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Manafort Jury Begins Day 3 of Deliberations; Pope Breaks Silence on Priest Sandal; Help for Addicted Pregnant Women. Aired 9:30-10a ET

Aired August 20, 2018 - 09:30   ET



[09:31:45] POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: All right, we're just a few minutes away from the jury returning to the third day of deliberations in the Paul Manafort bank and tax fraud trial. This after the judge refused to release the names of members on the jury on Friday after a request by the media saying he's received personal threats and that he's afraid the same jury will -- the same will happen to the jury if their identity becomes public.

Let's go outside the courthouse. Jessica Schneider is here.

So day three begins. What are you looking at right now?

JESSICA SCHNEIDER, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: It does begin, Poppy. It begins after two days of deliberations totally 14 hours in all and it is interesting that the judge does really fear for the safety of these jurors. That was the comment that he made when he denied that motion by media outlets, including CNN, to release their names.

It was quite an interesting moment. It happened as those jurors were still deliberating. The judge held this hearing inside his courtroom. And the judge said that he was really surprised in this case about the emotions that this case against Paul Manafort had elicited. And then the judge said that he too, as a federal judge, he had even received threats. So he said his safety wasn't an issue. He said, he has the protection of the U.S. Marshal Service. But, of course, those jurors don't. So that's why this judge deciding to keep the names of those jurors secret.

They are definitely hard at work here. They've been deliberating pretty painstakingly without much of a peep from them. They've had two notes last week, one asking the judge for clarification on four different questions, and one simply saying on Friday that as of 5:00 p.m. they were ready to call it quits. So they'll be back here this morning at 9:30.

One thing the defense team has reiterated over and over, Poppy, they think that the longer this jury takes, the better it is for them. They say that these long -- or the longer the deliberations go, the better chance Paul Manafort has.

Poppy, Kevin Downing, Paul Manafort's lawyer, just walked into court. As he did, he put it this way. He said, I feel pretty good. My client feels pretty good as well.

So we'll see what this day brings as day three of jury deliberations begins any minute now.


HARLOW: Right. They were -- they were trying to figure out last week sort of what does reasonable doubt actually mean, and that's the crux of all of it, right?

Jess, thanks for the reporting.


HARLOW: Shan Wu, our legal analyst, is back with me.

And I should also note, of course, you formerly represented Rick Gates, Manafort's longtime associate, up until Rick Gates decided to plea.

So, let's talk about the jury working painstakingly, very quietly right now. As Jess said, we haven't heard a lot from them, just those two notes. What does that signal to you?

SHAN WU, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well, as a former prosecutor, in my prosecutor days, I was always pleased if the jury has been working quietly for a while. I think initially I thought that first question about reasonable doubt might imply that they were having some disagreements very quickly.

I've changed my mind because they were very quiet on Friday and they are working painstakingly, as we just heard. And I think that's probably a good sign for the prosecution. I understand the defense team's point.

I agree about two things with them. First, if it goes really long, that's probably a good sign for them, particularly if we get some notes saying that the jury's having trouble reaching a unanimous decision.

HARLOW: Right.

[09:34:59] WU: And then, secondly, I think the defense team has a right to feel good. A lot of us thought this was going to be a slam dunk case and they've kept the jury out and that first question from the jury, or the four questions, indicated that the defense team succeed in focusing the jury on some of the weaker parts of the government's case. So I think they should feel good about what they've done.

HARLOW: All right, Shan Wu, thank you for the expertise on that as well. We'll keep you close by in case we do get a verdict coming down any time soon.

Ahead for us, Pope Francis finally speaking out. A scathing letter addressing the latest rampant allegations of sexual abuse within the church. More than 1,000 children falling victim. What the pope said, next.


HARLOW: This morning, the pope is finally breaking his silence on the latest sex abuse scandal in the Catholic Church. He has written a letter -- a letter to the victims. Let me read you part of it.

Quote, the victim's outcry was more powerful than all the measures meant to silence it or sought even to resolve it by decisions that increased its gravity by falling into complicity. The Lord heard that cry and once again showed us on which side he stands.

[09:40:13] Now, this follows that stunning report from that Pennsylvania grand jury detailing allegations of widespread abuse by more than 300 priests against more than 1,000 children over seven decades. The report also suggests how church officials actively worked to hide the abuse, to silence the victims and alleges that this cover- up went all the way up to the Vatican.

There you see the Pennsylvania attorney general who detailed all of this last week.

And now, just now, we're hearing from the pope in detail.

Let's go to our Barbie Nadeau. She joins me from Rome.

A lot of people were saying, why haven't we heard sooner? Why aren't we hearing immediately from the pope? But now he has written this letter.

BARBIE NADEAU, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: That's right. And, you know, he calls for the greater catholic community to embrace the victims. He calls for the clergy to listen to the victims. But he doesn't call for any resignations. And that's something that the victims themselves have been calling for. They want to see greater accountability. They want to see heads roll in this scandal. And he did not call for that.

Let me read you a little bit more of this letter from him. It's important. The words he says are important. They are words we haven't heard before. Looking back to the past, no effort to beg pardon and to seek to repair the harm done will ever be sufficient. Looking ahead to the future, no effort must be spared to create a culture able to prevent such situations from happening, but also to prevent the possibility of their being covered up and perpetuated. The pain of the -- of the -- of the victims and families is also our pain.

Those are important words. But time and time again, when we've talked to this victim -- these victim, they want action. Words just aren't enough, Poppy.

HARLOW: I mean you're talking about children raped. A young girl raped in the hospital after she got her tonsils out. And young boy tied up and whipped. I mean this is what these priests did to these children, according to the attorney general. And you look at more of what the pope wrote and he said that the church is now implementing this zero tolerance policy. I mean, aside from the fact, Barbie, that it should have implemented a

zero tolerance policy from the beginning, what do we know specifically about what will change, right? Because the law does not hold these people to account. The statute of limitations has run out on almost all of them. So what will the church actually do?

NADEAU: That's right. Well, the church needs to open their secret archives. They've got records on a lot of these complaints by family members when their young children expressed what was happening to them. But you also have to, I think, question, I think this is going to be a big question coming up. You have to question whether the secular society is in this? Why didn't the police act more? Were they complicit in this on some level? Did they protect the church? Are the catholic communities in so many states across the United States and across the world are so strong and so important and so influential.

And the next question in a lot of these abuse cases is going to be, why? Where were the cops and why wasn't anyone arrested? Why aren't the prisons filled with predator priests at this point?

HARLOW: Yes. Exactly.

Barbie, thank you very much for all that reporting. I appreciate it.

Also this morning I want to update you on that story we've been following, of course, about that pastor in Turkey, the American man. The White House is reportedly rejecting Turkey's offer now to release him. This is the American pastor Andrew Brunson. According to reporting out of "The Wall Street Journal," Turkey is asking the United States to forgive billions of dollars in fines against a Turkey bank in exchange for releasing this American man. "The Journal" says this impasse could now leads to new U.S. sanctions against Turkey this week. This man, Andrew Brunson, has been held in Turkey since 2016. He's accused of helping plot the coup against Turkey's president, Recep Erdogan. The issue is he and the United States says that is not the case at all. So the bank and forth continues.

A health crisis for an increasing number of pregnant women, opioid addiction. A controversial program that helps women wean off of opiates during pregnancy. We're going to dive into all of it with Sanjay Gupta.


[09:48:50] HARLOW: It is a growing crisis in this country. According to a new CDC report, more than 72,000 Americans died from drug overdoses last year. That is a 7 percent increase from a year before. And most of those deaths related to opioids. Now a growing part of the population that is in crisis, pregnant women and the babies they are carrying.

Our chief medical correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta reports.


RACHAEL SOLOMON, OPIATE ADDICT IN EARLY RECOVERY: I have been addicted to opiates since I was 17. My grandmother gave me my first Percocet. I had a headache. And she told me that would help.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): If there was a last refuge of people insulated from the opioid epidemic, it was pregnant women. But even they are no longer immune. For them, the risk of opioid addiction has quadrupled over the last 15 years.

GUPTA: (on camera): What do you think when you hear that?

SOLOMON: I believe it because I did it.

GUPTA (voice over): Rachel Solomon grew up here in eastern Tennessee. A part of the country hard hit by the opioid epidemic. Two years ago, she had a miscarriage. Her doctors say due to her opioid addiction. So when Rachel found out she was pregnant again, she was terrified.

GUPTA (on camera): How worried were you about the baby?

SOLOMON: I was very worried. But I just thought that my body was not going to be able to carry it.

[09:50:03] GUPTA (voice over): It's hard to overstate the risks of being pregnant while addicted to opioids. Miscarriage, stillbirth and the possibility a baby would essentially be born into a crisis of withdrawal known as Neonatal Abstinence Syndrome, NAS.

This is tough to watch. The uncontrollable crying, unstoppable tremors and this distinctive scream.

GUPTA (on camera): They're essentially coming off of opioids I guess like -- like an adult would, except these are babies that have just been born?


So we're going to see how big the baby is.

GUPTA (voice over): For Dr. Craig Towers, this was not acceptable, so he decided to challenge the status quo.

GUPTA (on camera): Conventional wisdom has been, if someone has a use disorder during pregnancy, don't try and detox. Wait until after they've delivered the baby. The thought was that would be safest, is that right?

TOWERS: That's correct. But our two systematic reviews now have shown that that's not the case.

GUPTA (voice over): Dr. Towers say he has now detoxed more than 600 women from opioids while they were pregnant. Not a single baby has died.

GUPTA (on camera): What was it that made you convinced that maybe you could get through this time?

SOLOMON: He asked me just to trust him. And nobody's ever done that with me, you know? They've never cared like that.

GUPTA (voice over): It's the same compassion Michaela Howard (ph) felt when she detoxed during pregnancy. It wasn't easy. But look at how it turned out.

GUPTA (on camera): How's JC doing?

MICHAELA HOWARD: She's good. She's a happy baby.


GUPTA (voice over): This is her beautiful baby girl, who's now three months old.

HOWARD: She was born with no withdrawal symptoms. And she didn't go to the NICU.

GUPTA (on camera): You're pretty proud, I imagine, that she is doing -- JC's doing so well?

HOWARD: I'm very happy about that.

SOLOMON: We're almost there.

TOWERS: Yes, we're doing good.

GUPTA (voice over): Now, just weeks away from her due date, Rachel is hoping for the same miracle as Michaela.

GUPTA (on camera): You've got named picked out?

SOLOMON: Brantley (ph).

GUPTA: What's it like to look at Brantley?

SOLOMON: It's amazing. It's amazing.


HARLOW: Joining me now is our chief medical correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta.

I am so glad you did this story. And it is such a problem that is ballooning clearly as you laid out. Can you just walk us through how this detox actually works? I mean that doctor that has delivered I think you said 600 of these babies, not one death.

GUPTA: That's right.

Well, you know, the detox works essentially by getting gradually lower doses of what they call an agonist, in this case opioid, and they use different types of -- types of opioids that are lower dose, lower power. And then eventually they give something that basically blocks all the opioid receptors in the body so that if you take an opioid, you're going to get really sick. And so it's a big deterrent for them. The biggest risk, Poppy, and you may know this, and we're hearing

about it all over the country, is that when someone is detoxing, they start to -- their body gets acclimated to lower doses. If they suddenly go back and take a higher dose or a street dose --

HARLOW: Right.

GUPTA: That is when a real risk of death occurs. So there's a real risk to the mother if they don't stick with the system and abide by the sort of plan that the doctor lays out.

HARLOW: Seeing -- and, Sanjay, seeing those babies in your piece, I mean that video of that one baby's leg shaking uncontrollably, I -- for anyone, parent or not, it is so hard to watch.

But, long term, how are these babies doing? I mean do they have long- term affects?

GUPTA: It's a great question. And I think, you know, what we're seeing right now, Poppy, is something that's unfolding real time. So what you've just seen is this is -- this is happening right now. There's not a lot of long term data on this.

What this medical program is, is a reflection of our society, frankly. The doctors are going to be studying these babies long-term. Six hundred, as you mentioned, babies have now been born after the mothers have been detoxed. All of them survived. That was a big question mark even before they began the study. Would the babies be able to come to term and survive?

HARLOW: Right.

GUPTA: So they've gotten through that. Now the next question is, how do they do long term? Indications are pretty good so far.

HARLOW: Wow. Let's hope for the best for all those children, all their mothers as well.

Dr. Sanjay Gupta, thank you for doing this, for shining a light. Appreciate it.

GUPTA: Yes. Thank you.

HARLOW: All right, ahead for us, a violent and deadly weekend in Chicago. More than five dozen shootings in three days. We'll update you.


[09:59:04] HARLOW: Chicago is reeling this Monday morning after another incredibly violent and deadly weekend. Since Friday in Chicago, 60 people were shot, four people killed, including two teens who were found dead early this morning. One of the victims as young as three years old. This is the second time this month that Chicago has experienced such a sharp uptick in gun violence. Just a few weeks ago, 44 people were killed in Chicago -- were shot in Chicago, rather, in a single weekend.

All right, top of the hour. Good morning, everyone. I'm Poppy Harlow in New York.

President Trump lashing out again this morning at the special counsel, Bob Mueller, accusing him of ruining lives and trying to impact the election. Now, these accusations in a flurry of tweets from the president follow this bombshell "New York Times" reporting detailing how White House Counsel Don McGahn sat down for three separate interviews with Bob Mueller's Russia probe team for 30 hours.

[10:00:02] Now, we've also learned the president's lawyers were never fully debriefed on what exactly McGahn told Mueller's investigators.

Let's go to the White House. Let's begin there this hour with Jeremy Diamond.

Good morning to you.