Return to Transcripts main page
Trump Not Bringing Attorney DiGenova Days After Hiring Announced; Students Lead Nationwide Marches Against Gun Violence; Young Activists Vow to Take Gun Reform Movement to the Polls; Daniels Speaks Out Tonight on Alleged Affair with Trump; Outrage Grows After Police Release Video of Shooting; Aired 1-2p ET
Aired March 25, 2018 - 13:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[13:00:12] FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. Thanks so much for joining me this Sunday. I'm Fredricka Whitfield.
We begin with yet another shuffle to the president's legal team. Today, Trump's attorney announcing that two new lawyers will not join the president's team for the Russia probe after all. Joseph DiGenova and his wife Victoria Toensing are out just days after meeting with Trump.
The president tweeting in part, "Many lawyers in top law firms want to represent me in the Russia case," and adding, quote, "I am very happy with my existing team. Besides there was no collusion with Russia except by crooked Hillary and the Dems," end quote.
Of course all this after the massive marches across the country for gun control and safety.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CAMERON KASKY, MARJORY STONEMAN DOUGLAS STUDENT: Americans are being attacked in churches, nightclubs, movie theaters and on the streets, but we the people can fix this.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: Powerful moments as young people called on lawmakers for change from the nation's capital and beyond. The demonstrations launched by the teens who survived the Parkland school shooting in Florida.
Later today the president returns to Washington from Mar-a-Lago and tonight one of his alleged mistresses, porn star Stormy Daniels, will speak out to CNN's Anderson Cooper about her relationship with the president airing on "60 Minutes."
We begin with the president's personal attorney, Jay Sekulow, saying in a statement that President Trump is disappointed conflicts stand in the way of Washington power attorneys Joseph DiGenova and his wife Victoria Toensing, representing him in the Russia probe.
CNN's Boris Sanchez is live in West Palm Beach near the president's Mar-a-Lago estate. So, Boris, what are you learning about the situation?
BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Hey there, Fred, yes, just a few days after it was announced that Joseph DiGenova and Victoria Toensing would be joining the president's legal team, it turns out actually they're not. Jay Sekulow, as you noted, the president's attorney, making the case that they are not joining the president's legal team because of conflicts of interest.
Of course we have to point out, Victoria Toensing also represents certain clients that are part of Robert Mueller's Russia probe, though she apparently did get some waivers from those clients allowing her to represent the president. So this comes as a bit of a surprise. The president on Twitter trying to change the narrative again about his legal team. He was making the case that contrary to fake news reports, that the White House was not having any issues finding representation.
That's after last week CNN reported that the White House had approached a number of prominent attorneys for representation ultimately to be denied, to be declined. So the president there, we should take those tweets with some sort of grain of salt. Obviously he tweeted out last week there were no shakeups coming to his legal team. That was shortly before his lead attorney, John Dowd, resigned.
Beyond all of that, Fred, the president has remained quiet on two major stories this weekend. First on the gun control marches that you mentioned. We didn't get any kind of direct statement from the president yesterday. There was something put out by Deputy Press Secretary Lindsey Walters touting what she felt that the president had achieved on gun control, passing the Fix NICS bill, as well as the Stop School Violence Act.
Definitely several steps back from what the president had previously talked about in raising the minimum age to buy assault weapons and being open to comprehensive gun control. The president has been mum on those issues since.
But the other major noteworthy thing that's coming this weekend the interview that Stormy Daniels is giving to our colleague Anderson Cooper on "60 Minutes" tonight. The president uncharacteristically silent as he has been consistently attacked not only by Stormy Daniels but also her attorney. President Trump not weighing in on the allegations that he had an affair with her or the allegation that she was paid $130,000 to keep quiet about it.
Certainly not something that we're used to seeing from a president who's very vocal when it comes to anyone that criticizes him or in his words claims false things about him -- Fred.
WHITFIELD: OK. So the Stormy Daniels interview this evening, the other alleged mistress Karen McDougal, she spoke earlier in the week and we aired that interview, and then as the president makes his way back to Washington, the first lady will be staying in Mar-a-Lago for the week for spring break. Do we know anything about her reaction to these interviews now airing
from these women who allege their relationships in detail with the president?
SANCHEZ: She has stayed quiet throughout all of these allegations, Fred, now in the several weeks that we've had these consistent news reports about Stormy Daniels and her interactions with the president's attorney Michael Cohen.
[13:05:05] We should note that her stay here in spring break was long planned before this interview with Stormy Daniels was announced. However, we do have to point out that on Friday it was originally planned for her to travel with the president to Air Force One alongside each other leaving the White House together. That changed. She ended up traveling separately from the president to arrive here in Mar-a-Lago.
So you may want to read between the tea leaves there, but it's certainly not something that we're hearing publicly from the first lady that she's even paying attention to these allegations -- Fred.
WHITFIELD: All right. Boris Sanchez, thank you so much. Appreciate that.
Let's talk a little bit more about the shakeup of the legal team and beyond at the White House with my panel Douglas Brinkley, as a CNN presidential historian, Michael Zeldin is a CNN legal analyst and Karoun Demerjian is a political analyst and congressional reporter for the "Washington Post."
Good to see you all. All right. So Joseph DiGenova and Victoria Toensing, you know, powerhouse Washington attorneys, and they just released a statement, saying, I'm quoting now, "We thank the president for his confidence in us, and we look forward to working with him on other matters," end quote.
But for now, Michael, that team will not be working with the president after meeting with him earlier in the week after the White House announcing that they were on the legal team as it pertains to the Russia investigation. So what does this indicate to you?
MICHAEL ZELDIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well, so the reporting says two things. First and most fundamentally Joe and Vicky have a conflict and taking on the representation of the president. They represent Mark Corallo, a person who quit the administration when he said that they were engaged in what he thought was obstructionist behavior, and they represent Sam Clovis, a former campaign manager who may have information relevant to Papadopoulos and his meetings with Russians.
Those are irreconcilable conflicts. They're not really waivable, so in the end I think that was the right decision. The other reporting, though, is that the president didn't seem to have good chemistry with them and we learned if anything else the president likes to have good chemistry with the people around him, most of us do, and that if there was a sense that this was not a team that I could work with and combined with the conflicts that just made for no sense that they would join the team.
WHITFIELD: But, Karoun, what's interesting about that is the chemistry almost seems like an aside because that came or that discovery came apparently during the Thursday meeting, but it was Monday when the White House made the announcement that they would potentially be joining the team.
So wouldn't the White House, the president, somebody know about this potential conflict with this team and representation of Trump during this investigation, given there are at least, you know, two other people involved in investigations of the Russia probe, already being represented by this team?
KAROUN DEMERJIAN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Right. I mean, I think this just kind of goes to show to illustrate that there is tension between the president and his advisers when it comes to selecting exactly who should be interfacing with the Mueller probe for him and there are attributes of these lawyers, they're very well-known around Washington, you know, that would make them very attractive to have them join the team especially when it's been difficult for this White House to have their pick of the liter.
The president's tweets notwithstanding from this morning, it has not been the easiest job for this White House to staff up their legal team, and they did just lose a key member of that also earlier this week. So I think the fact that you've seen that yes, they're coming on, no, they're not happening within a span of days just goes to illustrate what we've been talking about for a long time, which is that there are tensions in the White House about and in the president's personal legal team as well, about how you deal with the Mueller probe, about who should be bending the president's ear on these matters and it seems like that is not even a completely resolved thing even when there are public announcements made to the effect that you think that that had already been settled.
ZELDIN: May I add just one thing to that.
WHITFIELD: Yes. Go, Michael.
ZELDIN: I agree with Karoun absolutely. The other thing, though, I would add is that it speaks to the ongoing sort of problem in the White House of doing due diligence because this was really knowable that Joe and Vicky had this conflict and basic due diligence would have said look, we can't bring them on. They've got an irreconcilable conflict with representing their clients and us.
ZELDIN: But due diligence seems to be a continuing issue and that is what happened here, too, I think.
WHITFIELD: And Douglas, what does this overall say about the stability or lack thereof in the White House? Because if it's that not doing due diligence to find out that there is a conflict, if they could discover right away, it's also, you know, John Dowd, the personal attorney, who is out and the same week that National Security adviser HR McMaster is out. What is this saying about the White House?
DOUGLAS BRINKLEY, CNN PRESIDENTIAL HISTORIAN: That Donald Trump doesn't do due diligence. We all know that about him. He's very impetuous. He does things in a willy-nilly fashion all the time.
[13:10:03] He undermines his own most cherished plans with a tweet. And, you know, it's been amazing to me that someone like General McMaster, who's actually a very thoughtful and brilliant military and foreign policy analyst, has been able to stay in for a year in that kind of helter-skelter environment that's going on in the White House.
So Donald Trump is what he's always wanted to be, his own guy, my way. And, you know, they're going to have a revolving doors of lawyers by the time it's done because whenever he gets bad news, whenever something negative appears here on CNN, he lashes out at somebody, it's either by a fire or humiliation or an ugly tweet, and that's just the way this president is wired.
WHITFIELD: And then, Karoun, all of this happening on the heels of these passion-filled more than 800 marches globally, but particularly what culminated right there on Pennsylvania Avenue, the first family was not at the White House.
What signal is that sending to have the youth of America and their families descending on the nation's capital to try to ensure safety in schools in schools, in streets, in all public places? Yes, there was a statement coming from the deputy press secretary, but not a peep from the president and that the president and first lady wouldn't be present, knowing that this was going to be a movement of this magnitude right outside the White House? What does that indicate to you?
WHITFIELD: Or is that problematic?
DEMERJIAN: I think a lot of people that were participating in that march or supporting it from, you know, other parts of the country that weren't on the streets noticed that, that the president is in Florida when this is happening in Washington, D.C.
There is tension between the president and these protesters. So the idea that the president would be among the protesters or joining with them when they're basically protesting and asking for the president to take a tougher stance and a more proactive stance on influencing gun control measures that doesn't necessarily -- you know, you wouldn't expect to see the president also rallying and carrying signs when part of what they're protesting is where he stands.
But the fact that he's not here, that's another incentive for the people that are sympathetic to these marchers to be angry about what's going on. Look, Congress isn't in town either. So for lawmakers that don't agree with these students and their supporters, didn't want to be around, they didn't have to be around either. So it's kind of -- it's convenient for people that feel attacked or that these protesters are directly addressing with these protests to not have to actually be there to take it face-to-face.
I mean, it's a strategic move that kind of cuts down that tension but it doesn't make the fundamental conflict go away, which is that these people are asking for gun control policies that most of the GOP doesn't support including right now, it seems, the president.
WHITFIELD: And then, you know, Douglas, on the issue of unity, which is what you saw on display, you know, globally, but particularly in these American cities and the nation's capital there, and then when, you know, there is an expectation from Americans about the unity coming from the White House, the president and in this case the first lady, and we understand the first lady will be staying in Florida and Mar-a-Lago for a week, the president making a return back, and this, you know, on the heels of the same week where the first lady made a commitment, you know, particularly to the youth about cyber bullying, et cetera.
Are these incongruent messaging?
BRINKLEY: Yes. They are incongruent. I think Melania has made a mistake picking cyber bullying as her main issue that she wants to be identified with. There's so many other issues to put her brand on because it kind of makes her look ridiculous when Donald Trump is the kingpin of cyber bullying.
I was disappointed that President Trump didn't meet with some of these, you know, gun control protesters. I mean 16 dead in Parkland, 58 dead in Las Vegas, he could have done something informal, talked to them, or if he was going to be in Mar-a-Lago, meet with Rick Scott, the governor, and say, look, you've done something very brave down here, you've made buying guns no longer 18 but moving it to 21 How can you help me do that nationally?
I thought the president missed an opportunity to show he really cared over this historic weekend and it's because he's all about politics, he's trying to weigh on how not to anger the NRA and make sure that he doesn't lose 23 seats this November that the Democrats can get control of Congress with.
WHITFIELD: And there was a remarkable assemblage of people right there in Parkland, that's only about 45 minutes or so away.
WHITFIELD: You know, from Mar-a-Lago, so it's not being in Washington, then perhaps there was an opportunity, you know, to send some sort of message to the people there.
All right. Michael Zeldin, Douglas Brinkley, Karoun Demerjian, see you soon again. Thanks so much.
[13:15:00] All right. Still ahead, people in Parkland, Florida, are vowing that yesterday's marches will not be the end of the conversation over gun control. How they're using this movement to motivate their communities to act.
WHITFIELD: All right. From coast to coast we felt the power of America's youth, the younger generation stepping into the spotlight and demanding action on gun violence. We heard cries for change, warnings to politicians, and a powerful speech punctuated with a deafening silence.
CNN's Ryan Nobles has the story.
RYAN NOBLES, CNN WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): On a day filled with loud cries.
UNIDENTIFIED PROTESTERS: We want change. We want change. We want change.
NOBLES: Powerful songs. And energizing speeches.
DELANEY TARR, STONEMAN DOUGLAS STUDENT: We are not hear for bread crumbs, we are here for real change.
[13:20:01] NOBLES: It may have been the sound of silence that best captured the moment.
Emma Gonzalez, a young woman who has become one of the most recognized faces of the movement borne out of the massacre that took place in the halls of her school, stood stone-faced and silent.
EMMA GONZALEZ, STONEMAN DOUGLAS STUDENT: Six minutes and about 20 seconds and a little over six minutes, 17 of our friends were taken from us.
NOBLES: Gonzalez and a cadre of her fellow Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School students took their pain and turned it into action that culminated in marches and rallies all over the world. From Boston. To Chicago.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The violence that they experience every day.
NOBLES: Denver. To Los Angeles. And back to Parkland, Florida, where the shooting took place. While they may have only had each other when those shots rang out, they had the support of hundreds of thousands. Including celebrities.
PAUL MCCARTNEY, MUSICIAN: One of my best friends was killed in gun violence right around here. So it's important to me.
NOBLES: Pop stars. And even the granddaughter of a civil rights icon.
YOLANDA RENEE KING, MARTIN LUTHER KING JUNIOR'S GRANDDAUGHTER: I have a dream that enough is enough. And that this should be a gun-free world. Period.
NOBLES: Their hope is to do much more than march. They want action. Specifically stricter gun laws. Something the federal government has been reluctant to do.
KASKY: Stand for us, or beware, the voters are coming.
NOBLES: And the debate over guns remains divisive. Counter rallies were held in cities like Boston and Salt Lake City, but these students are hoping this movement is different, that common ground will be reached and they are warning their leaders they won't be giving up until they get the change they are looking for.
Ryan Nobles, CNN, Washington.
WHITFIELD: Powerful. So what is next? CNN's Kaylee Hartung joins us now live from the heart of this movement, Parkland, Florida.
So what is the message that you're hearing? What's next?
KAYLEE HARTUNG, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Fred, as Adam (INAUDIBLE), a Stoneman Douglas student, said yesterday at the Parkland rally, the finish line of the march here at Parkland and all those across the country is just the beginning line. He said, we're just getting started.
The march here in Parkland was more intimate in this small community than you saw in bigger cities across the country, if you can call a march and a gathering of about 20,000 people, as officials estimated, intimate. But I have met with people who'd flown in volunteering from Kansas City, Philadelphia, and Washington, who could have participated in marches in their own cities but wanted to be here with the heartbeat of this movement.
Now this march, of course, planned by Stoneman Douglas students. Many of whom told me they wanted to be here in Parkland as opposed to Washington or anywhere else on the day of the march to support their friends, families of victims, and a community that's still grieving. But as we have seen this community do in the weeks since February 14th, they continue to channel that grief into passion.
We heard from Tony Montalto, the father of Gina Montalto, who lost her life on February 14th, who said, our loss is giving this community a voice that is resounding across this nation. And you ask what's next. Well, what's next, circled on many students' calendars is their first opportunity to vote.
I spoke with a young woman, Sari Kauffman, she's 15 years old, she's a sophomore at Stoneman Douglas. She can't vote until the 2020 presidential election but yesterday she was spearheading a voter registration drive. She asked the crowd gathered here in Parkland to vow to get 17 other people to vote in honor of the 17 victims.
Fred, and as one student told me, spring break is coming up for the students of Stoneman Douglas but there is no break for them because there is still so much work to do. Marches are great, Sari told me, they've raised awareness but they want action, they want change and the way to do that is to vote. WHITFIELD: All right. And including a voter registration drive.
I've talked to a lot of kids there in Washington, D.C., yesterday who said they are now part of voter registration drives to make sure that they're colleagues who are 18 this year are poised to vote.
All right. Kaylee Hartung, thank you so much.
All right. Still ahead, Stormy Daniels will speak out tonight in a primetime interview just days after a former Playboy model detailed her alleged affair with the president. The legal and political fallout that could lie ahead for the White House. Next.
WHITFIELD: Tonight in a highly anticipated TV interview on "60 Minutes" with Anderson Cooper adult film star Stormy Daniels is expected to provide new details about her alleged affair with President Trump and the hush money she says she received to keep the relationship quiet.
Today Daniels' lawyer sent out this tweet, saying, quote, "Note, A, not all of our evidence will be mentioned or displayed tonight. That would be foolish. B, we are not sure what CBS will include, but we know a lot from the full interview will have to be cut because of the time allowed. C, tonight is not the end, it's the beginning," end quote.
Daniels is not the only woman fighting to go public with claims about the president.
[13:30:01] Former Playboy model Karen McDougal says she had a 10-month relationship with Trump about a decade ago. The White House has denied that affair. In an exclusive interview with CNN's Anderson Cooper, McDougal is now telling the world why it took so long to get her story out.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: Donald Trump announces for president. He's going to run, he gets the Republican nomination. At what point does this start to come back or this -- this become suddenly in the forefront for you again?
KAREN MCDOUGAL, ALLEGES AFFAIR WITH DONALD TRUMP: I was watching the Republican debate with a friend named Johnny. He's one of my good friends from many years ago. He said, you know, the story is a big story. And I said no way, it's not going to happen. You know where I stand on this, Johnny. I will never say anything. We dropped it.
COOPER: Your friend Johnny was saying, this story meaning your story, the story of your relationship.
COOPER: Your alleged relationship with Donald Trump?
MCDOUGAL: Right. And of course Johnny is a Democrat but I'm a Republican. So --
COOPER: You're a Republican?
MCDOUGAL: I am. And I voted for Donald. Yes, I did. There you have it. Yes. Die hard Republican. So we dropped it. But then later on, maybe a week or two later, an ex-friend or an old friend of mine started on social media talking about my relationship and she was part of that. She knows everything. She had started putting it out there. So it was being seen. So I came to Johnny one day and I said, Johnny, look what she's doing. I said, do I need to worry about this. And he's like absolutely you do.
He said, you need to get ahead of the story now before everyone else takes your story and manipulates it any way they want to manipulate it and make it this very ugly thing. You need to control your story and you need to tell your truth. And I said, yes, you're right. So that's what we decided to do and that's where Johnny one day comes over and he's like, you know, our mutual friend that we have found this guy named Keith, and he's going to help you share your story.
COOPER: Keith Davidson.
MCDOUGAL: Yes, that's correct.
COOPER: An attorney.
MCDOUGAL: Yes. Correct.
COOPER: An attorney who also was an attorney for Stormy Daniels.
MCDOUGAL: I didn't know that. Yes.
COOPER: And others in this business?
COOPER: So what did he do then? You contacted Davidson?
MCDOUGAL: I didn't. Johnny did. Johnny and the mutual friend contacted Davidson. Within a matter of a couple days Keith came out and we all had lunch together and he wanted to know details. So we sat down at lunch for a couple of hours, I gave him details and Keith is like, you know, the story is worth many, many millions. And I'm like, OK. So we talked about it. And that's when Keith brought it to AMI.
COOPER: So did you know that Keith, your attorney, was going to go to AMI, which is the parent company which owns "National Enquirer" and other magazines?
MCDOUGAL: He said AMI. I didn't know what AMI was, to be honest. He said AMI, and we have this company that, you know, they'll probably want to hear your story. So -- COOPER: And what was the thought of selling the story in your mind?
MCDOUGAL: To get my truth out there. I wasn't looking for money, clearly, but when he said, it's worth many millions, I'm like, you know --
COOPER: That was something that was hard to pass up?
MCDOUGAL: Sure. Of course. But if you fast-forward I ended up not wanting to do that deal. So we were going to go to ABC and tell the story just to get the story out there and for nothing. There was no pay.
COOPER: Did Keith have a meeting with AMI? Did you have a meeting with AMI?
MCDOUGAL: We did. We had a meeting with AMI.
COOPER: You told them your story.
MCDOUGAL: We told them the story. They actually didn't think it was very credible, even though off the record they said Dylan believes your story, but clearly when they came back they said it wasn't believable.
COOPER: Dylan being?
MCDOUGAL: Dylan Howard. He's with AMI.
MCDOUGAL: So they had like a 12-hour window to -- I know I'm probably skipping around, I'm sorry. They had a 12-hour window to accept whether they wanted the story or not. And they didn't want the story.
COOPER: Once Donald Trump won the Republican nomination.
MCDOUGAL: Right. Correct.
COOPER: You're saying Ami suddenly came back to you with interest in the story?
MCDOUGAL: Well, to Keith, yes. To us, for the story, yes.
COOPER: Why do you think it was that it was after Donald Trump was the Republican nominee that they came back?
MCDOUGAL: They wanted to squash the story.
COOPER: You're saying they wanted to protect Donald Trump?
MCDOUGAL: I'm assuming so, yes. But the offer, which we didn't discuss or haven't discussed, was, you know, they had offered me a big, you know, contract for work, for modeling, and fitness and things like that. My life has always been health and fitness. So --
COOPER: They said they were going to have you be a columnist, you would write columns about health and fitness.
MCDOUGAL: Correct. They said I'd write columns, I would get one article per month in "OK" magazine, one article per month in "Star" magazine, for two years.
[13:35:07] And then four columns per month on RadarOnline for two years. On top of that, two magazine covers. And their reasoning was like, you know, you've been a successful model, fitness, et cetera. We want to help you continue and we actually want to rebrand you, and you know, you're older now so we want to jumpstart into a new career for you and really get you out there to work.
And I'm like, this was perfect. Like who doesn't -- what model wouldn't want that, especially as an older model. I'd be like, this is great, right? So yes, but then the side deal was, oh, we're squashing the story. OK. It's a win-win for me. Like I get the work and my story doesn't have to come out.
COOPER: If Donald Trump hadn't been running for president do you believe this deal would have been made with AMI, knowing what you know now?
MCDOUGAL: Probably not. No. Probably not.
COOPER: You're pretty -- you're convinced now this was an effort to do a favor for Donald Trump in the last few months of the presidential race?
MCDOUGAL: Unfortunately, yes.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: And we'll hear more claims about the president tonight when Stormy Daniels speaks out. Her attorney tweeting out about the "60 Minutes" interview today. Details on all of that next.
[13:41:38] WHITFIELD: All right. Welcome back. We expect to hear more allegations tonight from adult film star Stormy Daniels about her claims of an affair with President Trump. She's giving her first extended interview to Anderson Cooper on "60 Minutes."
With me to discuss this is Wendy Murphy, who is a former prosecutor and professor at the New England School of Law in Boston. Also with me, is Amy Kremer who is co-chair of Women Vote Trump.
All right. Wendy, let me begin with you. So Stormy Daniels' attorney says whatever anyone hears tonight it's not the full story. How could her version of events change the course of her legal case against the president?
WENDY MURPHY, FORMER PROSECUTOR: Well, there's so much to what we don't know and Avenatti setting very low expectations suggests that there still could be more to it even after tonight is over, and if we all say, oh, that was a big yawn, there's not a whole lot more to it than salacious details, I don't think the story ends but I do think the public's attention might wane a little bit.
So my concern is, obviously, not about the sex, but about campaign finance laws and the possibility that the president may, in fact, some day face a perjury charge related to this case if he has to submit to deposition, for example, in Avenatti's state court case in California.
So tonight if we hear anything at all about connections between Trump's campaign, Trump himself, and the money that Stormy Daniels received only days before the general election in November of 2016, that could change the trajectory of this story and it could very much change the president's legal exposure or at a minimum Michael Cohen's legal exposure because thus far, we've been told there's no there- there. There's no connection.
This was a private deal. Michael Cohen made the payment. It was all to protect the president's family from shame and nobody I know thinks that's true that Michael Cohen really did that only out of the personal goodness of his heart. The question is whether we'll hear more about those possible connections tonight and whether that disc that we've all seen a picture of now, the disc that Avenatti sent a photo of on Twitter claiming there's stuff there, I think his implication is that there are documents that will corroborate whatever shocking details Stormy Daniels does talk about tonight.
So the president won't be in a position to say she's a liar because there's going to be something in writing to prove that she's telling the truth.
WHITFIELD: Yes. We don't know what stuff is on that DVD that's in that safe that he, you know, tweeted out that photograph, Amy, but, you know, Daniels' attorney he is essentially threatening the president and his team. That they need to be careful about what they say out loud, how they respond out loud, to that interview tonight.
Do you think, you know, that will silence the president who has already attached his name to a legal challenge against her but at the same time denying that there was an affair?
AMY KREMER, CO-CHAIR, WOMEN VOTE TRUMP: So, Fredricka, I think that -- I mean, Stormy is riding this all the way to the bank. I mean, that is what she's doing this to promote herself. I mean, she is obviously a PR (INAUDIBLE) and good for (INAUDIBLE). We all love to make money.
But just in general, I'm not an attorney and don't play one on TV but in general you have to be careful about what you say in public and as far as after tonight's "60 Minutes" interview I really don't expect to hear anything else from the president.
[13:45:13] I think that he's already spoken through the legal actions that he's filed and I certainly don't expect him to tweet anything or to make a statement, and I don't really honestly think that this is a story with his base. I mean, what we knew was out there going into the election, people voted -- WHITFIELD: But not about the payment.
KREMER: Well, that may --
WHITFIELD: No one knew about alleged payments. And that's really what's the crux here.
KREMER: That may be but --
WHITFIELD: It's not really about the relationship, but, Amy, you know, you said well, you know, he will continue likely to remain silent, that's really -- hasn't been his style. He usually is quite loquacious about most things but it is different here in that he is not saying anything and Stormy Daniels' attorney is essentially challenging him, if he does, it could create more troubles.
KREMER: Fredricka, he is -- there is ongoing litigation and anybody that's been through litigation knows that you don't go out and talk about it. I mean, that is not just something because he's the president, that is anybody with ongoing litigation. You let your attorneys deal with it. So that is why I don't think he's going to say anything. And like I said he's already spoken through the litigation that has been filed, so, you know, this is not a story to his base.
I know the left desperately wants to bring down this president. And I don't think this is going to do it. We voted for him not because he was going to be our pastor or because he was going to be our husband. We voted for him because he was a businessman that would fight back and do what was best for the United States.
KREMER: And so far he's proven that he has -- he's followed through on his campaign promises, most of them, and we're pretty happy with how he's leading.
WHITFIELD: All right. So, Wendy, what is it that has you shaking your head?
MURPHY: Well, first of all, that's not what the right said when something similar happened to Bill Clinton. It was all about the morality of the president, his leadership, and messaging to the nation and so forth. I mean --
KREMER: Wendy, he did it while he was in office.
MURPHY: No, he did things before office that you all also said were, you know, worthy of impeachment even though you can't be impeached for certain things. There was a lot of criticism from the right about things Clinton did with women that were perfectly legal but that occurred prior to him taking office. So the hypocrisy label goes on all sides of this case.
You know, what I think matters the most is that he's staying silent because he has been advised that he faces the possibility of testifying under oath. That potentially means being forced to answer questions about his relationships with these women, some of them nonconsensual, and if he's forced to answers those questions he could be in a what we know of as a perjury trap and he'll say, well, OK, I lied to the general public, I'm now going to testify truthfully under oath, it's all true. That's really his only escape for a perjury trap.
But, but, let's also be clear, thus far the evangelicals in particular have said, we don't mind that he's been having affairs, we don't mind that he's been sleeping around while married and so forth, we're going to give him a pass on that. That's fine. I actually give him a pass on that even though I don't like it. But, but what if there's more to the story? There are two provisions in the nondisclosure agreement he signed with Stormy Daniels that make reference to pregnancy and children.
Two different provisions. There are, you know -- statements out there that he had unprotected sex. What if it comes out that there was a pregnancy and that there was a request for the woman to terminate the pregnancy?
KREMER: This is not -- I mean, honestly this is none of our business. This was a consensual relationship between two consenting adults. We have no business even talking about this.
WHITFIELD: OK. Well we will find out because we know that this is a legal tangle so it's pretty big business not just between these two but we are talking about the president of the United States, a representation of the U.S. So we're going to find out at least for starters, what happens this evening and what comes after that.
Wendy Murphy, Amy Kremer, thank you so much to both of you. Appreciate it. We'll be right back.
[13:53:43] WHITFIELD: Police in Sacramento are watching for the potential of more demonstrations today days of protests last week following the death of Stephon Clark. He was a 22-year-old unarmed black man who was shot multiple times by police in his grandmother's backyard last weekend. Police said they thought he was pointing a gun. But all that was recovered at the scene was his cell phone.
CNN's Dan Simon is in Sacramento. So, Dan, what is the latest on the investigation and the fallout?
DAN SIMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, hi, Fred. Well, first of all, we are not expecting to see a repeat of what we saw at the Sacramento Kings game on Thursday. That said, Fred, there is not a reduction in the terms of the raw feelings. There is definitely a sense of heightened anxiety with community activists. They are demanding some type of accountability specifically, Fred, they want to see these two officers charged with murder.
But this is an investigation that can certainly go on for months and we know that the next piece of all this is more video. We are expecting more video to be released in the coming days. What it could show we don't know, but there are lingering questions as to why those two officers turned their microphones off just moments after the shooting. Now department policy does allow for that to happen but only under narrow circumstances and we don't know why the officers did that.
[13:55:05] We know that the police chief Daniel Hahn, he's been on for about a year or so. He is the first African-American police chief for Sacramento and he has used his time to try to bridge, you know, the feelings that people have with the community, but obviously, again, this investigation is going to go on for several months.
As for those two officers, they remain on paid administrative leave. And Fred, I can tell you that both of them have received numerous death threats -- Fred.
WHITFIELD: All right. Dan Simon, thanks so much in Sacramento.
Still so much more straight ahead in the NEWSROOM. But first here's this week's CNN Hero.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The cruelest part of late stage cancer is the emotion. Guilt that you're leaving behind your children and dread that you're going to miss their milestones.
We give these families the chance to have fun, have positive memories. We are trying to give each family their own unique treasured time together.
(END VIDEO CLIP)