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NFL Players Test Positive For Coronavirus; Ben Carson Suggests Trump Will "Get There" On Kneeling During National Anthem; Trump Administration Under Fire For Refusing To Reveal Companies Receiving Coronavirus Relief Funds; Rep. Katie Porter (D-CA) Discusses Her Demand For Trump Administration To Reveal Companies Getting PPP Loans; Black Protester Carries Injured White Man To Safety In London. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired June 15, 2020 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:30:00]

DR. ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Every expert I've spoken with -- and these are people who study Hydroxychloroquine and COVID -- said there never really was any evidence that this drug worked. Basically, what we had was a president who was pushing it -- Brianna?

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: And there was evidence from the beginning, from the very beginning, that it caused problems.

Elizabeth Cohen, thank you so much from Atlanta for us.

We have breaking news in the coronavirus pandemic. As states and cities threaten to shut down again as more and more crowds are just flat-out ignoring social distancing guidelines, the NFL Network is reporting that several NFL players have tested positive for the virus.

Plus, NBA stars divided over whether they should restart the season as the unrest grows across America.

And Ben Carson suggests the president will come around on kneeling during the anthem, despite everything the president has said.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:35:35]

KEILAR: We have breaking news. As states and cities threaten to shut down as more and more crowds ignore social distancing guidelines, we're getting word that several NFL players have tested positive for the virus. This, as sports leagues are planning to restart their seasons.

NFL insider for NFL Network, Ian Rapoport, broke this story and is joining me now.

Ian, tell me what you know here.

IAN RAPOPORT, NFL INSIDER, NFL NETWORK: My understanding, and according to sources who have told me and my colleague at NFL Network, several Texans players and several Cowboys players, including at least one big-name player, have, in fact, tested positive for the coronavirus. This is something that's happened in recent days.

And a couple of important facts here. First of all, from what we understand, none of these players have been in the facility, which would be something that, had they been in the facility, teams would have to do a deep clean and other protocol measures.

I'm also told both teams did, in fact, follow through on health protocols.

And as far as these players go, just on the personal individual health, they are fine. None are, as far as I can tell, exceedingly sick. Obviously, good news there. They're OK.

But, yes, several Cowboys and several Texans players have, in fact, tested positive for COVID-19.

KEILAR: All right. Ian, great reporting. Thank you for joining us.

I want to talk now with retired NFL offensive tackle, Ephraim Salaam.

Ephraim, thank you for being here with us.

And I wonder, when you look at this as a former player, how do you think that they can expect to have a four-month season when they have players testing positive here?

EPHRAIM SALAAM, RETIRED NFL OFFENSIVE TACKLE: It will be difficult. But I will say this. Once teams get back to their facilities and they have an eye in -- keep a notion on what everyone is doing.

When players are at home at their own disposal, we don't know who they're coming in contact with. They're living by their own guidelines.

So until they're in a structured environment where they can, you know, be watched and adhere to certain rules, once training camp starts to go, that's the only way you can keep guys from, you know, associating with someone whether they know they have the disease or not.

KEILAR: I want to bring Ian back into the conversation.

Ian, how do you think this is going to affect the season for the NFL --

(CROSSTALK)

KEILAR: -- but also for the NBA?

RAPOPORT: Yes. This is something -- first of all, as far as the timing goes, the NFL's going to have the benefit of watching how the NBA and perhaps, hopefully, Major League Baseball as well, reacts to some positive tests, the protocol. What do they do? How do they limit the spread? The NFL has the benefit of watching all that just because players

aren't due in training camp until late July. The date's still not set.

But it should be noted that Dr. Allen Sills, the chief medical officer of the NFL, has said very publicly they expect there to be positive tests. It's not a question of if. It's really a question of when.

It's really just about following protocol. Limiting the spread and making sure that really is not something that gets out of control.

That is something that sort of has been the focus of the NFL rather than saying, all right, let's make sure there are no positive tests. There are going to be some. It's how teams, how the organizations itself respond and follow the protocol that's really going to dictate how the 2020 season goes.

KEILAR: To Ephraim's point, how do they kind of keep the players in a bubble, right?

Ephraim, one question I want to ask you separately that keeps coming up is we're seeing widespread protests for racial justice. Are athletes going to take a knee during the national anthem when the NFL resumes games in the fall? Seems likely there's just going to be more just from what we're hearing from players.

This morning, HUD Secretary Ben Carson, the only African-American in the president's cabinet, was asked about whether the president would soften his stance on this kneeling during the national anthem. And let's just listen to what Ben Carson said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HUGH HEWITT, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST (voice-over): So is there any chance you might persuade the president that he ought not to be upset with players kneeling during the national anthem?

BEN CARSON, HUD SECRETARY (voice-over): Well I don't think he has manifest as much animosity in that region lately. And I think we just continue to work with him. He'll get there.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[13:40:11]

KEILAR: Do you think he'll get there?

SALAAM: No, I don't think he'll get there. He has shown no signs of getting there. He's shown he wants to be right and why would he walk back that stance.

And you know I have no faith in Ben Carson knowing exactly what the president's going to do. Ben Carson is the same man who a couple of years ago said that slaves were immigrants in the bottom of slave ships. So he has no validity of the situation or the flight of the American slave in this country. So how can we take his word about what Donald Trump is going to do,

come around or not come around to something that has been plaguing this country for so, so many years?

KEILAR: I want to listen to some of what the president has said on this, on kneeling during the anthem.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Wouldn't you love to see one of these NFL owners, when somebody disrespects our flag, to say get that son of a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) off the field right now? Out! He's fired!

(CHEERING)

TRUMP: He's fired!

(CHEERING)

TRUMP: We have to stand proudly for the national anthem. Or you shouldn't be playing. You shouldn't be there. Maybe you shouldn't be in the county.

When you go down and take a knee or any other way, you're sitting, essentially, for our great national anthem, you're disrespecting our flag and you're disrespecting our country. And the NFL should have suspended some of these players for one game.

Everybody stood up yesterday. There was nobody kneeling at the beginning of the Super Bowl. We've made a lot of improvements, haven't we? That's a big improvement.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Ephraim, it seems like the issue here is going to be pushed because, for instance, Houston Texas star, Texans star, J.J. Watt was firing back on Twitter at a fan saying, "Pretty sure you won't see Watt take a knee."

Watt tweeted, "A, don't speak for me. B, if you still think it's about disrespecting the flag or our military, you clearly haven't been listening."

To that point, do you think that Americans are some Americans are kind of coming round on the kneeling? And to J.J. Watt's point there, maybe they have more context now for why players have kneeled?

SALAAM: I think the narrative got hijacked a couple of years ago when Kaepernick started this silent protest to bring awareness to what was happening in urban and African-American communities. Now I think people really understand.

What we've got to see eight minutes and 46 seconds of a man begging for his life at the hands of police with George Floyd, I think the narrative now, people understand exactly what Kaepernick meant and other players who decided to peacefully protest by taking a knee.

You can't change the narrative. And in this country, we have a way of shifting what is American and what is un-American. Right?

Look at NASCAR, what NASCAR did. They just banned the Confederate flag. What's more un-American than the Confederate flag in terms of they wanted to secede from the south? They didn't even want to be a part of the country. That's still a badge of honor and heritage, and Robert E. Lee.

All of these things that were completely un-American have become a symbol of America. But someone peacefully protesting by taking a knee is somehow against the county and military.

We have to stop changing the narrative and forcing our own ideals into certain situations and protests.

KEILAR: Yes. Ephraim Salaam, thank you so much for your perspective.

SALAAM: Thank you.

KEILAR: A SWAT team in Florida quits over the criticism from the city's vice mayor. She is going to be joining me live.

Plus, a black protester carries an injured white man through an angry crowd. We're going to tell you the back story behind this picture.

[13:44:14]

And the congresswoman who's demanding the Trump administration reveal who has received coronavirus relief will join me live.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KEILAR: The Trump administration is under fire for refusing to reveal the names of companies on the receiving end of billions of your dollars in coronavirus relief funds. Millions of businesses were recently given loans as part of the Paycheck Protection Program.

Back in March, Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin promised -- this is his, quote -- "full transparency," end quote, about who was receiving those emergency PPP loans.

Well, now Mnuchin and the Trump administration are completely breaking that promise. The administration now argues that the identity of those companies is, quote, "confidential."

Steve Mnuchin, the same person who promised transparency, and he said that the loan amounts are quote, "proprietary information."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEVE MNUCHIN, TREASURY SECRETARY: In so far as naming each and every company, I don't think that promise was ever made. And I don't think it's necessary.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Congresswoman Katie Porter is a Democratic representative from California. She's joining us now. She serves on the Financial Services and Oversight and Reform Committees.

Thank you for being here.

REP. KATIE PORTER (D-CA): Absolutely.

[13:49:58]

KEILAR: So you are we should also mention a law professor. You disagree with Steve Mnuchin. You co-wrote a letter with Senator Kamala Harris demanding transparency and you also gave the treasury secretary's legal argument an "F."

So on the legal argument part of this, explain why you give it an "F."

PORTER: Well, because he doesn't have any legal argument. This isn't something where we can see some interpret this way or that. He's making an assertion that this information is somehow confidential or proprietary. And hasn't offered anything to back him up. In fact, every point of law we would look at points the other direction.

So, the Paycheck Protection Program is a $650 billion program. The applications that borrowers fill out implicitly tells them this information may be disclosed. So there's no argument that it's confidential.

In fact, to the contrary, he told borrowers they may have to give the information up. And regular ABA loans have to be disclosed.

So that argument that now that we an even larger program and a more powerful program, the Paycheck Protection Program, it's all the more important to have that transparency and that disclosure.

And the treasury secretary had been ignoring and refusing to respond to FOIA requests from those trying to understand were our taxpayer dollars have been used wisely.

KEILAR: Yes. And the application says the identity of the recipient and the loan amount are basically FOIA-able, subject to the Freedom of Information Act.

When you look at this, what is your fear about why the administration has broken its promise on transparency and is saying we're going to keep this secret?

PORTER: So, one possibility is there's a lot of abuse, a lot of things they don't want the American public to know. We saw some of the abuses of the Paycheck Protection Program, Steak Shack, Barratone (ph). But that's because they were public companies.

I would suspect if the secretary of treasury doesn't want this information public, it's because he thinks the public may be outraged with what they see. But this is our tax dollars being spent in this program. It's not

Secretary Mnuchin's personal war chest. It's our tax dollars. And we, in Congress, can't evaluate if the program is working or not without this data.

KEILAR: So, we've learned now that Secretary Mnuchin could be open to striking an agreement on greater transparency for the Small Business program. I wonder what kind of deal would you be open to, short of all these names and they got this amount each?

PORTER: I've written -- in that letter I wrote with Senator Harris, we called for getting this information out. But also I have a bill, the Paycheck Protection Program Transparency Act, that would require the disclosure. And it's clear what they have to provide and don't have to provide. And I think that bill lays out what we need to get Secretary Mnuchin to agree to in this negotiation.

Frankly, we have the upper hand here. The law is on our side. And the will of the American people, across the ideological spectrum, is on our side. They want oversight and they want transparency.

KEILAR: Congresswoman, thank you. Congresswoman Katie Porter, we appreciate you joining us.

PORTER: Thank you.

KEILAR: The man in this powerful image here, seen carrying an injured white protester to safety at a Black Lives Matter demonstration in London, will join me next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:55:45]

KEILAR: An image of incredible humanity from London protest has gone viral. A black man carrying an injured white man to safety after far- right demonstrators targeted a Black Lives Matters protest.

Let's take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(SHOUTING)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Now this injured white man had fallen to the ground in all of this chaos. And that's when Patrick Hutchinson and a group of his friends formed a protective ring around him, as you can see. Hutchinson scooped him up and carried him through the angry crowd to police.

And Patrick Hutchinson is being hailed as a hero. And he's joining us live with a group that attended the demonstration to protect Black Lives Matters protesters.

Patrick, thank you for being here to talk to us and kind of explain to us something behind this image.

Can you walk us through what happened on Saturday?

PATRICK HUTCHINSON, CARRIED INJURED WHITE MAN THROUGH ANGRY CROWD TO SAFETY: Yes, hi. So, we were down at the demonstrations looking to sort of protect and serve our community. And these gentleman behind me, that you can see, Chris Otoketo (ph), Pier Noah (ph), Germane Facey (ph), and Lee Russell (ph), these guys were here with me to do what we know best, and that's to serve and protect our community.

There was an altercation taking place. These guys in front of me ran in, dispersed the crowd, made a shield over the gentleman that had fallen on the ground, was being attacked. And I ducked under them, scooped him up and put them on my shoulder. And we carried them towards police with them shielding me and protecting me from the continued onslaught.

KEILAR: So, there's been a lot of questioning about who that man is that you carried. Do you know?

HUTCHINSON: I have no idea who this man was. All I know is that he was there up to no good, let's just say.

KEILAR: So, he was a counter-protester. He wasn't there in support of Black Lives Matter, to be clear?

HUTCHINSON: Yes. He wasn't here to support Black Lives Matter. He was here with football hooligans and thugs that were clashing with some of the Black Lives protesters. I think he was a fallen man. He got left behind.

KEILAR: So, people look at that photo and they say that's the image of humanity, right? You're picking up this guy, who, by your description, was up to no good, and carrying him to safety. I think there's a lot of people who look at that very positively. What do you say to that?

HUTCHINSON: Yes, I think it's something that your police officers over there could learn a lesson from. You know? Just because somebody's up to no good, doesn't mean you have to kill them.

KEILAR: Tell us what was going through your mind as you rushed in to scoop him up.

HUTCHINSON: To be honest, my mind was blank. In instances like this, we don't think. You just act. And so, it was an instinct. The guys had already done their part. And it was really left for me. I had no alternative really but to go under there and grab him and lift him up onto my shoulders and carry him out.

KEILAR: Patrick, we want to thank you for joining us and talking about this and just explaining a little more about that photo.

And thank you to your friends as well, the gentlemen behind you, for joining us as well.

HUTCHINSON: Thank you. It's OK. My friends also, they thank you as well for inviting us on.

KEILAR: Oh, thank you.

All right. Patrick Hutchinson, we appreciate it.

[14:00:04]

Top of the hour now. I'm Brianna Keilar.