shep! Jay 39, I need air. Where are they. Shep! Here! Shep! Shep! Shep! Shep!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What you running for?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Shep! Shep, here! Hey, get up. Guys, my dog I got to hold him. He`s running with my dog. Where is somebody? Get on the ground

now. I`m not taking him. Get him, Shep. Get off my dog, bro. Get off my dog, bro.

I`m opening a driver. I`m chasing him. I`m carrying one suspect. Let`s go, now on the ground. On the ground, now. I`ll get him when you get on your

face. I`m not (muted) with you. On your face now. I`m going to tase the shit on you. Shep, down. Down. Down. Down. Leave him, down. Down. Stay.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m not moving, man.

[18:04:55] UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m in the driveway. On your face. On your face! Stay. Hands out. I`m not sure. I`m in a driveway. There`s no address.

Here somebody is coming. We`re good. I`m good. Let`s go. On your face. Put your face on him. I`m going to put him back on you.

I`m going to put him back on you. Put your hands out. Down. He`s the only one. Yes. He was carrying -- yes, I`m fine. He is just carrying my dog

through the woods. I hear him yelping. I know.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That`s a good man. That`s a good boy. I know you did your job.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I know. You did your job. You don`t listen, bro. I told you not to run. He took off one way. He took the other I`m stay on him and

he tried to grab him. I hear my dog yelping. I picked him up and carried him with me and ran through the woods.

I could see him dragging my dog through the woods. All right. Stand up. Good boy. Good boy. That`s my man. I know. I`ll meet you back out front.

I`m going to shut my siren off.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: That is how you catch a crook or at least how officer Shep catches a crook and his handler Officer Nick Carmack. My congratulations to

the Pasco County sheriff`s office for doing the job with a plum.

I want to bring in retired K-9 handler Jeff Schettler, and certified K9 axle. Not her real name but she`s gorgeous. There`s so many questions,

Jeff, I have about the line of work that you are in and the line of work that those puppy dogs are in.

Because to me, my puppy is adorable and sweet but would never follow commands like that. I want to know about what Shep did when Shep was out of

-- out of range of the camera. When Shep was chasing after the driver of that vehicle and we lost sight, what is Shep`s command to do? What are they

taught to do?

JEFF SCHETTLER, RETIRED K-9 HANDLER: Well, the whole situation is Shep needs to engage with the subject as soon as doggingly possible. We need

Shep to engage with the subject. Keep him within range of the handler if it all possible and keep him restrained. It`s important that Shep engages with

the subject in such way that the subject can`t use a weapon or fight back. This is ideally what we need to have happen.

BANFIELD: I know ideally is what you`re always hoping for. But I`ve often seen your K-9 associates engage with someone in front you, meaning you can

kind of monitor what`s going on but Shep was incredible. I mean, get him, Shep was all Shep needed to chase that bad guy out of range and I actually

-- I don`t know about you.

I mean, you would know better than me but I felt like I could hear in Officer Nick Carmack`s voice the terror of the possibility that he might

have lost his dog. That that bad guy may have done something to that dog and that he might not see him again.

SCHETTLER: Well, I think any officer who ever deploys his dog has these moments of panic when the dog goes out of sight. But it`s one of the parts

of the job that every officer has to deal with. There`s times that you have to put your dog into a search pattern where you`re going to lose sight of

them especially in a wooded environment like this.

This is a very, very difficult situation. Not only is the officer engaged with a subject right in front of him. He has to handcuff this guy and

restrain him but his dog is now deployed after the second subject. I mean, it`s literally a catch 22 situation.

BANFIELD: I mean he had to make that decision when he grabbed this first guy that we`re seeing on the video, cuff him and then he literally had to

decide do I leave him here? Do I run after my dog? Do I leave my dog or do I haul this 200 some pound guy along with me? And that was the decision he

made. Was that the right decision, is that the typical decision or is this all done on the fly?

SCHETTLER: Well, it`s hard to backseat drive any type of deployment. You know, I think in this situation we have a number of variables that took

place that the officer couldn`t have been prepared for, for every one of them.

I don`t think that he expected his dog to chase the subject for such a long distance. And the other thing is I didn`t -- I don`t think he expected the

other subject to jump out of the car the way he did. So he had to deal with two things simultaneously. I think he actually did a pretty good job with

it.

[18:10:01] BANFIELD: Well, I hate to say that I actually delighted in seeing this because it seems to me that the guy in the cuffs was exhausted

and was having to run military style nonetheless because there was no other choice.

His buddy has decided to take off and that was going to be, you know, his fate after that. So I do have another question and I want to roll a part of

the video.

SCHETTLER: Sure.

BANFIELD: It`s a little tricky to see. So, you know, we`ll slow it down as best we can and zoom in on it. But it`s the moment when Officer Carmack

comes upon Shep who seems to have the suspect and it`s hard to tell but it looks like he`s got him by wrist. Is that what dogs are trained to do?

SCHETTLER: Well, it really depends how the dog has been trained. I mean, the dog can engage in a number of ways. They can engage below the waist,

they can engage on whatever body part that the subject extends to them. It really depends on how the subject is fighting back, if he is or if he

isn`t.

I can`t really say with certainty how Shep was trained because I haven`t had any involvement with the officer or the dog. So it`s impossible to

really say just by looking at the video.

BANFIELD: Well, in about 49 minutes, pardon my math but somewhere around there we`re actually going to have Shep and Officer Nick Carmack come and

join us and answer some of those questions. Because this is all sort of unraveling live for us as well.

And so getting him on the air will be sort of a lot of fun but at the same time I think really enlightening for the rest of us who maybe don`t come

into contact with K-9 officers that often.

I did want to ask you about what you said and that`s how the bad guys tend to fight off the K-9s. What do they do and how do you train in terms of

knowing that a dog is going to come up against someone who`s going to do anything to stop the dog?

SCHETTLER: Well, first off, we have to have a dog that has the type of fight drive that when he engages with our subject that he keeps the subject

right there and doesn`t allow him to fight back. We don`t want the dog to disengage or to follow the subject without stopping him. And we need to

have this end as quickly as possible.

So the fight drive has a lot to do with it. If the subject is going to be fighting back by kicking, hitting, using any type of weapons, the dog has

to be fast on its feet and has to be tough. It has to be able to get through all of this without ever giving up. And that`s really hard to ask

any animal to do, any dog in particular. It takes a lot of training, a lot of time and a lot of experience for not only the dog but also the handler.

BANFIELD: So the dog sitting beside you, I have not failed to notice how incredibly disciplined Axel is. Axel has been either staring at you or

staring straight at the camera and nary moved a muscle.

SCHETTLER: Right.

BANFIELD: And is that basically the way Axel will sit until you tell Axel to sit otherwise?

SCHETTLER: Well, she`s been paid very well. So, yes, it`s all just good obedience.

BANFIELD: She`s unbelievable.

SCHETTLER: It`s all obedience. Just good obedience.

BANFIELD: And by the way, she`s absolutely stunning to look at. I mean, I`m a huge dog person so there`s that but she`s just...

(CROSSTALK)

SCHETTLER: I know. Can you see those eyes? Look at those eyes.

BANFIELD: Yes, I am transfixed by her eyes. The same color as your vest. She`s beautiful. Real quick. I have one last question. Apparently, Shep got

an ice cream treat after all of this. But it did not, it wasn`t lost on me how Officer Cormack or Carmack changed his voice immediately saying "good

boy. Good boy, such a good boy." I mean, it was almost sing songy. Was that out of relief or is that out of training?

SCHETTLER: You know, I think it`s kind of a, you know, a combination of things. I mean, the voice command and the way the handler is working with

the dog. Not only is the dog reading the body language of the handler but the voice is everything. And so, it could mean correction. It could mean

praise. It could mean a command. A number of different things.

BANFIELD: Well, listen, I can`t thank you enough for coming on and talking us through this. I can`t wait to also speak with Officer Carmack who is

going to join us like I said about 45, 46 minutes from now. And if you can give a good real good girl to Axel for us and a little scrub between the

ears I`d appreciate it as well, Jeff. Thank you.

SCHETTLER: All right. Pretty girl. You did great. Very good. OK. She`s done.

BANFIELD: Good girl. Good girl.

Thank you, Jeff. I`m so excited. I can`t wait to meet Shep. So I hope you`ll stay with us into the next hour of Crime and Justice and also talk

to Nick a bit about what he went through.

P.S., a little teaser ahead. Just in October, Nick was in an a incident that was extraordinary. So frightening. It involved an AK, it involves

shots fired, it involved a murder. And I believe that Shep was on location as well. But I have to sort through there so we`re going to talk to him in

a moment about that.

[18:14:56] I also have new information tonight on a search for a serial killer and not just any serial killer. California police say they now have

some new clues in man hunt for the man become -- who`s become known as the Golden State killer. He`s wanted for 12 murders, he`s wanted for dozens of

sexual assault. All this goes back to the 1970s.

One of the lead detectives is going to join us straight ahead with the new information and why they think this guy is still out there and still alive.

[18:20:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: There are cold cases and there are cases that can chill you to the bone. Cases where the killer has ice in his veins and this is one of

those cases. Because the man behind 12 murders and over 50 rapes and assaults. The man who terrorized an entire state for ten years is still out

there somewhere tonight. He could be your neighbor. He could be your friend. And God forbid he is your husband. Because he is known as the

Golden State killer.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In June of 1976, a community was taken hostage. One of the most prolific serial killers in the history of this state if not in

this nation.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The subject has eluded investigations for over four years. The victims and families deserve justice.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We believe he`s alive. Anywhere from 60 to 75 years old.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The FBI is also offering a reward of up to $50,000.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The answer is out there. We need a name.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Back in the day in the 1970s, people in Sacramento felt safe.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It was small town atmosphere. People were friendly. The kids could play outside. There was a sense of peace and safekeeping.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`ve been hitchhiking since junior high school. Last summer I even went coast to coast by hitching.

MARCUS KNUTSON, SPECIAL AGENT, FBI SACRAMENTO: Sacramento was a quiet town at the time. People didn`t lock their doors at night.

PAIGE KNEELAND, DEPUTY SHERIFF, SACRAMENTO COUNTY SHERIFF`S DEPARTMENT: During the summer, it can be very hot during the day and at night you get

this nice delta breeze and so you leave your windows open.

ANNE MARIE SCHUBERT, DISTRICT ATTORNEY, SACRAMENTO COUNTY: That time in the mid-70s, it was a time when my parents would say, just make sure you`re

home before dark. That was it. But when the east area rapist start hitting, that all changed.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: The east area rapist, the Golden State killer was on the front of every paper as he worked his way from Northern California to Southern

California. Raping, killing, attacking, scores of innocent people from 1976 to 1986 and then he seemed to vanish.

But police think he`s still alive. And they want you to help them track him down. In fact, HLN has a five-part true crime original series called

Unmasking a Killer that premiers this Sunday, or Sunday, the March 18th at 9 o`clock Eastern.

And the reason that series is going to air is because there`s new information. Information that actually could help find this guy.

With me now, detective Sergeant Paul Belli. He`s a homicide bureau supervisor with the Sacramento County Sheriff`s Department. Also FBI agent

and profiler, Mary Ellen O`Toole. She was part of the team that actually work on the Golden State killer case. Also with me live is defense attorney

Darren Kavinoky.

Thank you to all three of you. I want to start with you, detective sergeant if I can. This case is one of those stories like Charles Manson. It gets in

your skin and it doesn`t leave. And I guess it`s good for good reason because he never went away. He`s still out there somehow. But why do you

think he`s still alive after all these years?

PAUL BELLI, DETECTIVE SERGEANT, SACRAMENTO COUNTY SHERIFF`S DEPARTMENT: Well, he would only be between 65 and 75 based upon descriptions of the

time in which he was offending. The descriptions are anywhere from 20 to approximately 30 years old. So actuarially, he certainly be alive at this

stage in his life.

BANFIELD: Well, actuarially is one thing. But then there is the whole cold turkey thing and I don`t know, maybe Mary Ellen, maybe you`re the person to

answer this.

But do serial killers who are so prolific who hurt so many people and kill so many people, do they just stop. Do they literally just stop and go

underground or do they die silently and take their secrets with them?

MARY ELLEN O`TOOLE, RETIRED FBI AGENT & PROFILER: Well, typically they don`t just stop. But I agree with the detective. We`ve had cases, they`re

not -- they`re not typical but we`ve had cases like the BTK in Kansas, the blind, torture, kill killer who stopped for 18 years and then he was

ultimately identified.

[18:25:03] So we feel like it`s unusual but in this case because this offender appears to have started out as a fairly young guy, his age, how

old he would be right now it makes it certainly a good enough possibility that law enforcement wants to stay on his trail.

BANFIELD: So, detective, there is one thing fascinating -- well, listen, there are many things fascinating about this case. But about the stoppage,

about this sort of going underground and staying underground for decades because we`re now going on a little over 40 years since the reign of terror

of this guy began.

Is it possible that he started and had an M.O. and that got you on his trail and for ten years he continued his patterns and then changed his

patterns? Meaning, loads and loads of murders since then aren`t attributable to him at least not that we know of.

BELLI: I would say that`s possible especially when you consider the fact that DNA was starting to become something known to become something that

was at least known to people right around 1986 which was the last time of his known offense.

As he moved forward he could have very easily discovered more information related to that. Because prior to 1986 we had a four and a half, five year

gap. So it could have been that he was slowing down and then also is able to learn a little bit more about what it is that he`s doing and could have

changed a variety of things so that we may not necessarily know additional crimes that he has committed.

BANFIELD: So the intriguing part of the time line is that this all started back, you know, in 1976. You yourself, you know, have been on the case,

detective, for ten years. But Richard Shelby and Carol Daily, they`re retired detectives with the Sacramento County Sheriff`s Department. They

speak at length about this crime and the series and how they started putting the pieces together and realize that they, in fact, had the same

guy on their hands doing the same thing over and over. Have a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RICHARD SHELBY, RETIRED DETECTIVE, SACRAMENTO COUNTY SHERIFF`S DEPARTMENT: October 5th, 1976 I was assigned to home invasion, sexual assault.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My partner Shelby and I we just had a rape you and you to get on it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Carol Daily and I arrived in the same car. Jane was sitting in a room. And somebody cut her wrist loose. She had shoe strings

around her wrist. It was a well planned assault. Too much detail. It was too well timed. He knew exactly when her husband was leaving and I thought

there`s more to this than the guy having a chance to run in and rape somebody.

RUSS OASE, RETIRED SPECIAL AGENT, SACRAMENTO COUNTY FEDERAL PROTECTIVE SERVICES: Richard Shelby asked for all the rape reports for the prior year.

He started going through them and what he noticed is that he started seeing the same method of operation.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And Lieutenant Shelby said this is the same guy. We had a serial rapist going. There were several prior cases with the same

M.O. Jane was rape number five.

SHELBY: During the attacks he was like a broken record. He comes in most of the time either through a sliding door or a window that got the screen off.

He would wake the victims up with flashlight or stick a gun in her face and he would tell them not to look at him.

OASE: He would have usually some type of rope to tie them up.

SHELBY: When he talked it was through clenched teeth.

OASE: You scream I`ll kill you.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do as I say I`m going to kill you.

SHELBY: I`ve got a .45 and I will use it. I will kill you. I`ll stick you with my knife.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: It`s chilling to hear these accounts. And what may be even more chilling is one of the victims because 51 people survived this guy and were

able to give descriptions not only of his look but also of his behavior and his patterns. This particular victim talks about what happened to her the

night she crossed paths with him. Have a listen.

(BEGIN VOICE CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I woke up with hand over my mouth. Sock stuffed in my mouth. Blindfolded. Gagged. Hands tied, legs tied. He said, "if you move,

I`m going to kill you."

(END VOICE CLIP)

BANFIELD: Detective, has anyone ever claimed to be this person only to be determined through evidence and secrets maybe that you`re keeping and only

the killer will know to have born that not to be true?

BELLI: No. We`ve not had anybody come forward to indicate that they with the offender.

BANFIELD: So, Darren Kavinoky, just from a legal perspective, time is brutal to cold cases in so many ways. It`s brutal to memories. It`s brutal

to victims who are no longer alive to testify. It`s brutal to evidence. And it`s brutal to the statute of limitations as well.

[18:29:58] Do you see that as a massive challenge even if they ever catch this guy?

DARREN KAVINOKY, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, you`re right, Ashleigh. Cases in criminal court tend to not get better with age because victims and

witnesses can die or lose their memories or become otherwise unavailable. But the good thing in California from a prosecutor`s standpoint is there is

no statute of limitations on murder. So while the sex base (ph) defend is the statute of limitations can vary based on the unique facts of each

individual case, in a murder prosecution, you don`t have any of those statute of limitations issues.

And of course, one of the things that the detective mentioned which I think is so spot on besides his dashing haircut and he needs to be commended for

that, but obviously this is a case involving DNA evidence.

And that`s something that may help the prosecution team if they do finally unearth the killer or unearth the suspect that if there is DNA evidence

that ties this individual to those cases, that`s something that can even span the gulf of decades.

BANFIELD: Well, I`ll tell you what, there`s a lot of that. It turns out and I don`t want to get into the really dirty details but when you have that

many rapes, you definitely have that much DNA, and his was voluminous in particular, which is also a clue to this crime.

Can you both stay around? And Mary Ellen, can you stay around as well? Because I have just so many more questions. Number one about the

psychological profile that`s been created of this guy. And number two, whether you all think he`s proud of his work, and if there are killings

that have not been attributed to him, will he try to get them that way and will that trip him up?

If you can both stay, I`ve got that -- all three of you, actually, I`ve got those questions coming up. Plus, one more nugget of information that`s new

about this case.

[18:35:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: Serial killers typically torture us for a finite length of time until they get caught. And we track them in a court of law where they have

to answer for their crimes, right? But there is this one killer who has been haunting us for more than 40 years.

A man who killed 12 people in the 70s and the 80s often in their own homes, often right in front of their loved ones, and somehow, somehow, he got away

with it every time. And tonight, he still hasn`t been caught even though he has terrorized California for over 10 years.

(START VIDEO CLIP)

ANNE MARIE SCHUBERT, DISTRICT ATTORNEY, SACRAMENTO COUNTY: You only need to say three words and that is east area rapist, and everybody remembers it.

It was a time when really an essence of community was taken hostage. Everybody knew it. It was on the news every night.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: The golden state killer sparked so much fear for so long because he`s got a couple of other nicknames too like the original night stalker.

And then there was the east area rapist, known for attacking more than 50 women on top of those murders using his own shoe laces to bind them.

And then of course there were the burglaries, which brings me to the news tonight. The burglaries. Up until now, not everybody thought that a whole

bunch of burglaries might just be the same guy who started raping and then started killing.

Joining me again, Detective Sergeant Paul Belli, homicide bureau supervisor with the Sacramento County Sheriff`s Department, also FBI agent and

profiler Mary Ellen O`Toole. She was actually part of the team working on the golden state killer case. And defense attorney Darren Kavinoky is with

us still as well.

So detective, just take me to this whole story of these burglaries, because this is now bringing the whole thing back 42 years later. And I`m going to

ask if our producers can put up this comparative series of sketches.

On the left hand side of the screen where our audience is going to see is the sketches of the golden state killer and what we come to know as the

golden state killer.

But on the right hand side of the screen, new sketches, new sketches of the guy responsible for a whole bunch of burglaries. And I don`t think it`s

lost on anyone, detective, they look like the same guy. You`re convinced they are?

PAUL BELLI, HOMICIDE BUREAU SUPERVISOR, SACRAMENTO COUNTY SHERIFF`S DEPARTMENT: Yes. When we went back and did a burglary analysis dating back

to 1972, we recognized that there was a cat burglar that was operating in the same area that the east area rapist ended up operating five years

later.

And in going back and looking at all those 60,000 plus reports throughput the years, we found that many of the methods that the cat burglar was

utilizing to commit his crimes and doing during his crimes are very, very similar to what the east area rapist was doing and what was documented

during his series.

BANFIELD: I want to play if I can something from an investigator who was part of the very last victim`s crime. And the victim`s name was Jenelle

Cruz. This killer seemed to go cold after Ms. Cruz was murdered.

[18:40:00] So, as far as we know at this point, Ms. Cruz was the last known victim. Here is Larry Montgomery, an investigator, talking about joining

this case and coming into this story.

(START VIDEO CLIP)

LARRY MONTGOMERY, INVESTIGATOR: I was a fairly new investigator working with the Irvine Police Department and got a call that a homicide had

occurred up the north part of town. And so I drove out there with my partners and discovered Janelle Cruz`s body in her bedroom.

She had been struck multiple times on her face and head by some object that was fairly hard. We didn`t find a murder weapon at the scene. We did find

from the family that there had been a pipe wrench that had been left outside the backdoor and we did not find that wrench.

She also had pieces of ripped cloth which were all over her body. It could be consistent with strips of material that was being ripped above her. Her

arms were tied by the soft ligatures from the cloth, then taken by the killer so he wouldn`t leave evidence at the scene.

This is a person who has a desire to hurt and to kill in a very violent hands-on way. This brutality is different. There was a unusually large

amount of semen. It does appear that this particular individual was probably excited about what he was doing.

LARRY CROMPTON, DETECTIVE: He`s doing what he wants to do. He`s killing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: I want to read for you some of the psychological profile that`s been put together on the golden state killer. It`s likely he drove a well-

maintained car, dressed well, neat, well-organized in his personal life.

Likely began as a voyeur in his late teens or early 20s. Engaged in deviant behavior. That`s sort of unacceptable sexual practices in common parlor.

Possibly unmarried. Likely didn`t enter into long-term relationships. If married, probably had a wife who was tolerant of the sexual behavior.

Had a criminal record as a teen that was likely expunged. Was a skilled, experienced cat burglar and may have begun that way. Had some knowledge of

police investigative methods and evidence.

Hated women for real or perceived wrongs. Would have been described as arrogant and domineering, manipulative, a chronic liar. Would continue

committing violent crimes until incapacitated, death, or other means.

Mary Ellen O`Toole, two questions. How do you get that kind of information by someone who is virtually a ghost? And number two, is that kind of a

person going to take his crimes to his grave?

MARY ELLEN O`TOOLE, RETIRED FBI AGENT AND PROFILER (via telephone): well, some of those -- some of what you read to me sounds fairly speculative and

going out on a limb and being too risky. When the FBI or FBI trained analyst, when we do a profile, we look at all the behavior and the

forensics in the crime scene.

If series of scenes, we look at every one of those scenes. We pull together the forensics and the behavior. From that, we`re able to describe sort of

how the crime occurred, the motivation, and more about the offender`s personality. I would agree that some of those statements are not in-depth.

They are more speculative than what an FBI profiler would read.

BANFIELD: Detective, do you think he`s so proud of his crimes that if there are crimes out there that aren`t attributed to him, he`ll want you to

attribute them to him? Meaning, you might be able to trip him up?

BELLI: I`m not sure if that`s a question I can necessarily answer. I don`t know that he would necessarily be proud. I think the the offended for

reasons probably only known to him. I would certainly hope that if there are other crimes attributed to him that we could figure those out in some

way.

BANFIELD: So I just want to let our audience know that as we, you know, launch into this five-part series, you are also launching into a very big

project as well. There is a new website that is up and running for anybody who wants to learn more about this and actually supply information because

that`s how these things get solved.

The website is at sacsheriff.com. You can call FBI, 1-800-CALL-FBI. That`s 2255324. So there you go. There is the information. Sacsheriff.com, 1-800-

CALL-FBI.

Thanks so much to you, detective, for the work you`re doing so many years later.

BELLI: Thank you.

BANFIELD: Also to Mary Ellen O`Toole on the phone with us, and Darren Kavinoky, as always, thank you to you too.

[18:45:00] You don`t want to miss any of the HLN five-part true crime original series, "Unmasking a Killer." It premieres Sunday, March 18, 9:00

p.m. Eastern time.

A point-blank shooting streamed out live on Facebook by the victim himself. And now there`s a suspect in jail charged with his murder but the big

question is, why on earth did this happen?

[18:50:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: Whether it was on the streets or on their news feeds, the people of Wingate, North Carolina were probably used to seeing him. A 55-year-old

man named Prentis Robinson streaming videos on Facebook live everywhere he went.

And yesterday he was at it again, walking outside with a selfie stick, reportedly complaining about a theft, saying that one of his own family

members may have stolen one of his phones. And he had just actually reported that to the police.

But Prentis is not going to get that phone back. And that`s because of the man he ran into just after he left the police station. Mr. Robinson`s

camera was rolling live, this is what stranger did to him.

(START VIDEO CLIP)

(GUNSHOT)

BANFIELD (voice over): The killer even had the gall to step over Prentis Robinson`s body and the camera was still broadcasting live. Prentis was

left face down on the street, but that live stream was a critical clue to who his killer was. And with police at a loss for words struggling to

process how fast this all happened.

DONNIE GAY, CHIEF, WINGATE POLICE DEPARTMENT: I just spoke to him. It was so -- I don`t know. It`s hard to say anything about that. Just got through

talking to him.

BANFIELD (voice over): For almost 24 hours, the gunman was on the loose. The local university and the elementary school were put on lockdown in a

town of less than 4,000 people. But this morning a suspect turned himself in and was charged with first-degree murder and tonight he`s in jail

without bond.

GAY: Several tips came in from the video, from the Facebook live video. Several people had recognized his voice and his stature and a few had even

seem him wearing the same clothing earlier in the video.

BANFIELD (voice over): Sixty-five-year-old Douglas Colson will appear in court tomorrow for the murder of Prentis Robinson. And the question tonight

is, why would he do it? Why would anyone do it?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Defense attorney Darren Kavinoky joins me live now from Los Angeles. I rarely have you as a guest. When you can see a crime actually be

carried out on video, especially when it`s the victim videotaping the crime perpetrator against him, I`m assuming you`re pretty surprised but then

again not.

KAVINOKY: Well, it is a bit shocking and I`m reluctant to use the word ironic that somebody that was so prolific in you-tubing and videoing

himself would actually videotape his own murder.

And I think the thing I`m most stunned by in hearing the story is that this person actually turned himself which is something that`s something you

never hear in a murder case where you`re looking at the possibility of a life sentence without the possibility of parole or even the death penalty.

BANFIELD: And it is remarkable that the person who turned himself in, you can see him on the live feed. You can hear the murder victim saying you`re

live right now, bro. You`re live. You`re live. And it happens any way. It`s just -- it`s sort of astounding, all at once.

Darren, I`m going to ask you to stick around, if you can, because if I told you that Missouri police were involved in a high speed chase for a naked

guy driving a stolen ATV the wrong way down the interstate, would you believe me? What if I showed it to you?

(START VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice over): Swear to God. White dude, naked as a jaybird on an ATV running against traffic on I-29. He`s getting ready to

pass us.

BANFIELD (voice over): That`s one more thing and it`s straight ahead.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[18:55:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: One more thing for you tonight from Kansas City, Missouri. And you kind of just have to see it to believe it.

(START VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice over): Swear to God. White dude, naked as a jaybird on an ATV running against traffic on I-29. He`s getting ready to

pass us. Dude is naked. Only in Kansas City.

Hold on. I`m getting out of these cops way. Wow.

(LAUGHTER)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice over): Wow. This dude is going faster on an ATV than we can go in car.

BANFIELD (voice over): Yes. White dude naked as a jaybird on an ATV. You heard it right. And police caught up with 27-year-old Jonathan Menth, when

he wrecked out the stolen ATV. He`s now got a brand new mugshot.

Looks to be naked from the waist up. He also has a laundry list of charges including burglary, tempering with a motor vehicle, and property damage.

One thing we did not see on the charge document, indecent exposure.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[19:00:00] BANFIELD: At least not yet. Next hour of "Crime and Justice" starts right

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: When you steal a car.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Looks like they are looking for place to bail.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And crash it into a pole. Do not make a run for it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Get him, Shep.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because at least in Pasco, Florida, you are going to get caught by this guy.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Shep, down. Down. Down.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The incredible video of good boy taking down the bad guys.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That`s a good boy. I know you did your job.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He killed at least 12 people.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She had been struck multiple times on her face and head.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Attacked over 50 women.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He knew exactly when her husband was leaving.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And did it inside their own home.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He kind (INAUDIBLE) to a sliding door or women that screen off.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Sometimes making their love ones watch.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If you scream, I will kill you.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do as I say or I`m going to kill you.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I have got .45 and I will use it. Will kill you if you look to my knife.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Forty years later, he still hasn`t been caught.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We believe he is alive anywhere from 60 to 75 years old.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Tonight, the search is on for the twisted golden state killer.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BANFIELD: God evening, everyone. I`m Ashleigh Banfield. And welcome to the second hour of CRIME AND JUSTICE.

It`s often said after a hard day there`s nothing like the loyal greeting of a dog. And it turns out after a grand theft auto, there`s nothing like the

loyal greeting of a K-9 officer.

You could just ask officer Nick Carmak and his partner, Shep of the Pasco County sheriff`s office in north of Florida, north of Tampa. When the call

came in to officer Carmak`s cruiser that a pair in a stolen SUV was on the run and need of catching, well, Shep could hear the radio from the backseat

and boy did that dog come alive with excitement.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We are going to be. Hold on one second. We`re going to be westbound on peace from JR.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Not your average dog riding in the car, right. Shep knows something is up and Shep is right. Because the guys in the stolen SUV are

about to make a run for it in two different directions. So officer Carmack is about to rely on his K-9 partner more than he has before.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

OFFICER NICK CARMAK, PASCO COUNTY SHERIFF`S OFFICE: (INAUDIBLE). We are slowing down. Doing about 75. Looks like they are looking for place to

bail. They are going to bail. They are opening the doors. Stand by.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE).

CARMAK: They just rocked into a hole. Standby. 70 miles an hour. Possibly looking for place to bail.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They just wrecked into a full semi.

CARMAK: Don`t run. Get on the ground. Get him. Get him. Get him Shep. Get him Shep. Get him. Hands behind you right now. Hands behind you right now.

I need a unit right now.

Pasco, I need a unit right now. I got -- I released my dog on the driver. I got the passenger trying to run. Get him, Shep.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I was trying to get out the car.

CARMAK: 10-4. I need somebody here now. I can`t see my dog. Get up. Let`s go. Let`s go. Let`s go. Run, let`s go. Shep! I need Eric. Where are they?

Where are you? I`m good. Shep! Here! Shep! Shep! Shep! Shep!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What you running for?

CARMAK: Shep! Shep, here! Get over here. Hey. He`s running with my dog. Where is somebody? Get on the ground now. I`m not taking him. Get him,

Shep. Get off my dog, bro. Get off my dog, bro. I`m chasing him. I`m carrying one suspect. Let`s go, now on the ground. On the ground, now. I`ll

get him when you get on your face. I`m not (bleep) with you. Your face now. I`m going to tase you. Shep, down. Down. Down. Down. Leave him, down. Down.

Stay.

[19:05:52] UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I`m not moving, man.

CARMAK: K13. I`m in the driveway. On your face. On your face. Stay. Hands out. I`m not sure. I`m in a driveway. There`s no address. Somebody`s

coming. I`m good. Let`s go. On your face. Put your hands out. I`m going to put him back on you. I`m going to put him back on you. Put your hands out.

Down. He`s the only one. Yes. He was carrying - yes, I`m fine. He just carrying my dog through the woods. I hear him yelping. I know.

CARMAK: That`s a good man. That`s a good boy. I know you did your job. I know. You did your job. You don`t listen, bro. I told you not to run.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE)

CARMAK: He took off one way, he took the other. I stayed on him and he bit me so I have to grab. And I hear my dog yelping. I picked him up and

carried him with me and ran to the woods. I could see him dragging my dog through the woods. Stand up. Good boy. Good boy. That`s my man. I know.

I`ll meet you back out front. I`m going to shut my siren off.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BANFIELD: OK. I have to do the slow clap. Because with me right now Pasco sheriff`s office K-9 deputy Nick Carmack and his partner Shep.

Congratulations to both of you for pulling this off. First and foremost, how are you doing, you know? Nick, how are you? Are you OK tonight?

CARMAK: Yes, good. Good. I have had the last couple of days off.

BANFIELD: How is Shep?

CARMAK: He is good. He was listening to the video and he is all amped up now because he thinks I`m yelling to him to go get somebody.

BANFIELD: You know, it is so interesting because as it was playing, the producers in the control room said you won`t believe what`s going on with

Shep. Because as the video is playing, I guess he could hear some of the audio. I`m going to roll some of the pictures of you guys listening to what

we just showed our audience so that our audience can see what Shep`s reaction was. Take a pause and look at this.

(VIDEO CLIP PLAYING)

BANFIELD: It`s awesome. Look at it. He`s so incredibly alert. Those ears are just fantastic. He is a little worked up, Nick, because of that?

Because if hearing all that?

CARMAK: Yes. He hears me. It`s me on the audio. So he thinks I`m trying to tell him to do something. So he gets a little amped up.

BANFIELD: Well, I hope he is going to be OK. He is a remarkable specimen as I`m sure I don`t need to tell you. But I have some questions about how all

that played out. When you said go get him, Shep. Did you expect Shep to chase him as far as he did way into the woods out of your sight?

CARMAK: Yes. Shep is not going to stop until he detains the guy or holds him. Ultimately, the guy didn`t tell me what he did. He actually had Shep`s

collar twisted in his hand. He was choking Shep and had him out as far as he was get away from his body so he can`t bite him anymore. He was dragging

him up the drive way to get away.

BANFIELD: Seriously. I was wondering because I couldn`t tell from the video from your body cam, it looked as though Shep had him by the wrist and that,

you know, that Shep, you know, teeth were this his wrist but what you are seeing is he was holding Shep off him by twisting his collar.

CARMAK: Yes. Shep actually bit him twice. Once on the left leg and once on the right arm. He had two bite marks there. So my fear, he couldn`t tell me

what he did, but my theory was that Shep had bit his leg. He got him off and Shep reengaged his right arm and then he choked him off and then he

figured out if he choked him and put him off to one side as far as he get away, Shep wouldn`t bite him anymore and he could run up the drive way to

try to get away.

[19:10:13] BANFIELD: Do you need a minute to calm Shep down there? Because I can tell that that he is still worked up.

CARMAK: Yes. No. He is probably going to do his thing. He is just going to amped up all the time because I`m talking.

BANFIELD: Yes. Well, he was super amped up in the backseat when the call came over the radio. Is that typically how things work? I mean, he hears

it`s on. We got a gig and it`s on. Does he get excited that way?

CARMAK: Yes. It`s consistency. So every time I go to a call to go track somebody or catch somebody like that or case a car or something like that,

my lights and sirens are always on. So once they come on, he knows its game time and get amped up. And he starts to whine and do his thing.

BANFIELD: So I know our Skype is freezing up a little bit. I`m getting most of what you are saying, though. And I will say this, Nick, when I watched

the video the first time and Shep took off after the driver and you were cuffing the passenger, I felt like I could hear something in your voice

that sounded a little frightened. Like I have to get this guy. I have to chase down this guy because he has run off with hi dog. Were you at all

worried at some point that you weren`t going to get your dog back? That you weren`t going to find him.

CARMAK: No. I knew I would get him back. I heard Shep yelp in the woods so I knew that he was fighting the guy because I heard him yelp real loud. But

I couldn`t see him. So I mean, it`s an eerie feeling when you have one guy and your dog is gone and you can`t see him at all. So I was a little amped

up. And then my only thing was is I got to go find my dog. So I made the guy get up and run with me and go get him.

BANFIELD: I thought that was, you know, slightly delightful, honestly, to hear the guy having to do the military run with you and sort of coughing

and sputtering all the way. But I mean, he realized that he was in a grave amount of trouble too because Shep could have been sicked on either of

these two suspects, correct?

CARMAK: Yes. So essentially the passenger after the driver, I put Shep on him, the passenger was in the car as I was running past it, he stumble and

tripped in front of me as he fell to the ground.

BANFIELD: I don`t know how you kept your composure. I mean, I guess it`s totally different when you have a partner. If my dogs were yelping in the

woods, I think I would have torn someone apart with my bare hands. That`s how my connection with my atlas.

But I do want to ask you this. When Shep was done and came back to you. Your voice completely changed. I want to play this clip for our audience

how you went from being this commander sheriff`s deputy to this delightfully adorable dog daddy. Let`s listen to it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CARMAK: I know. That`s a good man. That`s a good boy. I know you did your job. I know. You did your job. Good boy bubbsa. Good job. That`s my man.

I`ll meet you back out front. I`m going to shut my siren off and put him up. Good boy. Good boy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Nick, you had me smiling and laughing from ear to ear when I heard that. And I did want to ask you if that was one part relief and two

parts training. Because that`s how you tell your dog that he has done a good job. So what was it? What was that delight in your voice?

CARMAK: Yes. Well, I was very pleased to see he wasn`t hurt. And then I was praising him up for the job that he did because he did a good job. So it`s

all for the dog. It`s praising at the end to keep his happy. Let him know he did a good job.

BANFIELD: And he looked like he was fine. He wasn`t hurt by this guy twisting his collar, was he?

CARMAK: No, no, no. He was fine. He was a little wore out. I could tell that they fought a good amount of time in the woods because I could see it

on Shep`s face that he was a little wore out. His tongue was hanging out and he needed some water.

BANFIELD: So, I part where I saw that you poured him a big bunch of water when you got to the cruiser which was really sweet. And I expected nothing

less from a guy like you and a partner like him. But he also got something called doggy ice cream. Is that correct?

CARMAK: Yes. He always - whenever he catches somebody, we go home at the end of the night. He gets doggy ice cream every time he catches somebody.

BANFIELD: He had to wait until he gets home to get the doggy ice cream? He doesn`t get it right there in the cruiser?

CARMAK: No, no.

BANFIELD: Wait. You froze up. He gets no treats while working. It`s at the end of the day.

CARMAK: Yes. We can`t let them eat while they work because sometimes if I feed him, and then we go track, you know, it will upset his stomach and

make him sick.

BANFIELD: Well, I just can`t tell you how much I appreciate you taking the time to talk through this with us. And can you give him a scrub on the top

of the head for us and thank him for what he has done as well. And for sitting through this interview. I can tell he wants out of here. He doesn`t

like TV at all.

[19:15:11] CARMAK: no, he is just amped. He hears me talking so he thinks something going on or we are going to go do something.

BANFIELD: Deputy Carmak, thank you for your service, my friend. And thank you to offer Shep as well. We really appreciate it.

Tonight, by the way, we have a brand new clue in a 40-year-old cold case. And you are not going to believe what it is and what you see when you see

it.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:20:32] BANFIELD: There are cold cases and there are cases that can chill you to the bone. Cases where the killer has ice in his veins and this

is one of those cases.

Because the man behind 12 murders and over 50 rapes and assaults, the man who terrorized an entire state for ten years is still out there somewhere

tonight. He could be your neighbor. He could be your friend. And God forbid he is your husband. Because he is known as the golden state killer.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In June of 197, a community was taken hostage. One of the most prolific serial killers in this station if not in this nation.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The subject has alluding investigators for over 40 years. The victims and families deserve justice.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We believe he is alive. Anywhere from 60 to 75 years old.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The FBI is offering a reward of up to $50,000.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The answer is out there. We need a name.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Back in the day in the 1970s, people in Sacramento felt safe.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It was small town atmosphere. People were friendly. The kids could play outside. There was a sense of peace and safekeeping.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I have been hitchhiking since junior high school. Last summer I even went coast to coast by hitching.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sacramento was a quiet town at the time. People didn`t lock their doors at night.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: During the summer, it can be very hot during the day and at night you get this nice delta breeze and so you leave your windows

open.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That time in the mid-1970s, it was a time when my parents would say, just make sure you are home before dark. That was it.

But when the east area rapist start hitting, that all changed.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BANFIELD: The east area rapist, the golden state killer, was on the front of every paper as he worked his way from northern California to southern

California. Raping, killing, attacking, scores of innocent people from 1976 to 1986 and then he seemed to vanish. But police think he is still alive.

And they want you to help them track him down. In fact, HLN has a five-part true crime original series called "Unmasking a killer" that premieres this

Sunday, our Sunday on March 18th at 9:00 a.m. eastern.

And the reason that series is going to air is because there is new information. Information that actually could help find this guy.

With me now detective sergeant Paul Beli. He is homicide bureau supervisor with the Sacramento County sheriff`s department. Also FBI agent and

profiler Mary Ellen O`Toole. She was part of the team that actually worked on the golden state killer case. Also with me live is defense attorney

Daren Kavinoky.

Thank you to all three of you.

I want to start with you detective sergeant, if I can. This case is one of those like Charles Manson. It gets in your skin and I doesn`t leave. And I

guess it is for good reason because he never went away. He is still out there somehow. But why do you think he is still alive after all these

years?

DETECTIVE SGT. PAUL BELI, SACRAMENTO COUNTY SHERIFF`S DEPARTMENT: Well, he would only be between 65 and 75 based upon descriptions of the time in

which he was offending. The descriptions are anywhere from 20 to approximately 30 years old. So actuarially he certainly be alive at this

stage in his life.

BANFIELD: Actuarially is one thing. But then there`s the whole cold Turkey thing. And I don`t know - maybe Mary Ellen, maybe you are the person to

answer this. But do serial killers who are so prolific so hurt so many people and kill so many people, do they just stop. Do they literally just

stop or die silently and take their secrets with them?

MARY ELLEN O`TOOLE, PROFILER (on the phone): Well, typically, they don`t just stop. But I agree with the detective. We have had cases, they are not

typical but we have had cases like (INAUDIBLE) in Kansas, the fine torture killed killer who stopped for 18 years and he was ultimately identified. So

we feel like it`s unusual. But in this case because this offender appears to have started out as fairly young guy, his age, how old he would be now

makes it certainly a good enough possibility that law enforcement wants to stay on his trail.

[19:25:28] BANFIELD: So detective, there`s one thing that is fascinating -- there`s many things fascinating about this case but, about the stoppage,

about this sort of going underground and staying underground for decades because we are going on a little over 40 years since the reign of terror

this guy began. Is it possible that he started and had an MO and that got you on his trail. And for ten years he continued his patterns and then

changed his patterns? Meaning loads and loads of murders since then aren`t attributable to him at least not that we know of.

BELI: I would say that`s possible especially when you consider the fact that DNA was starting to become something that was at least known to people

right around 1986 which was the last time of his known offense. As he moved forward he could have very easily discovered more information related to

that. Because prior to 1986 we had a four and a half, five year gap. So it could have been that he was slowing down and then also is able to learn a

little bit more about what it is that he is doing and could have changed a variety of things so we may not necessarily know additional crimes that he

has committed.

BANFIELD: So the intriguing part of the timeline is that this all started back, you know, in 1976. You yourself, you know, have been on the case,

detective, for ten years. Richard Shelby and Carol Daily, they are retired detectives with the Sacramento County sheriff`s department. And they speak

at length about this crime and the series and how they started putting the pieces together and realize that they, in fact, had the same guy on their

hands doing the same thing over and over. Have a look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: October 5th, 1976 I was assigned to home invasion, sexual assault.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My partner Shelby, we I just had a rape, you and you to get on it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Carol Daily and I arrived in the same car. Gene was sitting in the room so I cut her wrist loose. She had shoe strings around

her wrist. It was a well-planned assault. Too much detail. It was too well timed. He knew exactly when her husband was leaving and I thought there`s

more to this than the guy having a chance to run in and rape somebody.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Richard Shelby asked for all the rape reports for the prior year. And he started going through them and what he noticed is that

he started seeing the same method of operation.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And lieutenant Shelby said this is the same guy. We had a serial rapist going. There were several prior cases with the same MO.

Jane was rape number five.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: During the takes he was like a broken record. He come in most of the time either through a sliding door or a window with the screen

off. He would wake the victims up with flashlight or stick a gun in her face and he would tell them not to look at him.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He would have usually some type of rope to tie them up.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When he talked it was through clenched teeth.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If you scream, I will kill you.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: DO as I say, I`m going to kill you.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I have got a .45 and I`ll use it. I`ll stick you with my knife.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BANFIELD: It`s chilling to hear these accounts. And what may be even more chilling is one of the victims because 51 people survived this guy. And

were able to give descriptions not only of his look but also of his behavior and his patterns. And this particular victim talks about what

happened to her the night she crossed paths with him. Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I woke up with hand over my mouth. Sock stuffed in my mouth, blind folded, gagged, hands tied, legs tied. Said if you move I`m

going to kill you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Detective, has anyone ever claimed to be this person only to be determined through evidence and secrets maybe that you`re keeping and only

the killer will have know to born that not to be true?

BELI: No. We have not had anybody come forward to indicate that they were the offender.

BANFIELD: So Daren Kavinoky, just from a legal perspective, time is brutal to cold cases. In so many ways. It`s brutal to memories. It is brutal to

victims who are no longer alive to testify. It`s brutal to evidence. And it`s brutal to the statute of limitations as well.

Do you see that as a mass of challenge even if they ever catch this guy?

DARREN KAVINOKY, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, you are right, Ashleigh, cases in criminal court tend to not get better with age because victims and

witnesses can die or lose their memories or become otherwise unavailable. But the good thing in California from a prosecutor standpoint is there is

no statute of limitations on murder. So, while the sex base defense is the statute of limitations can vary based on the unique facts of each

individual case. In a murder prosecution, you don`t have any of those statute of limitations issues. And of course, one of the things that the

detective mentioned which I think is so spot on besides his dashing haircut, and he needs to be commended for that, but obviously, this is a

case involving DNA evidence. And that`s something that may help the prosecution team if they do finally unearth the killer or unearth the

suspect that if there is DNA evidence that ties this individual to those cases, that`s something that can even span the gulf of decades.

BANFIELD: Well, I`ll tell you what, there`s a lot of that. It turns out and I don`t want to get into the really dirty details but when you have that

many rapes you definitely have that much DNA. And his was voluminous in particular which is also a clue to this crime. Can you both stay around?

And Mary Ellen, can you stay around as well because I have just so many more questions. Number one about the psychological profile that`s been

created of this guy, and number two, whether you all think he`s proud of his work. And if there are killings that have not been attributed to him,

will he try to get them that way and will that trip him up? If you can both stay, I`ve got that -- all three of you actually. I`ve got those questions

coming up, plus, one more nugget of information that`s new about this case.

[19:35:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: Serial killers typically torture us for a finite length of time until they get caught. And we track them in a court of law where they have

to answer for their crimes, right? But there is this one killer who`s been haunting us for more than 40 years. A man who killed 12 people, in the 70s,

in the 80s, often in their own homes, often right in front of their loved ones, and somehow, somehow, he got away with it every time. And tonight, he

still hasn`t been caught even though he terrorized California for over 10 years.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANNE MARIE SCHUBERT, DISTRICT ATTORNEY, SACRAMENTO CO.: You only need to say three words and that is "east area rapist" and everybody remembers it.

It was a time when really in essence a community was taken hostage. Everybody knew it. It was on the news every night.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: The Golden State Killer sparked so much fear for so long because he`s got a couple other nicknames, too, like the Original Night Stalker and

then there was the East Area Rapist known for attacking more than 50 women on top of those murders, using his own shoelaces to bind them. And then, of

course, there were the burglaries, which brings me to the news tonight, the burglaries. Up until now, not everybody thought that a whole bunch of

burglaries might just be the same guy who started raping and then started killing. Joining me again, detective sergeant Paul Belli, homicide bureau

supervisor with the Sacramento County Sheriff`s Department. Also, FBI agent and profiler Mary Ellen O`Toole. She was actually part of the team working

on the Golden State Killer case. And defense attorney Darren Kavinoky is with us still as well.

So, detective, just take me to this whole story of these burglaries because this is now brining the whole thing back 42 years later. And I`m going to

ask if our producers can put up this comparative series of sketches. On the left-hand side of the screen, what our audience is going to see is the

sketches of The Golden State Killer and what we come to know as The Golden State Killer. But on the right-hand side of the screen new sketches, new

sketches of the guy responsible for a whole bunch of burglaries. And I don`t think it`s lost on anyone, detective, they looked like the same guy.

You`re convinced they are?

DETECTIVE SGT. PAUL BELLI, HOMICIDE BUREAU SUPERVISOR, SACRAMENTO COUNTY: Yes, when we went back and did a burglary analysis dating back to 1972, we

recognized that there was cat burglar that was operating in the same area that the East Area Rapist ended up operating five years later. And in going

back and looking at all those 60,000-plus reports throughout the years, we found that many of the methods that the cat burglar was utilizing to commit

his crimes and doing during his crimes are very, very similar to what the East Area Rapist was doing and what was documented during his series.

BANFIELD: All right. I want to play, if I can, something from an investigator who was part of the very last victim`s crime. And the victim`s

name was Janelle Cruz. This killer seemed to go cold after Ms. Cruz was murdered. So, as far as we know, at this point, Ms. Cruz was the last known

victim. Here`s Larry Montgomery, an investigator talking about joining this case and coming into this story.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[19:39:59] LARRY MONTGOMERY, INVESTIGATOR: I was a fairly new investigator working with the Irvine Police Department and I got call that a homicide

had occurred up in the north part of town. And so, I drove out there with my partners and discovered Janelle Cruz`s body in her bedroom. She had been

struck multiple times on her face and head by some object that was fairly hard. We didn`t find a murder weapon at the scene. We did find from the

family that there had been a pipe wrench that had been left outside the backdoor and we did not find that wrench.

She also had pieces of ripped cloth which were all over her body. It would be consistent with strips of material that was being ripped above her. And

her arms were tied by the soft ligatures from those cloths. Then taken by the killer so he wouldn`t leave evidence at the scene. This is a person who

has a desire to hurt and to kill in a very violent hands-on way. This brutality is different. There was an unusually large amount of semen. It

does appear that this particular individual was probably excited about what he was doing.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s doing what he wants to do, he`s killing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: I want to read for you some of the psychological profile that`s been put together on The Golden State Killer. It`s likely he drove a well-

maintained car, dressed well, neat, was well-organized in his personal life. Likely began as a voyeur in his late teens or early 20s. Engaged in

deviant behavior, that sort of unacceptable sexual practices in common parlor. Possibly unmarried. Likely didn`t enter into long-term

relationships. If married, probably had a wife who is tolerant of the sexual behavior. Had a criminal record as a teen that was likely expunged.

Was a skilled, experienced cat burglar and may have begun that way. Had some knowledge of police investigative methods and evidence. Hated women

for real or perceived wrongs. Would have been described as arrogant and domineering, manipulative, a chronic liar, would continue committing

violent crimes until incapacitated, by death or other means.

Mary Ellen O`Toole, two questions, how do you get that kind of information by someone who is virtually a ghost, and number two, is that kind of person

going to take his crimes to his grave?

MARY ELLEN O`TOOLE, FBI AGENT AND PROFILER (via telephone): Well, some of those -- some of what you read to me sounds fairly speculative and going

out on a limb and being too risky. When the FBI or FBI-trained analyst, when we do a profile, we look at all of the behavior and the forensics in

the crime scene because the series of scenes we look at, every one of those scenes, and we pull together the forensics and the behavior. And from that,

we`re able to sort of describe how the crime occurs, the motivation, and then more about the offender`s personality, but I would agree that some of

those statements, they`re not in-depth. They are more speculative than what an FBI profiler would read.

BANFIELD: Detective, do you think he`s so proud of his crimes that if there are crimes out there that aren`t attributed to him, he`ll want you to

attribute them to him? Meaning, you might be able to trip him up?

BELLI: I`m not sure if that`s a question I can necessarily answer. I don`t know that he would necessarily be proud. I think that he offended for

reasons probably only known to him. I would certainly hope that if there are other crimes attributed to him that we could figure those out in some

way.

BANFIELD: So, I just want to let our audience know that as we, you know, launch into this five-part series, you are also launching into a very big

project as well. There is a new Web site that`s up and running for anybody who wants to learn more about this, and actually supply information because

that`s how these things get solved. The Web site is at sacsheriff.com, S-A- C-S-H-E-R-I-F-F.COM, sacsheriff.com, or you can call FBI, 1-800-CALL-FBI, that`s 225-5324. So, there you go, there`s the information, sacsheriff.com,

1-800-CALL-FBI. Thanks so much to you, detective, for the work you`re doing so many years later.

BELLI: Thank you.

BANFIELD: Also to Mary Ellen O`Toole who`s on the phone with us, and Darren Kavinoky, as always, thank you to you, too. Don`t want to miss any of HLN`s

five-part true crime original series, "UNMASKING A KILLER." It premieres Sunday, March 18th, 9:00 p.m. Eastern Time.

[19:44:58] A point-blank shooting streamed out live on Facebook by the victim himself. And now, there`s a suspect in jail charged with his murder,

but the big question is why on earth did this happen?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:50:01] BANFIELD: Whether it was on the streets or on their newsfeeds, the people of Wingate, North Carolina were probably used to seeing him. A

55-year-old man named Prentis Robinson, streaming videos on Facebook Live everywhere he went. And yesterday, he was at it again, walking outside with

a selfie stick, reportedly complaining about a theft, saying that one of his own family members may have stolen one of his phones, and he had just

actually reported that to the police. But Prentis is not going to get that phone back, and that`s because of the man he ran into just after he left

the police station. As Mr. Robinson`s camera was rolling live, this is what that stranger did to him.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: The killer even had the gall to step over Prentis Robinson`s body, and the camera was still broadcasting live. Prentis was left face

down on the street, but that live stream was a critical clue to who his killer was. And with police at a loss for words struggling to process how

fast this all happened.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONNIE GAY, CHIEF, WINGATE POLICE DEPARTMENT: I just spoke to him. It was - - it was so -- I don`t know, it`s hard to say anything about that. Just got through talking to him.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: For almost 24 hours, the gunman was on the loose. The local university and the elementary school were put on lockdown in a town of less

than 4,000 people. But this morning, a suspect turned himself in and was charged with first-degree murder, and tonight, he`s in jail without bond.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GAY: Several tips came in from the video, from the Facebook live video. Several people had recognized his voice and his stature. And a few had even

seen him wearing the same clothing as earlier in the video.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: 65-year-old Douglas Colson will appear in court tomorrow for the murder of Prentis Robinson. And the question tonight is, why would he do

it? Why would anyone do it? Defense Attorney Darren Kavinoky joins me live now from Los Angeles. I rarely have you as a guest. When you can see a

crime actually be carried out on video, especially when it`s the victim videotaping the crime perpetrated against him. I`m assuming you`re pretty

surprised but then again, not.

KAVINOKY: Well, it`s -- it is a bit shocking and I`m reluctant to use the word, ironic, that somebody that was so prolific in YouTubing and videong

himself would actually videotape his own murder. And I think the thing I`m most stunned by in hearing the stories that this person actually turned

himself in, which is something that that`s something you do -- that you never hear in a murder case, where you`re looking at the possibility of a

life sentence without the possibility of parole or even the death penalty.

BANFIELD: And it is remarkable that the person who turned himself in, you can see him on the live feed. You can hear the murder victim saying, you`re

live right now, bro, you`re live. You`re live. And it happens anyway. It`s just -- it`s sort of astounding all at once. Darren, I`m going to ask you

to stick around if you can, because if I told you that Missouri Police were involved in a high-speed chase for a naked guy driving a stolen ATV, the

wrong down the interstate, would you believe me? What if I showed it to you.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I swear to God, white dude, naked as a jaybird on an ATV, running against traffic on I-29. He (INAUDIBLE) pass us.

BANFIELD: That`s "ONE MORE THING". And it`s straight ahead.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Dude is naked (BLEEP). Only in Kansas City.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[19:55:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: We have "ONE MORE THING" for you tonight. If a picture is worth a thousand words, there is really no telling what this video is worth.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I swear to God, white dude, naked as a jaybird on an ATV, running against traffic on I-29. He (INAUDIBLE) pass us. Dude is naked

(BLEEP). Only in Kansas City!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Whoa! He missed the gears (INAUDIBLE) open. Hold on, I`m getting out of these cops` way. Wow, this dude is going faster on an ATV

than we can go in cars.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Naked as a jaybird, folks. Police caught up with 27-year-old Jonathan Mem when he wrecked out that stolen ATV. And now, he has a brand-

new mug shot, and yes, it looks like he isn`t wearing a whole lot more. He`s also got a laundry list of charges, including burglary and tampering

with a motor vehicle, and property damage. But we do not know if there is any indecent exposure on the horizon for that man.

Can`t make it up. See you back here tomorrow night 6:00 Eastern. And now, you can also listen to our show anytime, download our PodCast on Apple

PodCast, iHeart Radio, Stitcher, Tune In, or wherever you get your PodCasts for your "CRIME & JUSTICE" fix. Thanks so much for watching, everyone.

"FORENSIC FILES" begins right now.