Return to Transcripts main page

CRIME AND JUSTICE WITH ASHLEIGH BANFIELD

Two Toddlers Die, Cops Doubt Teen Mom`s Story; Woman Forced To Eat Mom`s Ashes; Mystery Deepens In CoEd`s Disappearance; Cops: Missing Mom Choked To Death By Ex; Man Kills Wife, Blows Up Home As Cover-up?; Waitress Confesses Theft To Former Boss 20 Years Later; Beautiful 24-Year-Old Mom Was Last Seen At Her Daughter`s Very First Birthday Party And Has Been Missing Since; Entire Family Is Behind Bars After Investigators Say They Humiliated And Tortured Their Young Relative. Aired 6-8p ET

Aired August 1, 2018 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[18:00:02] (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Two beautiful young girls die after police say they were trapped in a sweltering car in the Texas heat.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Two little kids were left in the car all night long. And until probably about noon the next day.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: As the investigation widens, authorities believe it`s more than just a horrible accident.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Some people should never have kids.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Locked away in a cage.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I can`t believe this took place.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did an entire family humiliate and torture their young relative?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hidden under branches, plywood and tarps.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Holding her against her will.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The victim live like an animal.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And making her their personal slave.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A bucket for a toilet, a bucket to drink from.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A desperate search for a missing mom of four turns into a murder investigation.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don`t know if he snapped or what would have made him snap.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why are police looking at her live-in boyfriend?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He was very well invested in the relationship. It`s totally out of his character.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s seems like a good place to live.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The shocking home explosion becomes the death investigation.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The explosion that has occurred was intentional.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When the body is found in the home, but the autopsy reveals more than just burns.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Steven intentionally blew up this house.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She asked me, if I would help her commit suicide.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PAT LALAMA, GUEST HOST, HLN CRIME AND JUSTICE: Good evening. I`m Pat Lalama in for Ashleigh Banfield. This is "Crime and Justice."

If you live in Texas, you know the temps can rise to the 90`s during the early summer, and that kind of heat can get deadly if you`re trapped in a

car for 15 hours. That is how long two little sisters, just 1 and 2 years old, were allegedly left in a SUV outside their teen mom`s friend`s house.

19-year-old Amanda Hawkins had a much more innocent story when she brought her girls into the hospital, reportedly saying they collapsed, smelling

flowers.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SHERIFF RUSTY HIERHOLZER, KERR COUNTY, TEXAS: And they gave the story that they had been down at this lake, one of our local little bitty lakes, and

the kids were running around smelling flowers and you know, they thought maybe they got into something poisonous, and that is what the story was.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LALAMA: But when little Brin and Addison passed away, investigators started looking into mom`s story and they soon determined that Hawkins left

her daughters in a car while she hung out with a friend overnight, allegedly telling the folks in the house, quote, they`ll cry themselves to

sleep.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HIERHOLZER: She left them in the car. Intentionally in the car. The two little kids were left in the car all night long and until probably about

noon the next day. Some people should never, ever have kids.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LALAMA: Now, Amanda Hawkins is stuck in jail, but she is not the only one charged. The murder charge goes to one of her friends. Joining me now,

Mike Taylor, reporter with Hill Country breaking news.com, and Austin Overgard, the father of Addison Overgard. Also joining me, medical

examiner and forensic pathologist Dr. William Morrone. I don`t even know where to begin with this. Because there`s so many confusing details. I am

sure the audience feel the same way.

Mike Taylor, do I have it right, you are a reporter for Hill Country breaking news.com, do I have it right that a friend who slept in the car is

facing the murder charge, but the mother who allegedly said I`ll leave them there, they`ll cry themselves to sleep, and then lied allegedly about how

they perished, she is not charged with murder. Explain this to me?

MIKE TAYLOR, REPORTER, HILL COUNTRY BREAKING NEWS.COM: At this time, she is not charged with murder, but who knows what the future can hold on this

case. They`re being tight-lipped about it at this time, but you are correct, it`s not just one murder charge. It is facing two murder charges,

one for each of the little girls left in the car.

LALAMA: But, Mike, I mean, I guess I`d have to understand all of the law in the state to get what`s going on here, but if she knew her children were

in this car in the scorching heat overnight into the next day, in 90-plus- degree temperatures and allegedly told a friend at the party who said, don`t you want to bring them in, and she purportedly said, oh, no, they`ll

cry themselves to sleep. How is she not directly negligent? Even the police in this case say it`s the most horrific case of child negligence

they`ve ever seen.

[18:05:12] TAYLOR: It is. The Kerrville community, I mean, stuff like this doesn`t ever really happen in this part of Texas. It`s a real tight-

knit community. There aren`t a lot of murders, not a lot of crime. And then something like this happened and it really shook their whole area to

the core.

I mean, I drive down that street still and I look over at that house and I look over in that driveway where that vehicle was, and I am just in

complete awe. When I look over there -- and I drove less than a quarter mile from when those girls were in that vehicle and I wonder to myself, how

could anyone let their kid be alone in a car for five minutes, much less overnight, over 12 hours?

LALAMA: And say, let them cry themselves to sleep, allegedly.

Dr. William Morrone, medical examiner and forensic pathologist, toxicologist. I don`t want to make this too gruesome, it`s heartbreaking

enough, but can you give us a sense of what it`s like for a 1-year-old and 2-year-old child to be in sweltering heat, not entirely for 15 hours,

because they were there overnight. Give us a sense of how the hell they were in, to put it bluntly.

WILLIAM MORRONE, D.O., MEDICAL EXAMINER AND FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST: Well, first off, all the heat that is trapped in the car stays because the glass

insulate, and it stays inside the car. When you`re in a temperature of 80 or 85 degrees, it can get up to a hundred degrees in less than two hours.

And if you`re in overnight, the heat from the previous day begins a much higher temperature, that those temperatures may have been up to 140, 150,

160 degrees inside. It is suffocating. It is painful.

The bodies are overheating and the heart and the blood vessels, the veins and arteries are dilating to try to cool it down, but it`s not going to

happen, because the heat is trapped inside the car. And they end up going delirious and dehydrated with tremendous psychotropic delusions. An adult

would say maybe they were seeing things or hearing things, but a child would be so fearful, that they don`t know what they`re feeling. They don`t

know how to get out. It is a living hell.

LALAMA: Oh, my gosh. I`m looking at the pictures of these little children and we have Austin Overgard with us, who is the father of Addison. Austin,

I thank you for coming on and my heart just aches for you. Give us some insight -- I know you don`t want to talk about the legalities of this case,

but give us some insight as to what may have happened here, what you know.

AUSTIN OVERGARD, FATHER OF ADDISON AUSTIN: As far as I can go into detail, like both of them said, she was left overnight. You know, both the girls

didn`t deserve that, to be left in a car overnight with no love. There was no love there from Amanda at all. Amanda was selfish with the kids and

didn`t want anybody else to take care of them, but her, but she couldn`t even take care of herself.

LALAMA: Well, Austin, let me ask you, have you witnessed similar kinds of scenarios? We know that law enforcement has said that, quote, this isn`t

the first time it`s happened. What do you know?

OVERGARD: No, it`s not the first time it`s happened. When this all first started, some younger teens, friends of hers, were coming out and saying

that they should call cps, that it wasn`t the first time that she is gone out to party and left the kids inside the car. So, no, it`s not the first

time. She is definitely done it before, time and time again. I have witnessed it? No, but I know that she didn`t care for the kids as much --

actually, my brother and my best friend have witnessed her allowing the kids to go into Walmart half naked, diaper on, and full of shit, no shoes,

no socks, no nothing, just half naked, in the middle of Walmart.

LALAMA: Austin, let me ask you a pretty direct question. Did anyone ever call children`s services? Was she ever investigated for being this alleged

bad mom?

OVERGARD: No, nobody did.

LALAMA: Why?

OVERGARD: That is a good question.

[18:10:00] As far as I know, I only found out about all this stuff when I was in rehab, and I had no way of contacting anybody, so, and I was working

on getting full rights of her. Me and my dad were looking into lawyers and everything else and we are working on me getting the rights of Addison, so

--

LALAMA: Well, I can`t imagine what it must be like to lose a child. And I`ll get right back to you in just a second, Austin. Don`t go anywhere.

We have Kirby Clements, defense attorney. So, Kirby, this is where I`m absolutely mystified, because as the story goes, these are the facts that

we have, and I`m sure they can be disputed once the case gets rolling, but the mother allegedly stayed in the house, was asked by friends or told by

friends, your children are crying in the car, she says allegedly, well, they`ll cry themselves to sleep. Cut to her 16-year-old pal goes to sleep

in the car for a few hours, because there was no place to sleep in the party house. Allegedly gets up, wakes up, rolls up the windows, locks the

door, and leaves the car. Now, why is he charged for murder and she is not?

KIRBY CLEMENTS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, it would appear at this point there`s that break in your story as you just told me. The mom was inside

of the house at the time that she is last reported to have heard from the kids. They were crying. And so she thought they would cry themselves to

sleep. Someone had gone outside, so she assumed they were OK. That would be the basis for not charging her at this point, absent more information.

As to the individual who locked the kids in the car, that is an entirely different matter. I mean, they were in the seats, as I understand it. The

person rolled the windows up and locked these children in. At this point, that seems to be a deliberate act. I mean, this person couldn`t have done

those things without knowing those children were in the car. The mom may say --

LALAMA: Kirby, stop. But stop for a second. Do you believe, as a criminal defense attorney, that she is not in any way criminally negligent

in terms of a manslaughter charge?

CLEMENTS: Well, I would say, given the state of the facts right now, I`d have to say no. She has -- there`s no indication that she thought that the

children were in danger. Now maybe the fact of leaving the kids in a car at night could be some sort of reckless endangerment that one could say,

which might be a misdemeanor, that one can say, you knew it was an unsafe condition that they were left in, but not that it was an unsafe condition

that would have led to this particular type of death. That is the defense they will make.

LALAMA: OK. All right, but listen to this, I`m going to pose this to Mike Taylor. I want you to listen to this, Kirby. So, she allegedly, when she

discovers that her children are unconscious in the car, she takes the children, allegedly, into her house, bathes them, changes their clothes,

goes to the hospital and tells authorities that something happened to them at a lake, smelling flowers. Mike, come on!

TAYLOR: Yes, there`s something terribly wrong with that, but the indictment and the murder indictment that was handed down this week to

Kevin Frankie, it appears to say, when I read it, what I see is that Kevin Frankie allegedly tried to talk her out of taking the kids to the hospital.

And that is why it was postponed so long.

LALAMA: But she was part of that. She enabled that scenario, Kirby. Kirby, she enabled that scenario by saying to him, by not saying, you`re

out of your mind, I`m taking my children to the hospital for care, they`re still alive.

CLEMENTS: No, you are absolutely correct. And I will say this, that once the children we clearly in need of medical attention, if she delayed it or

she gave the doctors the wrong information, because they could have engaged in a different type of treatment for those children, then that could

certainly lead to charges, but again, I would say that it would not lead to a murder charge, but if they can definitely connect her omission or her

delay in acting to their death, then perhaps manslaughter, but at this juncture, she did take them, despite this man`s efforts to keep her from

going to the hospital.

LALAMA: Wow, so interesting. Dr. William Morrone, we don`t have too much time, but can you -- could these children have been saved in their

unconscious state if they had gotten them to the hospital?

WILLIAM MORRONE, D.O., MEDICAL EXAMINER AND FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST: Likelihood, no. Because you need to have kids that are still sweating,

that haven`t dehydrated, and there`s 749 deaths in the last 15 years this way. And thousands of children present with heat stroke. It`s so

difficult, states have made a Good Samaritan law for anybody to break into a car to save children. That is how difficult it is.

LALAMA: Wow, Mike Taylor, where are they now, these two?

TAYLOR: They are both in the Kerr County jail, and Amanda Hawkins, to my knowledge, has a bond of $200,000, and the last time that I checked, Kevin

Frankie had a bond of $240,000. And that might actually be escalated now with the new murder charges.

[18:15:04] LALAMA: And very quickly, did she have some sort of allegedly inappropriate relationship with a corrections officer?

TAYLOR: So there was a corrections officer that was fired a few months ago. And I went back and looked at the video. The sheriff clearly says

there are over 50 phone calls made from Amanda Hawkins to this corrections officer and that this connections officer was fired for giving Amanda

Hawkins contraband. It was allegedly a contraband charge, and Amanda Hawkins actually had to go to the hospital, because the ring was too tight

for her finger. So they actually had to send her to the hospital to get this ring cut off of her finger.

There are so many twists and turns to this case, it is unreal. And the corrections officer allegedly went home after being terminated for this and

after getting the contraband charge. He allegedly went to his house and got into a fight with his wife and ended up getting domestic violence

charges or something of that sort.

LALAMA: Oh, my gosh.

TAYLOR: And ended up in the Kerr County jail after this happened.

LALAMA: Unbelievable. A script you couldn`t make up.

Outrage tonight after a Louisiana family is arrested for brutally abusing an autistic relative. And outrage may not even be strong enough of a word.

There is a special place in hell for people who could allegedly do the things we`re going to tell you about to another human being.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:20:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LALAMA: Tonight an entire family is behind bars after investigators say they humiliated and tortured their young relative. Holding the 22-year-old

against her will and turning her into their personal slave. And family may not be the best word to describe these people. A mom, a dad, and their

three adult children accused of forcing the reportedly autistic young woman to do housework just for food and water. Like, get this, brace yourself.

Lapping up a spill with her tongue, cleaning the septic tank with her bare hands, and they supposedly had her sleeping in a chicken wire cage with

only a bucket for a toilet.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That was what she had to lay on. This girl was eat up with the mosquitos, the bugs. It`s horrible. I mean, the damn dog got

treated better than she did.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LALAMA: Well, according to appalling new court documents, the family threatened to kill the young victim, who was preferred to as only D.P. And

they assaulted her multiple times with everything from a hammer to a bb gun to a cigarette lighter. In one nightmarish accusation, they forced her to,

get ready, to eat her own mother`s ashes. And if that is not enough, investigators say the family was planning on sharing the victim with

others.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SHERIFF DANIEL EDWARDS, TANGIPAHOA PARISH: They also had planned to bring her to another specific location for the purpose of her performing sexual

acts on a large group of people in exchange for them, the captors, being paid money.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LALAMA: I want to bring in my panel. On the phone, Matt Doyle, assistant news Director for Louisiana radio network. Also, retired FBI special agent

Maureen O`Connell, and defense attorney, Kirby Clements. So where do I begin, Matt Doyle, with you?

MATT DOYLE, ASSISTANT NEWS DIRECTOR, LOUISIANA RADIO NETWORK: Well, this all began back in August of 2015, when the victim`s mother died and her

care was transferred over to her relatives in the Knope family. She was allegedly abused for about a year by that family until authorities made

their initial discovery and arrest in June of 2016. Raylaine Knope, Terry Knope and their children, Bridget Lambert, Jody Lambert, and Taylor Knope,

have all been hit with a pretty serious set of charges, including forced labor, attempt sex trafficking, hate crimes which is held up in federal

court among others. The victim is related to Raylaine, and authorities say the family engaged in these calculated abuse to try to maintain control of

the victim for some manual labor and her SSI checks. They got about $8,796 worth of those SSI checks.

They were being mailed to Terry Knope at the time. You mentioned a few of those details that were fairly disturbing. She was kept in the chicken

cage at night, according to authorities. A few other ones that were mentioned, the fact that she was forced to take methamphetamine and that

was used as blackmail to prevent her going to the police, also allegedly forced to eat dog feces that was spread on bread. This went on for about a

year until authorities made that initial arrest.

LALAMA: Maureen O`Connell, former FBI special agent. So, you were talking about federal crimes here. Explain why this is a federal case.

MAUREEN O`CONNELL, RETIRED FBI SPECIAL AGENT: Well, first of all, the good news is that the prosecutors and the police feel the same way about this

victim that we do, and they hit them with every single solitary possible charge known to mankind, and thank you to that team that did that.

[18:25:09] It`s a federal charge for a number of reasons. It`s a hate crime. It took place in different areas. There were all kinds of things

that bring it to a whole different level, which is why it was addressed by us, but the fact of the matter, and they were stealing money from her SSI

account, and there were all kinds of little federal nexuses, but this -- what they did to this young person is absolutely probably the worst torture

I`ve ever heard of.

LALAMA: Kirby Clements, defense attorney, when they were forcing her to eat her mother`s ashes, with a spoon, as if it were like a broth of some

sort, they stood by and they laughed. They found this rather amusing. As a defense attorney, where are you going to go with this, if you happen to

have any -- if you would have ever been involved in a case like this?

CLEMENTS: As a defense attorney, I would certainly hope my clients would be the younger one. The daughter, who I believe, one is like 21 and one

20, which would have put them at 17 or 18 when this all began, so I would argue they were subject to the influence of Raylaine and Terry Knope, who

are the older people, that is they are the ones that were driving the boat. So, from a defense perspective, I would go with the younger ones and that

is who I hope would be my clients, because I`d be able to argue that they were coerced into this or compelled to do this by their parents. And it

was just a survival method for them.

LALAMA: But Maureen, let me ask you as a long-time law enforcement person, is this like the mob mentality? How is it, where`s the moral compass,

where is one member of the family that says, whoa, this is wrong?

O`CONNELL: Obviously there`s no moral compass and the parents are bullies and that is just the beginning. I mean, these people like control, they

wanted the money. I`ve seen children sexually abused, I`ve seen them murdered, I`ve seen them tortured, but the depth and breadth of this

particular situation is beyond anything I can possibly imagine. There is no moral compass in the younger people, the young children, and their young

adult children that are involved in this. They`re ruined for life, as well they should be.

LALAMA: Absolutely. And so let`s hear from the sheriff, I believe, of this county about this case.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

EDWARDS: The degree of trauma that somebody like this goes through is probably indescribable. And it`s something I can`t imagine. So I would

certainly ask that we all, you know, keep her in our thoughts and prayers.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LALAMA: Wow. So Mike Boyle -- excuse me -- Matt Doyle, tell me, they`re all charged, but one of the adults has a much lesser crime held against

her, and why is that?

DOYLE: Well, they have not released a lot of information on that specific area. This is pretty early on in the process. It would appear that maybe

she was less involved with some of the other aspects of it, such as the sex trafficking, and that indicates reason why she may be having a lesser

charge.

LALAMA: All right. So, let me ask you this, we understand that this victim is autistic. Is there any information on the spectrum? Was she

able -- what was her mental capacity? And I know that she tried to escape at least one time. So clearly she knew that she was living in a veritable

hell.

DOYLE: Well, she would have been verbal enough to communicate to guests and communicate to authorities, but at this time, they`re really not

mentioning much of anything. All we have is the initials, and I think authorities are trying to keep her as protected as they can from the

public. I can only imagine that would be incredibly detrimental to her development and they`re trying to shield her from a lot of the media

attention.

LALAMA: Kirby, I just have about 20 seconds, I would guess that prosecutors want to work one defendant against the other?

CLEMENTS: In a case like this, you would probably work the younger ones against the older ones, but given the conditions here, as a prosecutor, I

mean, from my prosecutor days, I would go after everybody hard and they`d have to give me a reason to want to cut a deal. Because the facts are so

compelling.

O`CONNELL: And Pat, I think it`s most likely that the one that got the lesser charge is the one that has been cooperating the most so far.

LALAMA: Right. Let`s hope if there is a best case scenario that they all burn.

Tonight -- if they`re guilty. Tonight in Waterloo, Iowa, hundreds of people are expected at a vigil for Mollie Tibbets as the desperate search

for the 20-year-old college student continues. Two weeks ago, Mollie vanished after an evening jog and hasn`t been seen or heard from since.

The night she disappeared, she reportedly was supposed to have dinner with her mom. And Mollie`s mom said the past 14 days have been a surreal

nightmare.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The first night she went missing, I was -- you know, I was -- I was distraught. And I knew her phone was dead, but I sent her a

text anyway saying, you know, I love you, we`re looking for you, and we`ll find you no matter what. My greatest fear is that we wouldn`t find her. But

I can`t go there right now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LALAMA: Police and the FBI have conducted more than 200 interviews without any solid leads on where Mollie is. She was dog sitting for her

boyfriend and her brother when she was last seen and police have ruled them out as suspects.

Tomorrow morning at noon Eastern, her family and crime stoppers of central Iowa will have a joint press conference about that search and HLN of course

will bring that to you live.

Everyone thought she was abducted when the cops found a missing mom`s car. Everyone but maybe her ex, who reportedly just made a big confession. What

happened to Bellamy Gamboa? That`s next.

[18:35:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LALAMA: She has been missing for exactly a month. And though investigators first feared she was abducted, there may be an even darker end to the story

for Virginia`s Bellamy Gamboa.

She is a mother of four who was last seen at her apartment, where she reported lived with her ex-boyfriend so they could raise their infant twins

together. And he is the one who reportedly told police how unusual it was for Bellamy to skip work or leave her babies for long.

But four weeks after Bellamy vanished, Lamont Johnson was the one put in handcuffs, allegedly confessing to killing her while the two of them were

having a fight. Johnson apparently told the cops that he pushed her down the stairs and choked her to death before putting her body in a plastic

bag and driving it to a neighboring town.

Now, Lamont Johnson is behind bars, but Bellamy still hasn`t been found. And as the search for her body continues, more dark details are coming out

of the wood work about their relationship and other crimes he may have committed.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAMES CROCKETT, BROTHER OF SUSPECT: My brother is a kind-hearted person. I don`t know if he snapped or what would have made him snap. He was very

well invested into the relationship. For him to snap and lose it, it`s totally out of his character. He`s a great guy, that`s all I can say.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LALAMA: All right, so with me now on the phone, Jane Harper, reporter for the Virginian Pilot, also retired FBI special agent Maureen O`Connell, and

defense attorney Kirby Clements.

So, I want to first go to Jane. So, if he is willing to say, OK, yeah, it was me, then why doesn`t he show them where the body is?

JANE HARPER, REPORTER, THE VIRGINIAN PILOT (via telephone): Well, he may have, but we just don`t know that. It`s possible -- I kind of wondered if

maybe he put the body in a dumpster and it ended up in a landfill or something like that, and they haven`t been able to locate it. But we don`t

know whether he told them, yeah, where it was.

LALAMA: And Jane, he had a couple of different stories for exactly what happened?

HARPER (via telephone): I believe he told them at first that, you know, he wasn`t sure where she was, that she had left the, you know, home that night

and didn`t come back. And when they did searches, from what I understand, he never participated in any of those searches.

LALAMA: Wow! So, what would compel him to say, OK, yeah, it was me?

HARPER (via telephone): I`m not sure. Maybe he folded under police questions. I don`t know. Maybe guilt got to him. We don`t know the answer.

We just know that it said in the court document that he had confessed to killing her and that he had strangled her.

LALAMA: Maureen O`Connell, retired FBI, a lot of people think that nobody murders are hard to get a conviction. I say, not necessarily. How about

you?

MAUREEN O`CONNELL, RETIRED FBI SPECIAL AGENT: I agree. And I also think that the reason he may have confessed could have something to do with the

forensics in the case.

For example, the police may have fingerprinted the vehicle that was found that was hers and found only his fingerprints on the steering wheel and the

handle to exit the driver`s seat and so on. So when they hit him with that information, he buckled and folded, coupled with all the history between

the couple.

[18:40:00] LALAMA: So defense attorney Kirby Clements, he`s charged with second-degree murder. Is he using the location of the body maybe as a

bargaining chip or the just don`t know where she is?

KIRBY CLEMENTS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I don`t that he would use the location of the body as a bargaining chip at this stage. Quite honestly, if I were

his lawyer, I would really be challenging the nature of this interrogation because he was probably subject to some intensive interrogation techniques.

They don`t have a body. They really don`t have a motive. They don`t have any evidence to suggest that there was a fight beforehand. So with such a

tremendously circumstantial case as this, he can rely on the facts as a bargaining chip or the absence of facts.

LALAMA: Well, interesting you should say because apparently there are, as they like to say, prior bad acts. Jane Harper, there is a 911 call where

she`s fearing for her life about one year earlier, correct?

HARPER (via telephone): Correct. And she filed complaints and requests for protective orders with the juvenile and domestic relations district

court, claiming that he had twisted her arm when she had one of their babies in her arm and pushed her to the ground. Apparently she backed off

of those claims, saying that she was afraid that he would become even angrier if she followed through.

LALAMA: Maureen O`Connell, I`m sure you`ve seen a lot of this in your time in law enforcement. You know, women are sort of trapped in a lot of

ways, not all the time. But in this particular situation, it sounds like perhaps she was afraid of him, maybe there was some co-dependency, some

emotional co-dependency, some financial co-dependency, but this is not a new story, is it?

O`CONNELL: It`s not a new story at all unfortunately and the thing that -- my take-away from this particular case is that she had a romantic notion of

what she wanted for her children. And more than anything else, she wanted her children to grow up in a family that was intact. And she mentioned that

over and over.

And it`s part of the reason why she stays, it`s part of the reason why she didn`t face charges. So she really wanted throughout this whole thing to be

the very best mother that she could be, that was obvious.

And secondly, back to the defense attorney, there`s no information whatsoever that says that this interrogation of this person that admitted

this was anything other than a conversation.

LALAMA: Kirby?

CLEMENTS: Well, at this point, I mean, I would say this, that this has been going on for some time, so we don`t know how long the interrogation

was there. I mean, I`ve dealt with people who have -- when there was a missing wife or things of that nature and they were subject on all manner

of techniques.

They froze their bank accounts. They really just came at this individual that I`m referring to now, you know, in such a hard way. But ultimately

that person was exonerated. I`m not saying that occurred in this case, but it merits looking into.

LALAMA: Jane Harper -- go ahead. Go ahead, Maureen.

O`CONNELL: I was going to say certainly that`s true, Kirby, but the bottom line is, when you have a missing person, you have to do whatever you can to

bring them back safely. That`s our mission.

LALAMA: Jane Harper, where is he now?

HARPER (via telephone): He`s being held without bond in the Virginia Beach jail. He was supposed to have a bond hearing yesterday but withdrew his

request for it.

LALAMA: OK. Thanks so much and keep us posted. A Wisconsin man allegedly goes to explosive extremes to cover up the death of his wife. But despite

the utter destruction, he wasn`t able to obliterate the evidence. And now he`s going to prison. Details, next.

[18:45:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LALAMA: In Madison, Wisconsin, something strange and terrifying happened on a Wednesday afternoon in September. Nine-one-one was notified of an

explosion at the home of a couple who had been married for more than two decades.

Police described the explosion as hellacious. Firefighters and police arrived to the house that the couple, Steven and Lee Ann Pirus, built. They

said the home was obliterated by the blast. Two days later, investigators found the body of Lee Ann.

One would think the explosion or fire killed her, but an autopsy revealed a gunshot to the head. And authorities found enough evidence to conclude

the blast was intentional. Lee Ann`s husband, Steven Pirus, was arrested. Investigators say he shot and killed her and tried to cover it up.

She had apparently been dead for weeks, if not months before the explosion. And get this, animals had reportedly begun eating her remains.

Steven Pirus is expected -- suspected of manipulating the natural gas supply line to the house to cause the explosion. But what`s the alleged

motive for any of this?

Maureen O`Connell and Kirby Clements are still with me, thankfully, to help me get through this one. OK, Maureen, so lord knows how long this

woman was in the house.

[18:50:02] She`s living there. He worships his animals but lets them allegedly eat her, and then kills them in the explosion. How many kinds of

crazy is this, allegedly?

O`CONNELL: Well, he killed her, that`s obvious. And then he was ruminating day after day, week after week, potentially month after month, figuring

out, how am I going to get rid of the body? The smell is starting to take over the house.

One can imagine all kinds of things that are going through his head. So he ultimately makes the decision to blow up all the evidence and I don`t know

when people are going to learn that you don`t just obliterate the evidence, especially in this day and age, it`s become easier and easier to

really get to the bottom of things.

LALAMA: Well, not too many of these people are all that bright when it comes down to it. Kirby Clements, he says she was mentally ill and that

she had pleaded with him to kill her and so he did. The judge didn`t agree with that and said it`s not a mercy case, but is that the arena you might

be going in, if you were the defense attorney?

CLEMENTS: Not at all. That`s not even a defense. They begged me to murder them so I murdered them. Therefore, I`m not guilty of murder. That would

not be a way to go. That`s -- not at all, I wouldn`t go that way at all.

LALAMA: Well, what would you do, Kirb?

CLEMENTS: Well,right now, I would really have to explore the forensics to get a closer look at that to find out whether this was an execution style

shooting or whether they can tell us, you know, how close or far away it was, to call into question how she died. And then use that as a bargaining

chip to try to negotiate a plea, assuming that my client admitted that he was guilty of something.

LALAMA: Maureen O`Connell, this was pretty devious. First of all, to know that your beloved animals are eating your wife. I feel like I`m reading the

script of some horror film. But he knows that, he`s living in the house. And then after a few weeks, he`s like, whoa, can`t deal with this, so he

cuts the gas line. I mean, that takes some real, real nefarious mental stuff going on, right?

O`CONNELL: Absolutely. He cuts the gas line and then he waits until it fills the house and finds an ignition source and ultimately explodes. It

looks like a fairly nice house in a pretty nice neighborhood. It just goes to show you that this type of thing can happen anywhere, anytime, anyplace.

But for him to blow up that house and his animals is a whole new level of crazy.

LALAMA: Well, here`s something, Kirby, that you can play with. On his cell phone was a picture of a woman, not his wife, in a very seductive pose.

And if I`m not mistaken, he was giving money to certain people he was meeting online. What do you think?

CLEMENTS: Well, I would say this. That probably wouldn`t give rise to murder charges. I mean, it would not be very good. I mean, I got a picture

of me on my cell phone, so I don`t know what that says about me.

(LAUGHTER)

LALAMA: You do?

CLEMENTS: Although I got a picture of my wife on a laptop. That`s another story. But I don`t know that that`s going to give rise to a murder charge.

Him giving money, again, they`re probably not going to be able to establish that motive because you can`t really connect what he has there now to when

they claim that the murder took place.

LALAMA: All right, Kirby, I want you to e-mail me about that picture of yourself on your cellphone.

(LAUGHTER)

LALAMA: We need to have a discussion about that. Thanks both of you. It`s a good thing there is no statute of limitations for apologies, because a

former waitress who did the wrong thing 20 years ago is now doing the right thing, plus interest. One more thing, next.

[18:55:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LALAMA: One more thing for you tonight. An inspiring example that it`s never too late to make something right and to pay it forward. Last week,

the owners of El Charro restaurant in Tucson were startled when they received a letter of apology and a thousand bucks in cash from a former

waitress.

She wrote that one of the waiters encouraged her to forget to ring in a few drinks a shift and to pocket the cash. She said she did, but that she had

felt guilty about it for the past 20 years, so she sent the money back with interest. The owners say they have no idea who could have sent it, but they

are planning to help others with the money.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: With or without the money, it was nice to have the apology. The money just says this person is pretty special. We want to do

special things with the money. It`s not life-changing money for us.

We want to do something where we can grow it and benefit others, whether it be through a scholarship or an emergency fund for people in the hospitality

industry.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LALAMA: Paying it forward as it should be. The next hour of "Crime & Justice" starts right now.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice over): A woman`s disappearance brings shocking discoveries. Her rotting remains. And investigators say she was strangled

by the father of her baby girl, as she held the infant in her arms.

[19:00:04] UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice over): Locked away in a cage.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I can`t believe this took place.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice over): Did an entire family humiliate and torture their young relative?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hidden under branches, plywood and tarps.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Holding her against her will.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The victim lived like an animal.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And making her their personal slave.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A bucket for a toilet, a bucket to drink from.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A desperate search for a missing mom of four turns into a murder investigation.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don`t know if he snapped or what would have made him snap.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why are police looking at her live-in boyfriend?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He was very well invested into the relationship. It`s totally out of his character.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You know, seems like a good place to live.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A shocking home explosion becomes a death investigation.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The explosion that occurred was intentional.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When a body is found in the home.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Leanne was in the house.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But the autopsy reveals more than just burns.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Steven intentionally blew up this house.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She asked me if I would help her commit suicide.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PAT LALAMA, HLN HOST: Good evening. I`m Pat Lalama in for Ashleigh Banfield.

This is the second hour of CRIME & JUSTICE.

Tonight, the tragic answer to the question one Florida family has been asking for months -- where is Cassandra Robynson? The beautiful 24-year-

old mom was last seen at her daughter`s very first birthday party. That was back in February. And for nearly five months she was missing.

When police came knocking, Cassandra`s boyfriend allegedly said she had gone on a very well deserved vacation, suggesting that she was in Bermuda.

But then investigators say they found her remains in a storage trailer, stuffed into a green steel drum, and smelling so badly they could detect

the dead body from outside. And police don`t know how she died.

But they have told us that Henry Stiger confessed to killing Cassandra, telling a friend what he strangled her with her bare hands while she was

holding their baby, and that the baby even fell to the floor.

With me now on the phone, Dave Mack, syndicated talk show host. Also Mike Wood, the public information officer for the Pensacola police department,

medical examiner and forensic pathologist, Dr. William Morrone and defense attorney Kirby Clements.

So Dave Mack, so listen. What is the latest on the case?

DAVE MACK, SYNDICATED TALK SHOW HOST (on the phone): What we have right now is the baby daddy, Mr. Stiger, who is 53 years old, has been charged

with second-degree murder after Robynson, who was the mother of their 1- year-old daughter, was found dead. This happened on July 11th when she was found. But they didn`t even start looking for her as a missing person

until the middle of June.

It`s really been a weird case, Pat, from the very beginning. You mentioned the last time anybody saw Cassandra was at the birthday party for her 1-

year-old daughter, and that was February 1st. From that time on, nobody had seen her, nothing was going on. And Mr. Stiger filed for custody

rights and some other paternity three days after the missing person`s report was filed, all the while knowing that she was not missing. She was

in one of his trailers on a friend`s property.

LALAMA: Dave, just very quickly explain the relationship. He`s much older than her. Am I right about that?

MACK: Yes, she was 25. He was 53. And she had -- you know, she had an interesting background. And when they got together, apparently Mr. Stiger

also had another girlfriend. And you know, he showed up right after February 1st, sometime in the week following that, showed up at his other

girlfriend`s house with the baby, saying, hey, look what I got you, here`s a present.

I don`t know what his deal was, and I`m sure we will hear about it during the trial, but it just seems like he used this young woman, took advantage

of her just to have the baby and then once that was accomplished, she was just thrown to the side.

LALAMA: And didn`t he say something like, yes, the mother is only -- we only need her for the milk, something like that?

MACK: Yes, we just need her for the milk. And that`s what he told the people he had been feeding to the baby, is that he had a bunch of breast

milk that she had pumped ahead of time and was in the freezer.

You know, one of the thing about this is that Cassandra`s sister made a comment on this yesterday when she mentioned that fact that now that the

baby was over a year old at the birthday party, that she could eat other things, that she didn`t have to be just on breast milk and maybe that was

what pushed Stiger to go ahead and do what he planned to do all along.

LALAMA: Well, we are fortunate to have with us, officer Mike Wood of the Pensacola police department.

Mike, great work on finally solving this, it seems. So how were you tipped off? What led you to that horrific scene, and describe that scene for us.

[19:05:12] OFFICER MIKE WOOD, PUBLIC INFORMATION OFFICER, PENSACOLA POLICE DEPARTMENT: Well, first of all, I want to say that our investigators got

this case four months behind. They were four months behind the eight ball when they got it. And they did a fantastic job of good old-fashioned

police work finding this body. They found it after some good police work, after investigating this in the trailer at a lot of 65th and Fairfield in

Pensacola.

LALAMA: So -- but give us a scenario of what led you to what, a, b, and c. So, you know, you go to his house, what, do you get a search -- what leads

you to that property and whose property was that?

WOOD: Well, in a homicide case, the first thing investigators do is they start with the people closest to the victim. And that was what happened in

this case. They were able to develop a suspect very early, but you have to put the pieces together, and that takes some time. So they were able to do

that. They were eventually led to this lot. They were given permission by the lot owner to look all over the lot, and then they found the trailer and

they found the smell coming from the trailer and went and got a warrant.

LALAMA: Dr. William Morrone, medical examiner, we are talking about a badly decomposed body. I`m told it was just unviewable. What does that

mean? I mean, I know what it means, but in terms of investigating a case, what can you glean from a body that is that badly decomposed?

DR. WILLIAM MORRONE, MEDICAL EXAMINER/FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST (on the phone): One of the final stages of decomposition is the dry stage of rotting, often

times called skeletonization that the body`s actually -- all the soft tissue is gone, the ants and beetles and spiders have taken things away.

And you have to able to judge it just like you would be looking ancient holy burial mounds or Egyptians anthropologically. You have to look at the

bones and say, what kind of trauma was there? How old is this? And any of the other soft tissue around will be putrefying (ph), will be giving off --

the body leaks like a container and it soaks into the floor and the carpet. And the final organization is full body x-ray, to look for trauma from

weapons and fractures.

LALAMA: Dave Mack, back to you. Where is he now? What`s he been charged with? How has he pled? What`s next?

MACK: Well, Stiger is sitting in jail. He was actually in jail before for a couple of weeks ahead of time, because he has a pretty lengthy criminal

background and was on probation and violated that in a previous event in his life financially. But he is in jail He is charged with second-degree

murder. And at this point, pleading not guilty. We will have to wait and see what`s going to happen next. But as we see right now, he has been in

jail since before the body was found.

LALAMA: So officer Mike Wood, back to you, Pensacola P.D. So in the beginning, he gave you one story, right, that he saw her leave? What did

he tell you in the beginning?

WOOD: Well, he said that he took the keys to a car, a BMW, and left. He also gave indications that she may have taken a vacation, may have gone to

Bermuda, but that simply wasn`t the case.

LALAMA: And didn`t he say he didn`t have contact with her because he didn`t want to bother her while she was vacationing?

WOOD: That`s correct. And also she would -- it wasn`t unheard of for her not to speak to her family for a while. A lot of people wonder why it took

so long for us to pick up on that case, or the family to pick up on the problem. And it wasn`t unheard of for her to do that. When she stopped

posting on social media, she stopped phone calls, that`s when the family became suspicious and called us.

LALAMA: So, officer, do you believe that a fight happened, that this was a crime of passion? Obviously it was second-degree, it is not premeditated.

WOOD: Right. And it had to do with the family member, we believe it was an incident that occurred at the birthday party of their daughter. He

became angry and we believe that Cassandra had threatened to leave and was taking the baby and doing so at the time that he killed her.

LALAMA: Also, officer, did he confess to a friend allegedly?

WOOD: Well, again, allegedly, that`s what we are told, but I don`t want to get into confessions at this point. I`d like to see that play out in a

courtroom.

LALAMA: Kirby Clements, defense attorney, I`m going to have to ask you, if it were your client, what would you do with this?

KIRBY CLEMENTS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I would be going for something less than murder. I`d be going for manslaughter. I think there are some allegation

--

LALAMA: What!

CLEMENTS: I would have to go for manslaughter. You couldn`t walk away, because it`s his trailer. It is locked. It is on a friend`s property and

the body is in there. So you couldn`t even say he had no connection to that. So all you can try to do is get the charge reduced to manslaughter.

And I think there`s some allegation that her sister may have said the baby wasn`t his. That could have been the reason for the fight that could

trigger for a manslaughter charge, that he was angry when he found out that was not his baby.

[19:10:24] LALAMA: Well, why, you know, I understand it personally, but in your mind, what diminishes the charge from murder to manslaughter?

CLEMENTS: Well, it would be the same as if you found -- if you came home - - when you talk about manslaughter, the classic example is, you come home and you find your spouse in bed with another person.

LALAMA: In bed, right.

CLEMENTS: And so you kill them. And that would be that hot blood, if you will, that reduces murder to manslaughter. I would suggest that if he

finds out that he is not the father of the baby and that`s when he explodes and that`s when he -- assuming the death was by strangulation, that he

strangled her at that point, that that would be the reduction from murder to manslaughter.

LALAMA: Interesting.

So let`s go back to Dave Mack, syndicated talk show host. He had, so they say, $100,000 in cash in his home. Is that true?

MACK: They took pictures of it. This guy apparently got $400,000 from his concurrent girlfriend over the last couple of years, and he was preparing

to flee. When the police were actually investigating, they came to do -- they did two searches of his house. First time they came, did a walk

through. Saw a number of things. Got a second search. Came back the second time, they noticed things had been packed up, personal effects for

his daughter as well as for himself were by the door. That means toys and diapers and things like that. But on top of that, over $100,000 in cash

was right there in a bag next to the front door, getting ready to leave.

LALAMA: Oh, my. Officer Wood, how did he amass that kind of cash?

WOOD: Well, we are still looking into that. He had a company, a supposed coffee company where he sold coffee beans. I don`t think there was ever

any break-in that we are building. That he sold coffee out of this. So we are looking into that. That also has some charges, some money laundering

involved, indirect to this case, you know, to the murder charge. So where exactly he got it, we are still looking into that.

LALAMA: Well, was the coffee business a front, or was it a legitimate business?

WOOD: Well, I mean, that`s possible. We don`t know. We are still looking into that. We do know that he was into hot air balloons, and the trailer

that Cassandra was found in was the trailer that he used to haul his hot air balloons around in. I don`t know if that was a business or a hobby,

but he was into that as well.

LALAMA: So the two of them had no ongoing relationship. He was the father of the child as far as you know? Or do we even know that for certain?

WOOD: Well, he and Cassandra had known each other for about two years. They were together on and off.

LALAMA: But he really did not play a role in raising the child or did he? Did he have visitation?

WOOD: Well, he did -- he was involved in the child`s life. As to how often, I can`t tell you that, but I do know that he was involved.

LALAMA: So this vacation that she allegedly went on, officer Wood, were you suspicious when he told you that story?

WOOD: Well, our investigators are going to be suspicious of every story and rightfully so. Again, when you talk to somebody, when you investigate

a murder case, you talk to people that were closest, and when he came up with that, our investigators automatically began to dig deeper.

LALAMA: All right, getting back to this supposed confession, what are you able to tell us? The friend with whom he shares the business allegedly

said that he confessed. Let me give you some facts. He said there was only three ways to get rid of the victim, one, sell her into slavery, pay

her off, kill her. Three ways to kill your lover. Is that true?

WOOD: Well, that`s what he supposedly said. He allegedly said in the confession as well. But I don`t want to get into whether he confessed or

not. I wasn`t there for the interview and I wasn`t there when he was talking to this witness. So I would rather let that play out in court.

LALAMA: Kirby Clements, what would you do with that kind of information, that the business partner, who probably has no reason to make it up, or

maybe he does?

CLEMENTS: I would certainly see that the business partner has a great reason to make it up. He obviously stands to gain that money from the

business. Was he involved in this money laundering scheme, is he trying to protect himself? That s he is trying to make himself untouchable by making

himself valuable to the investigation. So I would definitely go after the business partner. He has a huge financial motive.

LALAMA: Dave Mack, so I don`t know, if I were going to kill somebody, I`m not going to throw them in a barrel on some property close by. Not too

bright, is it?

MACK: Yes. One thing that you mentioned right there is that he actually didn`t have a plan. He actually -- when you actually back into it and you

realize that he put the body -- allegedly put the body of his baby mama into a trailer that he owned and then put it on property of a not great

friend, but somebody who is an acquaintance.. And they were able to, you know, the body could have been there since February. Nobody has seen her

since February 1st. So he had to know, he had to have been aware of what was going on. He put her right where it could all be traced right back to

him. The hotter balloon thing was a business that he was deeply involved with and made money with. He made hundreds of thousands of dollars. He

was living in a multi million dollar place up until last year.

[19:05:43] LALAMA: Very interesting.

Kirby, I`m going to give you the last here. Apparently there was a custody case. So I`m going to take off the defense attorney hat and put on a

psychiatrist hat. So why is he fighting for this kid if he has got all this money and with somebody else? What?

CLEMENTS: It sounds like maybe the kind of person that just wants what he wants when he wants it, you know. He was making this money. He was a

little bit out of control in his life when he was convicted of previous crimes. But you know, he is the kind of guy that, you know, I get what I

want when I want to get it and when I put my mind to it. And that`s why he is fighting. I mean, it doesn`t make sense. But like in divorce cases,

you know, people will fight over a TV.

LALAMA: And yes. And stick the kids in the middle, let`s not forget that.

CLEMENTS: Exactly.

LALAMA: So thanks, Kirby.

House of horrors in South Louisiana, where an autistic woman was allegedly brutalized by her so-called family, forced to live in inhumane conditions

and perform unimaginable acts. That`s next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:21:33] LALAMA: Tonight, an entire family is behind bars after investigators say they humiliated and tortured their young relative.

Holding the 22-year-old against her will and turning her into their personal slave. And family may not be the best word to describe these

people. A mom, a dad, and their three adult children accused of forcing the reportedly autistic young woman to do housework just for food and

water. Like, get this, brace yourself, lapping up a spill with her tongue, cleaning the septic tank with her bare hands, and they supposedly had her

sleeping in a chicken wire cage with only a bucket for a toilet.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROCKY STEWART, FAMILY MEMBER: That was what she had to lay on. This girl was eat up with the mosquitos, the bugs. It`s horrible. I mean, the damn

dog got treated better than she did.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LALAMA: Well, according to appalling new court documents, the family threatened to kill the young victim, who was referred to only as D.P. And

they assaulted her multiple times with everything from a hammer to a BB gun to a cigarette lighter. In one nightmarish accusation, they forced her to,

get ready, to eat her own mother`s ashes. And if that`s not enough, investigators say the family was planning on sharing the victim with

others.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SHERIFF DANIEL EDWARDS, TANGIPAHOA PARISH: They also had planned to bring her to another specific location for the purpose of her performing sexual

acts on a large group of people in exchange for them, the captors, being paid money.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LALAMA: I want to bring in my panel. On the phone, Matt Doyle, assistant news director for Louisiana radio network. Also, retired FBI special agent

Maureen O`Connell, and defense attorney Kirby Clements.

So where do I begin, Matt Doyle, with you?

MATT DOYLE, ASSISTANT NEWS DIRECTOR, LOUISIANA RADIO NETWORK (on the phone): Hello, Pat. This all began back in August of 2015, when the

victim`s mother died and her care was transferred over to her relatives in the Knope family. She was allegedly abused for about a year by that family

until authorities made their initial discovery and arrest in June of 2016. Raylaine Knope, Terry Knope and their adult children Bridgett Lambert, Jody

Lambert and Taylor Knope have all been hit with a pretty serious set of charges, including forced labor, attempt sex trafficking, hate crimes,

which is how this ended up in federal court among others.

The victim is related to Raylaine. And authorities say the family engaged in the calculated abuse to maintain control of the victim for some manual

labor and her SSI checks. They got about $8,796 worth of those SSI checks. They were being mailed to Terry Knope at the time.

You mentioned a few of those details that were fairly disturbing. She was kept in the chicken cage at night, according to authorities. A few other

ones that were mentioned, the fact that she was forced to take methamphetamine and that was used as blackmail to prevent her going to the

police, also allegedly forced to eat dog feces that was spread on bread. And this went on, like I said, for about a year until authorities made the

initial arrest.

LALAMA: Maureen O`Connell, former FBI special agent. So, you were talking about federal crimes. Explain why this is a federal case.

[19:25:02] MAUREEN O`CONNELL, RETIRED FBI SPECIAL AGENT: Well, first of all, the good news is that the prosecutors and the police feel the same way

about this victim that we do, and they hit them with every single solitary possible charge known to mankind. And thank you to that team that did

that.

It`s a federal charge for a number of reasons. It`s a hate crime. It took place in different areas. There were all kinds of things that bring it to

a whole different level, which is why it was addressed by us. But the fact of the matter, they were stealing money from her SSI account, and there

were all kinds of little federal nexuses. But what they did to this young person is absolutely probably the worst torture I have ever heard of.

CLEMENTS: Kirby Clements, defense attorney, when they were forcing her to eat her mother`s ashes, with a spoon, as if it were like a broth of some

sort, they stood by and they laughed. They found this rather amusing. As a defense attorney, where are you going to go with this, if you happen to

have any -- if you would have ever been involved in a case like this?

CLEMENTS: Well, as a defense attorney, I would hope my clients would be the younger ones. The daughter who I believe - one is like 21, and one is

20, which would have put them at 17 or 18 when it all began, so that I would argue that they were subject to the influence of Raylaine and Terry

Knope who are the older people. That is they are the ones that were driving the boat.

So as -- from a defense perspective, I would go with the younger ones and that`s who I hope would be my clients, because I would be able to argue

that they were coerced into this or compelled to do this by their parents. And it was just a survival method for them.

LALAMA: But, Maureen, let me ask you as a long-time law enforcement person, is this like the mob mentality? How is it? Where is the moral

compass? Where is one member of the family that says, whoa, this is wrong?

O`CONNELL: Well, obviously, there`s no moral compass. And the parents are bullies and that`s just the beginning. I mean, these people like control,

they wanted the money. I have seen children sexually abused, I have seen them murdered, I have seen them tortured. But the depth and breadth of

this particular situation is beyond anything I can possibly imagine.

There is no moral compass in the younger people, the young children, their young adult children that are involved in this are ruined for life, as well

they should be.

LALAMA: Absolutely. And so let`s hear from the sheriff, I believe, of this county about this case.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

EDWARDS: The degree of trauma that somebody like this goes through is probably indescribable. And it`s something I can`t imagine. So I would

certainly ask that we all, you know, keep her in our thoughts and prayers.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LALAMA: Wow. So Mike Boyle -- excuse me -- Matt Doyle, tell me, they are all charged, but one of the adults has a much lesser crime against her, and

why is that?

DOYLE: Well, they have not released a lot of information on that specific area. This is pretty early on in the process. It would appear that maybe

she was less involved with some of the other aspects of it, such as the sex trafficking, and that indicates why she may be having a lesser charge.

LALAMA: All right. So let me ask you this, we understand that this victim is autistic. Is there any information on the spectrum? What was she able

- what is her mental capacity? And I know that she tried to escape at least one time. So clearly she knew that she was living in a veritable

hell.

DOYLE: Well, she would have been verbal enough to communicate to guests and communicate to authorities, but at this time, they are really not

mentioning much of anything. All we have is the initials. And I think authorities are trying to keep her as protected as they can from the

public. I can only imagine that would be incredibly detrimental to her development and they are trying to shield her from a lot of the media

attention.

LALAMA: Kirby, I just have about 20 seconds. I would guess prosecutors want to work one defendant against the other?

CLEMENTS: In a case like this, you would probably work the younger ones against the older ones. But given the conditions here, as a prosecutor - I

mean, from my prosecutor days, I would go after everybody hard, and they would have to give me a reason to want to cut a deal. Because the facts

are so compelling.

O`CONNELL: And Pat, I think it`s most likely that the one that got the lesser charge is the one that has been cooperating the most so far.

[19:30:01] LALAMA: Right. Let`s hope if there is a best case scenario, that they all burn.

Tonight -- if they are guilty.

Tonight in Waterloo, Iowa, hundreds of people are expected at a vigil for Mollie Tibbetts. As the desperate search for the 20-year-old college

student continues, two weeks ago, Mollie vanished after an evening jog, and hasn`t been seen or heard from since. The night she disappeared, she

reportedly was supposed to have dinner with her mom. And Mollie`s mom says the past 14 days have been a surreal nightmare.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LAURA CALDERWOOD, MOTHER OF MOLLIE TIBBETTS: First night she went missing, I was -- you know, I was -- I was distraught. And I knew her phone was

dead, but I sent her a text anyway, saying, you know, I love you, we`re looking for you, and we`ll find you no matter what. My greatest fear is

that we wouldn`t find her. But I can`t go there right now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LALAMA: Police and the FBI have conducted more than 200 interviews without any solid leads on where Mollie is. She was dogsitting for her boyfriend

and her brother when she was last seen. And police have ruled them out as suspects. Tomorrow morning at noon Eastern, her family and crimestoppers

of Central Iowa will have a joint press conference about that search and HLN, of course, will bring that to you live.

Everyone thought she was abducted when the cops found a missing mom`s car. Everyone but maybe her ex, who reportedly just made a big confession. What

happened to Bellamy Gamboa, that`s next.

[19:35:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LALAMA: She`s been missing for exactly a month. And though investigators first feared she was abducted, there may be an even darker end to the story

for Virginia`s Bellamy Gamboa. She`s the mother of four who was last seen at her apartment, where she reportedly lived with her ex-boyfriend so they

could raise their infant twins together. And he`s the one who reportedly told police how unusual it was for Bellamy to skip work or leave her babies

for long. But four weeks after Bellamy vanished, Lamont Johnson was the one put in handcuffs, allegedly confessing to killing her while the two of

them were having a fight. Johnson apparently told the cops that he pushed her down the stairs and choked her to death before putting her body in a

plastic bag and driving it to a neighboring town.

Now, Lamont Johnson is behind bars but Bellamy still hasn`t been found. And as the search for her body continues, more dark details are coming out

of the woodwork about their relationship and other crimes he may have committed.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAMES CROCKETT, BROTHER OF SUSPECT: My brother`s a kind-hearted person. I don`t know if he snapped or what would have made him snap. He was very

well invested into the relationship. For him to snap and lose it, that`s totally out of his character. He`s a great guy, that`s all -- that`s all I

can say.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LALAMA: All right. So with me now, on the phone, Jane Harper, Reporter for the Virginian-Pilot. Also, retired FBI special agent Maureen

O`Connell; and defense attorney Kirby Clements. So, I want to first go to Jane. So, if he`s willing to say, OK, yes, it was me, then why doesn`t he

show them where the body is?

JANE HARPER, REPORTER, THE VIRGINIAN-PILOT: Well, he may have, but we just don`t know that. It`s possible -- and I kind of wondered if he put the

body in a dumpster and it ended up in a landfill or something like that, and they haven`t been able to locate it. But we don`t know whether he told

them, yes, where it was.

LALAMA: And, Jane, he had a couple of different stories, did he not, for exactly what happened?

HARPER: I believe he told them at first that, you know, he wasn`t sure where she was, that she had left the home that night and didn`t come back.

And when they did searches, though, from what I understand, he never participated in any of those searches.

LALAMA: Wow. So, what would compel him to say, OK, yes, it was me?

HARPER: I`m not sure. Maybe he folded under police questions, I don`t know. Maybe guilt got to him. We don`t know that answer. We just know

that it said in the court document that he had confessed to killing her and that he had strangled her.

LALAMA: Maureen O`Connell, retired FBI, a lot of people think that no-body murders are hard to get a conviction. I say, not necessarily. How about

you?

O`CONNELL: I agree. And I also think that the reason he may have confessed could have something to do with the forensics in the case. For

example, the police may have fingerprinted the vehicle that was found that was hers, and found only his fingerprints on the steering wheel and the

handle to exit the driver`s seat and so on. So, when they hit him with that information, he buckled and folded, coupled with all the history

between the couple.

[19:40:08] LALAMA: So, Defense Attorney Kirby Clements, he`s charged with second-degree murder. Is he using the location of the body maybe as a

bargaining chip, or they just don`t know where she is?

(CROSSTALK)

CLEMENTS: I don`t know that he would use the location of the body as a bargaining chip at this stage. Quite honestly, if I were his lawyer, I

would really be challenging the nature of his interrogation, because he was probably subject to some intensive interrogation techniques. They don`t

have a body, they really don`t have a motive, they don`t have any evidence to suggest that there was a fight beforehand. So, with such a tremendously

circumstantial case as this, he can rely on the facts as a bargaining chip, or the absence of facts.

LALAMA: Well, interesting you should say that, because apparently there are, as they like to say, prior bad acts. Jane Harper, there is a 911 call

where she`s fearing for her life about one year earlier, correct?

HARPER: Correct. And she filed complaints and protect -- requests for protective orders with the juvenile and Domestic Relations District Court,

claiming that he had twisted her arm when she had one of their babies in her arm, and pushed her to the ground. And apparently, she backed off of

those claims, saying that she was afraid he would become even angrier if she followed through.

LALAMA: Maureen O`Connell, I`m sure you`ve seen a lot of this in your time in law enforcement, that you know, women are sort of trapped in a lot of

ways, not all the time, but in this particular situation, it sounds like perhaps she was afraid of maybe there was some co-dependency, some

emotional co-dependency, some financial co-dependency, but this is not a new story, is it?

O`CONNELL: It`s not a new story at all, unfortunately. And the thing I -- that my takeaway from this particular case is that she had a romantic

notion of what she wanted for her children. And more than anything else, she wanted her children to grow up in a family that was intact, and she

mentioned that over and over, and it`s part of the reason why she stays, it`s part of the reason why she didn`t face charges. So, she really wanted

throughout this whole thing to be the very best mother that she could be, that was obvious.

And secondly, back to the defense attorney, there is no information whatsoever that says that this interrogation of this person that admitted

this was anything other than a conversation.

LALAMA: Kirby?

CLEMENTS: Well, at this point, I mean, I would say this, that this has been going on for some time. So, we don`t know how long the interrogation

was there. I mean, I`ve dealt with people who have -- when there was a missing wife or things of that nature and they were subject to all manner

of techniques, they froze their bank accounts, they really just came at this -- at this individual that I`m referring to now, so you know, in such

a hard way that, you know -- but ultimately, that person was exonerated. Now, I`m not saying that occurred in this case, but it merits looking into.

O`CONNELL: Certainly --

LALAMA: So, Jane Harper -- oh, go ahead -- go ahead, Maureen.

O`CONNELL: I was going to say, certainly that`s true, Kirby, but the bottom line is, when you have a missing person, you have to do whatever you

can to bring them back safely. That`s the -- that`s our mission.

LALAMA: Jane Harper, where is he now?

HARPER: He`s being held without bond in the Virginia Beach jail. He was supposed to have a bond hearing yesterday but withdrew his request for it.

LALAMA: OK. Thanks so much, and keep us posted. A Wisconsin man allegedly goes to explosive extremes to cover up the death of his wife.

But despite the utter destruction, he wasn`t able to obliterate the evidence. And now, he`s going to prison. Details, next.

[19:45:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LALAMA: In Madison, Wisconsin, something strange and terrifying happened on a Wednesday afternoon in September. 911 was notified of an explosion at

the home of a couple who had been married for more than two decades. Police describe the explosion as hellacious. Firefighters and police

arrived to the house that the couple, Steven and Lee Anne Pirus built. They said the home was obliterated by the blast. Two days later,

investigators found the body of Lee Anne. One would think the explosion or fire killed her, but an autopsy revealed a gunshot to the head. And

authorities found enough evidence to conclude the blast was intentional. Lee Anne`s husband Steven Prius -- Pirus was arrested. Investigators say

he shot and killed her and tried to cover it up. She had apparently been dead for weeks, if not months, before the explosion. And get this, animals

had reportedly begun eating her remains. Steven Pirus is expected -- or suspected of manipulating the natural gas supply line to the house to cause

the explosion. But what`s the alleged motive for any of this?

[19:49:57] Maureen O`Connell and Kirby Clements are still with me, thankfully, to help me get through this one. OK, Maureen, so lord knows

how long this woman was in the house. He`s living there. He worships his animals but lets them allegedly eat her, and then kills them in the

explosion. How many kinds of crazy is this allegedly?

O`CONNELL: Well, he killed her, that`s obvious. And then he was ruminating day after day, week after week, potentially month after month,

figuring out how am I going to get rid of this body? The smell is starting to take over the house. One can imagine all kinds of things that are going

through his head. So, he ultimately makes the decision to blow up all the evidence, and I don`t know when people are going to learn that you don`t

just obliterate the evidence, that it`s -- especially in this day and age, it`s becoming easier and easier to really get to the bottom of things.

LALAMA: Yes, well, not too many of these people are all that bright when it comes down to it. Kirby Clements, he says she was mentally ill and that

she had pleaded with him to kill her, and so he did. Now, the judge didn`t agree with that and said this is not a mercy case, but is that the arena

you might be going in if you are the defense attorney?

CLEMENTS: Oh, not at all because that`s not even a defense. You know, they ask -- they begged me to murder them so I murdered them, and

therefore, I`m not guilty of murder. That would not be a way to go. I mean, that`s -- not at all. I wouldn`t go that way at all.

LALAMA: Well, what would you do, Kirb?

CLEMENTS: Well, right now, I would really have to explore the forensics to take a -- to get a closer look at that to find out whether this was an

execution-style shooting or whether they can tell us, you know, how close or how faraway it was to call into question how she died. And then, use

that as a bargaining chip to try to negotiate a plea assuming that my client admitted that he was guilty of something.

LALAMA: Maureen O`Connell, this was pretty devious. I mean, first of all, to know that your beloved animals are eating your wife. I mean, I know

that`s -- I feel like I`m reading the script of some horror film but he knows that, he`s living in a house, and then after a few weeks, he`s like,

whoa, can`t deal with this. So, he cuts the gas line. I mean, that takes some real, real nefarious mental stuff going on, right?

O`CONNELL: Absolutely. He cuts the gas line and then he waits until it fills the house and finds an ignition source and ultimately explodes. It

looks like a fairly nice house in a pretty nice neighborhood, and it just goes to show you that this type of thing can happen anywhere, anytime,

anyplace. But for him to blow up the house and his animals is a whole new level of crazy.

LALAMA: Well, here`s something, Kirby, that you can play with. On his cell phone was a picture of a woman, not his wife in a very seductive post,

and if I`m not mistaken, he was giving money to certain people he was meeting online. What do you think?

CLEMENTS: Well, I would say this, that probably wouldn`t give rise to murder charges. I mean, it would not be very good. I mean, I got a

picture of me on my cell phone, so I don`t know what that says about me.

LALAMA: You do?

CLEMENTS: Although, I got a picture of my wife on my laptop. So, that`s another story. So -- but I don`t know that that`s going to give rise to a

murder charge. Him giving money, again, they`re probably not going to be able to establish that motive because you can`t really connect what he has

there now to when they claim that the murder took place.

LALAMA: All right. Kirby, I want you to e-mail me about that picture of yourself on your cell phone. We need to have a discussion about that.

Thanks both of you.

It`s a good thing there is no statutes of limitations for apologies because a former waitress who did the wrong thing 20 years ago is now doing the

right thing, plus interest. "ONE MORE THING," next.

[19:55:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LALAMA: "ONE MORE THING" for you tonight, an inspiring example that it`s never too late to make something right and to pay it forward. Last week,

the owners of El Charro Restaurant in Tucson were startled when they received a letter of apology and $1,000 in cash from a former waitress.

She wrote that one of the waiters encouraged her to forget to ring in a few drinks, a shift, and to pocket the cash. She said she did but that she had

felt guilty about it for the past 20 years. So, she sent the money back with interest. The owners say they have no idea who could have sent it,

but they are planning to help others with it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: With or without the money, it was nice to have the apology. The money just says this person is pretty special, and we want to

do special things with the money. We -- it`s not life-changing money for us. We want to do something where we can grow it and benefit others,

whether it`d be through a scholarship or, you know, an emergency fund for people in the hospitality industry.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LALAMA: Paying it forward, as it should be. We`ll see you back here tomorrow night at 6:00 Eastern. "FORENSIC FILES" begins right now.

END