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Stunning Revelations Over Russia & Kushner Rock West Wing; Students Return to School Two Weeks After Massacre. Aired 6-6:30a ET

Aired February 28, 2018 - 06:00   ET



DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I have nothing to do with Russia. I have no deals there.

[05:59:04] UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Investigators for Robert Mueller are asking about business activities of Donald Trump in Russia prior to the 2016 campaign.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is a president who could be incredibly compromised.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just because they are asking doesn't mean they have evidence of it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The fact he's been downgraded suggests that he is not in a position to be a significant role of this White House.

SARAH HUCKABEE SANDERS, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: He's a valued member of the team, and he will continue.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're getting this blurring of behavior in his private and public roles.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're going to take it as it comes along every single day.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We're going to feel the presence of emptiness.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're more connected than ever. I don't think anything is ever going to change in this.


CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome to our viewers in the United States and around the world. This is your NEW DAY. It is Wednesday, February 28, 6 a.m. here on the East Coast.

I am in New York. Alisyn is back in Parkland, Florida. A very important day there. We're going to check it in one second. But here's our starting line.

We've had several major Russia revelations rocking the West Wing. CNN has learned Special Counsel Bob Mueller's team is investigating President Trump's business dealings with Russia. The key part, before the 2016 campaign.

Also, White House chief of staff John Kelly stripping the president's son-in-law, Jared Kushner, of his top-secret security clearance. A bombshell report in "The Washington Post" says that at least four countries discussed ways to manipulate Kushner by taking advantage of his lack of experience, financial troubles, and intricate business arrangements.

And a source tells CNN the president's communications director, Hope Hicks, admitting to House investigators she has had to tell "white lies" for the president. But a top Democrat says Hicks refused to discuss her role in drafting a misleading statement about that 2016 Trump Tower meeting with Russians -- Alisyn.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: OK. So, Chris, I am back here in Parkland, Florida. I am outside of Douglas High School, as you can see over my shoulder, as well as a huge police presence, because it was exactly two weeks ago today that that gunman turned Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School into a war zone.

So just one hour and a half from now, students will return to class for the first time since then. But of course, they will be without 17 of their friends and teachers who were killed during that massacre.

So throughout the morning here, we will be speaking to those students and their parents about whether they feel prepared to go back, how they're emotionally preparing, and of course what they want to see happen next in the national debate over gun violence that they have sparked since this massacre.

Legislators here in Florida are moving towards trying to figure this out. Their plan is to arm teachers. They want to appropriate millions of dollars to do so. Meanwhile, efforts in Congress do not seem to be moving as quickly.

So Chris, some of the students are already here to talk to us. And we'll be bringing you that all morning.

CUOMO: Important place to be. Thank you for being there for us. We'll be back with you in a second.

We have all this covered this morning. Let's begin with Abby Phillip live at the White House. A lot of headlines that they cannot like.

ABBY PHILLIP, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Chris. We are learning some new information this morning about the president's son-in-law, Jared Kushner, and also the Russia investigation.

The special counsel probe appears to be looking into issues beyond the 2016 election, including the reasons behind Mr. Trump's decision to run for president in 2016.


PHILLIP (voice-over): Multiple sources tell CNN that investigators for Special Counsel Robert Mueller have been asking witness about Mr. Trump's business dealings in Russia, before the 2016 campaign as he considered a run for the presidency.

TRUMP: I have no deals there. I don't know anything.

I have no investments in Russia, none whatsoever.

PHILLIP: Sources say questions from investigators include the timing of Mr. Trump's decision to run for president, any potentially compromising information the Russians may have had about him, and why efforts to brand a Trump Tower in Moscow fell through. Mueller's team also focusing on the financing of the 2013 Miss Universe pageant in Moscow.

MICHAEL S. SCHMIDT, REPORTER, "THE NEW YORK TIMES": If Mueller was looking at your finances and your family's finances, unrelated to Russia, is that a red line?

MAGGIE HABERMAN, REPORTER, "THE NEW YORK TIMES": Would that be a breach of what his actual charge is?

TRUMP: I would say. Yes, I would say yes.

PHILLIP: The Russia probe gaining steam as the political future of President Trump's son-in-law and senior adviser Jared Kushner remains uncertain. "The Washington Post" reporting that foreign officials from at least four countries have discussed ways to manipulate Kushner "by taking advantage of his complex business arrangements, financial difficulties, and lack of foreign policy experience."

"The Post" also reporting that White House officials were "concerned Kushner was naive and being tricked in conversations with foreign leaders."

SHANE HARRIS, NATIONAL SECURITY REPORTER, "WASHINGTON POST": Jared Kushner was also having his own conversations with foreign officials. And people in other countries and was not reporting those in the normal channels to White House officials.

PHILLIP: The story came hours after news that Kushner's top-secret clearance was downgraded after months of delays in completing his background check.

REP. CHRIS COONS (D), DELAWARE: For him to be the person who's carrying forward an important peace plan at the same time that he lacks a top security clearance, I just don't think that's workable.

SARAH HUCKABEE SANDERS, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: He is a valued member of the team, and he will continue to do the important work that he's been doing since he started in the administration.

PHILLIP: One of President Trump's closest aides, White House communications director Hope Hicks, also under scrutiny. A source tells CNN that Hicks admitted during more than eight hours of testimony before a House panel that she's had to tell white lies for the president but says she has not lied about substantive issues.

Committee members say Hicks would not answer questions about her time in the White House or her role in drafting a misleading statement about Donald Trump Jr.'s 2016 meeting with Russians promising dirt on Hillary Clinton.

[06:05:09] Democrats on the committee demanding more transparency.

REP. MIKE QUIGLEY (D), ILLINOIS: Anyone who doesn't answer questions, they ought to be subpoenaed.

REP. ADAM SCHIFF (D-CA), RANKING MEMBER, INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE: This is not executive privilege. This is executive stonewalling.


PHILLIP: Well, Chris, all of this is happening as the threat of Russian election interference in the election remains very real. Just this week, this head of -- the outgoing head of the National Security Agency made it clear that President Trump has not given intelligence officials the authority to disrupt Russian hacking at its source, despite the threat that is posed to the 2018 election just this year.

CUOMO: Abby, what a morning of news. On any other day, all of these, like four separate headlines, would dominate coverage. Today we have to balance all of them. Thank you very much for getting us started.

Let's bring in our best. We've got CNN political analyst David Gregory and John Avlon. Am I wrong? Mike Rogers says, "No, the president has never asked me to go directly at Russia to do anything about the cyber threat.

Hope Hicks says, "No, I'm not going to answer these questions, even though I came in under the intentions of being open. Jared Kushner having his clearance stripped by Kelly and what that must mean politically in the house.

And then, of course, let's start with this one. David Gregory, Donald Trump said as president, "If this guy, Mueller, goes after my money, that's too far." I don't know how this isn't crossing that line. If Bob Mueller is not just looking into financial transactions but back before the 2016 campaign, who was he doing money with, what it could mean, what does that mean?

DAVID GREGORY, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: But that is the essential question for investigators. I mean, you have to ask yourself if there's a fact, right, that Russia interfered in our election, wanted to sway the election. Don't know if they did, but they wanted to do it.

You have a president who has not responded, who has not defended America and stood up for our electoral -- our election system. Why not?

GREGORY: You know...

CUOMO: So you say fair play to look back there, look at the money?

GREGORY: Of course, it's fair play. I think there's no question. Anybody looking at this thinks the greatest area of vulnerability is a potential financial entanglement that somehow means that the Russians have something on President Trump. Now, that may just be speculation.

Now, that just might be speculation. But how, in a long history of involvement in Russia and around the world, do you not look at that as an investigator when you have this event that happens around this candidate?

CUOMO: Now, John, fair point. Trump brought some of this on himself by not releasing his taxes, not opening the books of his business in a meaningful way, so it does fuel some speculation.

Still, this will rub people the wrong way who support the presidency. All the way back then? You're looking at him and how far are you going to go? Is this another Ken Starr look into Bill Clinton?

JOHN AVLON, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: At the time they were probably defending Ken Starr. You have to find the roots of the question of whether the president is compromised. Because there are a couple of core points you've got to figure out.

First of all, how come, in a world of people full of people Donald Trump will attack at the slightest provocation, will he never -- and has never said a bad word about Vladimir Putin, from the campaign to the presidency?

The second thing is what Mike Rogers said yesterday. You know, in his testimony, basically saying that not only has the president never ordered him to retaliate or push back on Russia, but that he believes Putin believes he's got free reign, because he won't get a pushback. That raises it from a question of being compromised from a political personal context to national security.

So follow the money, folks. It's basic. It's going to happen. It's appropriate.

CUOMO: And then, if you're going to follow the momentum, if it is true that the chief of staff withdrew the clearance from Jared Kushner, how does he stay in the White House?

GREGORY: I think it's very hard. You have to ask what has Jared Kushner accomplished in the White House. What role is he serving, other than -- first of all, the huge problem you start bringing in your children, right? This is nepotism.

That should be on its face a huge problem. If this is somebody the trusts, the question is, what is he doing? What has he done of value and substance that's helping, other than distract and have huge, you know, judgment decisions that are suspect?

CUOMO: And maybe make vulnerable with this other development that other countries were sizing him up as an opportunity because of vulnerability.

GREGORY: You have to ask how long he can be in this role. He he has to do Mideast peace? He's got to deal with Mexico over -- a lot of tough issues with Mexico. I think it's a real blow for him when the president said, "My chief of staff will make the right decision." You know, he's dealing with his son-in-law.

And by the way, if Kelly could not have made this decision, then we would have really seen how compromised they were, because that means he would be untouchable.

AVLON: But this is fascinating, because one of the core rules in politics is you never fight the family and win. In this case, Kelly seems to be winning this fight.

And it's also, when Kelly floated the idea of the top security clearance would be removed, he said, look, Jared is doing great work on the Middle East, Mexico. But what did we find out yesterday from "The Washington Post" report? That Israel, United Arab Emirates, and Mexico and China have all been talking about how they think they can roll and apply pressure to Kushner because of his financial dealings.

CUOMO: It happened because of the Rob Porter situation and vetting. So this is on them. This wasn't foisted on them. This is something that happened organically from their mismanagement within their own.

But how do we know for sure that Kelly is having the upper hand here? How do we know that this doesn't come out, removes it -- the president can in his own capacity of executive, say I'm going to let Kushner see this stuff anyway? It's my decision. And you went after my family, you're gone.

GREGORY: And I think that's possible. I don't think the president wants that fight with John Kelly right now. I think if he really wanted it, he could have taken hum out when he was -- when he got pretty hot and he was getting a lot of arrows his way about the handling of Rob Porter.

I think we have to say something, too, in the Mideast revelations that is an explanation. That still, there's a lot here to look at that seems to make sense. Mueller has got to prove. He's got to prove something big that the president -- the candidate for the presidency was compromised and that he's compromised by a foreign leader and that he made decisions...

CUOMO: Absolutely.

GREGORY: ... to work with the guy. You have to remember, Jared Kushner is a blank slate. He's got all of these business dealings. And anybody would look at him and say, first of all, who brings in his son-in-law who's got no experience to write some of these most important billion-dollar debt.

CUOMO: The key distinction that you're drawing that we try to remind people on a regular basis, although it is getting a little conflated. The point is criminality, potential indictments or political malpractice.

GREGORY: And naivete.

CUOMO: That's down here. But that's why it might have happened.

GREGORY: Why look at anybody and say, "You know what? This guy is a blank slate. In other words, you could see this story being written about almost anybody that has nothing to do with whether anybody did anything wrong.

CUOMO: Understood. All I'm saying is, at the end of the day, you may have -- well, forget about bringing in the best. Forget about cleaning up the swamp. They don't know how to run this White House. And they have done things that are shady/stupid. But those aren't necessarily crimes.

AVLON: None of those things are illegal. You could have incompetence and not criminality.

CUOMO: Obviously, and it could mean something to a motivated Congress.


CUOMO: But they don't have the votes.

AVLON: But against the backdrop of only the best people, against the, you know, West Wing running allegedly like a well-oiled machine, this is self-evidently chaos and Kremlinology. There are people who are fighting against each other in the West Wing, bleeding into the public.

CUOMO: Right.

AVLON: And even between the chief of staff, allegedly against, you know, the son-in-law and the daughter. You have the communications director yesterday.

CUOMO: Hope Hicks.

AVLON: Hope Hicks admitting, among other things -- first of all, refusing allegedly, to answer questions about the transition of the White House without invoking executive privilege. And also saying, admitting that she offers -- she white lies for the president all the time, which is sort of the daintiest lie. But it's still a lie.

CUOMO: You use white lie as a verb? "I white lie. You white lie?" I go to you as a source. What is the implication? Obviously, look, you have a little bit of a weird legal/political vibe with she won't answer questions.

Well, that's going to be up to how the community -- committee wants to exercise their jurisdiction and their purview here. So if she didn't do it, it was without penalty, as far as we know. But what do you make of the admission that, yes, we told some white lies. We don't know about what. Was it about -- we've never heard of any of our people meeting with Russians. You know, we don't know anything about communications. Were those the white lies?

GREGORY: I mean, any of us who are parents, I think, tell our children, if you're willing to lie about small stuff, how do we know you won't lie about the big stuff? And that's why there's a criminal investigation going on.

And by the way, let's also remember, the -- what the meat of the story is. The campaign manager for Donald Trump has been indicted because of fraud. And we know he has extensive ties with Russia and their puppets in Ukraine.

These are big questions when you have financial entanglements with any country, including Russia, that raises the prospect of being compromised. You don't see this in electoral politics very often, which is why we have to keep our eye on the ball and look at these as important developments across the board.

AVLON: None of this is normal. So let's not normalize it. Let's focus on the facts.

CUOMO: Understood. Gentlemen, could not cover more in less time. Thank you very much. Appreciate it.

Alisyn, you know, as you know, you're in the right place this morning, but I needed you here. We have not seen this many headlines come out of this investigation at one time in a long time.

CAMEROTA: I know. It's a big news day, as we often say, but today seems particularly so. But I am here, Chris, in Parkland, Florida. Because about an hour from now, the sidewalks that you see behind me, the parking lot will be filled with the 3,000 students returning to Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School for the first time since that gunman killed 17 of their friends and teachers.

And CNN's Dianne Gallagher has been covering this. She joins me here in Parkland, Florida. What are we expecting today?

DIANNE GALLAGHER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I think they're not really sure. I even talked to teachers, Alisyn, who said that right now they just kind of want to all be together. The word that I heard most from students was "apprehension." They're a little nervous about coming back, but they want to be there with all of their classmates. They want to try to return to normal, whatever that means.

The principal said that today is about comfort, not curriculum.


TYRA HEMANS, STUDENT, MARJORY STONEMAN DOUGLAS HIGH SCHOOL: The first time walking through the gates, hearing the bells ring, there's going to be a dramatic shift in the hallway. Like you're going to feel the presence of emptiness.

GALLAGHER (voice-over): Thousands of students returning for the first time to a campus that just two weeks ago they ran away from in terror.

JACK MACLEOD, STUDENT, MARJORY STONEMAN DOUGLAS HIGH SCHOOL: We've seen what the end of the world looks like for some 17 people. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Our grades aren't as important as they used to be to us. Our lives and the lives of our friends are what take priority right now.

GALLAGHER: And while some are ready...

MACLEOD: I guess there's a certain feeling of, you know, relief that I am going back to school. That, you know, we are going to return today to normality and stuff like that.

GALLAGHER: Others aren't quite sure.

KAI KOERBER, STUDENT, MARJORY STONEMAN DOUGLAS HIGH SCHOOL: How do you even begin to comprehend the empty desks? All of the friends people ask. You know, how do you return to normalcy after that?

GALLAGHER: Teachers like Darren Levine also unsure about what to expect.

DARREN LEVINE, TEACHER, MARJORY STONEMAN DOUGLAS HIGH SCHOOL: There's no playbook for this. There shouldn't be a playbook for this. And we're going to take it as it comes along every single day.

GALLAGHER: The school reopening, as law enforcement tell CNN the massacre's death toll could have been even higher. The killer still had 180 rounds when he dropped his rifle and fled out of the building, blending in with the fleeing students.

And investigators say that hurricane-proof glass the killer failed to break may have prevented him from using a third-floor window as a sniper's perch. Now, this week the schedule is shorter. Students cannot bring backpacks, and security will be, quote, "at an all-time high."

ISABELLA PFEIFFER, STUDENT, MARJORY STONEMAN DOUGLAS HIGH SCHOOL: I know I have a lot of friends there and my friends are going to be there. So I'm comfortable going back in. But there's always going to be, like, that sense of anxiety starting at school just because it was the place of a school shooting.

GALLAGHER: Preventing other school shootings now a rallying cry for much of the Stoneman Douglas student body.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, hey, ho, ho, the NRA must go!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, hey, ho, ho, the NRA must go!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, hey, ho, ho, the NRA must go!

GALLAGHER: But Wednesday, for at least half a day, the focus is here.

LEVINE: We're going to come back as a class, and we're going to continue on.

KOERBER: We're more connected than ever, obviously, and I don't think anything is ever going to change. You know, we're going to be a brotherhood until the day we die.


GALLAGHER: And those students are actually going to be returning back to the classrooms they were in when that shooting happened two weeks ago today.

Alisyn, I talked to one of the teachers, the teacher there in that story, Mr. Levine. We asked what is going to say when that bell rings at 7:40? He said, "I've got chills just thinking about it. I don't know yet."

I'm not going to share it with you guys. I want to talk to the kids first. But he goes, looking at the way the past few weeks have gone, I'm sure that they will share it with all of you immediately. The kids have found their voices. The teachers are supportive. And they're hoping that that activism, as well as being together again, is going to help them get through what's going to be a very difficult day.

CAMEROTA: Absolutely. But they do seem activated. And that's what's gotten through these past two weeks. So thank you for sharing your thoughts with all of them with us.

And Chris, we should just let you know there are some students who are not ready to go back, who say that they can't imagine going back into, as Dianne just said, what they call a crime scene. We'll be speaking to them also. We're also going to be, in a moment, meeting two students, one of whom was shot. How they're coping today with their emotional and physical wounds as they prepare to go to class today. So all of that is next from Parkland.


[06:22:22] CAMEROTA: So about in one hour, roughly 3,000 students will return to Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School that you see behind me. This is exactly two weeks two weeks after the massacre that killed 17 people inside.

So joining me now are two of the survivors. We have Samantha Grady and Carly Novell.

Great to see you guys this morning. Thank you so much for being with us before you head in. Samantha, let's just start with the physical wounds, OK, which I know are quite different than the emotional wounds that you all are -- you were shot twice.


CAMEROTA: Physically, how are you doing?

GRADY: Well, I got my staples removed, which is good. The only bad thing is it's itchy. But that's the only problem for right now.

CAMEROTA: And emotionally, how are you doing this morning? GRADY: I'm hesitant to walk into the building, but I know I have to

to, like start. I have to face it head-on. At least that's just my approach. I have a lot of different feelings. I want to flee. At the same time, I want to, you know, I kind of want to get this over with. It's a bunch of feelings.

CAMEROTA: You're all over the place. I mean, there's no play back for this for what the right way to enter this school is.

Carly, how are you feeling this morning?

CARLY NOVELL, SURVIVOR, MARJORY DOUGLAS STONEMAN HIGH SCHOOL SHOOTING: I'm nervous. I feel the same as her. I just -- I'm really scared to go in. But I know we have to go.

CAMEROTA: I mean, you don't really. I'm talking to some students who have decided not to go back today. They don't know if they can go back. Do you feel that you have to go?

NOVELL: I think I want to go back at the same time as all my friends. I don't want to go in there for the first time alone. Even though I won't be alone, I want to start the same way that my friends do.

CAMEROTA: And what do you think is going to happen in there, Samantha?

GRADY: Well, I don't think there's going to be much teaching. I think everyone is just going to, like, be happy to see each other, especially since we're starting off in the class that everything happened in.

CAMEROTA: I want to talk about that. You are going right back into the class where you were when you were shot.

GRADY: Well, not in the class, because that building is...

CAMEROTA: The whole freshman wing has been closed off, and nobody will be going back there. The windows have been taped over. The whole building has been closed off. But you mean you're going back into the same sort of class period you were...

GRADY: Yes, exactly.

CAMEROTA: ... with the same people.


CAMEROTA: And what's the thinking about that?

GRADY: Well, I have a lot of feelings about that. Because that class was the class where my friend was.

CAMEROTA: You lost your best friend?

GRADY: Yes, I did.

CAMEROTA: And how do you plan to cope with that?

GRADY: I don't know. I really don't know. I'm just going to see how I end up doing with it. As I said before, I'm kind of nervous about going into the whole situation. But depending -- I mean, I don't know how I'm going to feel, to be honest.

[06:25:08] CAMEROTA: Of course you're nervous. There will be a void of 17 people. Even your best -- I mean, obviously not just 17 people and random classmates, your best friend. And you know, that's kind of forever.

GRADY: Yes, exactly.

CAMEROTA: Carly, you had said that you don't want Marjory Stoneman Douglas to be remembered as the school where -- that had the shooting. So how do you want it to be remembered?

NOVELL: I want it to be remembered as the school that changed something. I don't want it to be just another one. And the other ones weren't other ones for the people that were there. But for the rest of the people in this country, everyone kind of forgot. And I don't want this to be forgotten, because something needs to change.

CAMEROTA: You all have done a great job of keeping it on our radar, keeping it front and center in the country because of the conversation that you have started. So let me bounce a couple things off of you. Because your state, the state legislature is now considering a $67 million initiative to train and arm teachers. Ten in each school. How do you feel about that?

NOVELL: I don't think the teachers want to do that. I don't feel comfortable with teachers having guns. I think that law enforcement should have guns, but I don't think teachers need to have them.

And I don't think we have enough money for that either. Education already doesn't have enough money. So we shouldn't be putting that toward arming our teachers.

CAMEROTA: After two weeks and after what you've got through these past two weeks, what do you think? What do you want to see happen? What is the next step?

NOVELL: I want to see gun legislation. I don't want to see teachers having guns. That's just, like, a bailout. It doesn't do anything. I want actual things to happen. I want the age to be raised to 21. I want us to not be able to get AR-15s anymore. And that arming teachers doesn't do anything about that.

CAMEROTA: I know that you tweeted out that you want the school to be known as the school that started a revolution. And do you feel that way? Do you feel that you will be leading the charge?

NOVELL: I hope so. I think the march is a great start. I think things are looking like they're starting to happen. But I don't know that it will until I actually see change, I think. CAMEROTA: You will obviously have to keep your foot on the pedal if

you want this. And it will be hard. You have to get back to school now.

NOVELL: The past few days have been really hard to keep talking about things. Because you just want to, like, sit back and relax, and it's hard not to do that.

CAMEROTA: I get it. Samantha, what do you want to see happen now?

GRADY: I just want to be -- at least have a feeling of being safe. I know -- I mean, at the moment, yes, I'm going through trauma. But I mean, other students, other people in class, they should -- I don't exactly know what the road is to get there.

But when you walk into a classroom, no one should have -- look there and be like, "OK, where is my escape route?" No one should ever have to do that. I have done that most of the times, not only since the shooting but even previously because of shootings that have occurred. I mean, either gun legislation, strengthening background checks, whatever it may take, I want people to feel safe going into a place. I mean, yes, things happen, but going into the place and not really having to worry, especially at school where we go every single day.

CAMEROTA: You deserve that. You deserve to feel safe in your school. Well, we'll be watching. Thank you both so much for stopping by. We're thinking of you both, and we'll talk again.

Chris, they deserve to feel safe. And that's what the feeling is here about how they will be able to do that today.

CUOMO: All right. Alisyn, an important place to be on a very important day for the kids and for the country.

We have another big story this morning, as well. A major development in the Russia investigation. Actually, several of them. One key question is whether President Trump's lack of transparency led Special Counsel Bob Mueller to dig deeper into his business dealings. How does that work? We'll tell you next.