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Inside the Middle East
January 22, 2009
Posted: 1455 GMT

mitchell

The Obama administration has named former American senator George Mitchell to be special envoy to the Middle East, sources told CNN.

Internationally, Mitchell is best known for his work as the man who helped broker an agreement between Protestants and Catholics in Northern Ireland, a dispute, at times,  just as bitter as the one between Israelis and Palestinians.

Mitchell served as a Mideast envoy for the Bush administration, authoring a 2001 report that called for a halt to Israeli settlements and greater Palestinian efforts to crack down on terror.

What do you think of the Mitchell nomination?

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Filed under: George Mitchell •Obama


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Fawad Ali   January 22nd, 2009 3:07 pm ET

Arabs want Obama administration to be fair, that's all

Fawad Ali   January 22nd, 2009 3:11 pm ET

Freedom for people across the Arab World

peace in Palestinian territories and in Israel

Stop Iran from acquiring Nukes

and SAVE IRAQ FROM IRANIANS

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 3:15 pm ET

Reading the news this morning blows my mind.
Radical elements are already busy rebuilding the destroyed tunnels in Gaza. Furthermore, Hamas wants all the money from donor nations to be given to Hamas and not to Abbas in the Westbank. It just proves that peace will never be achieved with these terrorist. They do not even care about there own people. Another war seems to be unavoidable. What a shame. How many innocent people have to die before this madness will stop.

Fawad Ali   January 22nd, 2009 3:18 pm ET

Peter

I don't know which news channel you are talking about

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 3:27 pm ET

Fawad Ali,
I am reading the world news from different sites.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 3:32 pm ET

Here's Obama on the third day, already getting things moving. Yesterday he calls arab nation leaders. Today, he goes to work on closing Guantanamo, and appoints a man who has done some good in Ireland. Although I don't claim to know the details of the peace agreement between the two Irish factions, there seems to have been relative peace in the region. Hopefully Obama and his team can help do the same in this part of the world.
As for the tunnels. What Hamas does on its own soil is it's own business. This is the problem with some people. Even after a cease fire, or peace agreement, they still need to have their nose in the buisiness of others. Nobody is reporting on how many jets, bombs or bullets Israel is stockpiling, or if they intend to rely on other allies for more artillary.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 3:35 pm ET

Yeah. PLEASE stay away from FOX. This morning, H. Clinton was being sworn in on CNN, and fox was doing some story on the rap star Jay-Z, trying to smear his name because they hate brown people. Couple of days ago, they were smearing rap star DMXs' name as well. I gues they will continue to portray all brown people as bad.

Saudi   January 22nd, 2009 3:36 pm ET

THE MATTER IS SIMPLE; IT IS JUST A MATTER OF ATTITUDE!

THE ISRAELIS ARE FRIENDS TO THE USA.

USA IS SYMPATHETIC AND SUPPORTIVE AND UNDERSTANDING TO THE ISRAELITE FRIENDS.

PALESTINIANS ARE NOT FRIENDS TO THE USA, NEITHER ARE ENEMIES.

USA DOES NOT CARE ABOUT THE PALESTINIANS, ARAB MUSLIMS AND WORTHLESS CREATURES AND NEVER HUMAN BEINGS.

The Mideast Envoy and President Obama must first work on changing the American attitude.

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 3:37 pm ET

Is peace only achievable when total destruction occurs. Surly there must be other way's. Why is it that Jorden, Lebanon and other surrounding Arab countries don't want Palestinians. Please don't tell me it is the Palestinians as a majority, it is the radical elements nobody wants. Why is it so impossible to find a solution amongst rational people.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 3:42 pm ET

This is not adoption. Why should other countries agree to take in a whole nation and it's problems, just because they're arabs. Then Jordan, Lebanon, etc will be doing just what you and zionists want...leaving The entire land of Palestine to the Jews.
Saudi. I guess when we went to Iraq the first time on behalf of muslims, that does'nt count. I guess President Jimmy Carters hard work for equality in the region goes unnoticed with you too.
Dealing with some is dealing only in absolution. No compromise, just what they want.

Hunk   January 22nd, 2009 3:42 pm ET

Dear Fawad,

The US and Israel are trying to substitute Israel with Iran as the enemy in the middle east which is utterly unacceptable and should never be endorsed by the people of the Arab world. Israel is our eternal enemy.

Israel will stop to be our eternal enemy when the conflict is about borders and not about existence as it now!!, as long as there is any mentioning of greater Israel, Israel will remain as the eternal enemies.

Do you have a concrete evidence that Iran is building a nuclear bomb? or we will be bitten once again from the same place with the history biggest lie of Iraq WMD .... do you realize this .... Israel is fueling the middle east with all reasons of instability from occupation to nuclear .....

CS   January 22nd, 2009 3:43 pm ET

Peter. Look at Palestine. Who destroyed the buildings in Palestine? Who destroyed the universities, the hospitals, and the media centers, and the mosques? I can bet it was'nt Palestinians.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 3:46 pm ET

Fawad. You sound very level headed. Do not be persuaded to accept Israel, and all Israelis, as your eternal enemy. This is a very absolute way of thinking.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 3:49 pm ET

Israel has done many bad things, no doubt. But this relentless hatred for them will not get things done either. It will only lead to more killing of innocents, which will breed more hatred. But maybe that's what some want. If Israel were to appologize, and offer cash, and retribution for it's behavior, some would STILL hate them always.
Not that I believe Israel ever would do a noble thing like admitt wrongdoing, but still.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 3:50 pm ET

Peter,

Its not that Syria, Jordan, Lebanon doest not the Palestinians.... You have to look at the big pictures.... Don't be so narrow minded.

Syria, Lebanon and Jordan all have already a lot of Palestinians refugees in them.... Its not a matter of radical or not.... But, Its a mutual understanding if you want to call it that way between Palestinians and their brothers in those countries. Palestinians right now have a right to return to their country. If they were given the Syrian, Lebanese, and Jordanian citizenships then that means Palestine is eliminated from the face of earth.

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 3:51 pm ET

CS
War is never a good outcome for anyone. Unfortuently as history has shown us so many times it is alway's the innocent who suffer. There is no right or wrong, the Palestinian leadership want's war ( whatever you call it ) and the Palestinian People want peace. Make a survey of all Palestinians everywhere and you might be surprised of the answer. Then again, maybe not. Palestinians want peace, just like the rest of us.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 3:53 pm ET

Professor is right about this. If Palestinians give up their citizenship, and relocate to another country, than There would be only Israel, and no Palestine. This is what some wish for, but not justice.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 3:57 pm ET

Peter. I agree that the majority of Palestinians want peace. But you are being unfair. You don't question what Israel wants. Not only must Hamas stop it's agression...Israel must be made to stop it's opression. To argue boarders anymore is futile. But to demand fair treatment from Israel is very reasonable, and very doable. Clinton, and Carter were very close. Hopefully Obama can take pages from their book, abdd some of his own swagger, and finally get it into writing. The Mecca accord almost worked.

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 3:59 pm ET

Good morning Professor,
Assuming that everything remains the same in the middle east and that Israel is not going anywhere and that Palestinians live where they are now. The question i have, how can we help the Palestinian people. How can we get peace under the PRESENT circumstances without going into history. WHAT CAN WE DO NOW to stop and prevent further bloodshed.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 4:02 pm ET

Peter,

Palestinians wants Peace believe it or not as much as Hamas wants Peace... Hamas after all are Palestinians not Marcians.

They want peace but with Justice... you cannot expect them to continue living as refugees and call that peace. Loosing their land and homes and not fight for it back.

How can you ask any human being to do such a thing?... forget Palestinians.... would you ask Canadians to vacate their land to the russians.... and go live in refugee camps in the US or South America and give up their citizenship?

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 4:03 pm ET

CS
I fully agree with you on your last point. There has to be a hand reaching out to Palestinians from Israel. But not all blame can be laid on the feet of Israel for whatever is wrong in the middle east.

Beny   January 22nd, 2009 4:04 pm ET

I believe he will be as toothless and useless as those before him, especially Carter. With everything Europeans have done not even so long ago (carpet-bombing Kosovo in 1999), I hardly trust them help anything here. Little can be done until the Palestinians elect and support a government that actually cares about them, and not just terrorists fighting on Iran's money and orders.

CS,

"look at Palestine, who destroyed...."

If by Palestine you mean the bit of land I'm sitting on right now...
You really think there was anything here worth something before we came?

Name me ONE university, ONE Palestinian hospital that was here before we came and we supposedly destroyed.

Example.
Hirbat Duran was a wasteland. A useless piece of desert controlled by some rich Arab noble. Yeoshua Henkin (Jewish Russian intellectual) came and BOUGHT the land from that Arab. Now it's called Rehovot and houses the Weizmann Institute of Science, with top-class research and innovations that help everyone on earth.

Who built it? I don't think the Palestinians did. On the other hand, who blew up in Rehovot's mall, killing dozens of innocents?

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 4:06 pm ET

Peter,

Are you asking me personally? Because I am not a Palestinians nor do I live in the region.

My answer would be forget about two states.... one state call it Lans of Canan or Israltein or Palrael if you want (I do not care what name it has) allow all the Palestinians to return to their homes and treat Jews, Christians and Muslims equally.

But, I do not think Israelis will agree with that... I don't think Palestinians would agree with it either.... But force it on both of them deplomatically.

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 4:09 pm ET

Professor
Good point. Let's get something together of what Palestinians want under the present circumstances.
Let's start out with peace.
Citizenship,
There own land, as it stands right now. Hopefully this can someday be resolved.
What else ?
Open borders.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 4:12 pm ET

ignorant Nazi Beny,

We are not talking about a specific piece of land that someone sold to someone. We are talking about the land which was stolen.... Homes were stolen.... There are Palestinians here living in the US with key and title to their homes and lands that are being occupied right now by Israeli who migrated from East Europe and living in their homes for free without paying any rent.... How is that fair and just?

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 4:15 pm ET

Peter,

I think you solved the problem that has been going around for over 60 years... hurray.

Do you think Palestinians want anything more than that? Thats all what they have been asking for.... to live like other human being on this earth.... they do not want to destroy the US. :)

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 4:16 pm ET

Professor,
I would like to think that there are a lot of rational people out there who would agree with your last point of view. It has to be forced diplomatically on both Israel and the Palestinians. In some small step's does it seem to work in the westbank. There is no quick solution to this intricate problem.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 4:18 pm ET

Beny. I think you misunderstood me, or I did not say it clearly. Either way. what I meant was that ISRAEL was responsible for targeting, and destroying Palestines infrastructure.
Peter had previously said something about , is peace achievable with total destruction? I was simply reminding him that Israel has been responsible for most of the destruction.
As far as what you think of Obama. I don't care what you or any other radicals think of the president. You will judge him according to the previous presidents errors. You have already condemned him and he obviously differs greatly to them on many issues...so it's obvious to me that you think all Americans are the same. Which it's not hard for me to see why you hate all Israelis. I can understand anger towards the leadership who caused this, but not at Peacefull people. It is so lame to just blanket entire races, countries, and religions with hatred, just because of the actions of a few.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 4:22 pm ET

Peter,

What is working in the West Bank?

Palestinians in the West Bank are not in any better situation from Gazans. Its still occupied. Prsident Abbas is a fake President.... he does not have a country to be a President on....

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 4:28 pm ET

CS,

Beny would like you to believe that when Israelis came there was nothing to destroy.... so what destruction are you blaming Israel for?

Palestine was a garbage dump place... thats why the British occupied it before.... The British did not have a trash dump places in England so they came and occupy and empty piece of land.... What an stupid idiot Nazi Beny.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 4:30 pm ET

Professor. In all the back and forth discussions I've had in here with reasonable, and unreasonable people...What you said was beautiful.
Very realistic. Not talking about exterminating Israel, or kicking out Palestine, but a real solution to this thing. This part of the world is sacred to many people. I pray one day I can visit, and worship in peace. So why not allow Muslims, Jews, and Christians to live there?
Why not keep the citizens there, and bring back those who were lost, and restore order? This land is God's land, and I'm sure He does'nt want us destroying it, or eachother. Excellent point Prof. Very nice! :)

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 4:30 pm ET

Professor,
Please,
We all have been hurling insults at each other and achieved nothing. Please stop calling people Nazis because they have another point of view. Some people speak from their heart, others use the past, others use logic as they see it. As for the westbank, granted it is not ideal but a lot better than in Gaza.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 4:33 pm ET

Beny. If Palestine was so worthless before Israel got there, than why did they stay? Why do they cling to it now?

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 4:35 pm ET

CS,

This has been my point of few for years... but when you get someone here who wants to kill or transfer any single Palestinian out of their homeland.... then that would tick me off and I would call for an end to Israel to show them that it does hurt..... that is exactly how they are hurting the Palestinians here... I am not Palestinian so they insults will enter from one ear and go out from the other in my case.

But, I would like to give a taste of their medicine.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 4:38 pm ET

Peter,

Anyone who is going to come here to deny the Palestinians their right to live in peace in their homeland.... is a Nazi.... it makes it worst that he is speaking it from his heart.

When people want peace for themselves then need to love it for the others too.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 4:39 pm ET

As far as geography, why If Palestine is such poor land, did Israel take claim to most of the coastline?
I think people know this place is abundant, as any, but want to make people think that Israel did Palestine a favor by.........
Woosaahh. Sorry folks. Were supposed to be being constructive right. Got side tracked, but I'm back.
If Israel and Palestine were made into one nation, and jew lived side by side with Muslim, than there could be no excuse for destroying the land, as it is inhabited evenly by both sides. Government should be made of both sides equally, everything equal right down the line.

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 4:40 pm ET

Mistakes have been made, big mistakes on all sides. But i applaud every Politician, may they be Palestinians or otherwise to try and find a solution. Will it be easy. No. But credit where credit is due, even if it is only baby steps. One tiny step forward is a lot better than a giant step back.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 4:43 pm ET

I cannot stand people who are filled with hate towards the Palestinians. Because after they are done with Palestinians then they are coming for me.... it will be my turn to be hated. People how have hate for someone.... can hate someone else just as easy.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 4:43 pm ET

Professor. You don't mean that about hurting others. You're better. I know you're angry, but focus, and continue with the positive message. It's uplifting, and possible. Don't worry. There will be nay sayers, and haters always. The way to teach them is to lead by example. If they don't follow than so be it.
And I can admit that I need to take heed to my own advise as well. Sometimes it's hard, but we must repent.

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 4:46 pm ET

Professor,
An eye for eye is not the solution nor does it help the Palestinian cause.The reality is (right or wrong) that Palestinians don't have the fire power to stand up to Israel. And war has to stop, period.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 4:46 pm ET

Peter,

There is one big mistake.... There are no mistakes made by both sides.

That mistake need to be resolved.... and only the stronger can make it happen and if he is not willing to make it happen then it needs to be forced on him.

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 4:50 pm ET

Professor,
OK, but does that not lead down the pad of another war with more suffering. It does not make sense to me.

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 4:50 pm ET

CS

YOU ARE AN ANGEL NOW BECAUSE YOU ARE AMERICAN, AMERICA IS EVEN WORSE THAN THE ZIONISTS.

1- WHO NUKED HORISHIMA AND NAGAZAKI – CIVILIANS AND CHILDREN – THEY SUFFER UNTIL TOMMOROW. AND FOR WHAT?
(NOTE: YOU MENTIONED THAT THEY ATTACKED ONLY MILITARY BASES) WHAT A NON SHAMEFUL PERSON YOU ARE.

2- WHO KILLED ALL THOSE VIETNAMESE – CIVILIANS AND CHILDREN AND FOR WHAT?

3- WHO KILLED ALL OF THOSE AFGHANISTANIS CIVILIANS AND CHILDREN – AND FOR WHAT?
(DON’T TELL ME ALGAEDA WHICH WAS DEFENDING ITS PEOPLE FROM YOUR ATTROCITIES IN THE BELLOW MENTIONED AREAS)

4- WHO TAUGHT AND FINANCED ALGAEDA – USA & SAUDI ARABIA AND FOR WHAT?

5- WHO BOMBED LIBYA CIVILIANS AND CHILDREN – AND FOR WHAT?

6- WHO BOMBED SOMALIA CIVILIANS AND CHILDREN – AND FOR WHAT?

7- WHO IS BOMBING AND OCCUPING PALESTINIANS CIVILIANS AND CHILDREN SINCE 1948 AND SUPPORTED BY WHOM -AND FOR WHAT?

8- WHO BOMBED AND OCCUPIED IRAQ CIVILIANS AND CHILDREN AND FOR WHAT?

9- WHO BOMBED LEBANON CIVILIANS AND CHILDREN AND FOR WHAT?

10- WHO BOMBED SYRIA CIVILIANS AND CHILDREN AND FOR WHAT?

WHO IS THE SATAN HERE ITS AMERICA AND WHAT YOU CALL ISRAEL!!!!!!!! WAKE UP AND OPEN YOUR EYES PEOPLE!!!!!!!!!

AND WHO CAME TO OUR HELP WHEN OUR CHILDREN ABOVE WERE SHELLED……………….NO ONE……..SO ITS TIME TO DEFEND OURSELVES BY ANYMEANS GIVEN AND BY ANY WEAPON WE CAN PUT OUR HANDS ON, HOPEFULLY MORE POWERFUL THAN THE WAIST STRAPS ……..DON’T TELL ME WHAT WEAPON OR WHICH PERSON TO FIGHT YOU …….YOU ALREADY BRANDED US TERRORISTS (HATRED) SO THEREFORE SEE THE TERRORISTS WHAT THEY CAN DO. WHO ARE THE HYPOCRITES HERE??

OUR PROPHET ASKED US TO LOOK AFTER OUR NEIGHBOURS TILL WE THOUGHT HE WOULD INCLUDE HIM IN THE INHERITANCE WILL.

DONT TELL ME ABOUT YOUR BOOK, WE HAVE OURS. AND BY THE WAY THE MOST EXTREMEST RELIGION IN THE WORLD TODAY IS CHRISTIANITY WHICH CHASTITIED THE PROPHET JESUS CHRIST TO BE A SON OF GOD OR GOD HIMSELF………………..WHAT IS MORE EXTREME MORE THAN THAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I WILL LEAVE HOLYWOOD MOVIES FOR YOU “TRAITOR” I AM WATCHING REAL HORROR MOVIES BY AMERICA AND BY WHAT YOU CALL ISRAEL.

OBAMA OR ANYONE WHO PRESIDES OVER USA IS AN ENEMY OF ISLAM (OTHERWISE HE WILL NOT SIT HIS ASS IN THE OVAL OFFICE) SO HE IS THE OTHER FACE OF THE SAME COIN “DUBYA”.

MANIPULATIVE IS WHAT YOU ARE YOU HAVE POSTED THE COMMENT AND WAS BOASTING ABOUT IT. (SEE BELOW)

January 22nd, 2009 204 GMT

Solomon. I was told how to deal with adversaries from a young age. What I do know, is that I cannot MAKE another person do anything. I can only manipulate myself, and my adversary will then change their approach. To wich my reaction will be benificial to me.

NOW YOU ARE EVEN A LIAR.

MAN UP YOU SAY: TO ADMIT THE WRONG PART ——ARE YOU BLIND TO SEE, DEAF TO HEAR…..WHAT THE WEST AND WHAT YOU CALL ISRAEL WANT……….MAN UP AND SAY IT IF YOU CAN DARE???

I WILL TELL YOU WHAT THE CHRISTIANS AND JEWS WANT: AS SAID BY OUR PROPHET: “ALMOST TRANSLATION”……

“NOT THE JEWS NOR THE CHRISTIANS WILL BE HAPPY WITH YOU UNTILL YOU FOLLOW THEIR STEPS”

AND YOU ARE NOT MY BROTHER AND NEVER YOU WILL BE, SO USE THOSE MANIPULATIVE WAYS OF YOURS TO SOMEONE ELSE UNTILL HE FIGURES YOU OUT.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 4:50 pm ET

Peter,

There was not an eye for an eye here..... That was a whole country full of eyes for an eye.... And that is going to make the whole world blind.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 4:51 pm ET

Peter,

What does not make sense?

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 4:52 pm ET

“We consider ourselves to be comrades in arms to the Palestinian Arabs in their struggle for the liberation of Palestine. There is not a single citizen in South Africa who is not ready to stand by his Palestinian brothers in their legitimate fight against the Zionist racists.” — Nelson Mandela

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 4:53 pm ET

Professor
I need to run also.
This was a good discussion, constructive with some good and not so good point of views. Hope to see you later.

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 4:54 pm ET

“I should much rather see reasonable agreement with the Arabs on the basis of living together in peace than the creation of a Jewish state. Apart from practical consideration, my awareness of the essential nature of Judaism resists the idea of a Jewish state with borders, an army, and a measure of temporal power no matter how modest. I am afraid of the inner damage Judaism will sustain — especially from the development of a narrow nationalism within our own ranks, against which we have already had to fight strongly, even without a Jewish state.” — Albert Einstein, 1932.

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 4:56 pm ET

“My sympathies are all with the Jews…But my sympathy does not blind me to the requirements of justice. The cry for the national home for the Jews does not make much appeal to me…Palestine belongs to the Arabs in the same sense that England belongs to the English or France to the French. It is wrong and inhuman to impose the Jews on the Arabs. What is going on in Palestine today cannot be justified by any moral code of conduct. The mandates have no sanction but that of the last war. Surely it would be a crime against humanity to reduce the proud Arabs so that Palestine can be restored to the Jews partly or wholly as their national home.” — Gandhi, 1938

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 4:59 pm ET

A sample of UN Resolutions violated by israel:
1955-1992:
* Resolution 106: “. . . ‘condemns’ Israel for Gaza raid”
* Resolution 111: “. . . ‘condemns’ Israel for raid on Syria that killed fifty-six people”
* Resolution 127: “. . . ‘recommends’ Israel suspend its ‘no-man’s zone’ in Jerusalem”
* Resolution 162: “. . . ‘urges’ Israel to comply with UN decisions”
* Resolution 171: “. . . determines flagrant violations’ by Israel in its attack on Syria”
* Resolution 228: “. . . ‘censures’ Israel for its attack on Samu in the West Bank, then under Jordanian control”
* Resolution 237: “. . . ‘urges’ Israel to allow return of new 1967 Palestinian refugees”
* Resolution 248: “. . . ‘condemns’ Israel for its massive attack on Karameh in Jordan”
* Resolution 250: “. . . ‘calls’ on Israel to refrain from holding military parade in Jerusalem”
* Resolution 251: “. . . ‘deeply deplores’ Israeli military parade in Jerusalem in defiance of Resolution 250″
* Resolution 252: “. . . ‘declares invalid’ Israel’s acts to unify Jerusalem as Jewish capital”
* Resolution 256: “. . . ‘condemns’ Israeli raids on Jordan as ‘flagrant violation”"
* Resolution 259: “. . . ‘deplores’ Israel’s refusal to accept UN mission to probe occupation”
* Resolution 262: “. . . ‘condemns’ Israel for attack on Beirut airport”
* Resolution 265: “. . . ‘condemns’ Israel for air attacks for Salt in Jordan”
* Resolution 267: “. . . ‘censures’ Israel for administrative acts to change the status of Jerusalem”
* Resolution 270: “. . . ‘condemns’ Israel for air attacks on villages in southern Lebanon” * Resolution 271: “. . . ‘condemns’ Israel’s failure to obey UN resolutions on Jerusalem”
* Resolution 279: “. . . ‘demands’ withdrawal of Israeli forces from Lebanon”
* Resolution 280: “. . . ‘condemns’ Israeli’s attacks against Lebanon”
* Resolution 285: “. . . ‘demands’ immediate Israeli withdrawal form Lebanon”
* Resolution 298: “. . . ‘deplores’ Israel’s changing of the status of Jerusalem”
* Resolution 313: “. . . ‘demands’ that Israel stop attacks against Lebanon”
* Resolution 316: “. . . ‘condemns’ Israel for repeated attacks on Lebanon”
* Resolution 317: “. . . ‘deplores’ Israel’s refusal to release Arabs abducted in Lebanon”
* Resolution 332: “. . . ‘condemns’ Israel’s repeated attacks against Lebanon”
* Resolution 337: “. . . ‘condemns’ Israel for violating Lebanon’s sovereignty”
* Resolution 347: “. . . ‘condemns’ Israeli attacks on Lebanon”
* Resolution 425: “. . . ‘calls’ on Israel to withdraw its forces from Lebanon”
* Resolution 427: “. . . ‘calls’ on Israel to complete its withdrawal from Lebanon’
* Resolution 444: “. . . ‘deplores’ Israel’s lack of cooperation with UN peacekeeping forces”
* Resolution 446: “. . . ‘determines’ that Israeli settlements are a ’serious obstruction’ to peace and calls on Israel to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention”
* Resolution 450: “. . . ‘calls’ on Israel to stop attacking Lebanon”
* Resolution 452: “. . . ‘calls’ on Israel to cease building settlements in occupied territories”
* Resolution 465: “. . . ‘deplores’ Israel’s settlements and asks all member states not to assist Israel’s settlements program”
* Resolution 467: “. . . ’strongly deplores’ Israel’s military intervention in Lebanon”
* Resolution 468: “. . . ‘calls’ on Israel to rescind illegal expulsions of two Palestinian mayors and a judge and to facilitate their return”
* Resolution 469: “. . . ’strongly deplores’ Israel’s failure to observe the council’s order not to deport Palestinians”
* Resolution 471: “. . . ‘expresses deep concern’ at Israel’s failure to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention”
* Resolution 476: “. . . ‘reiterates’ that Israel’s claim to Jerusalem are ‘null and void’”
* Resolution 478: “. . . ‘censures (Israel) in the strongest terms’ for its claim to Jerusalem in its ‘Basic Law’”
* Resolution 484: “. . . ‘declares it imperative’ that Israel re-admit two deported Palestinian mayors”
* Resolution 487: “. . . ’strongly condemns’ Israel for its attack on Iraq’s nuclear facility”
* Resolution 497: “. . . ‘decides’ that Israel’s annexation of Syria’s Golan Heights is ‘null and void’ and demands that Israel rescinds its decision forthwith”
* Resolution 498: “. . . ‘calls’ on Israel to withdraw from Lebanon”
* Resolution 501: “. . . ‘calls’ on Israel to stop attacks against Lebanon and withdraw its troops”
* Resolution 509: “. . . ‘demands’ that Israel withdraw its forces forthwith and unconditionally from Lebanon”
* Resolution 515: “. . . ‘demands’ that Israel lift its siege of Beirut and allow food supplies to be brought in”
* Resolution 517: “. . . ‘censures’ Israel for failing to obey UN resolutions and demands that Israel withdraw its forces from Lebanon”
* Resolution 518: “. . . ‘demands’ that Israel cooperate fully with UN forces in Lebanon”
* Resolution 520: “. . . ‘condemns’ Israel’s attack into West Beirut”
* Resolution 573: “. . . ‘condemns’ Israel ‘vigorously’ for bombing Tunisia in attack on PLO headquarters
* Resolution 587: “. . . ‘takes note’ of previous calls on Israel to withdraw its forces from Lebanon and urges all parties to withdraw”
* Resolution 592: “. . . ’strongly deplores’ the killing of Palestinian students at Bir Zeit University by Israeli troops”
* Resolution 605: “. . . ’strongly deplores’ Israel’s policies and practices denying the human rights of Palestinians
* Resolution 607: “. . . ‘calls’ on Israel not to deport Palestinians and strongly requests it to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention
* Resolution 608: “. . . ‘deeply regrets’ that Israel has defied the United Nations and deported Palestinian civilians”
* Resolution 636: “. . . ‘deeply regrets’ Israeli deportation of Palestinian civilians
* Resolution 641: “. . . ‘deplores’ Israel’s continuing deportation of Palestinians
* Resolution 672: “. . . ‘condemns’ Israel for violence against Palestinians at the Haram al-Sharif/Temple Mount
* Resolution 673: “. . . ‘deplores’ Israel’s refusal to cooperate with the United Nations
* Resolution 681: “. . . ‘deplores’ Israel’s resumption of the deportation of Palestinians
* Resolution 694: “. . . ‘deplores’ Israel’s deportation of Palestinians and calls on it to ensure their safe and immediate return
* Resolution 726: “. . . ’strongly condemns’ Israel’s deportation of Palestinians
* Resolution 799: “. . . ’strongly condemns’ Israel’s deportation of 413 Palestinians and calls for their immediate return

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 4:59 pm ET

Benyemen,

Einstein must've been a self hating jew... :)

He sure had a good foresight. Look at the Israeli Zionist Jews... they are pathrtics.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 5:09 pm ET

Is there any of the Zionist supporters on here? Have you read Ghandi's quote? Benyemen just posted it....

What do you think of it?

This is from 1938... way before the creation of the State of Israel....

Does that give you an idea about the history of the immigrant jews to the region?

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 5:10 pm ET

THE FOLLOWING ARE THE RESOLUTIONS VETOED BY THE UNITED STATES DURING THE PERIOD OF SEPTEMBER, 1972, TO MAY, 1990 TO PROTECT ISRAEL FROM COUNCIL CRITICISM:
* . . . condemned Israel’s attack against Southern Lebanon and Syria…”
* . . . affirmed the rights of the Palestinian people to self-determination, statehood and equal protections. . . ”
* . . . condemned Israel’s air strikes and attacks in southern Lebanon and its murder of innocent civilians. . . ”
* . . . called for self-determination of Palestinian people. . . ”
* . . deplored Israel’s altering of the status of Jerusalem, which is recognized as an international city by most world nations and the United Nations . . . ”
* . . . affirmed the inalienable rights of the Palestinian people . . . ”
* . . . endorsed self-determination for the Palestinian people . . . ”
* . . . demanded Israel’s withdrawal from the Golan Heights . . . ”
* . . . condemned Israel’s mistreatment of Palestinians in the occupied West Bank and Gaza Strip and its refusal to abide by the Geneva convention protocols of civilized nations.
* . . . condemned an Israeli soldier who shot eleven Moslem worshippers at the Haram al-Sharif/Temple Mount near Al-Aqsa Mosque in the Old City of Jerusalem. . . ”
* . . . urged sanctions against Israel if it did not withdraw from its invasion of Lebanon … ”
* . . . urged sanctions against Israel if it did not withdraw from its invasion of Beirut. . . ”
* . . . urged cutoff of economic aid to Israel if it refused to withdraw from its occupation of Lebanon. . . ”
* . . . condemned continued Israeli settlements in occupied territories in the West Bank and Gaza Strip, denouncing them as an obstacle to peace. . . ”
* . . . deplores Israel’s brutal massacre of Arabs in Lebanon and urges its withdrawal. . . ”
* . . . condemned Israeli brutality in southern Lebanon and denounced the Israeli ‘Iron Fist’ policy of repression. . . ”
* . . . denounced Israel’s violation of human rights in the occupied territories. . . ”
* . . . deplored Israel’s violence in southern Lebanon. . . ”
* . . . deplored Israel’s activities in occupied Arab East Jerusalem that threatened the sanctity of Muslim holy sites. . . ”
* . . . condemned Israel’s hijacking of a Libyan passenger airplane. . . ”
* . . . deplored Israel’s attacks against Lebanon and its measures and practices against the civilian population of Lebanon. . . ”
* . . . called on Israel to abandon its policies against the Palestinian intifada that violated the rights of occupied Palestinians, to abide by the Fourth Geneva Conventions, and to formalize a leading role for the United Nations in future peace negotiations. . . ”
* . . . urged Israel to accept back deported Palestinians, condemned Israel’s shooting of civilians, called on Israel to uphold the Fourth Geneva Convention, and called for a peace settlement under UN auspices. . . ”
* . . . condemned Israel’s . . incursion into Lebanon. . . ”
* . . . deplored Israel’s . . . commando raids on Lebanon. . . ”
* . . . deplored Israel’s repression of the Palestinian intifada and called on Israel to respect the human rights of the Palestinians. . . ”
* . . . deplored Israel’s violation of the human rights of the Palestinians. . . ”
* . . . demanded that Israel return property confiscated from Palestinians during a tax protest and allow a fact-finding mission to observe Israel’s crackdown on the Palestinian intifada . . . ”
* . . . called for a fact-finding mission on abuses against Palestinians in Israeli-occupied lands. . . “

Beny   January 22nd, 2009 5:15 pm ET

CS,

a) I'm still waiting for someone to name me one university or hospital or anything worthwhile that the Palestinians built here.

"Why do they cling to it now?"

Because no other country would accept them. Because Jordan and Syria already massacred them in tens of thousands. Because Egypt hates them and the trouble they're causing back home, even more than Egypt hates us.

Ironically, Israel, among all the Arab countries around us, is the only one that can help them settle somewhere, and we are the ones they're attacking. Between brainwashed and stupid, I'll give them the benefit of doubt and call them brainwashed (by groups like Hamas). But only until their next election. If they continue supporting Hamas, I'm going for stupid. With all the suffering they went through, you don't reelect the government that brought all this suffering on you.

Besides, I said nothing bad about Obama. Skeptic about his ability to change much, sure, but I have nothing against him. Good luck to the guy and who knows? Maybe he will achieve something.

As for what we destroyed in Gaza. Sure, you can be righteous and cry out "outrageous!" at every little kid Hamas shows you.

Or you can look at Hamas. Hamas, who are dragging little kids around to use as human shields (and I gave proof of that). Hamas, who shoot from schools and stack weapons in mosques (and I gave proof of that). Hamas, who STEAL intl. aid. Hamas, who killed hundreds of civilians in Hamas-Fatah clashes. Hamas who, even during this attack, conducted 34 public executions of people charged with supporting Fatah. Hamas who booby trap houses to explode on all their residents, just to kill the Givati platoon below.

Hamas who are, essentially, oppressing and torturing the very same people who elected them.

Hamas, who signed a cease-fire, only to violate it two days after. Who disregard the fact that every rocket closes down the border for a few hours, and keep shooting. Hamas, who disregarded countless threats that if they keep rocketing, we will respond. Hamas who, seeing Gaza in ruin, cried on to "continue the resistance" and retreated to their comfy bunkers, leaving the poor Palestinians to pay for their crimes.

Hamas who, essentially, brought this war on Gaza.

It's very easy to hate Israel from your safe, comfy home. Imagine someone, during a shootout, drags YOUR kid to defend himself while killing MY kid (so that both innocent kids die).

You can be righteous, going with the fashionable trend of blaming Israel for everything. Or you can be smart and look at the facts.

Tell me, CS, where are you from? Did your country ever have to deal with terrorism? If it did, you can be sure they did it much more brutally than us. And if you didn't, you have absolutely no right to pass judgement on us.

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 5:20 pm ET

U.S. taxpayer $$$$=Israeli bombs!!!!
Call the U.S. Congress to have them rescind
loan guarantees to Israel.
Benefits to Israel of U.S. Aid
Since 1949 (As of November 1, 1997)
Foreign Aid Grants and Loans
$74,157,600,000
Other U.S. Aid (12.2% of Foreign Aid)
$9,047,227,200
Interest to Israel from Advanced Payments
$1,650,000,000
Grand Total
$84,854,827,200
Total Benefits per Israeli
$14,630
Cost to U.S. Taxpayers of U.S.
Aid to Israel
Grand Total
$84,854,827,200
Interest Costs Borne by U.S.
$49,936,680,000
Total Cost to U.S. Taxpayers
$134,791,507,200
Total Taxpayer Cost per Israeli
$23,240

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 5:24 pm ET

Nazi Beny,

they were countless of colleges and hospitals in Palestine.... What an idiot.... I am not going to waste a second looking one name up for you.... first of all.... you are no body.... second where do you think Palestinians who got sick before 1947 were treated? in Night clubs?

What a moron... and he thinks that anyone would value him by giving him one answer to any of his question....

Its the occupation stupid.

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 5:25 pm ET

Israel did not condemn terrorism but rather awarded it.
Israel not only has been using terrorizism itself it has rewarded
the terrorizers
Menachem Begin headed Urgun and was awarded for his acts-
He was the Prime Minister of Israel from
June 21 1977 -October 10 1983
His successor was Izhak Shamir
elected Prime Minister of Israel after Begin
Headed Stern Gang-a terrorist organization
Eshkol
Prime Minister of Israel
1963-69
Haganah-a terrorist organization
Yitzhak Rabin
Prime Minister of Israel
1974-77 and 1992-95
Palmah-a terrorist organization
Moshe Dayan
Foreign Minister of Israel
1977-79
Haganah-a terrorist organization
Ariel Sharon
Foreign Minister of Israel
1998
Haganah-a terrorist organization
Just the Facts

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 5:27 pm ET

Political Correctness in the western Media
Rule #1: In the Middle East, it is always the Palestinians that attack first, and it’s always Israel who defends itself. This is called “retaliation”.
Rule #2: The Palestinians are not allowed to kill Israelis. This is called “terrorism”.
Rule #3: Israel has the right to kill Palestinian civilians; this is called “self-defense”, or “collateral damage”.
Rule #4: When Israel kills too many Palestinian civilians, the Western world calls for restraint. This is called the “reaction of the international community”.
Rule #5: Palestinians do not have the right to capture Israeli military, not even 1 or 2.
Rule #6: Israel has the right to capture as many Palestinians as they want (around 10,000 to date being held without trial). There is no limit; there is no need for proof of guilt or trial. All that is needed is the magic word: “terrorism”.
Rule #7: When you say “Hamas”, always be sure to add “supported by Hezbo-Allah, Syria and Iran”.
Rule #8: When you say “Israel”, never say “supported by the USA, the UK, European countries and even some Arab regimes”, for people (God forbid) might believe this is not an equal conflict.
Rule #9: When it comes to Israel, don’t mention the words “occupied territories”, “UN resolutions”, “Geneva conventions”. This could distress the audience of Fox, CNN, etc.
Rule #10: Israelis speak better English than Arabs. This is why we let them speak out as much as possible, so that they can explain rules 1 through 9. This is called “neutral journalism”.
Rule #11: If you don’t agree with these rules or if you favor the Palestinian side over the Israeli side, you must be a very dangerous anti-Semite. You may even have to make a public apology if you express your honest opinion
(Isn’t democracy wonderful?)

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 5:30 pm ET

There is a scriptural basis for the "Jews killed Jesus" claim:
"Now it was the governor's custom at the Feast to release a prisoner chosen by the crowd. At that time they had a notorious prisoner, called Barabbas. So when the crowd had gathered, Pilate asked them, "Which one do you want me to release to you: Barabbas, or Jesus who is called Christ?" For he knew it was out of envy that they had handed Jesus over to him.
While Pilate was sitting on the judge's seat, his wife sent him this message: "Don't have anything to do with that innocent man, for I have suffered a great deal today in a dream because of him."
But the chief priests and the elders persuaded the crowd to ask for Barabbas and to have Jesus executed.
"Which of the two do you want me to release to you?" asked the governor. "Barabbas," they answered.
"What shall I do, then, with Jesus who is called Christ?" Pilate asked. They all answered, "Crucify him!"
"Why? What crime has he committed?" asked Pilate. But they shouted all the louder, "Crucify him!"
When Pilate saw that he was getting nowhere, but that instead an uproar was starting, he took water and washed his hands in front of the crowd. "I am innocent of this man's blood," he said. "It is your responsibility!"
All the people answered, "Let his blood be on us and on our children".

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 5:31 pm ET

To those so called Christian Zionists on here:
8:42 Jesus said to the Jews, “If God were your Father, you would love Me, for I proceeded forth and have come from God, for I have not even come on My own initiative, but He sent Me.”
8:43 “Why do you not understand what I am saying? It is because you cannot hear My word.”
8:44 “You are of your father the devil and you want to do the desires of your father. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. Whenever he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own nature; for he is a liar and the father of lies.”
8:45 “But because I speak the truth, you do not believe Me.” [JOHN 8:42-45]

Debbie   January 22nd, 2009 5:34 pm ET

All the people answered, Let his blood be on us and on our children! And it continues, still to this day! What a shame!

Beny   January 22nd, 2009 5:37 pm ET

With all due respect to Gandhi, he wasn't here, he wasn't raided by Arab gangs, he wasn't burned in Auschwitz, and he sure as hell isn't here now, scattered across an exploded bus, or he would have sung an entirely different song.

I can argue with Gandhi, but he won't hear me (not that you guys do). Besides, I can give countless quotes by many other intellectuals to the contrary.

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 5:38 pm ET

So called Christians ZIONISTS are responsible for far more death and destruction, than any other religious group. Which is quite a feat considering that other religions have been here for longer. Since I deal in facts (which is why some of you get angry and speak in bold print, like I’m supposed to be impressed), let’s look at history. Starting with the crusades. Then let’s look at what Columbus did (murder rape and enslave brown Indians from two continents and several Islands), look at apartheid, look at what happened to the Native American Indian, look at the African slave trade, look at Englands opression of Scotland, Ireland, India, .. hell’ everybody, look at Hiroshima/Nagasaki, look at vietnam, look at Iraq (two wars that did not need to be faught), look at KKK/skinheads, and other so-called Christian groups, OH! let’s not forget Hitler, who also claimed to be a Christian, Stalin…I mean the list goes on and on. So called-Christians/Catholics, have gone on a millenium long reign of terror, worldwide. You speak of the Muslims fighting over their own land from pre-biblical times, but at least they stay in theri own neighborhood for the most part. And Israel is a close second. Let’s look at what has been going on in Lebanon, Their support for the Iraq war, the expulsion of Palestinians from their own land in 1948, and as of late, the Nazi’s are talking about Iran.
Let me tell you. Messing with Iran is a whole different ball game than These other small nations. Iran is a true opponent, and has resources and allies. This is exactly why Israel/U.S. approaches Iran so tenderly, because they are true bullies (cowards) The U.S. wants another Vietnam, as much as Israel wants another Lebanon.
But back to your foolish notion that Muslims are responsible for the most carnage…I only spoke of wars, and crimes against humanity. I did’nt get into the manufacture of Nukes, chemical warfare, biological warfare, the creation of certain viruses, and the systematic destruction of our planet.

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 5:42 pm ET

YES DEBBIE UNTIL THE DOOM DAY

BENY BESHAMEFUL OF YOURSELF

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 5:45 pm ET

Zionist Ideology began with premise that “…a land without a people for a people without a land.”

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 5:48 pm ET

Nazi Beny,

Sure he is not here now.... but he was watching the zionist gangs raping palestine, killing palestinians.... exploding their buldings and busses.... You are reaping what you sow. You will live in hell on this earth and in the hereafter.

Palestinians are not responsible for Auschwitz... so if you really were a man enough go take your revenge from whoever is resonsible for that. But, you are a coward and you like to kill innocent civilian women and children instead.

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 5:50 pm ET

“I have not yet begun to fight” John Paul Jones
On September 23, 1779, Jones fought one of the bloodiest engagements in naval history. Jones struggled with the 44-gun Royal Navy frigate Serapis, and although his own vessel was burning and sinking, Jones would not accept the British demand for surrender, replying, “I have not yet begun to fight.” More than three hours later, Serapis surrendered and Jones took command.

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 5:53 pm ET

Patrick Henry’s “Give Me Liberty Or Give Me Death” He was using violent resistance against the British Armed Forces!

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 5:55 pm ET

“WHO DOESN’T CLIMB MOUNTAINS, WILL ALWAYS LIVE IN HOLES” A TUNISIAN POET.

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 5:57 pm ET

By NOEL IGNATIEV
Zionism as a political movement developed in the late 19th century. Its founder, Theodore Herzl, was influenced by two phenomena: the extent of French anti-Semitism revealed by the Dreyfus Trial, and nationalist ideals then popular in Europe. Herzl held that Jews cannot be assimilated by the nations in which they live, and that the only solution to the “Jewish question” was the formation of a “Jewish state” in which all the Jews would come together. The early Zionists contemplated as the site of the future state Argentina or Uganda, among other locales. Herzl favored Palestine, because, although an agnostic, he wanted to make use of the custom, widespread among Jewish mystics, of going on pilgrimages to the “holy land” and establishing religious communities there.
In 1868, there were 13,000 Jews in Palestine, out of an estimated population of 400,000. The majority were religious pilgrims supported by charity from overseas. They encountered no opposition from the Muslims, and their presence led to no clashes with the Arab population, whether Muslim or Christian.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 5:57 pm ET

Benyemen,

Yes but Patrick Henry was a white person so he has a right to resist.... brown peopl do not have the same right.... when they do as Patrick Henry did they are called terrorists.... All terrorists are brown people.... have you noticed that?

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 6:00 pm ET

Benyemen,

Thats an abolutely correct historical facts....

In 1868, there were 13,000 Jews in Palestine, out of an estimated population of 400,000. The majority were religious pilgrims supported by charity from overseas. They encountered no opposition from the Muslims, and their presence led to no clashes with the Arab population, whether Muslim or Christian.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 6:01 pm ET

I'm back to defend myself against whining complainers. First of all benyemen, I have already condemned my countries wringdoings before Obama even got into office. I told the truth of Hiroshima/Nagasaki, and how we did not need to do this. If it were up to me, these things throughout history would have happened differently.
Second. I wasn't even alive during the times of vietnam, an WWII, and many of the other wrong things my country did. But I still live here. I still have the right to say aloud that I disagree with my countrys behavior in The middle east (DURING BUSH YEARS). Do you?

Next, my country is responsible for humanitarian efforts worldwide. Is yours?

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 6:01 pm ET

CONTINUED By NOEL IGNATIEV

In 1882, Baron Rothschild, combining philanthropy and investment, began to bring Jewish settlers from Eastern Europe to build a plantation system along the model the French used in Algeria. They spoke Yiddish, Arabic, Persian, and Georgian. Significantly, Hebrew was not among the languages spoken. The outcome of Rothschild’s experiment was predictable: Jews managed the land, while Arabs worked it. This was not the result the Zionists had in mind; a Jewish society could not be based on Arab labor. Consequently, they began to encourage the immigration of Jews to work in agriculture, industry, and transport.
In 1917 British Foreign Minister Lord Balfour, seeking support for Britain’s efforts in World War I, issued his famous declaration expressing sympathy with efforts to establish a Jewish homeland in Palestine. The Zionists immediately seized upon this statement, which they interpreted to mean support for a Jewish state. At the time of Balfour’s declaration, Jews comprised less than 10% of the population and owned 2.5% of the land of Palestine.
The problem of building a Jewish society among an overwhelming Arab majority came to be known as the “conquest of land and labor.” Land, once acquired, had to remain in Jewish hands. The other half of this project, known as Labor Zionism, called for the exclusive use of Jewish labor on the land acquired by the Jews in Palestine. The Labor Zionists maintained this dual exclusionism (or apartheid, as we would now call it) in order to build up purely Jewish institutions.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 6:10 pm ET

Beny. I don't know the name of the University that Israel destroyed. I know that CNN Announced that this particular univeristy was one of the first things hit in the early days of this attack. And I have been consistant in my disagreement with the way Hamas does things. But if you want to discuss this, let's deal in fact, and not emotion, ok.
ISRAEL broke the cease fire 2 days after signing, by going into Gaza, and killing 3 Hamas members. Palestine immediately retaliated, then resumed with the cease fire. The fact I just gave was provided by, HAARETZ...An Israeli media source.
Next cease fire breach wasby Israel in November, as they invaded Gaza again, to kill 7 Hamas members. The fact I just gave was provided by a Jew, who gave an interview with CNN'S RICK SANCHEZ.

If you can be man enough, talk about a reasonable way to fix this thing instead of whining about what is already past.

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 6:12 pm ET

Moshe Dayan, former Defense Minister, stated in a famous speech before students at the Israeli Institute of Technology in Haifa .
Jewish villages were built in the place of Arab villages. You do not even know the names of these Arab villages, and I do not blame you because geography books no longer exist. Not only do the books not exist, the Arab villages are not there either. Nahial arose in the place of Mahlul; Kibbutz Gvat in the place of Jibta; Kibbutz Sarid in the place of Huneifis; and Kefar Yehushua in the place of Tal al-Shuman. There is not a single place built in this country that did not have a former Arab population (Ha’aretz, April 4, 1969,

I.B. Wright   January 22nd, 2009 6:15 pm ET

C.S. The world could use a lot more objective patriots like yourself.

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 6:18 pm ET

CS WROTE:

January 22nd, 2009 1810 GMT

If you can be man enough, talk about a reasonable way to fix this thing instead of whining about what is already past.

I AM MAN ENOUGH, BEFORE I KNEW YOU AND AFTER KNOWING YOU. YOU ARE A CONFESSED MANIPULATOR AND THAT'S NOT A MAN CHARACTER.

ANSWER THE ABOVE IF YOU ARE HUMAN ENOUGH.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 6:20 pm ET

CS,

Good for you.... and thats exactly what Israeli's and their zionist supporters need to do before they are taken seriously.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 6:21 pm ET

Beny. You're using dangerous language right now. Forget any logic about anything you and I have spoken of. If you're threatening my country, it is a mistake. We may have done things wrong, and things I disagree with. But this is still my home. And I promise you, American civilians are the most armed people anywhere. So I suggest you save the tough talk for someone else. You niether impress, or scare anybody in here.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 6:21 pm ET

Benyemen,

Am I missing something? CS was talking to Beny and you took that as if it was directed at you.

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 6:22 pm ET

It is a mistake to draw a moral line between Israel and the Occupied Territories; it is all occupied territory. The 1967 war, as a result of which Israel conquered and occupied East Jerusalem, the West Bank of the Jordan River, and the Sinai Peninsula, was a continuation of the process that began in 1948.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 6:22 pm ET

benyemen. It is best if you do not adress me.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 6:25 pm ET

Obama,

Orders the shut down of any CIA prison outside the United States....

Way to go Obama.... A very good step forward.

Roscoe   January 22nd, 2009 6:27 pm ET

Immitaion Professor January 22nd, 2009 1757 GMT

Yes but Patrick Henry was a white person so he has a right to resist…. brown peopl do not have the same right…. when they do as Patrick Henry did they are called terrorists…. All terrorists are brown people…. have you noticed that?

******************************************************************

You're stretching the facts on this. There is a huge difference!!

Patrck Henry resisted against the British Armed Forces. He did not violently resist agains the women and children of England!

If the Resistance of the Palestinian people was directed at the IDF, this would be the same Patrck Henrys' efforts!

Hamas sending rockets inidiscminately intp the villages and cities of Israel does not qualify as resistance, it's terrorism.

Resist against the IDF!

CS   January 22nd, 2009 6:29 pm ET

The dangerous language comment was meant for the one who wishes to "show them what terrorists can do" I made an error, and adressed this to beny, but it was meant forbenyemen.

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 6:30 pm ET

PROF

HE IS A MANUPALATOR, I TRUSTED HIM BEFORE BUT ALL OF A SUDDEN THE GUY HAVE UNMASKED HIMSELF. AS A MANIPULATOR.

AND AN INSULTER AND A PROUD AMERICAN PATRIOT, WHO DOESN'T ANYONE TO SAY THE TRUTH, AS IF AMERICA IS GOD AND WE ARE BEGGERS. AND WILL NOT SURVIVE WITHOUT AMERICA.

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 6:34 pm ET

David Ben Gurion (the first Israeli Prime Minister): “If I were an Arab leader, I would never sign an agreement with Israel. It is normal; we have taken their country. It is true God promised it to us, but how could that interest them? Our God is not theirs. There has been Anti – Semitism, the Nazis, Hitler, Auschwitz, but was that their fault ? They see but one thing: we have come and we have stolen their country. Why would they accept that?” Quoted by Nahum Goldmann in Le Paraddoxe Juif (The Jewish Paradox), pp121

mohammed gharbawi   January 22nd, 2009 6:34 pm ET

Benyemen
I knew that Cs was a manipulative long time ago. the guy has two faces. sure.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 6:35 pm ET

Little Nazi Rascal,

Hamas targets the Israeli Occupying Forces it does not target women and children like Israel does.

But, its using primitive rockets... they do not hit their targets and by mistake they fall on homes.... and the civilians dead in Israel are casualties of war.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 6:35 pm ET

OK Roscoe. Since you want to clarify us on the facts of what white terrorists, did what, how about Oklahoma city bombing, was he not white. How about David Koresh. How about the KKK? How about skinheads? How about Hitler. I have to agree with Professor on this one. Many people in the past who did things were called patriots, or freedom fighters, but when brown people do it we're called terrorists, or radicals, or some other hyped name to scare people. The founders of this country were called terrorists by the crown, and called heroes by others. It's all how the writers of history, and media reporters tell it.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 6:36 pm ET

CS,

were you directing your comment (that started with Beny,....) to Beny or to Benyemen?

CS   January 22nd, 2009 6:37 pm ET

I don't have two faces. You're just sore because I wont go around blindly hating people because somebody tells me to. Must suck to be a slave.

dan perman   January 22nd, 2009 6:38 pm ET

Faulty Figures

Gazan doctor says death toll inflated

Physician at Gaza's Shifa Hospital tells Italian newspaper number of dead in Israeli offensive 'stands at no more than 500 or 600, most of them youths recruited to Hamas' ranks'. Senior Palestinian Health Ministry official denies claims, IDF estimate on 1,200 casualties in Strip remains unchanged

What really is behind the numbers reported on the number of civilian casualties in the Gaza Strip? Italian newspaper Corriere Della Sera reported Thursday that a doctor working in Gaza's Shifa Hospital claimed that Hamas has intentionally inflated the number of casualties resulting from Israel's Operation Cast Lead.

"The number of deceased stands at no more than 500 to 600. Most of them are youths between the ages of 17 to 23 who were recruited to the ranks of Hamas, who sent them to the slaughter," according to the newspaper article.

The doctor wished to remain unidentified, out of fear for his life.

'Mostly armed teenagers'

A Tal al-Hawa resident told the newspaper's reporter, "Armed Hamas men sought out a good position for provoking the Israelis. There were mostly teenagers, aged 16 or 17, and armed. They couldn't do a thing against a tank or a jet. They knew they are much weaker, but they fired at our houses so that they could blame Israel for war crimes."

The reporter for the Italian newspaper also quoted reporters in the Strip who told of Hamas' exaggerated figures, "We have already said to Hamas commanders – why do you insist on inflating the number of victims?"

These same reporters mentioned that the truth that will come out is likely to be similar to what occurred in Operation Defensive Shield in Jenin. "Then, there was first talk of 1,500 deaths. But then it turned out that there were only 54, 45 of which were armed men," the Palestinian reporters told the Italian newspaper.

Hamas, while boasting on having killed Israeli soldiers by the dozens, a number that has proven to be exaggerated, claimed that no more than 48 of its members were killed during the Israeli offensive. According to IDF figures, Hamas lost hundreds of fighters from its rank

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 6:38 pm ET

CS

DANGEROUS LANGUAGE MY ASS.........YOU ARE THE ONES (I MEAN THE WEST AND ISREAL ) WHO BRAND ALL MUSLIMS TERRORISTS .......ISN'T THAT FACT

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 6:40 pm ET

The whole world is lying now but Nazi Dan expects us to believe him becuase he has an inside connection into the truth.

mohammed gharbawi   January 22nd, 2009 6:40 pm ET

zionists and co (because there is a co here)

you tell us patrick fought the english army , not women and children.

ok! but lets face facts.
The israeli society is a military society ; there no civilians.
Besides, if you want your women to be safe, return the land to its owners.
you colonize me ,and you tell me who to kill and whom not to kill.

its the occupation stupid.

Roscoe   January 22nd, 2009 6:40 pm ET

Immitation Professor January 22nd, 2009 1835 GMT

Little Nazi Rascal,

Hamas targets the Israeli Occupying Forces it does not target women and children like Israel does.

But, its using primitive rockets… they do not hit their targets and by mistake they fall on homes…. and the civilians dead in Israel are casualties of war.

***************************************************
You're a real hoot!

They've never, never hit an IDF target with one of those blind rockets!

Since you can't seem to defend their actions you simply resort to ignoranct sacasm! I should expect as much!

CS   January 22nd, 2009 6:40 pm ET

There were 2. The first one that starts with beny, was meant for beny (when he was ranting in bold print earlier.) The ones advising beyemen about his terrorist threats, were meant for benyemen, I know I said Beny, but I was a little aggrovated at the monment, my mistake.

dan perman   January 22nd, 2009 6:42 pm ET

"The whole world is lying now"

yeah, right:

Italian newspaper Corriere Della Sera reported Thursday that a doctor working in Gaza’s Shifa Hospital claimed that Hamas has intentionally inflated the number of casualties resulting from Israel’s Operation Cast Lead.

dan perman   January 22nd, 2009 6:43 pm ET

These same reporters mentioned that the truth that will come out is likely to be similar to what occurred in Operation Defensive Shield in Jenin. “Then, there was first talk of 1,500 deaths. But then it turned out that there were only 54, 45 of which were armed men,” the Palestinian reporters told the Italian newspaper.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 6:43 pm ET

Benyemen,

Its was the US administration under Bush who did that.... I hope that Obama will force his administration to change that tone since his father was a Muslim.... I don't think he would like anyone calling his father a terrorist.

Americans majority did not agree with Bush but unfortunately the minority had the louder voice (FOX) under Bush.

CS, has stated already that he disagree with that position.... so why are you attacking him?

Roscoe   January 22nd, 2009 6:44 pm ET

CS January 22nd, 2009 1835 GMT

OK Roscoe. Since you want to clarify us on the facts of what white terrorists, did what, how about Oklahoma city bombing, was he not white. How about David Koresh. How about the KKK? How about skinheads? How about Hitler. I have to agree with Professor on this one. Many people in the past who did things were called patriots, or freedom fighters, but when brown people do it we’re called terrorists, or radicals, or some other hyped name to scare people. The founders of this country were called terrorists by the crown, and called heroes by others. It’s all how the writers of history, and media reporters tell it.
**********************************************************************

None of those people or organizations you mention above were ever considered freedom fighters by any history writers, reporters or anyone!

They've always been considered either terrorists or just plain criminals, just like Hamas and other such organizations!

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 6:46 pm ET

BROTHER MOHD GHARBAWI

I AM SORRY FOR ONCE I APOLOGIZED ON YOUR BEHALF TO THIS MANIPULATOR CALLED CS

CS

IN THE INNAGURATION SPEECH OBAMA SAID WE WILL FIGHT TERROR................THE CNN ANCHOR CAPING THE SPEECH SAID OBAMA SAID WE WILL FIGHT MUSLIMS TERROR

WHAT PROOF YOU NEED MORE THAN THAT TOO SHAMEFUL OF YOURSELVES

mohammed gharbawi   January 22nd, 2009 6:46 pm ET

jews
I will not define "terrorism" because the term is elusive and relative, but i will describe one picture that is circulating in the net and i ll let you define the term for yourselves:

THE PICTURE

a dead palestininian woman with a seven months infant out of her body (she was pregnant).

The commentary of the photographer:

This is the photo of the youngest terrorist ever..

waiting for your comments.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 6:47 pm ET

Thanks for clarifying that CS.

Roscoe   January 22nd, 2009 6:48 pm ET

mohammed gharbawi January 22nd, 2009 1840 GMT

zionists and co (because there is a co here)

you tell us patrick fought the english army , not women and children.

ok! but lets face facts.

Imprison the terrorists, stupid!!

Roscoe   January 22nd, 2009 6:52 pm ET

More reports that Islamic hard liners and their friends do not want to hear:

Cremonesi, a correspondent for Italys’ Corriere della sera, interviewed Gazans who echoed Israels’ insistence of how Hamas gunmen used civilians as human shields. One Gazan recalled civilians in Gaza shouting at Hamas and Islamic Jihad men, "Go away, go away from here! Do you want the Israelis to kill us all? Do you want our children to die under their bombs? Take your guns and missiles with you."
"Traitors, collaborators with Israel, spies of Fatah, cowards! The soldiers of the holy war will punish you. And in any case you will all die, like us. Fighting the Zionist Jews we are all destined for paradise. Do you not wish to die with us?" the religious fanatics of Hamas reportedly responded.
Other Palestinians told Cremonesi of Hamas operatives donning paramedic uniforms and commandeering ambulances. A woman identified as Um Abdullah, 48, spoke of Hamas using UN buildings as launch pads for rockets. Cremonesi reported that he had difficultly gathering evidence as the local population was terrified of Hamas.

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 6:57 pm ET

“It is the duty of Israeli leaders to explain to public opinion, clearly and courageously, a certain number of facts that are forgotten with time. The first of these is that there is no Zionism, colonialization or Jewish State without the eviction of the Arabs and the expropriation of their lands.”
Yoram Bar Porath, Yediot Aahronot, of 14 July 1972

Roscoe   January 22nd, 2009 7:00 pm ET

Immitation Professor January 22nd, 2009 1825 GMT

Obama,

Orders the shut down of any CIA prison outside the United States….

Way to go Obama…. A very good step forward.
*****************************************************

He also said he getting on a plane on Monday to go see Amadinenutjob and from their heading to N Korea to see Kim Jung Il and then would stop by to say hello to Mugabe on his way home!

benyemen   January 22nd, 2009 7:09 pm ET

GOODNIGHT GOOD PEOPLE AND A HORRIBLE NIGHT FOR BAD PEOPLE AND MANIPULATORS.

mohammed gharbawi   January 22nd, 2009 7:10 pm ET

rascal
your are right "emprison terrorists". we will; its a question of time.

Roscoe   January 22nd, 2009 7:11 pm ET

mohammed gharbagi January 22nd, 2009 1902 GMT

rascal

everybody knows that cnn is biase to your case. Lately, even BBC, which we used to consider as objective, has shown its face too.
As i said yesterday, we should play a more active role to counter you.
frankly, you are killers, bur you work more than we do.

********************************************************

Just so you understand, I put no faith or trust in the reporting of CNN as it relates to any ME issues-none! US stories-- I still do not give CNN much faith!

I'm simply here on the CNN blogs because there's good entertainment!

For ME Issues I put my faith in Al Jazeera English TV,

mohammed gharbawi   January 22nd, 2009 7:16 pm ET

Once, there was a black african in a bus in Paris; he was leaving the bus when the clerk told him to show the ticket. The black african pushed him and went out of the bus. Suddenly, two policemen showed up, caught him, and told him to bring the ticket.
The guy told them: prove i was in the bus.lol

This is a true story.

The point is: this is the same logic used by israeli moorans: they colonised us and they tell us to prove they did.

facts are facts, my dear.

Roscoe   January 22nd, 2009 7:16 pm ET

mohammed gharbagi January 22nd, 2009 1906 GMT

Rascal
with simple kalash we killed 80 dog.isnt that enough?

********************************************

BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!

Then why do need the Tomahawks!

earle,florida   January 22nd, 2009 7:30 pm ET

Great start,great negotiator,and well grounded,...

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 7:32 pm ET

Dear President Obama,

First, Congratulations on becoming the 44th President of the United States and taking action quickly to resolve some of the many problems facing our nation.

I want to sincerely thank you for signing an executive order to close the detention center at Guantanamo Bay. For too long the horror stories which have come from the detention center and the failure to provide due process for the detainees has been counter-productive in our efforts to build bridges of understanding between the United States and most of the world, particularly the Arab and Muslim World.

This quick and initial step will go a long way, but it is also important to remember that the key to strong relations with Arab and Muslim World is a just solution to the Palestinian issue and we look forward to your quick and evenhanded engagement in genuine peacemaking.

Sincerely,

Roscoe   January 22nd, 2009 7:34 pm ET

mohammed gharbagi January 22nd, 2009 1917 GMT

rascal
are you a tretard
in order not to kill your women son of a bitch.

****************************************************

Now there you go again, no good response so you need to get all upset and start calling people names! Grow up!!!

If all you have are sticks and stones and those brainless rockets then you simply need to go find the IDF and take up the fight directly with them. Leave the women and children of Israel out of it. Better, yet, simply wake up to the fact that you don't have what it takes to defeat the IDF!

It will never be acceptable to any one in the world, other than the radical terrorists, for you to sit in Gaza and just launch rockets into the towns and cities in Israel.

Brfore start your ranting and raving about the Israelis kiling the innocent people of Gaza-- I don't buy that either-- that happens because people like you and Hamas force them to stay and protect the fighters. You know it, I know it, and the world knows it! You fight from behind the skirts of your women and children, and you have the audacity to blame their deaths on the Israelis! No one but you and brothers buy that story! No one!!

I'm sorry that you and your people are stuck in the Dark Ages. But you've simply not taken the effort to change that-- ever!

Even your Arab brothers will not support your actions. If they did, they would have hepled you out of this situation decades ago!!

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 7:36 pm ET

Obama also signed an order to stop the use of torture.

Way to go Mr. Pres.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 7:36 pm ET

We will have to see how he will deal with Israel which uses torture in its prisons.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 7:39 pm ET

Israeli war ships broke their own unilateral cease-fire.... What a joke of a democratic country.... ROTFLMAO

CS   January 22nd, 2009 7:48 pm ET

Professor. The angry lillte men attack me because I have a mind of my own, and they can't force me to hate, the way they force 14 and 15 yr old boys to blow themselves up.
Now these whiners are saying that, because a reporter said something, that that means Obama said it. Even after Obama just said what he meant. He can't be held accountable for what the reporter said.

I'm telling you professor...some of these guys are the same as George Bush. They deal in absolution, and want to turn people against eachother for their own purposes.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 7:51 pm ET

Although I disagree with Roscoes scorn against Palestine. He makes a good point. Why does Egypt, Iran, and other arab nations not ally with Palestine.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 7:54 pm ET

Professor. No matter how many good things Obama, or anybody does, some people will always hate. They will always wish to fight.
If Israel gave up their land right now, and marched to the ocean, jumped in, and every last one drowned...some people would swim in after them to argue with the corpse. There's just no pleasing some people. You know.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 7:55 pm ET

CS,

Iran does not ally with Palestine?

Egypt has a reason.... Egypt is the seond largest foreign aid receipient from the US after Israel.

Roscoe   January 22nd, 2009 7:59 pm ET

CS January 22nd, 2009 1951 GMT

Although I disagree with Roscoes scorn against Palestine. He makes a good point. Why does Egypt, Iran, and other arab nations not ally with Palestine.
***************************************************************

You misjudge my position. I simply have no use for the radical islamic elements and the hatred that they spew. Mohammed Gharbawi does this on a regular basis. The coninuation of this philosophy will yield nothing more than scorn and hatred for his kind!

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 8:06 pm ET

Little Nazi Rascal,

And the same for the Zionists and their supporters.... they spew hatred and it will only yield more than scorn and hatered for their kind!

Roscoe   January 22nd, 2009 8:07 pm ET

CS January 22nd, 2009 1951 GMT

Although I disagree with Roscoes scorn against Palestine. He makes a good point. Why does Egypt, Iran, and other arab nations not ally with Palestine.
*******************************************************************

Iran is responsible for the rockets, armaments and money that Hamas and the other radicals Palestine obtain.

But, the radicals, Hamas, Islamic Jihad, etc., view this as support. When in reality, all it amounts to is Irans' contribution in an effort for these guys to wage terror on Israel. This way Iran keeps their hands clean- sort of! However, the result of their efforts is no more than the destruction of Palestine at the hands of the Israelis.

Roscoe   January 22nd, 2009 8:14 pm ET

Immitation Professor January 22nd, 2009 2006 GMT

Little Nazi Rascal,

And the same for the Zionists and their supporters…. they spew hatred and it will only yield more than scorn and hatered for their kind!

************************************************************

That's why you will never see peace. You simply cannot accept the fact there is a State of Israel.

You have no desire to accept their right to exist. Therfore, for you, there will always be hatred and you will never be happy. I feel sorrry, for people who think like you because I realize that you will be an angry, hateful and unhappy person for all of your life.

Why don't you just get over over it, move on !!!

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 8:16 pm ET

Little Nazi Rascal,

Zionist Israelis and they supporters cannot keep a straight lie.... on one hand they say that Iran supply the rockets.... on the next day they will say they have home made rockets....

Hamas stated that they do not have ships to transport the weapons and they do not have a port to welcome Iranian ships...

Israel control most of the border with Gaza.... and Egypt control a small piece....

Can you explain to me your twisted brain and how it functions?

Roscoe   January 22nd, 2009 8:24 pm ET

Immitation Professor January 22nd, 2009 2016 GMT

Little Nazi Rascal,

Zionist Israelis and they supporters cannot keep a straight lie…. on one hand they say that Iran supply the rockets…. on the next day they will say they have home made rockets….

Hamas stated that they do not have ships to transport the weapons and they do not have a port to welcome Iranian ships…

Israel control most of the border with Gaza…. and Egypt control a small piece….

Can you explain to me your twisted brain and how it functions?
*****************************************************

Oh, please-- you know as well as I do that some are made in Gaza and some come in through the tunnels as well as the Mediterranean by small boat. Even the ones made in Gaza require explosive compounds and chemicals to be smuggled in. And they certainly down manufature their AK47's either

Who needs a big ship and and port to deliver smuggled goods to the beach???

Go back and finsh your grade school education! Or just quit being stupid!

imad Saleh   January 22nd, 2009 8:25 pm ET

Great man great choice that will deliver graet results

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 8:37 pm ET

Obama stated that his administration will abide by the Geneva Convention.... which implies that the previous one did not..... and if Obama's administration want to prove that America has high ethical values then he should order an investigation of the previous administration actions not abiding by the Geneva Convention.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 8:41 pm ET

Stop you hallucinations you little Nazi Rascal.

Its the occupation stupid.

dan perman   January 22nd, 2009 8:52 pm ET

The Connection between UNRWA and the Palestinian Terror Organizations in the Gaza Strip

In recent years a vast amount of information has accumulated regarding the gradual takeover of UNRWA (United Nations Relief and Works Agency), the UN relief agency for the Palestinian refugees, by Hamas and other Palestinian terror organizations. Awad al-Kik, a teacher at the UNRWA school, who served simultaneously as the head of the engineering and weapons manufacture unit of Islamic Jihad serves as a prominent example.[1]

It has long been known that UNRWA and the Palestinian leadership are contributing to the perpetuation of the refugee problem and the attendant misery of the refugees. It has been noted that despite the fact that Israel in August 2005 retreated from the Gaza strip, the Palestinian Authority, and presently the Hamas government, did not lift a finger to rehabilitate the Palestinian refugee camps.

The reverse is true: the Palestinian leadership made it crystal clear that the government of the Palestinian Authority would not settle the refugees in the areas of the settlements that had been evacuated. This was done so in order to preserve their "right of return".

This argument is completely disingenuous, because an amelioration of the refugees' conditions does not weaken the demand for return or compensation in any shape or manner. It would appear that the interests of the Hamas government and UNRWA dovetail on this matter, namely preventing the dismantlement of the refugee camps, despite the severe privation existing there that promotes extremism, in order to nurture the dream of a return to Palestine, which means Israel.

In recent years a vast amount of information has accumulated regarding the gradual takeover of UNRWA by Hamas and other Palestinian terror organizations. In elections for the UNRWA employees Association on June 14, 2006, Hamas representatives won a resounding victory. Hamas took all 11 seats on the Association allotted to representatives of the 7000 teachers in UNRRA, all 9 of the seats allotted the service sector in UNRWA (physicians, engineers, pharmacists and nurses) and 3 out of the 7 seats allotted the balance of UNRWA employees.

Following the military coup during which Hamas seized power in the Gaza strip (June 2007), there were reports, including from Palestinian human rights organizations, to the effect that armed forces of the Hamas government had taken over institutions belonging to UNRWA in the Gaza Strip and had even housed forces of the Al-Qassam, Brigades, the Hamas military wing, in some of the buildings. Parents of students learning in the UNRWA schools sent a letter to a senior official in UNRWA where they claimed that thousands of teachers belonging to the Al-Qassam brigades were teaching in a UN agency's school. They demanded that an emergency investigation be conducted on the matter.

One of the striking examples illustrating that UNRWA has become a hospitable organisation for Palestinian terror organisations was unveiled during the attack by the Israeli Air Force that targeted a weapons manufacture workshop in Rafah. Among those Killed in the attack was Awad al-Kik (Abu Mohammed), a teacher, educator and UNRRA school principal in Rafah who simultaneously served as the head of Islamic Jihad's engineering and weapons manufacture unit in the southern Gaza strip.

Al-Kik was born in the Jebalya refugee camp and lived in the Rafah refugee camp. He studied at UNRWA schools and excelled in chemistry and physics. After he had completed his academic studies at Al-Azhar University, Al-Kik began a teaching career at the UNRWA schools and rapidly ascended the professional ladder. At a relatively young age he was appointed vice principal of the Ibn Sina elementary school and was subsequently chosen by UNRWA to serve as principal of junior high school "E" until he was killed in an Israeli air force attack.

Already as a high school student, al-Kik joined Islamic Jihad and was active in the high school and college Islamic Jihad student's organization (Al-Jamaa Al-Islamiyya). He subsequently joined the Jerusalem Squads, the military wing of the organization.

Al-Kik's technological training was fully exploited in the framework of his activity. Al-Kik was one of the senior operatives in charge of manufacturing and developing rockets for Islamic Jihad, preparing explosive charges and war materiel as well as training generations of "engineers" on the basis of the knowledge that he had accumulated.

In the summer of 2006 al-Kik visited China where he displayed an interest in light aircraft, possibly for the purpose of purchase/manufacture in order to commit a terror attack against Israel.

Al-Kik's activity in the realm of terror was exposed in September 2007, when he escaped an Israeli assassination attempt. Nevertheless, he continued to serve as a teacher, educator and school principal for UNRWA and involved in educating children and youths in summer camps. It is not clear why after his terror activity had been exposed UNRWA refrained from sacking him from any educational and teaching post at its institutions.

There is little justification for UNRWA's existence if the organization views its entire purpose as preserving the misery of the refugees in the camps. However beyond this the affair of the "terrorist educator" and the Hamas takeover of the UNRWA institutions and work staff should trigger a "warning light" with regard to the possibility that funds transferred to UNRWA by the donor states (including the United States and Canada) find their way to financing the salaries of Hamas and Islamic Jihad activists.

This matter requires an urgent investigation, and in any case, UNRWA would be well advised to channel hundreds of millions of dollars from its budget to clear out the refugee camps and rehabilitate their inhabitants in new and more spacious towns. The donor states should pose this as a preliminary condition to their continued assistance to UNRWA.

--------------------------–

[1] http://www.alquds.com/node/23120

Tom   January 22nd, 2009 8:56 pm ET

Who really is the fake "Professor"? a Hamas member? Most people have come to expect the same tired old retoric from the Palestinian terrorists. Give it up! You haven't got a chance. Every time Hamas or one of the other terrorists groups attacks Israel they get whipped badly. But they never, never learn. Driven by hate and lies they just continue to bloody themselves. I think the world should get behind Israel and drive the terrorists out of Israel completely. They are occupying someone else's land. Sooner or later they will go.

Roscoe   January 22nd, 2009 9:00 pm ET

dan perman January 22nd, 2009 2052 GMT

The Connection between UNRWA and the Palestinian Terror Organizations in the Gaza Strip

****************************************************

Yea-– what does that tell you!!!!!!

CS   January 22nd, 2009 9:01 pm ET

Roscoe,Professor. I think that those who support Palestine do so, for one reason, and one reason alone. The same reason that those trouble makers in here try to turn people against each other. They want to stir trouble. That's it. If Iran TRULY supported Palestine, then they would do so in a way that would actuallt help them. They would lend some financial, and militery assistance. Not give them the recycled trash from it's surplus that they were probably never gonna use anyway. I mean what is the point in shooting rockets into a town where you know the people are not home. Where you know there will be minimal damage.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 9:05 pm ET

Roscoe. Were you one of the complainers that whined about Hamas getting shipments from Egypt in the tunnels? How can they make bombs one minute, ship them in the next, and get them from Iran the next, and get them from egypt the next. If all these things were occurring, I think they would have faired better in this conflict, no?

CS   January 22nd, 2009 9:07 pm ET

Professor. I'm trying to keep it civil, but that thing you said about little nazi rascal is really cracking my sides. Every time I read it, I laugh uncontrolably. OK bacck to buisiness.

Roscoe   January 22nd, 2009 9:08 pm ET

Immitation Professor January 22nd, 2009 2041 GMT

Stop you hallucinations you little Nazi Rascal.

Its the occupation stupid.

*********************************************************

It's, Imprison the terroists, stupid!!!!!!!

Your Arab brothers even want to keep you locked up!

How sad!!

CS   January 22nd, 2009 9:09 pm ET

Dan Perman. The president does not speak in those terms anymore. "The Terrorists" Why do you.? Why do you try to group all Islamic people as terrorists?

CS   January 22nd, 2009 9:14 pm ET

I don't know if Roscoe is talking about Guantanamo, but if so, the only reason Hamas, or any other radiacal group would want Guantanamo to stay opened, or John Mccain elected, is because this will fuel their hatred. Guys like Mccain, and Bush are easy to read, and to make react, so, naturally they would want something to support their efforts. If there is peace, there can be no war, and that is what SOME want.

CS   January 22nd, 2009 9:17 pm ET

Peter is right on this. We (myself included) should try to stick to the topic. It's just hard when people get angry with you for saying your opinion. But I will say what I wish. If people don't like it, so be it.

Roscoe   January 22nd, 2009 9:17 pm ET

CS January 22nd, 2009 2105 GMT

Roscoe. Were you one of the complainers that whined about Hamas getting shipments from Egypt in the tunnels? How can they make bombs one minute, ship them in the next, and get them from Iran the next, and get them from egypt the next. If all these things were occurring, I think they would have faired better in this conflict, no?
*************************************************************

No one was whinig about it – Immitaion professor asked for an explanation becoause he doesn' seem to understand.

Don' take my word for it -- check it out for yourself.

The quassam rockets they have are made in Gaza.
The Grad rockets are Iranian, it's a know fact.

Neither of which has any guidance systems.

To my knowldge none of the illicit armamanents originate in Egypt.

How does this stuff get in?????

Guess-– doesn't take a genius!!!

Hamas controls some of the tunnels.

Roscoe   January 22nd, 2009 9:27 pm ET

CS January 22nd, 2009 2114 GMT

I don’t know if Roscoe is talking about Guantanamo, but if so, the only reason Hamas, or any other radiacal group would want Guantanamo to stay opened, or John Mccain elected, is because this will fuel their hatred. Guys like Mccain, and Bush are easy to read, and to make react, so, naturally they would want something to support their efforts. If there is peace, there can be no war, and that is what SOME want.
***************************************************

It's simply a response to repeated statements by Immitation Professor, Mohammed Gharbagi and some of his other associates,
as they continue to spout any time someone questions the reason for the situation in Isarael and the Paestinian Territories.

They're coming off with "It's the Occupation Stupid", when they have no other response-- so I simply respond- "Its' imprison the terrorists stupid!"

Nothing to do with Gitmo!

John   January 22nd, 2009 9:33 pm ET

You haven’t said why Hamas can’t renounce violence and terrorism and prove to the world that it means it. It is starting to look like the solution to this age old problem is way over everbodies head. Since Hamas is so narrow minded, violence is all they know that they are showing the world. We all know you can’t answer the question of “why can not Hamas renounce violence and terrorism?” Which is the main reason nothing is getting accomplished. Wow, it doesn’t take a highly educated, intelligent human being to see that this is only way. You can keep saying it is the occupation, but that isn’t going to change. So quit the stupid excuse of the occupation. It is non-relevant. The Palestinians are not going anywhere and the Israelis are not going anywhere. I would think that even uneducated people could figure that one out. No brainer! Lets see,what is the only way you can totally destroy Israel? With a nuclear bomb! There you go! We have found a way to take care of the problem. Only thing is whomever blows it off, you better kiss you buns goodbye because the bad ass US is coming to take you out. So what do we have left after Israel is a radioactive wasteland? We will have a few more places, most likely in the middle east, that will radioactive wastelands also. So in the end, the US will occupy the middle east and all the Palestinians should be dead or are dying from all the radioactive fallout all while they are being martyed. Looks like the future is bright! The future of the middle east will look like the present US. Where everyone, no matter what religion or race, will live in peace. OR the Palestinians can get some help to start to demand that Hamas renounce violence and terrorism and start doing good things towards people and then we could start the peace process and have all the Jews, Muslims, and everybody else living with each other, driving the economy, bringing all the poor people opportunities to enrich their life beyond anything that a Militant faction could bring them.

Roscoe   January 22nd, 2009 9:36 pm ET

CS January 22nd, 2009 2101 GMT

Roscoe,Professor. I think that those who support Palestine do so, for one reason, and one reason alone. The same reason that those trouble makers in here try to turn people against each other. They want to stir trouble. That’s it. If Iran TRULY supported Palestine, then they would do so in a way that would actuallt help them. They would lend some financial, and militery assistance. Not give them the recycled trash from it’s surplus that they were probably never gonna use anyway. I mean what is the point in shooting rockets into a town where you know the people are not home. Where you know there will be minimal damage.
***********************************************

CS- you really should take the time to investigate the connection there-- don't take my word for it.

But I think you got some of my point– "If Iran TRULY supported Palestine"-- they don't! They simply want nothing more than Hamas to be the dog that will continue to bite the ankles of Israel.

The situation is the same with Iran and Hezbollah, this really isn't secret stuff!

Besides, if Iran was to provide munitions to Hamas which could seriously do harm to the Israelis-– what do you think would happen???

John   January 22nd, 2009 9:50 pm ET

January 22nd, 2009 1536 GMT
THE MATTER IS SIMPLE; IT IS JUST A MATTER OF ATTITUDE!
THE ISRAELIS ARE FRIENDS TO THE USA.
USA IS SYMPATHETIC AND SUPPORTIVE AND UNDERSTANDING TO THE ISRAELITE FRIENDS.
PALESTINIANS ARE NOT FRIENDS TO THE USA, NEITHER ARE ENEMIES.
USA DOES NOT CARE ABOUT THE PALESTINIANS, ARAB MUSLIMS AND WORTHLESS CREATURES AND NEVER HUMAN BEINGS.
The Mideast Envoy and President Obama must first work on changing the American attitude.
********************************************************************************
The statement of "USA DOES NOT CARE ABOUT THE PALESTINIANS, ARAB MUSLIMS AND WORTHLESS CREATURES AND NEVER HUMAN BEINGS" is really stupid. You apparently are not an American, thus have no idea what the majority of US citizens care about. Palestinians we do care about, Arabs we do care about, Jews we do care about, Athiests we do care about, drunks, murderers, rapists, drug pushers, militants, we all care about. Have you looked at all the money the US gives to other countries for the people in need? You don't even have a clue! Look at the militants of the Middle East. What have they done for anybody except for themselves? They haven't done one damn thing for humanity. Unless you have some proof of their money going to some needy country or people? You want peace in the Middle East. Stop the militants from doing all the violence and convert them to good, caring, and loving people, instead of doing hatred, murders, and teaching their children to hate and murder. Assigning Mitchell is the right thing to do. He made two big points early when discussing the Middle East. Israel needs to stop building settlements on land that was not given to them, and the Militants need to renounce violence and terrorism and start teaching people to be good. The American attitude is fed up with Militants, not the Palestinians and the rest of the Middle East. We want the Palestinians to live free with no fear, but as long as they let the Militants call the shots, and they accept them to be their leaders, there is no chance that anybody can do anything. So it is really up to the Palestinians to change the attitude of the Militants, which is turn will change the whole scope of the problems we are witnessing. Violence breeds Violence. Good breeds good! Start teaching everybody you know to start spreading good and rejecting any type of violence against anybody and hold the criminals accountable for the violence they spread, no matter who is doing it. From this day forward we need to spread good! Forget the past, you can't change it. We can only shape the future!

dan perman   January 22nd, 2009 10:05 pm ET

unwra is terrorits:

The Connection between UNRWA and the Palestinian Terror Organizations in the Gaza Strip

In recent years a vast amount of information has accumulated regarding the gradual takeover of UNRWA (United Nations Relief and Works Agency), the UN relief agency for the Palestinian refugees, by Hamas and other Palestinian terror organizations. Awad al-Kik, a teacher at the UNRWA school, who served simultaneously as the head of the engineering and weapons manufacture unit of Islamic Jihad serves as a prominent example.[1]

It has long been known that UNRWA and the Palestinian leadership are contributing to the perpetuation of the refugee problem and the attendant misery of the refugees. It has been noted that despite the fact that Israel in August 2005 retreated from the Gaza strip, the Palestinian Authority, and presently the Hamas government, did not lift a finger to rehabilitate the Palestinian refugee camps.

The reverse is true: the Palestinian leadership made it crystal clear that the government of the Palestinian Authority would not settle the refugees in the areas of the settlements that had been evacuated. This was done so in order to preserve their "right of return".

This argument is completely disingenuous, because an amelioration of the refugees' conditions does not weaken the demand for return or compensation in any shape or manner. It would appear that the interests of the Hamas government and UNRWA dovetail on this matter, namely preventing the dismantlement of the refugee camps, despite the severe privation existing there that promotes extremism, in order to nurture the dream of a return to Palestine, which means Israel.

In recent years a vast amount of information has accumulated regarding the gradual takeover of UNRWA by Hamas and other Palestinian terror organizations. In elections for the UNRWA employees Association on June 14, 2006, Hamas representatives won a resounding victory. Hamas took all 11 seats on the Association allotted to representatives of the 7000 teachers in UNRRA, all 9 of the seats allotted the service sector in UNRWA (physicians, engineers, pharmacists and nurses) and 3 out of the 7 seats allotted the balance of UNRWA employees.

Following the military coup during which Hamas seized power in the Gaza strip (June 2007), there were reports, including from Palestinian human rights organizations, to the effect that armed forces of the Hamas government had taken over institutions belonging to UNRWA in the Gaza Strip and had even housed forces of the Al-Qassam, Brigades, the Hamas military wing, in some of the buildings. Parents of students learning in the UNRWA schools sent a letter to a senior official in UNRWA where they claimed that thousands of teachers belonging to the Al-Qassam brigades were teaching in a UN agency's school. They demanded that an emergency investigation be conducted on the matter.

One of the striking examples illustrating that UNRWA has become a hospitable organisation for Palestinian terror organisations was unveiled during the attack by the Israeli Air Force that targeted a weapons manufacture workshop in Rafah. Among those Killed in the attack was Awad al-Kik (Abu Mohammed), a teacher, educator and UNRRA school principal in Rafah who simultaneously served as the head of Islamic Jihad's engineering and weapons manufacture unit in the southern Gaza strip.

Al-Kik was born in the Jebalya refugee camp and lived in the Rafah refugee camp. He studied at UNRWA schools and excelled in chemistry and physics. After he had completed his academic studies at Al-Azhar University, Al-Kik began a teaching career at the UNRWA schools and rapidly ascended the professional ladder. At a relatively young age he was appointed vice principal of the Ibn Sina elementary school and was subsequently chosen by UNRWA to serve as principal of junior high school "E" until he was killed in an Israeli air force attack.

Already as a high school student, al-Kik joined Islamic Jihad and was active in the high school and college Islamic Jihad student's organization (Al-Jamaa Al-Islamiyya). He subsequently joined the Jerusalem Squads, the military wing of the organization.

Al-Kik's technological training was fully exploited in the framework of his activity. Al-Kik was one of the senior operatives in charge of manufacturing and developing rockets for Islamic Jihad, preparing explosive charges and war materiel as well as training generations of "engineers" on the basis of the knowledge that he had accumulated.

In the summer of 2006 al-Kik visited China where he displayed an interest in light aircraft, possibly for the purpose of purchase/manufacture in order to commit a terror attack against Israel.

Al-Kik's activity in the realm of terror was exposed in September 2007, when he escaped an Israeli assassination attempt. Nevertheless, he continued to serve as a teacher, educator and school principal for UNRWA and involved in educating children and youths in summer camps. It is not clear why after his terror activity had been exposed UNRWA refrained from sacking him from any educational and teaching post at its institutions.

There is little justification for UNRWA's existence if the organization views its entire purpose as preserving the misery of the refugees in the camps. However beyond this the affair of the "terrorist educator" and the Hamas takeover of the UNRWA institutions and work staff should trigger a "warning light" with regard to the possibility that funds transferred to UNRWA by the donor states (including the United States and Canada) find their way to financing the salaries of Hamas and Islamic Jihad activists.

This matter requires an urgent investigation, and in any case, UNRWA would be well advised to channel hundreds of millions of dollars from its budget to clear out the refugee camps and rehabilitate their inhabitants in new and more spacious towns. The donor states should pose this as a preliminary condition to their continued assistance to UNRWA.

--------------------------–

[1] http://www.alquds.com/node/23120

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 10:22 pm ET

John,

Can you explain to me how would you like to see Palestinians living? I see that you care about the Palestinians... and you want them to live in Peace.... can you give me a visual? Lets assume for a second that Hamas decided to give up their weapons. What would be your next step?

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 10:24 pm ET

Now according to Nazi Dan,

UN organization is a terrorist organization. way to go...

Yeah we believe you.... did you graduate from Harvard?

Solomon   January 22nd, 2009 10:27 pm ET

the only way for George Mitchell to solve this problem is to tell Israel Enough.you have to give back occupied land all of it, remove the settlers all of them knock that wall down and build it on your side.

he should tell Israel for the first time in 61 years the Arabs in their peace initiative will recognize you as a state after all this is done..

this is the only way that Israel will have security and the Palestinians will have their state and security too.

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 10:37 pm ET

Ok Guy's,
If i am following this right what i see on the news, then the following has happened today in Gaza. Hamas is rebuilding the Tunnels and Israel has just retaliated. Now, a couple of day's after the cease fire are we back at it again. Israel has every right to defend itself. It was up to Hamas to stop it. So, in my view did Hamas not honor the cease fire. The boarders are open for Humanitarian convoy's to enter Gaza, so why is it necessary to rebuild the tunnels. Who wants peace and who wants war. It seems to be quite clear.

John   January 22nd, 2009 10:39 pm ET

If the militants gave up the violence and renounced terrorism and the destruction of Israel, the next step would be to invite all medias from around the world to spread the word that violence is not an option any more and good is the only way. Just think how much press this would get. Then it puts all the pressure on Israel to get this worked out, because #1, there is no excuse that they have to defend themselves from Jew hating militant factions. Plus it puts the world spotlight on the region of good, that is hopefully going to be changing. You invite different envoys from all over the world to come visit the Gaza strip and the West Bank and ask repeatedly for aid to help build a strong area that the whole world would be proud of. There are billions of dollars ready to flow to the Palestinians if the world knew the violence was not an option anymore. You could then start to get negotiations with Israel to get them to get out of any land that they are building settlements on, and a ton of other benefits that are owed to 1000's of Palestinians. It would be a slow process, but it can work. But you have to control the militants and not let them survive. We can keep going back to the past and rejecting any and all possibilities concerning Israel, but we have to move forward, make it a peaceful place, and then demand in front of the world for help and payback for all the atrocities committed by Israel and the militants. The world will see instantly what is going on in Palestine with all the media roaming around and seeking anything they can. Use it to call out to the world, and you will find that help will come from the most unexpected places. But the world isn't going to help if they know that violence is a possibility. You need Muslims, and Jews working together, which can and will happen. The world sees this and the area will be rewarded. Just think of the help the US would give the Palestinians if they would just renounce all violence and terrorism. It would be astronomical! Get on the bandwagon, the time is now! It can be done this way, unless the militant factions undermine it.

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 10:43 pm ET

Amen John,
You are right on.

Solomon   January 22nd, 2009 10:43 pm ET

peter .
1 nothing in the ceasefire that talks about tunnels.

2 Israeli ships were firing at Gaza yesterday was live on Aljazeera

3 Israel can not lie and make the world believe anymore Aljazeera is watching the whole time.

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 10:48 pm ET

Solomon,
They cease fire was broken just by the fact that Hamas is re-building the tunnels. Why is that necessary. Are there not other more importend things to do.

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 10:50 pm ET

Re-building the tunnels does not help 1.5 million people right now, but it gives the rest of the world the wrong impression.

Solomon   January 22nd, 2009 10:52 pm ET

peter
there is no smuggling tunnels in Gaza city Israeli ships were firing at people 5 people were wounded the shelling was live on Aljazeera.

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 10:52 pm ET

And sorry Solomon, but Al Jazeera to me is the same as Fox news. I do not trust neither.

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 10:55 pm ET

Ok, maybe i am wrong. Has anyone else heard or seen anything to set the record straight.

Solomon   January 22nd, 2009 10:56 pm ET

Peter.
you can not deny live pictures on the news.

another thing peter why should the Palestinians prove to the world that they are nice? why should not the occupying power show respect to international law?

Solomon   January 22nd, 2009 10:56 pm ET

be back soon.

Bill   January 22nd, 2009 11:00 pm ET

An interesting article claims the human losses from Operation Cast Lead were far less than reported:

In addition to reporting that no more than 500 or 600 Palestinians were killed in Gaza during the IDF operation, Cremonesi, who based his report on tours of hospitals in the Gaza Strip and on interviews with families of casualties, assessed the number of wounded to be far lower than 5,000, the number quoted by Hamas and repeated by the UN and the Red Cross in Gaza.

"It is sufficient to visit several hospitals [in the Gaza Strip] to understand that the numbers don't add up," he wrote.

In the European hospital in Rafah, one of the facilities which would presumably be filled with wounded from the "war of the tunnels," many beds were empty, according to Cremonesi. A similar situation was noted in the Nasser Hospital in Khan Younis, and in the privately-run Amal Hospital Cremonesi reported that only five out 150 beds were occupied.

Cremonesi interviewed Gazans who echoed Israel's insistence of how Hamas gunmen used civilians as human shields. One Gazan recalled civilians in Gaza shouting at Hamas and Islamic Jihad men, "Go away, go away from here! Do you want the Israelis to kill us all? Do you want our children to die under their bombs? Take your guns and missiles with you."

"Traitors, collaborators with Israel, spies of Fatah, cowards! The soldiers of the holy war will punish you. And in any case you will all die, like us. Fighting the Zionist Jews we are all destined for paradise. Do you not wish to die with us?" the religious fanatics of Hamas reportedly responded.

Other Palestinians told Cremonesi of Hamas operatives donning paramedic uniforms and commandeering ambulances. A woman identified as Um Abdullah, 48, spoke of Hamas using UN buildings as launch pads for rockets.

Cremonesi reported that he had difficultly gathering evidence as the local population was terrified of Hamas.

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 11:07 pm ET

Hi Bill,
Lets assume that this is right, and i don't doubt it.
Now is the time for Palestinians to stand up and trough there so called leaders out.

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 11:10 pm ET

Professor, com'on you know better. You know what the tunnels are for. Everone else seems to know.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 11:11 pm ET

I love the disinformation campaig.... hey guys the sky is really not blue.... The Israeli Minister of disinformation reported that the sky is really green.... And terrorists need to stop calling the sky is blue.... Otherwise The Israeli Occupying Forces reserve the right to retaliate.

Solomon   January 22nd, 2009 11:16 pm ET

peter
do you watch Aljazeera?

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 11:20 pm ET

Solomon,
I did in the past but i found them like fox, biased. So the answer to your question is no.

Solomon   January 22nd, 2009 11:22 pm ET

Times.

Backlash begins as Israel split over success of war in Gaza

A day after the last of their country's soldiers pulled out of the Gaza, Israelis are increasingly asking themselves just what they were fighting for.

The offensive enjoyed massive popular support while under way, but with the guns silent, scathing criticism is emerging from both the Left and the Right about the lack of any clear achievement, other than a huge Palestinian death toll and the damage to Israel’s international reputation.

The stated goal at the start of Operation Cast Lead was to end Hamas’s constant rocket fire on southern Israel. Like Hezbollah in the Lebanon war two years ago, Hamas kept on firing rockets until the end of the fighting, and is believed still to have about 1,000 missiles stockpiled, despite Israel’s devastating air strikes on its hidden arsenals.

Nick-Canada   January 22nd, 2009 11:24 pm ET

Prof
Tunnels are a problem for a lot of countries including the US, Mexicans have built underground tunnels into America as to get drugs, weapons and even people themselves into the US. Should Americans just not care about this and let it go on, big deal right professor its nothing Americans should worry about just like your saying Israelis should'nt worry about tunnels granting access to their country right? Sure no big deal let the mexicans in illegally, man why did'nt this guy run for president he sure is smart!

Solomon   January 22nd, 2009 11:29 pm ET

times

Many of the tunnels used for smuggling in arms under the Egypt-Gaza border carried on working even during the hostilities.

WOW. and Israel want to stop it now

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 11:32 pm ET

Nazi-Canada,

I don't see the US firing back and killing mexicans for digging tunnels. Would you like to see the US just shooting to kill Mexicans now? Why you hate their sombreros? They make them look like terrorists?

Solomon   January 22nd, 2009 11:32 pm ET

It is not Hamas.
It is not the tunnels.
it is not the rockets.
It is not terrorism.

It is occupation fools.

Bill   January 22nd, 2009 11:33 pm ET

It been documented time after time after time that Islamic terrorist societies exagerate their casualties (and even fake them), to garner support from a gullible and emotional world. This strategy only lasts for awhile until the world sees that the numbers don't add up, that the hospitals are not overflowing, and that the guys in the stretchers often get up and walk away after they think the cameras have been turned off.

The article I posted above is not surprising in any way. These lies are standard practice for this type of society. If there really are 1500 dead and 5000 injured, where is the list of the 1500 dead? If 5000 people are wounded, why is there so much empty space in the hospitals the reporter visited? Simple questions. Simple conclusion.

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 11:33 pm ET

And there is the reason why hostilities will not stop. Hamas smuggles weapons and Israel want's to stop it. The easiest way to stop any retaliation from Israel is to stop smuggling weapons. This is not to hard to comprehend, is it ?

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 11:37 pm ET

Solomon,
Israel pulled out of Gaza in 2005.
What occupation are you taking about.

mohammed gharbawi   January 22nd, 2009 11:38 pm ET

"I have chiefly had men's views confided to me privately. Some of the biggest men in the U.S., in the field of commerce and manufacturing, are afraid of something. They know that there is a power somewhere so organized, so subtle, so watchful, so interlocked, so complete, so pervasive, that they had better not speak above their breath when they speak in condemnation of it." The New Freedom. Woodrow Wilson, 1913
What was this power to which Wilson referred? Why was it talked about in hushed tones and behind closed doors?

Jews have played an important role in this duping drama and yet, the average Jew remains ignorant of what is transpiring. The average Jew has been effectively brainwashed by cries of anti-Semitism and pictures of the Jewish Holocaust The average Jew lives in a state of fear and anxiety and feels a part of the victim class. No matter how much power is amassed, the average Jew feels one step away from extinction. There is always a threat hanging over his head. Another swastika appears on a Synagogue. Another "suicide bomber" manages to get through the labyrinth of checkpoints in Israel. (if you know anything about the checkpoints, you will find this a bit difficult to believe ) Well placed occurrences keep the average Jew vulnerable to this "power." And what is this power? ZIONISM.

mohammed gharbawi   January 22nd, 2009 11:39 pm ET

Zionism is a political movement that arose in the latter part of the 1800's. Initially it referred to the effort of certain Jewish people to establish a Jewish nation in the land of Palestine. But that term has changed over the years. Today it applies to those who want to expand the borders of what was already established. It refers to those who think nothing of putting their own interests ahead of the interests of any nation in which they reside. It refers to those who will sacrifice anyone, Jews and Gentiles alike, to realize their goals.

John   January 22nd, 2009 11:40 pm ET

The idea that the Israeli and Palestinian people are truly separate, or have separate needs, is simply a lie of the mortal mind. Spiritually, we are all one. Israelis and Palestinians were created by the same God; in Him they are equal and they are joined eternally. Only thought forms have separated them. Thought forms of guilt and separation have been handed down to children born innocent of such lies, generation after generation; those are the true enemy here, not either group of people.

As any of us move beyond the fear-based thought forms of separation and guilt to the truth of our eternal oneness, it becomes easier for everyone else to do so as well. Let's give up the way-too-easy, so-American way of chiding either Israelis or Palestinians for their difficulty in forgiving the past. What both peoples have endured is almost unimaginable, and only the truly sainted among us should even for a minute consider judging either side.

We don't have to; and when in our own right minds, we don't want to.

Use the power of your mind to create a new possibility… a miracle in the Middle East.

As the poet Rumi wrote so eloquently, “Out beyond all ideas of right and wrong, there is a field. I'll meet you there.” So go there now. Such thoughts are not just poetry, or even symbol, any longer. In the world that's being born, they're the stuff of a new politics.

No more simply asking, “But what can I do?” Go even further, to “What can I think? What can I pray for? What can I meditate on?” Pray for the removal of all walls that separate any of us from any of us, not only on our earth but also in our minds. Pray for the removal of the guns that still fire within your own mind as you accuse or withhold your forgiveness from anyone. And pray that at this perilous hour, those of us whose lives have not been touched by the horrors of war can be of service to those whose lives have been.

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 11:41 pm ET

Look who is back

mohammed gharbawi   January 22nd, 2009 11:42 pm ET

It is a grave mistake to believe that all Jews are supporters of Zionism. There have been many vocal critics as well as some who have, for reasons of fear and intimidation, not been as vocal. I will mention some of these courageous voices and my apologies to those I omit. Anti-Zionist writers such as John Sack, Alfred Lilienthal, Benjamin Freedman, Israel Shamir, Israel Shahack, Norman Finkelstein, Henry Makow, Ralph Schoenman, Lenni Brenner, Victor Ostrovsky, Henry Meyer and Jack Bernstein are only of few of this group. These man have dared to speak out and have, as a result, been forced to suffer vicious attacks from groups like the "Anti-Defamation League" (ADL). Despite its appealing name, this group specializes in slander and defamation.

Solomon   January 22nd, 2009 11:44 pm ET

peter
Israel did not move out of Gaza and out of the west bank and you know it

it is occupation and nothing else.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 11:44 pm ET

John,

Would you accept for Palestinians Christians and Muslims to live together with Jews in one country called Israltine.... or Palesrael?....

Having equal rights and freedoms?

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 11:46 pm ET

Come on lets take a vote.... Who is for it and who is against it.

John   January 22nd, 2009 11:47 pm ET

I would accept all of them living together, yes. What to call it, I really don't care. But yes, they all should have equal rights and freedoms.

As Americans, we have a creed - a set of principles enshrined and institutionalized in our founding documents. First and foremost among them is that “all men are created equal.” Period. End of story. Don't be lured into thinking that either Israelis or Palestinians have been either the perfect innocents or the perfect victims here; such thinking serves neither. The greatest gift you can give to both is to realize that on a spiritual level, Israelis and Palestinians are one. Their only true reality is the reality of whom they are in this moment, freed from any thoughts of the past.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 11:47 pm ET

Don't coward now...

mohammed gharbawi   January 22nd, 2009 11:48 pm ET

Author Jack Bernstein stated:

"I am well aware of the tactics YOU, my Zionist brethren, use to quiet anyone who attempts to expose any of your subversive acts. If the person is gentile, you cry "you're anti-Semitic," which is nothing more than a smokescreen to hide your actions. But if a Jew is the person doing the exposing, you resort to other tactics:

First, you ignore the charges, hoping the information will not be given widespread distribution. It the information starts reacting too many people, you ridicule the information and the person giving the information. If that doesn't work, your next step is character assassination. If the author or speaker hasn't been involved in sufficient scandal, you are adept at fabricating a scandal against the person or persons. If none of these are effective, you are known to resort to physical attacks. But NEVER do you try to prove the information wrong. " (from The Life Of An American Jew in Racist-Marxist Israel. By Jack Bernstein, 1984)

mohammed gharbawi   January 22nd, 2009 11:49 pm ET

The Nuturei Karta is the name given to a group of Orthodox Jews in Jerusalem who refuse to recognize the existence or authority of the so-called "State of Israel" In their literature they write:

"Zionist propagandists are always given to bullying tactics and censorship. It is very helpful in this regard to read former Congressman Findley's book, They Dared to Speak Out. It is the sorry record of the immense resources that the Zionist lobby invested in destroying the careers of politicians all across the United States who had voiced some qualms about this nation's subservience to Israel.

mohammed gharbawi   January 22nd, 2009 11:51 pm ET

Of course, anti-Zionist Jews of all political and religious orientations have long experienced the lash of the Zionist movement. In 1924, a scholarly Dutch Jew, Dr. Jacob Israel de Hahn, who functioned as a secretary of Rabbi Yosef Chaim Sonnenfeld (1849 – 1932 ) Chief Rabbi of Palestine, (may their memories be blessed) was murdered as he returned from evening prayers outside Shaarui Zedek hospital in Jerusalem. His crime was that he had been involved in discussions with Arab leaders that offered an alternative to Zionist hegemony. His murderers were members of the Haganah, a Zionist, so – called "defense organization." In fact, Dr. de Hahn may well be described as the first victim of Zionist violence in the Holy Land. Yet, outside of a limited circle of anti – Zionist Jews, this cowardly and cold blooded murder is completely unknown"

Peter   January 22nd, 2009 11:52 pm ET

It is alway's the same people on this Blog. And luckily for the world, Israel and Palestinians are we a minority. And i am glad that is so. At least there is still hope for peace, then neither of any of us matter in the big picture. Luckily there are wiser Man or Woman than the few of us.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 11:52 pm ET

Cool John... we can shake hand on this.... Let us push our government... Our newly elected President to push for a one state solution.... Break all the borders and put pressure on both Israel and Hamas to accept it.... by the end of this year.

Between now and then Israel should remove all the checkpoints.... all the military should be guarding the new country borders so it should move away from Gaza and the west bank.... Allow Palestinians to enter democratic elections and be part of the society.

John   January 22nd, 2009 11:52 pm ET

For all our talk about wanting to be the change, how many of us are siding now against one side or the other in the current Mid-East conflict? If you really want to help the situation there, ask God to remove from your heart any judgment you have against the Israelis or the Palestinians. Any thought of judgment you hold is like a gun that you yourself are firing.

Professor   January 22nd, 2009 11:54 pm ET

Peter, do go beating around the Bushes and answer the question.... :)

mohammed gharbawi   January 22nd, 2009 11:55 pm ET

the fate of colonization: loss.

John   January 22nd, 2009 11:59 pm ET

I am all for it Professor. We see it, now we have to somehow show the Palestinians and the Israelis. But I do see one or both not accepting that deal right at this moment. That is why I am wanting the Palestinians to reject any violence or terrorism or the destruction of Israel. It has to start somewhere, and the Palestinians need to do it, and now. It has to start from within, to take away the threats to Israel so they can't use that as the excuse not to get things settled.

We must mature beyond the belief that the thinking that got us into this mess is thinking can lead us out of it. “The problems of the world will not be solved on the level of thinking we were at when we created them,” Einstein wrote. We must realize that the mortal ego will not provide us with a solution to the existence of war, because it itself is the problem. Notions such as, “The Israelis have a right to defend themselves,” and “The Palestinians have taken so much abuse; what do you expect them to do?” are both insidious drivers of war masquerading as principled stands. They keep us attached to the very duality that is the root of separation and war.

Solomon   January 23rd, 2009 12:01 am ET

U.N. investigator sees evidence of war crimes in Gaza
Thu Jan 22, 2009

By Jonathan Lynn

GENEVA (Reuters) – There is evidence that Israel committed war crimes during its 22-day campaign in the Gaza Strip and there should be an independent inquiry, U.N. investigator Richard Falk said on Thursday.

The mental anguish of the civilians who suffered the assault is so great that the entire population of Gaza could be seen as casualties, said Falk, U.N. special rapporteur on human rights in the occupied West Bank and Gaza Strip.

Falk, speaking by phone from his home in California, said compelling evidence that Israel's actions in Gaza violated international humanitarian law required an independent investigation into whether they amounted to war crimes.

Peter   January 23rd, 2009 12:03 am ET

Yes Professor
I am all for it.

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 12:03 am ET

folks

if you want to know about the present of israel , read about its past, a past written by the honest jews and not the zionists whose hands are staines with the blood of new-borns. I have a full collection of references (primary and secondary sources) ranging from articles in periodicals (journals, reviews, newspapers, magazines) , books, and online references too. once you read this material you get shocked by the degree of the evil of zionism and the proportion of the bad luck of palestinians. Believe me my friends: israel is anation that has caused enormous tragedies to humanity and it will cause more.what we have seen is just another episode of the drama that was illustrated in diir yassine and sabra and shatilla, etc........

Bill   January 23rd, 2009 12:04 am ET

Professor – Did Moon say that 1500 Palestinians were killed? Do you have a reference? Do you have their names? What about the 5000 wounded that don't appear to be there? Where did they go?

The WP shells were used for illumination and for smoke screens. Such use is permitted under international conventions.

Whose lying now, Gilligan? Same old Muslim lies. Different day.

You make claims. You have no proof. You attempt to change the subject. Standard propaganda for people who never have respected the truth until it explodes on top of them.

Professor   January 23rd, 2009 12:05 am ET

John,

Neither side is going to accept it but the US can use its influence on Israel to accept it and it can pressure the Arab countried to use their influence on the Palestinians to accept it.... But we need to sell it to our administration.

You cannot just ask the Palestinians to do something.... If you are going to wait for the Palestinians to do something or for the Israelis to do something... then nothing is gonna get done.

We need to push our President to stop the Aid to Israel unless it accepts this deal and threaten Egypt and Jordan that they will loose their Aid unless they pressure the Palestinians... The minute you announce that Palestinians can move back to their homes and lands.... you will not see one Palestinian raising a gun or a stone.

Professor   January 23rd, 2009 12:07 am ET

Peter, welcome to the change team. :)

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 12:09 am ET

professor
these people have been trained to argue and convince you that you are wrong. they are not intuitive as we are. you proposed the one state solution right now and they will agree, but at thr practical , its another story.
for zionists, arabs are a nightmarebecause they stand as a stumbling block in the face of their expansionist policy. they were aiming to colonize egypt; now, all they want is the land they colonized in 1948 and 1967 and further land where to settle more jews and all jerusalem , and.............and............................

John   January 23rd, 2009 12:11 am ET

Professor, that sounds pretty good. We are getting somewhere. I agree with the aid not being released unless good things happen. Good point! But it will be hard to get Israel to open up if it still has a threat to their existence. Plus, I bet the new administration won't blackmail Israel. So I am still going with the Palestinians getting the militant to stop all violence and terrorism and the destruction of Israel. The militants can't win in any type war or ongoing terrorism against Israel. It isn't going to happen with the big brother watching over them. So it stills goes back to the Palestinians to get this jump started. The Palestinians getting all militants under control and renouncing violence will work! Guaranteed!

Professor   January 23rd, 2009 12:12 am ET

Mohammed,

Anyone who does not accpet the single state solution proves the recist charachterstic of the State of Israel (for Jews only).

So far I only heard from John and Peter....

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 12:15 am ET

professor
one of the tactics they use is their total ignorave to what you say if they feel that what you say is relevant, true, and verifiable.

Another tactic is their transformation into bashers to distract you from real issues.

further tactics include seeking your sympathy about some points, using leaps of logic like the either or fallacy:
either you are with us or with binladen .................etc....etc.

they may fool illiterate people in america, but not us.

its the occupation stupid.

Professor   January 23rd, 2009 12:17 am ET

John,

I sense you are back paddling.... The pressure has to be on both side to accpet it.... I guarantee you the home made rockets are no threat to the existence of Israel.... And when you have one state... no one is occupying no one... then any citizen of that country acting to kill another citizen of that country is simply a criminal and you can send him to court and prison for his criminal act.... its not an occupation resistance anymore... right?

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 12:18 am ET

professor

frankly, can you believe that the kind of people who kills in the way we saw last week are going to sign any kind of peace treaty.
they have colonised a land, and they intend to stay there.

Solomon   January 23rd, 2009 12:20 am ET

that was Quick.
the American navy stopped a ship carrying arms to Hamas.

the Israeli source said that the American navy is watching the Indian ocean, the Arabian sea,the red sea,and the Mediterranean sea. but it did not say when and where the ship was seized.

they are also watching the Atlantic ocean and the pacific ocean.

Wow I did not know that Hamas is that Important.

Professor   January 23rd, 2009 12:21 am ET

Mohammed,

I really do not believe that they would but the US can make them do it.... and that goes to both sides just like what happened in South Africa.

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 12:23 am ET

professor
out of experience, when someone tells me forget about history, and think about the future, i begin to doubt his intentions.

In fact, zionists belong to a very different species so much so that even american congressmen are afraid of them; why? READ THE QUOTATION ABOVE.

Peter   January 23rd, 2009 12:26 am ET

Mohammed,
You are nothing but a little bug who should be stepped on and killed. You don't belong on this blog. People told you before, go away. We finally have a conversation going with different but positive and intelligent views.We all know that we don't see it everyones way and we at least respect each other. Go back to previous blogs and see how much progress has been made. There are almost no more insults, but discussions with different views. So, please go away or behave civilized.

Professor   January 23rd, 2009 12:27 am ET

Mohammed,

Read Paul Findley (ex congressman from IL.) books it will explain to you why they are really afraid of them.... He has three books on the subject.... very good insight.

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 12:29 am ET

SOLOMON
israel has a wild imagination. when its attacked by the whole world, it will respond by a package of systematic and planned lies.this is what we call situational irony: it will make you (the recipient) believe that gazza is russia .unfortunately, in europe and the states, they will believe these lies.why? BECAUSE OF THE LOBBY.

Professor   January 23rd, 2009 12:33 am ET

Delibrate deceptions...
They dare to speak out...
Silent no more...
Are the three books.... in case you have not read them yet.

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 12:35 am ET

Peter January 23rd, 2009 026 GMT

Mohammed,
You are nothing but a little bug who should be stepped on and killed. You don’t belong on this blog. People told you before, go away. We finally have a conversation going with different but positive and intelligent views.We all know that we don’t see it everyones way and we at least respect each other. Go back to previous blogs and see how much progress has been made. There are almost no more insults, but discussions with different views. So, please go away or behave civilized.
***************************************************************************
this is the tactic im talking about; this is a perfect illustration of the zionist blocker.
He will try to hypnotize you; if you resist , he will try to show that you are an enemy and that even your community should let you down (the same tactic has been done with Mashaal and hamas, but it did not work).

This is stimulating and fascinating; this is what we call in french "un cas d'ecole".

its the occupation stupid"
with courtesy from my friend Professor.

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 12:37 am ET

Akiva Heifetz

you are right.

Akiva Heifetz   January 23rd, 2009 12:45 am ET

CNN
your own propaganda was very crap!
it was very clear your not neutral!
shame
you did allways try what we eat ... what a crap

it was great to see today how you try to repare your face!
it was nice how you did discover a littlebit of the israel propaganda today
as this blogger story today ;)

its no problem to see how you try to save your self now :)
your a 10000 times better propaganda machine then israel ever got
but dont compare your self with israel or who ever
its still a foolish istiot propaganda machine :))

how can you think that people are so stupid?
not only in the case of gaza ... also before and soure also in future ;p

go on and fix your face :)
israel is game over
discover now more of the israel lies ... it will make you more sympatic ... maybe not more trustfull ... but it will be comedy and it will make you symphatic ;)

and now after all is over ... do a youtube site as alJazera and put up your stream now again :))

Peter   January 23rd, 2009 12:45 am ET

Mohammed,
Please grow up.
The Professor can speak for himself.
Like i said before, a lot of people have changed in there tone, and that is good.
We all know that we are having our own strong points of view, but we are trying to find out what we have in common, not what separates us.
At least we are now civilized, and that by itself is progress.
So, again go away you little bug.

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 12:55 am ET

Peter
give me your email and ill send you lessons about discourse analysis and communicative strategies.

you are pathetic .Are you a zionist? AS FAR AS I KNOW YOU ARE INTELLIGENT. YOU DECEIVE YOUR ANIMAL FAMILY.

Akiva Heifetz   January 23rd, 2009 12:57 am ET

what can we learn ?

the truth is at the side of the winners!

if people come together in the name of truth they get power
power wich no one can supress
not with highTec weapons .. not with propaganda

and the liars will lose

history knows it
now the present knows it

let us hope the future will know it withou need of a new war!

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 12:58 am ET

peter
dont like yourself that much; this is a sort of structural ambiguity here; i mean you are not intelligent but zionists are, in an evil way ,though.

Peter   January 23rd, 2009 12:59 am ET

Mohammed,
There is no reason for me to comment. Your response is self explanatory to all who are reading this blog, and further shows your intelligence. Keep it up, for the majority of the people on this blog have figured you out a long time ago. I know that you are frustrated. Ask yourself one question, who is responding to your blogs. Yes, you are right.........No One

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 1:03 am ET

Peter January 23rd, 2009 045 GMT

Mohammed,
Please grow up.
***************************************************************************
Can you believe this?See what peter the liar is saying : grow up.
In the arab country where i proudly live, they say, "those who really dont know you loose you".
lol

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 1:08 am ET

Peter
once i show up , your dear zionists suddenly disappear. YOU know why?
i ifgure you already do.

As far as my frieds here are concerned, we really appreciate your logic, your way of discussing..........all in all, this is the rhetoric of occupation.
My main aim, and i do it in other blogs, is to show who you reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaly are.
full stop.

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 1:17 am ET

sure,, you are absolutely right.

Roscoe   January 23rd, 2009 1:18 am ET

I've been away for a couple of hours so i am just now catching up on your conversations. I see some of you would push for a single state solution to this issue. It might be OK!

But I'll ask-- have any of you seen the announcement speeches today of George Mitchell' Did you listen to what Obama, Hillary and Mitchell had to say about their positions and the intended direction in the pusuit of a permanent solution to the Palestinian/Israeli conflict??

Akiva Heifetz   January 23rd, 2009 1:19 am ET

let us bring israel now to den haag ;)
http://www.icj-cij.org/
invest your time into the future ;)

Peter   January 23rd, 2009 1:27 am ET

They num nuts are getting frustrated. Nobody is writing back. boooooooooh

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 1:29 am ET

concerning the latest news Hala, spies are the persons behind the killing of Dr sentissi, yassine, and others. you know , this is a bit too local for you in the US but in gazza, we feel those who want us to be wiped from the map as you usually inform your audience..
anyway i think CNN can do better. if you have any pressure from a superior authority, just resign. Hala, we live only once; we dont have time for hypocricy and fear.
if this land belogs to zionists ,then they take it all; why will have to split it?
history ,documents, witnesses (from jews themselves) are against this massacre.
Hala, play a role in humanity .(refer back to history in a full documentation and you ll have satisfying results if you want to rest in peace).

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 1:36 am ET

Peter
i dont need zionists writing back because i show their weaknesses minute by minute. the only animal who can face me is the one who does not think :its the liar peter. fro you , even taliking to me is avictory.
good to you.keep on
sleep on this blog.lol

CS   January 23rd, 2009 1:38 am ET

I would like to see a one state solution to this issue, because both sides deserve to exist. God put every person here for a reason. No life is created by the great God, by accident.

A way to move forward would be as Professor said earlier; Both sides liveng intermingled. Now everyone would have a steak in his/her surroundings, therefore would be less likely to destroy it.

And the practice of loving thy neighbor as thy self, is strongly suggested. There have been many things done wrong by both sides, and I do sympathize with Palestine, as they are the ones outmatched, and being opressed.
However, this is water under the bridge. What is past is past. There must be a starting point if peace is to be achieved. We cannot continue going into the past.

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 1:40 am ET

Peter January 23rd, 2009 059 GMT

Mohammed,
There is no reason for me to comment. Your response is self explanatory to all who are reading this blog, and further shows your intelligence. Keep it up, for the majority of the people on this blog have figured you out a long time ago. I know that you are frustrated. Ask yourself one question, who is responding to your blogs. Yes, you are right………No One
************************************************************************

let me correct you. no zionist can reply.
you know why?
BECAUSE they realized that they fol countries and they dont want to be unveiled.
Anyway once a terrorist , always a terrorist.

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 1:43 am ET

CS
I m usually polite, but let me ask you who are you?

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 1:45 am ET

cs
may be im wrong, but i feel you are zionist who has been allocate a role in your black comedy; am i right?

CS   January 23rd, 2009 1:46 am ET

Akiva. I agree that news media in general needs to step up and tell things the way that they are, and not the way those with the money want it to be told. It is a little strange to me that you complain about CNN, but here you are on their blog.
Which brings me to my next point. People seem to want to place ALL the blame on America for what is occurring, without accepting some blame themselves. If America is so bad, why do you know English so well? Why are you so well versed in American culture? Why are you on an American blog? Surely there are arab/israelis, and other blogs, and media sources. If it is so terrible here, than leave. Nobody forces you to be here.
I have no problem telling the truth about my country's past, good or bad. I will admit fault when it is mine. But I will not take the blame for every shortcoming through the ages.

Some people need to Man -up, and handle their buisiness, instead of always pointing the finger. When you point a finger at someone else, there are 3 more pointing right back to you.

Peter   January 23rd, 2009 1:47 am ET

Well said Mohammed,
Once a terrorist alway's a terrorist.
But we knew that already for a long time. But i guess it took courage for you to admit that you are one,

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 1:48 am ET

cs
show me the mechanisms that will impleùent these dreams.

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 1:53 am ET

Peter
i suggest you sleep .as far as im concerned you only waste my time. next time ill ignore you. you know why? BECAUSE WHEN YOUR ZIONIST MOTHER TOLD YOU TO STUDY YOU USED TO WASTE TIME ON MASTURBATING. GOOD FOR YOU NOW.SLEEP WHEREAS AN ARAB IS WHIPPING YOUR ASS. ITS HECTIC RED FROM WHAT I SEE .HAHAHAHAAHHA

Peter   January 23rd, 2009 1:53 am ET

CS
In Mohammed's view, everyone is either a terrorist or Zionist if he does not agree with him. And i agree with you, why does he not you to some Arab Web site to spew his poison. Makes one wonder.

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 1:56 am ET

cs
too many questions; but sorry my friend, their answers are all against you.

CS   January 23rd, 2009 1:57 am ET

First of all Mohammed the angry, I am no zionist. I am a Christian. I do not pacify any group. If I see wrong, I caal it what it is. If I see right, I call it what it is. I'm not so blinded by hate that I will stand by and watch my brother sin without rebuke, just cause he's my brother. Some people make excuses for their bretheren. This is called enabling. I don't do this.
And as I said before. My brothers are Muslim, Christian, and Jew alike. But since you decide to bring race to the issue, I see you must be cut off. Just as it says in the bible about the lawless son. If he keeps a stiff neck, and refuses to do right by God, and the tribe, than he must be cut off. It actually say to stone him, so that he will not influence the rest of the group.

I'm sorry that we are probably both brown skinned, but you must bring race to the discussion, just because I have a different view than you.

We have agreed on the mistreatment of Palestine, and the history of the conflict. We differ in how to approach it. But no matter. I'm not here for you. I'm here to push for justice, and fairness, and peace for Palestine. I you don't like my position on things, that's fine. You're nothing anyway.

Peter   January 23rd, 2009 1:58 am ET

Mohammed,
You are childish, ignorant and stupid. You will alway's post a reply back, because otherwise would you be all alone. Ask yourself what people think when they see your responses. Is this how a mature adult writes.

CS   January 23rd, 2009 2:00 am ET

Peter. We may not agree on many things, but we can agree that Mo can't even answer a few questions. He just want's to stir anger, hate, and not be constructive to the issue at hand. Shot attention span to have to say "Too many questions"

No wonder he is not the leader he thinks he should be. Very critical of Obama, and others, but can't even answer a few simple questions.

Akiva Heifetz   January 23rd, 2009 2:02 am ET

CS

if i speak to CNN
do you think i better sould do it in a hiden russian or chinese blog?

sorry that i tell things directly to those people who it is addressed to

do you think english is only spoken in USA ?????
so learn about the history of USA and where the english people in USA did came from to occupie the country of native americans ;)
why i am versed in america stuff ... its not your problem ;p
but watch out i tell you :))
i did life in USA as little child and did learn to write the alphabeth with the smurf comix in texas ... so i can understand that your a bit like bush
happly i got also some real education :)
and there are moe reason but i dont wanna make it to complexe for you ;p

your so clever i dont wanna waste your time ;)

Peter   January 23rd, 2009 2:02 am ET

Mohammed
Do you have any idea of how many people are reading this blog as you and i write. Do you really believe that we are they only ones on her.
People are just fed-up. They want an intelligent conversation, so please, i ask you again. Go away you little Bug.

CS   January 23rd, 2009 2:07 am ET

So peter, what do you think of President's adress today?

Peter   January 23rd, 2009 2:11 am ET

Cs
Whoever and whatever you are.
There are a lot of good points that you make.
Foremost, you are for peace.
You do not want killing and suffering.
So, i think we have lots in common.
I agree with you, that race, religion, and color are irrelevant, we are all Human beings.

CS   January 23rd, 2009 2:12 am ET

All I'm saying is simple. If you have such a problem with CNN, Go someplace else.

If you Hate America, don't concern yourself with learning about America in any way. That's all. :D :)) :) :8

CS   January 23rd, 2009 2:16 am ET

Peter. I think that what Obama said today was good. I just wish there could be a little more emphasis put on Israel to have something to do with lasting peace, as well as Palestine. But we'll have to give him time, and see what he does. So far, he has done more to unite people, and stop torture in 3 days than Bush has done in 8 years, so I gues that's a pretty good start.

Peter   January 23rd, 2009 2:17 am ET

Mohammed
I am happy for you that you have a 10 year old Son.
Now do me a personal favor and go play with him.
You little bug.

Peter   January 23rd, 2009 2:23 am ET

CS
Obama reminds me a lot of President Kennedy.
He is sincere and i can visualize good things happening.
I believe he is open minded and look at the world in a different perspective than Bush. I am glad the Bush years are behind us. A new start is long overdue. I prey for him, and i hope that he can bring peace to all of us.

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 2:26 am ET

Peter January 23rd, 2009 223 GMT

CS
Obama reminds me a lot of President Kennedy.
He is sincere and i can visualize good things happening.
I believe he is open minded and look at the world in a different perspective than Bush. I am glad the Bush years are behind us. A new start is long overdue. I prey for him, and i hope that he can bring peace to all of us
µµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµµ
A typical zionist answer.
they used to support bush ; now they suppot obama.
this is funny.

CS   January 23rd, 2009 2:34 am ET

Peter, Professor, Hunk, and all other rational people. I have figured out the playbook to getting Israel and Palestine to get along. Make them both madd at America :) Sometimes it's best just to let you geniouses ramble.

Peter   January 23rd, 2009 2:38 am ET

Well Mohammed,
I feel sad for anyone who gets killed.
But if your Son is anything like you and just as twisted, then i will shot him myself. Any other question you little rat.

Peter   January 23rd, 2009 2:41 am ET

Get a spell checker Guy's.

CS   January 23rd, 2009 2:41 am ET

Mohammed, I was almost your father, but the line was too long. Had other things to do but bang your sorry mother.

It's so funny to watch Mohammed try so hard to try to fight with people. First he challenges Peter, and when Peter ignores him, he tries to bring it to me. Thank God you don't represent all Muslims, because you just wanna fight with anybody for any reason. Many Americans see all Muslims as angry war making people. I'm glad I'm not hateful enough to think like this. So no matter how much you hurl corny little insults, and make gay little emotional outbursts, you wont get me to hat all Muslims, just so you can have somebody to fight. The way you talk, I can tell you're a little pussy anyway. Why even bother waisting time with you?

CS   January 23rd, 2009 2:47 am ET

Peter. Did she just say "WISIT" What the hell is wisit? I know what visit is, but "wisit" wow. Really smart.

mohammed gharbawi   January 23rd, 2009 2:47 am ET

cs
have you read anything before?
SOMETHING ABOUT ORIENTALISM.

You talk about america as if its the source of knowledge.this is toooooooooooooooo narrow-minded for my taste.
be more universal and youll gain more notions. dont be so limited to the canon.

Peter   January 23rd, 2009 2:50 am ET

CS
I should not be laughing, but you brought tears to my eyes with your response to Mohammed. I love you Man. I don't know what you are nor do i want to be presumtious. If you are Muslim, Palestinian or Arab, you are a fine Man. We need more like you.

Peter   January 23rd, 2009 2:56 am ET

CS
I am signing off.
Let the kids play by them self.
I hope to see you tomorrow.
Have a good night.

Bill   January 23rd, 2009 4:22 am ET

Same Islamic terrorists. Different Day.

On Wednesday night, CBS News reported that the US Navy had intercepted an Iranian ship in the Red Sea carrying arms allegedly on their way to Gaza. Israel is concerned that Iran will try to transfer long-range Fajr missiles to Hamas capable of hitting Tel Aviv.

Also on Wednesday, Hamas commandeered the trucks carrying humanitarian supplies into the Gaza Strip as part of its effort to show that it is providing for the Palestinian people.

Defense officials told The Jerusalem Post on Thursday that Hamas had also taken over a mental hospital in Gaza City and had kicked out the patients to use the facility as a jail for Fatah supporters.

The officials said Hamas was concerned that Fatah would try to take advantage of its weakened state and attempt to take back control over Gaza. During Operation Cast Lead, Hamas imposed curfews on predominantly Fatah neighborhoods and executed any Fatah member seen on the street.

open your eyes   January 23rd, 2009 5:11 am ET

Israelis are very lucky, that the Palestinians are not Irish.
The Israelis can attack and kill civilians only because that is tolerated by USA.

Bill   January 23rd, 2009 6:14 am ET

So far only the Palestinian Center for Human Rights (PCHR) and Italian journalist Lorenzo Cremonesi have publicly attempted to verify the death count on their own, with vastly differing results.

On Thursday, Cremonesi published an article in the Italian paper Corriere della Sera, in which he claimed that the Palestinians had distorted their claims, much like in past incidents.

He quoted a doctor at Gaza City's main Shifa Hospital who said no more than 500 or 600 could have been killed in the IDF attacks, and that most were men between 17 and 23 recruited to Hamas's ranks.

Cremonesi, who based his report on tours of hospitals in the Gaza Strip and on interviews with families of casualties, also assessed the number of wounded to be far lower than 5,300, the number quoted by Hamas and repeated by the UN and the Red Cross in Gaza.

"It is sufficient to visit several hospitals [in Gaza] to understand that the numbers don't add up," he wrote.

In the European Hospital in Gazan Rafah, one of the facilities that would presumably be filled with wounded from the "war of the tunnels," many beds were empty, according to Cremonesi.

A similar situation was noted in the Nasser Hospital in Khan Yunis, and in the privately-run Amal Hospital, where Cremonesi reported that only five out 150 beds were occupied.

He noted that in past instances, such as in Jenin during Israel's Operation Defensive Shield in 2002, there was initially talk of 1,500 dead, which ended up being whittled down to 54, of whom 45 were gunmen.

The IDF's Gaza Coordination and Liaison Administration has compiled a list with 900 names of Palestinians killed during the operation, out of which 750, it says, are believed to be Hamas operatives.

IDF estimates are that two-thirds of all those killed were gunmen affiliated with Hamas, Islamic Jihad and other Palestinian terror factions.

Hamas deliberately played down the number of its dead and on Sunday claimed that only 48 members of its military wing had been killed, defense officials said. Many bodies belonging to Hamas operatives were being stored in the morgue in Shifa Hospital, the officials added.

They said the vast majority of the Hamas operatives killed were not wearing uniforms, to disguise their affiliation, another reason for the exaggerated estimate of civilian casualties cited by the United Nations and others.

dan perman   January 23rd, 2009 6:18 am ET

The Connection between UNRWA and the Palestinian Terror Organizations in the Gaza Strip
14/01/2009

In recent years a vast amount of information has accumulated regarding the gradual takeover of UNRWA (United Nations Relief and Works Agency), the UN relief agency for the Palestinian refugees, by Hamas and other Palestinian terror organizations. Awad al-Kik, a teacher at the UNRWA school, who served simultaneously as the head of the engineering and weapons manufacture unit of Islamic Jihad serves as a prominent example.[1]

It has long been known that UNRWA and the Palestinian leadership are contributing to the perpetuation of the refugee problem and the attendant misery of the refugees. It has been noted that despite the fact that Israel in August 2005 retreated from the Gaza strip, the Palestinian Authority, and presently the Hamas government, did not lift a finger to rehabilitate the Palestinian refugee camps.

The reverse is true: the Palestinian leadership made it crystal clear that the government of the Palestinian Authority would not settle the refugees in the areas of the settlements that had been evacuated. This was done so in order to preserve their "right of return".

This argument is completely disingenuous, because an amelioration of the refugees' conditions does not weaken the demand for return or compensation in any shape or manner. It would appear that the interests of the Hamas government and UNRWA dovetail on this matter, namely preventing the dismantlement of the refugee camps, despite the severe privation existing there that promotes extremism, in order to nurture the dream of a return to Palestine, which means Israel.

In recent years a vast amount of information has accumulated regarding the gradual takeover of UNRWA by Hamas and other Palestinian terror organizations. In elections for the UNRWA employees Association on June 14, 2006, Hamas representatives won a resounding victory. Hamas took all 11 seats on the Association allotted to representatives of the 7000 teachers in UNRRA, all 9 of the seats allotted the service sector in UNRWA (physicians, engineers, pharmacists and nurses) and 3 out of the 7 seats allotted the balance of UNRWA employees.

Following the military coup during which Hamas seized power in the Gaza strip (June 2007), there were reports, including from Palestinian human rights organizations, to the effect that armed forces of the Hamas government had taken over institutions belonging to UNRWA in the Gaza Strip and had even housed forces of the Al-Qassam, Brigades, the Hamas military wing, in some of the buildings. Parents of students learning in the UNRWA schools sent a letter to a senior official in UNRWA where they claimed that thousands of teachers belonging to the Al-Qassam brigades were teaching in a UN agency's school. They demanded that an emergency investigation be conducted on the matter.

One of the striking examples illustrating that UNRWA has become a hospitable organisation for Palestinian terror organisations was unveiled during the attack by the Israeli Air Force that targeted a weapons manufacture workshop in Rafah. Among those Killed in the attack was Awad al-Kik (Abu Mohammed), a teacher, educator and UNRRA school principal in Rafah who simultaneously served as the head of Islamic Jihad's engineering and weapons manufacture unit in the southern Gaza strip.

Al-Kik was born in the Jebalya refugee camp and lived in the Rafah refugee camp. He studied at UNRWA schools and excelled in chemistry and physics. After he had completed his academic studies at Al-Azhar University, Al-Kik began a teaching career at the UNRWA schools and rapidly ascended the professional ladder. At a relatively young age he was appointed vice principal of the Ibn Sina elementary school and was subsequently chosen by UNRWA to serve as principal of junior high school "E" until he was killed in an Israeli air force attack.

Already as a high school student, al-Kik joined Islamic Jihad and was active in the high school and college Islamic Jihad student's organization (Al-Jamaa Al-Islamiyya). He subsequently joined the Jerusalem Squads, the military wing of the organization.

Al-Kik's technological training was fully exploited in the framework of his activity. Al-Kik was one of the senior operatives in charge of manufacturing and developing rockets for Islamic Jihad, preparing explosive charges and war materiel as well as training generations of "engineers" on the basis of the knowledge that he had accumulated.

In the summer of 2006 al-Kik visited China where he displayed an interest in light aircraft, possibly for the purpose of purchase/manufacture in order to commit a terror attack against Israel.

Al-Kik's activity in the realm of terror was exposed in September 2007, when he escaped an Israeli assassination attempt. Nevertheless, he continued to serve as a teacher, educator and school principal for UNRWA and involved in educating children and youths in summer camps. It is not clear why after his terror activity had been exposed UNRWA refrained from sacking him from any educational and teaching post at its institutions.

There is little justification for UNRWA's existence if the organization views its entire purpose as preserving the misery of the refugees in the camps. However beyond this the affair of the "terrorist educator" and the Hamas takeover of the UNRWA institutions and work staff should trigger a "warning light" with regard to the possibility that funds transferred to UNRWA by the donor states (including the United States and Canada) find their way to financing the salaries of Hamas and Islamic Jihad activists.

This matter requires an urgent investigation, and in any case, UNRWA would be well advised to channel hundreds of millions of dollars from its budget to clear out the refugee camps and rehabilitate their inhabitants in new and more spacious towns. The donor states should pose this as a preliminary condition to their continued assistance to UNRWA.

--------------------------–

[1] http://www.alquds.com/node/23120

Nona   January 23rd, 2009 6:52 am ET

It's nice to see a thread that seems, for the most part, genuinely devoted to a rational exchange of viewpoints, a commitment to peaceful resolution and an overall tone of respect for differing opinions.

Kudos, gentlemen!

Debbie   January 23rd, 2009 7:12 am ET

What people crucified Jesus? I am trying to understand all of this. I need to know the answer to that question and then maybe I will understand all that is being said. I think all this trouble stems from day one, the day Jesus was crucified on the cross. I am probably wrong. But, that is what I believe.

GLeigh   January 23rd, 2009 8:37 am ET

Someone once challenged the Prof to say that Israel had the right to exist. He couldn't/ wouldn't. The goal is to destroy Israel, wipe it off the map, however you care to read the wording. It's been written. It's been televised being spoken. Everything else is basically just confussion.

Missiles hidden in populated areas were fired at Israel. The people hiding them there didn't build bomb shelters for that population. Israel went in to stop them. Civilians were hurt. World opinion said to stop because civilians are being hurt. Israel started moving out tanks. The missiles continue even now. Apparently this is a source of pride. What about the hurt civilians?

The only argument I've seen justifying the rockets and missiles are that they are homemade so they don't really kill too many people in Israel so why should they have to stop.

Now some want the people shooting these missiles and who think Israel should be "wiped off the map" to live in Israel and vote. A one state solution. Personally, I wouldn't find these ideal neighbors.

Well I was on this morning. The Prof said mean things about me and I wanted to read back and see if he had said anything else. He's still here. Apparently this is a full time 24/7 job for some.

It's not a full time job for me. Time to rest. Interesting though. Many Americans do think people in that part of the world are violent. I once mentioned wanting to visit the Pyramids and all my friends started with the warnings. Perhaps part of this opinion is because of 911, along with other bombings. We went to Australia and New Zealand instead.

dan perman   January 23rd, 2009 9:54 am ET

GLeigh

you can come and visit israel insstead

it is safer here than some other parts of the world

Mordechay Ariely   January 23rd, 2009 10:55 am ET

Recognizing Hamas=accepting Islamists worldwide domination desire
********************************************
USING THE DOMACRATIC SYSTEM TO DESTROY DEMOCRACY SHOULD NOT BE ALLOWED
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

• Hamas doctrine is; ;
1-worldwide domination
2-calm to world cultures only under Islam
3-kill all Jew
4-use democracy to gain power and later destroy democracy
5-terror as a tactical tool
6-shielding between civiliance

Groups and supporting countries with such doctrines should be outlawed by the international community

GLeigh   January 23rd, 2009 12:17 pm ET

Thanks. The problem is simple; the solution tough. Sad part is, people I know like borth. Both are proud. Both are attractive. Both have long histories that we can only dream about in the U.S. There are some of course who can't appreciate it, or anything. Always have those. This new envoy is suppose to be tough and fair. Let's hope.

GLeigh   January 23rd, 2009 12:19 pm ET

About to do the driving guys to school thing. Finally, when they were a foot taller, stopped calling them kids. See ya. Peace.

GLeigh   January 23rd, 2009 1:21 pm ET

This is off the subject, but since guys are here, I figure it would bring back old memories or something. Yesterday went to pick the guys up from school. Was waiting in the senior parking lot, my son isn't one but his friend who rides with us it, and I was waiting. Next to my car was a zooped up classic. Chrome. Two seniors ran over and took the knob off the gear shift. I was watching. They held it up a second for me to see and took off running. I died laughing. Then the guy who owns it and his friend who rides with him came over and got it. I had my face stuck in a magazine so they wouldn't ask me. I'm not a snitch. They got out, laughing and carrying on. Well, here come my guys. They look inside the car and soon there's a crowd. Then the two guys who took it go driving by, one with his arm out the window holding it. Everyone goes chasing them, around the parking lot. Thought I'd die laughing, hoping no one got ran over. Finally the car slows a lot, and Sams passes it to one of the chasers and the car takes off, melts rubber. Teens are a pain, but so funny!

GLeigh   January 23rd, 2009 1:43 pm ET

Sorry again. I know your dialog is guy warrior stuff and I'm a pain. I just use to have a very close friend in Egypt and always cared about this part of the world, all of it. I have work to do and meeting friends for lunch. Later.

StewartGrundy   January 23rd, 2009 2:40 pm ET

Re George Michel saved Nothern Irland.
What realy saved Northern Irland was 9.11 it stoped the U.S from turning a blind eye to Irish terrorist since you now had problems you needed help with I.E Tony Blair.

Tony Larue   January 23rd, 2009 3:00 pm ET

It is a new day people a new day. Good decision by Mr. Obama to strive for peace in the Middle East by appointing a good man George Mitchell as a "trouble shooting envoy"

My fear is that there are some who do not want peace and we may again be looking at wasted opportunities.

Because of the unfairness and the "wanton" killings we just saw in Gaza, it CANNOT be allowed to happen again. Neither should innocent Israelis be subjected to rockets being launched into their neighborhoods.

It is time to move away for all the venemous rhetoric and destruction and help the Palestinians ASAP. This was unspeakable carnage in Gaza. Over 1000 Gazans dead. By the way, how many israeli lives were losts? All God given lives are precious.

I guess hatred is hatred whether it is the Middle East or the US and this brings me to Mr. Obama. From CNN reports, even when you are elected as President by a majority of Amercians there are still white Supremacist groups in the US who are increasing their death threats against a US President.who so happens to be black.

The Secret Service who from recent reports were found to have racist elements in their ranks, need to go after these home grown white "terrorists" groups with the same zeal and vigor the FBI went after and destroyed the original Black Panthers in the 1960's.

I am proud and have faith in the american people who voted for Mr. Obama but keeping these racists groups in close range should be done to avoid a civil war or nasty racial conflict should something unspeakable happen to Mr. Obama.

I think we are beyond conflict in the US but one never knows how the climate may change. Even at a very young age, I can recall what ensued after Rev. Martin Luther King was assasinated and it was something I do not want to see again.

GLeigh   January 23rd, 2009 3:45 pm ET

Tony hadn't planned to write anything else. But this caught my ear. I'm 50 now. Ouch. When I started kindergarten there were two drinking fountains marked "White" and "Black." I had to ask what that meant. Took me awhile to get it. In first or second grade, the signs disappeared. We had one black guy in our class. I don't know the story. He played with me and my other female friends. We really liked him. In third grade, my teacher announced that Wardell was staying back a class. I was never an easy child. I was angry and asked why because his grades were good. He was a smart guy. She explained, patiently, that he and his parents had put in a formal request because there was another black male person in the grade below us. I looked over and asked him if that was true. He nodded. I started crying because we were all just kids who goofed together. I've been the target of the race thing and seen it done to others.

My son, 3 at the time, went to day care school. A new guy started, Rudy, African American. Immediately they became friends. Both were big into baseball. He asked if his new friend Rudy could come to our house to play. I told them that I was having a hard time remembering which child Rudy was – describe him. He struggled. He said Rudy was about as tall as him. I acted puzzled. I asked what color hair. He couldn't remember. Rudy did come to our house to play. Both of his parents attended first and we had coffee together. They were protective parents. Rudy's dad was an engineer and got transferred later. My son was so upset. We bought him a new book as a gift. Now the race people still exist. The newer generation is smarter I think. I hope.

Tony Larue   January 23rd, 2009 3:56 pm ET

Benyemen,

This is indeed very interesting and astounding information on US aid numbers to Israel. Are these acurate facts? If this information is acurate then the poor blacks and other hard working Americans need to see this information. The victims of Katrina for instance also need to see this information.

I must add that there is nothing wrong at all with aid to Israel. I will be the last person to deny the state of Israel this aid. However, the poor in the Us need some aid also.

Tony Larue   January 23rd, 2009 4:15 pm ET

Gleigh,

Thank you. I do agree with you whole heartedly. I have all the faith in the young people and the Gleighs of the world. But Gleigh, I am sure you will agree with me when I say that the cancer of hate remains.

We are blinded by hate when we should be looking for commonalities instead of differences.

We should be more concerned about the water we drink, the food we eat, the environment and the Wall Street bankers walking away with BILLIONS of dollars and not spending a day in jail at least not yet while single mothers, fathers and poor families continue to struggle to survive to feed their children.

Tony Larue   January 23rd, 2009 4:30 pm ET

Gleigh,

By the way, you mention that you are a young 50. Well you have just started to live since. Do not forget we are living much longer and staying active than before. We now start to slow down around 85.
Enjoy your life to the fullest with your children. You sound like an amazing person.

GLeigh   January 23rd, 2009 4:37 pm ET

On that same note, I do think people have to learn to be responsible. Children need both parents. Moms are marshmellows and dads are tough, at least here. But kids are challenging. They two however the dynamics. Call me old fashioned.

Debs   January 23rd, 2009 6:05 pm ET

Hey Dan, Linda, GLeigh and all

I think that george mitchells role may help. I know from personla experience the work he has done in Northern Ireland. He did manage to broker a peace deal between the Irish Republican Army and the Ulster Defence army, these two despicable terrorist groups murdered so many people over religion and land.

If he got these animals to stop there bombings then maybe he could help bring peace to Israel and Palestine. Maybe he could help found a goo decent Palestine for the people so they can have a home in peace and security with out the violence.

Salam and Shalom

Professor   January 23rd, 2009 6:41 pm ET

I just read this interesting article.... But one sentence caught my eye...

Israel did not allow the Palestinian Authority (Abbas government in the West Bank) to transfer 60 million dollar to Gaza so it can pay the salaries of its employees who live there...

Can any of you who denies that Palestinians are living under occupation what does that means to you?...

Professor   January 23rd, 2009 6:54 pm ET

Those who like to learn more about the history can visit
If Americans Knew website which has some good facts:

http://www.ifamericansknew.org/history/maps.html

By the way its run by a very gentle christian american woman.... not by any Arab or a Muslim....

Its the occupation stupid.

Professor   January 23rd, 2009 7:08 pm ET

11 Palestinians injured today by the Israeli Occupying Forces in the West Bank.... Someone is going to tell me What occupation?... and I am going to reply to him....

Its the occupation stupid. :)

Beny   January 23rd, 2009 7:23 pm ET

False Prof.,

If that sentence you found came from the site you gave later, then I personally would not believe a WORD of it. "If Americans Would Only Believe My Lies" (the site you gave) is run by a very gentle, christian, American, stupid and ignorant woman.

If you want me to argue with her, I'd love to, but so far I've read the page you gave and found 11 innacuracies and 4 BLATANT LIES.
Example: she says stuff like "stolen" and "occupied" land of 1948-1967, and conveniently FAILS to say a single word about the wars THE ARABS DECLARED to start all this.

On the other hand, you get your news from Al-Jazeera, so what else could I expect.

CS,

You tell me to "quit whining about the past" and "start working for a solution". Well.... for 60 years Israel has been working on solutions with many Arab leaders, including Abbas who managed to squeeze a lot out of us in negotiations.

Nevertheless, Hamas keep on attacking us to "reclaim" ALL the Palestinian land we "occupied" since 1880.

The Haaretz page you gave me was just an opinion article, and never in there was concrete proof of what you say. 21st of June, Hamas (trying to disguise it as "Badr Forces", which we now know to be just a platoon) shot 3 rockets at Israel. WAY before any Israeli operation in Gaza.

You say you "disagree" with what Hamas are doing. How convenient. You think it gives you legitimation to bash Israel. Well if you not only admit, but also disagree, with what Hamas are doing, why are you still blaming Israel? YOUR country would have flattened Gaza 7 years ago!

Beny   January 23rd, 2009 7:25 pm ET

False Prof,

Yes, please, what occupation?

John   January 23rd, 2009 7:29 pm ET

Professor, you got me thinking about how to end this conflict from your comments yesterday as my thinking was to have the Palestinians reject violence and terrorism and get Hamas to do the same. Since that probably won't happen since Hamas controls most of the Gaza and West Bank, I have been entertaining another solution that could work:
Israel, as the militarily superior power, could take the first steps to end this conflict once and for all. It could do that at any time by making the following moves:
1. Implementing a massive Marshall Plan in Gaza and in the West Bank to end poverty and unemployment, rebuild all that has been destroyed of the Palestinian infrastructure, and encourage investment in a new Palestinian economy;
2. Dismantle the settlements or tell the settlers unequivocally that they must become citizens of a Palestinian state, live by its laws, face charges if their settlements were constructed on land stolen from Palestinians, and that they will not be able to count on Israel to protect them;
3. Accept 30,000 Palestinian refugees back into Israel each year for the next thirty years, a number that would not seriously endanger the population balance, apologize for its role in the 1948 expulsions of Palestinians (known as al Naqba), and offer to coordinate a worldwide effort to raise funds to compensate Palestinians for all that they lost during the Occupation;
4. Recognize a Palestinian state within borders already defined by the Geneva Accord of 2003.
This is the only way Israel will ever achieve security. It is the only way to permanently defeat Hamas and all extremists who wish to see endless war against Israel. But it won’t happen until there is a massive shift in understanding about what promotes “security.”
As the US has been doing in Iraq and Afghanistan, by trying to make the United States secure, is to dominate, which isn't working and will not work. They are killling lots of militants, but are not making the country any more secure, except to delay another attack on US soil.
The most significant contribution the new Obama Administration could make to Middle East Peace would be to embrace an alternative strategy: that homeland security is best achieved through generosity and caring for others. If the United States were to announce its embrace of a Global Marshall Plan, beginning with the Middle East and backed up with money and the conscious articulation of a Strategy of Generosity, it would do more to help Israel than all the armaments it can promise and all the shuttle diplomacy it might facilitate.

Beny   January 23rd, 2009 7:42 pm ET

John,

Disregarding the fact that I disagree with you on so many points (Let 30,000 Palestinians in?! Why the hell?! They'll have their own state, let them go there!)
You haven't said a single thing about what the Palestinians should do.

1) Allow Israeli police presence in Gaza like they do in the West Bank. That's the reason there are rockets and terrorists coming from Gaza and the West Bank is quiet.
At least for the first few years, until a Palestinian police will be able to fight the terrorists coming from there (and they will always come).

2) Give up stupid demands for land that supposedly "belongs" to them and think of what land will be the best for the new Palestinian state.

3) Sever all diplomatic and military ties with Iran until Iran chages it's attitude.

4) Allow supervision over the military strength of the Palestinian state. We were invaded three times already, we want to make sure it won't happen again.

5) Apologize for their role in all the suicide bombings since 1920, also called "terrorism".

I have SO many more demands, but let's address these for now. This is my idea- I (and Israel with me) am willing to give up a LOT for peace, but what I want is PEACE, not the PROMISE OF PEACE. I don't want a piece of paper for the next Arab to wipe his bottom with. I want REAL military incentives to ensure Israel's security.

Beny   January 23rd, 2009 7:52 pm ET

Akiva, I agree. The West DOES have double standards when it comes to Israel.

When Hamas were shooting rockets daily for 8 years, not a single word of protest.

When in Darfur there is a massacre going on even as we speak, apart from mild claims, the world was silent.

When Hamas preach hate in schools and drag children around, VIOLATING the Children's Right's rules, for long before Israel fought in Gaza, the world was interestingly silent.

But when Israel FINALLY acts to stop the aforesaid rockets, we are suddenly "criminals" and "Nazis".

You know what? Ironically, I wish we were. If we were to apply even a fraction of the force ANY other country (let alone Hitler) would have done or did, Hamas would have been vaporized by now and both the Palestinians and Israelis would have been safe for decades at least.

Professor   January 23rd, 2009 7:57 pm ET

John,

I think you were going the right direction... but as you see the idiot Beny... Israelis do not want a mutual peace.... they just want Peace for themselves and the hell with the Palestinians....

I guarantee you Beny that wont happen.... mark my words... read my lips if you can.... It never happened to any occupation in the past and it will not happen to Israel and it will never happen to any occupation in the future. Get my drift?

Beny   January 23rd, 2009 8:03 pm ET

False Prof.,

Yes I agree, maybe the Palestinians will never work on a fruitful, pragmatic and realistic solution and will keep on demanding what they gambled away long ago.

I still have hope, though.

PS, It's your cat.......stupid.

Professor   January 23rd, 2009 8:04 pm ET

http://uk.reuters.com/article/usTopNews/idUKTRE50L28S20090123

After Gaza war, Israel sees Hamas prisoner swap
Fri Jan 23, 2009 1:12am GMT Email | Print | Share| Single Page[-] Text [+] By Dan Williams

JERUSALEM (Reuters) – After pummeling Hamas in the Gaza Strip, Israel now hopes to push through a prisoner swap to retrieve a soldier held by the Palestinians since 2006, Israeli officials said on Thursday.

They said Israel was conditioning any lifting of its Gaza blockade on immediate progress in Egyptian efforts to free Gilad Shalit, and would be willing to relax its objections to a list of Palestinian prisoners which Hamas wants released in exchange.

The Islamists demand amnesty for 1,400 inmates, including 450 senior militants. Israel long balked over the latter group, saying their release would sap Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas's peace strategies by bolstering rival hardliners.

But after its 22-day offensive against the Hamas administration in Gaza, Israel appears to be more flexible.

"There is a sense that we can afford to relax our criteria on the prisoner release, as any benefit to Hamas would be more than offset by the damage it sustained in Gaza," said one Israeli security official.

The official said Prime Minister Ehud Olmert wanted to clinch a deal before he is replaced in a February 10 election, though it was not clear whether the Israeli security cabinet could approve all the names on the Hamas release roster.

Addressing reporters on Thursday, Olmert said: "I believe that the military operation in Gaza created levers that can help in speeding the return of Gilad Shalit ... I will not elaborate."

Security cabinet minister Binyamin Ben-Eliezer told Israel's Army Radio that new discussions on a possible prisoner swap had not yet taken place. He added: "I am among those who would be willing to pay the highest price for Gilad's return."

Professor   January 23rd, 2009 8:10 pm ET

Israel spent 22 days killing innocent unarmed Palestinian civilians in order to free one soldier prisoner.... but it failed.... Now its going to sit down with Hamas to negotiate his realase in an exchange program....

So, tell me who lost this war?.....

Professor   January 23rd, 2009 8:12 pm ET

Hamas is going to demand the release of all its prisoners and Israel will bend over to Hamas demands and release them.

Its the occupation stupid.

Professor   January 23rd, 2009 8:14 pm ET

Beny,

Are you burning inside now?.... or not yet?....

See Arabs do not need ovens to burn you in.... You will burn inside in this life and you will burn in hellfire in the hearafter.... :)

Get my drift?

Its the occupation stupid.

Beny   January 23rd, 2009 8:22 pm ET

Prof.,

Hamas spent 8 years shooting rockets and 11 years sending suicide bombers in order to free a little grain of sand that doesn't even belong to them. Now they're sitting down to talk. If only they would have done that long ago all this bloodshed could have been avoided.

Tell me, why is Mashaal still hiding in his bunker? Why is Nasrallah still hiding in his bunker?

I.B. Wright   January 23rd, 2009 8:22 pm ET

Beny -of course you want peace, as long as Israel dictates the terms and maintains its control and domination of the Palestinians. Maybe "they" should supervise the Israeli military and give the Palestinians some nuclear weapons to put them on equal terms with Israel too. No wonder its so hard to reach a peace deal.

Peter   January 23rd, 2009 8:35 pm ET

I could't sleep last night for about 10 sec, because i was so upset what he said. lol

Beny   January 23rd, 2009 8:38 pm ET

I.B.,

"as long as Israel dictates the terms and maintains its control"

1948 has shown very well what happens when the Arabs get to dictate their terms. Even the Arabs didn't like it.

I ask you this: West Bank, ruled by Abbas, is open to occasional Shin Bet and IDF operations. "Dictating our terms", as you put it. That place is incredibly quiet. A better lifestyle than Gaza, and also ABBAS HAS ACHIEVED IN 3 YEARS OF NEGOTIATIONS WHAT HAMAS COULDN'T IN 8 YEARS OF ROCKETS. No innocent Palestinians killed, no bloodshed, no terrorism, and we don't have to do there what we do in Gaza.

Gaza, ruled by Hamas, is a different situation. As this operation has shown, the rockets stopped only by....IDF presence, "dictating our terms"!
See, when we let them "dictate the terms", we get rockets. I don't like rockets.

As for giving them nukes....
1967 they had twice the tanks and airforce, and that's what led to the war. They had strong weapons, and deemed it to be enough to destroy Israel.
2009 you give 'em nukes? That's masochistic at best.
No wonder it's so hard to reach a peace deal.

P.S. You dislike my offer for peace. Okay. You think that keeping up the rockets only to bring about yet another war is better? Look at it this way- Israel is going to fight and win (we are militarily stronger) until they agree to it's terms. Which are even less. Between the anvil and the hammer, I'd pick the one that hurts me less and be happy with what I've got.

You think that the Jews were happy with the 1947 plan? It was sh*t! 60% of what we got was arid desert! But still, the alternative was not having an Israel at all, so we were happy with what we got. The Arabs, btw, weren't.

Akiva Heifetz   January 23rd, 2009 8:41 pm ET

BackStory: Filming Gaza death:
U.S. doctors help dispel rumors that video of the death of a boy in Gaza was staged.
CNN's Michael Holmes reports.

http://www.cnn.com/video/?JSONLINK=/video/bestoftv/2009/01/22/bs.holmes.gaza.boy.death.cnn

---------

CNN discovers the israelian propaganda blogers
which are spreading pro-israel false-information

these are the sources of a lot pro-israeli posters here
they use false information to blind them self and to blind others
----
dont trust blindly in to propaganda!

Beny   January 23rd, 2009 8:56 pm ET

I.B.,

Shame. I fancied you for one of those "intelligent" Israel-bashers I can at least have fun arguing with. But what you said to Brandon has shown the opposite. You don't even bother putting on a facade of civility.

False Terrorist Prof.,

As Golda Meir once said "if there is such thing as a Palestinian, I am a Palestinian myself".
No one can claim this place's ultimate belonging to him. Jews were here forever (two big dynasties in the past and a constant existent- if small- population here at all times. 19th century, by the way, Jerusalem had a JEWISH majority) and Arabs were here forever too- a constant majority population and widespread settling, if never an autonomous state. Saying, to quote the singer Dido, "This Land Is Mine", is childish and irrelevant.

What IS relevant, however, is the current situation, brought about by years of stupid losing wars the Arab leaders waged on us.

We are sitting here now. We are not going anywhere. Get used to it.

The Arabs want to sit here too. We're cool with that. I am all for the "land for peace" formula, I just want real sustainable incentive-based peace and not just a piece of toilet paper saying "we promise".

The Arabs also want us out of here. We're not cool with that. I suggest they revise that wish.

Beny   January 23rd, 2009 9:03 pm ET

False Terrorist Prof,

Were Syria Egypt Jordan Lebanon Saudi Arabia and Iraq stronger, militarily, than Israel in 1948? 1967? 1973? The answer is a huge YES. But still Israel not only stands, but won spectacular victories in all three.

Israel is not going anywhere. Get used to that. Everyone in history (including lots and lots of Arabs) tried to finish us off and failed. What makes you think you will succeed? Jews have a knack for survival, and Israel is the Jew's home, no matter what crazy religious guys in Europe spew out.

Roscoe   January 23rd, 2009 9:05 pm ET

CNN discovers the Palestinian propaganda blogers
which are spreading pro-Palestinan false-information

these are the sources of a lot pro-Palestinan posters here
they use false information to blind them selves and to blind others
———-
dont trust blindly in to propaganda!

Beny   January 23rd, 2009 9:07 pm ET

False Terrorist Prof,

So you basically agree that, in regard to how they fulfilled them, all our agreements with the Arabs are equivalent to toilet paper (which I am in shortage of now, so I might as well use the Oslo Pact).

Thank you. That's what I've been saying all along.

I.B. Wright   January 23rd, 2009 9:14 pm ET

Two things Beny:
1.Beny- What Brandong gets, Brandong deserves and has nothing to do with you. He wanted to play by calling me an Idiot Bastard Right and home grown terrorist -so don't preach to me about civility. When I start calling anyone else that, then you can complain.

2. Are you trying to suggest your proposal is just for both sides? I don't see it that way and furthermore what does that have to do with rockets? I've always said I don't agree with Hamas firing them unless in self defense so don't twist my words to make it sound like my position is to keep firing them into Israel as a better way to peace.

Akiva   January 23rd, 2009 9:19 pm ET

Akiva Heifetz

I'm really ashamed of you!
You tell so many lies!

French court rejects Al-Dura hoax posted at 8:24 am on May 22, 2008 by Ed Morrissey

French broadcaster France2 lost its case and a large portion of its credibility yesterday when its appeals court called their Al-Dura story a hoax and reversed a lower-court ruling on a defamation case. Philippe Karsenty was vindicated in his criticism of France2 when he called their video of a supposed murder of a Palestinian child by Israeli soldiers staged for propaganda purposes. As PJM’s Richard Landes notes, the entire unedited footage of France2 contained a long series of laughably staged “injuries”, prompting him to refer to France2 as “Pallywood”:
The French court of appeals, presided over by the redoubtable Madame Laurence Trébucq, has reversed the decision of a lower court — the (in)famous “Chambre 17″ that specializes in verbal crimes had found Philippe Karsenty guilty of defaming France2 after Karsenty, in a 2004 article, claimed (as have many familiar with the dossier), that the scene was staged. The unexpected reversal by the court of appeals represents the first major European breach of the blanket of silence that has greeted any effort of critics to call into question France2’s presentation of the Al Dura footage as actual news.
The Muhammad al Durah affair represents one of the most revealing and distressing cases in the mainstream media’s coverage of the Arab-Israeli conflict. On September 30, 2000, France2’s Middle East correspondent, Charles Enderlin, ran footage of what looked like a boy and his father, together hiding behind a barrel, “the target of fire coming from the Israeli position.” According to this report, the boy was killed and the father badly wounded. The footage went around the world instantly, provoking outrage and violence against both Israel and Jewish communities in the Arab world and in Europe.
France2 compounded these violations of journalistic ethics by attempting to block any criticism. Ridiculing the proponents of the “staged hypothesis” as conspiracy theorists on the order of 9-11 truthers or holocaust deniers, France2 sued independent French citizens who had the nerve to criticize them for their journalistic incompetence. …
France2’s legal maneuver backfired when they were called to show the court the raw footage of their Palestinian cameraman, Talal abu Rahmah, whose camera work and testimony lie at the heart of the accusation against the Israeli army. They found themselves forced to cut the most embarrassing scenes before showing the footage to the court, and to explain to the court why the remaining footage had so many suspicious scenes.
The reversal and the resultant implosion of France2’s credibility shows the lengths that some will go to paint the Israelis as the source of all woe in the region. Instead of reporting objective truth, the “journalists” at France2 decided to propagate lies as a means of telling the narrative they prefer. They couldn’t actually find examples of Israeli soldiers deliberately killing unarmed children, but France2 believed that they did, so they staged it and passed it off as truth. And unfortunately, they found many people who believed them despite the many inconsistencies in the video — such as the child moving after his supposed death and the lack of blood in the scene, rather odd for a gut shot.
The reversal upholds an important principle for freedom of speech — the freedom of criticism. Karsenty dared to criticize France2 for their hoax, and the broadcaster decided to wage a campaign of intimidation against him rather than attempt to defend its propaganda. They succeeded in the lower court and could have forced Karsenty into silence. Instead, Karsenty persevered and eventually forced France2 to release all of its footage, a step they had resisted from the first. That showed the depth of dishonesty not just for the team that created the al-Dura hoax, but for the entire organization that deliberately hid the truth and tried to silence Karsenty through legal action.
Landes includes a long video presentation as part of this story. Be sure to watch it all the way through, and ask yourselves this question: how many al-Duras have we been fed by a media eager to take sides in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict? Landes provides at least one more major hoax with which Americans may be very familiar.

Beny   January 23rd, 2009 9:24 pm ET

I.B.,

1) What Hamas get, Hamas deserve. They wanted to play by shooting rockets and exploding in buses- so don't preach to me about "peacemaking" or "proportionality". When IDF start attacking anyone else, then you can complain.

2) Just or unjust, what I proposed is the only way to ensure Israeli safety while building your Palestinian state. As I said, I want REAL military conditions that keep me safe, not a piece of toilet paper saying "I promise".

The same way the police will not blindly trust a big-time drug dealer (dealing drugs===60 years of invading and exploding in buses and shooting rockets) they caught (our military victories) and set free (helping to build a Palestinian state), under the promise he will not deal again. They put him under strict surveillance and even house arrest, at least for a while.

Roscoe   January 23rd, 2009 9:34 pm ET

Obamas' speech at the State Department, thursday, introducing Hillary Rodham Clinton as Secretary of State and George Mitchell as Sepcial Envoy to the Middle East

Obama said the cease-fire that recently ended the three week Israeli offensive in Gaza can only hold if Hamas stops firing rockets, Israel completes its withdrawal from Gaza and the U.S. and its allies support an anti-smuggling system that prevents the militant Palestinian group from rearming. "The United States will fully support an international donor's conference to seek short-term humanitarian assistance and long-term reconstruction for the Palestinian economy," Obama said Thursday that Abbas' Palestinian Authority should control the aid. "This assistance will be provided to and guided by the Palestinian Authority." Obama said Gaza's borders should be opened to allow aid to come in, with "appropriate monitoring." “Until such time that Hamas agrees to renounce violence and recognizes Israels’ right to exist, Hamas will not be an active participant in the Political process.”

I.B. Wright   January 23rd, 2009 9:37 pm ET

One other thing Beny- you think giving Palestinians a nuclear weapon is masochistic so what do you call Israel having them? a deterrent?. Again, your reasoning is just as flawed as you peace proposal because you have no respect or trust in the Palestinians. I was only being sarcastic but you prove to me that as long as Israels' enemies have no weapons then they will never be in a position to bargain on even terms right? Besides, you mention the West bank is quiet even though the IDF makes the occasional incursion to check up on them as a sign they are happy. I take it mean they want peace so bad they are willing top put up with things they wouldn't normally put up with.

Akiva Heifetz   January 23rd, 2009 9:39 pm ET

Peter your great !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

show us more :D
your the best !!!
do more friendly fire ant then blow your head off :))
you must be a israeli ... they did also kill the own people by friendly fire :))

Akiva Heifetz   January 23rd, 2009 9:41 pm ET

Akiva

if you cant post your source
why should just one person trust in you?
:D

Beny   January 23rd, 2009 9:44 pm ET

Roscoe,

Gotta agree with that Obama guy. I'll be first to donate to the poor suffering Gazans like I did to the poor suffering Sderot citizens, as long as Gaza will stop shooting me. But...

He did outline the two main things stopping peace with Hamas:

a) "can only hold if Hamas stops firing rockets".

b) "Until such time that Hamas agrees to renounce violence and recognizes Israels’ right to exist, Hamas will not be an active participant in the Political process.”

Unfortunately, Hamas will do neither, since they are just Iranian puppets paid to fight.

No long-term peace is possible with them. We scared them into a cease-fire, but we can't establish a Palestinian state with those guys in the lead. Even Mahmoud Abbas (a.k.a. "the calmer, smarter terrorist") is better.

I.B. Wright   January 23rd, 2009 9:47 pm ET

Yo Beny -if you don't care if your "peace proposal" is just or unjust then you shouldn't care about rockets falling on your head either. And here I thought you were serious about having an intelligent conversation.

Akiva Heifetz   January 23rd, 2009 9:48 pm ET

Beny
"Unfortunately, Hamas will do neither, since they are just Iranian puppets paid to fight."
-----------
if you know the future ...
please tell me the lottery numbers :D

Beny   January 23rd, 2009 9:57 pm ET

I.B.

Yes. I do not trust the Palestinians. I trusted them in 1947 to build a state beside us peacefully, and look what I've got.

I trusted them in 1993, (gave them complete autonomous rule they wanted), to stop the suicide bombings. It exploded in my face barely months later.

I trusted them in 2005 to stop shooting rockets in exchange for kicking thousands of Gush-Katif residents out of their homes in the Gaza strip. Now I (not me directly, but you understand) am running to the shelter every 6 minutes remembering my trust.

I trusted them in 2008 to at least halt the rockets for a little while, and two days later it exploded on my country.

I trusted and trusted and trusted. Now I've gotten VERY paranoid, and justly so. The Palestinians have a long way to go to regain my trust.

"I take it mean they want peace so bad they are willing top put up with things they wouldn’t normally put up with."

When you look at Hamas, where they want WAR so bad they are willing to put up with things no one would but up with (blockades and bombardments). Abbas doesn't want peace so bad. He's just smart enough to understand that you can get much closer to destroying Israel by talking like Arafat did, than by bombing like Hamas do.

P.S. As for being parrot. Despite the fact that even parrots are more intelligent than some people here...
I am not a parrot, but I will repeat things several times until I get a response or the things sink in. Now, saying "it's the occupation....stupid". THAT's parroting.

Beny   January 23rd, 2009 10:02 pm ET

I.B.

If you care for "just or unjust" more than you care for "practical or unpractical", then you shouldn't care for the settlements (which are very justly built on Israeli soil). And here I thought you really wanted to reach a solution.

I.B. Wright   January 23rd, 2009 10:18 pm ET

Well Beny, It's a good thing you're not at the negotiating table then because obviously you are neither negotiable nor respectful of the people you're supposed to negotiate with. It's either your way or the highway right? BTW I don't trust Israel either so now what? "Abbas doesn't want peace so bad". So it's only quiet in the West bank because Israel intimidated him into keeping quiet then? If that's the case then the West Bank is not exactly a role model for a peace agreement is it?

Roscoe   January 23rd, 2009 10:22 pm ET

Beny January 23rd, 2009 2144 GMT

Gotta agree with that Obama guy. I’ll be first to donate to the poor suffering Gazans like I did to the poor suffering Sderot citizens, as long as Gaza will stop shooting me. But…

No long-term peace is possible with them. We scared them into a cease-fire, but we can’t establish a Palestinian state with those guys in the lead. Even Mahmoud Abbas (a.k.a. “the calmer, smarter terrorist”) is better.

*********************************************************

I think Obama fully understands this and is of the mindset the Hamas really just needs to fade away and become irrelevant. After all, this seemed to ocurr in Jordan.

Beny   January 23rd, 2009 10:40 pm ET

I.B.,

Compared to how the Palestinians are "negotiating" over 1967 lands and Jerusalem:

"we want all the land you 'occupied' for the Palestinian state and Al-Quds (Jerusalem) its capital"

"Um...no. We're already sitting here. We're not just gonna give back what you gambled away trying to destroy us"

"we want all the land you 'occupied' for the Palestinian state and Al-Quds (Jerusalem) its capital"

"Uh... we can retreat a little bit from here and here..."

"NO! we want all the land you 'occupied' for the Palestinian state and Al-Quds (Jerusalem) its capital"

"Okay, look at this- 94% of the '67 land (because we really don't want to give you Ariel) and a part of the Arab-populated east Jerusalem is yours, we don't need it anyway"

"NO! we want all the land you 'occupied' for the Palestinian state and Al-Quds (Jerusalem) its capital"

That's where it is between Abbas and Olmert now. The conclusion? It's either my way or the highway, if the highway means giving them all they demand and getting a promise in return.

And I'd rather have my way. Besides, what can you give to ensure 100% Israel's security? Because without that security, you get nothing from me.

You say you don't trust Israel? I have explained why I don't trust the Palestinians.

"So it’s only quiet in the West bank because Israel intimidated him into keeping quiet then?"

Once AGAIN you twist my words and put your lies into my mouth. Abbas is quiet because he is smart enough to understand you can squeeze a lot more out of Israel by talking rather than bombing. A smart strategic move which I hope Hamas would embrace too. Abbas, following Arafat's footsteps, is a perfect role model.

He's no less a terrorist than Hamas. He's just a smart one.

Goodnight, It's 1am here and I just spent the last four hours arguing with Israel-bashers. It's getting addictive.

Professor   January 23rd, 2009 10:59 pm ET

Jenin is not occupied...

Gaza is not occupied...

The West Bank is not occupied...

Jerusalem is not occupied...

Is Israel occupying anything?.... What the hell is wrong with the world? The Whole world is wrong.... If Israel says its not occupying anything then you better believe it.... or ELSE.

mahmoud jboor   January 23rd, 2009 11:37 pm ET

the most important job is how sen mitchell will convince the people of israel that there is another way for living rather than wars and force and crimes...bloody stupid!!!.....pres. mushraff said: US treats pakistan unequally, infact US treats all contries around the world unequally...just one exception: israel !! its nonsense !!! you want to fight terror but you are opening the hell of doors for terror !! you are suffering economic crises but U are promoting military operations with funny names plus wasting billions...!! and no results !!! ....go communicate with the world ..try to understand their rights and then you will safe a lot .....

Roscoe   January 23rd, 2009 11:52 pm ET

Immitation Professor January 23rd, 2009 2259 GMT

Jenin is not occupied…

Gaza is not occupied…

The West Bank is not occupied…

Jerusalem is not occupied…

Is Israel occupying anything?…. What the hell is wrong with the world? The Whole world is wrong…. If Israel says its not occupying anything then you better believe it…. or ELSE.

*******************************************************

Calm down!!! Obama, Clinton and George Mitchell are all on board to see that you are treated fairly. I hope you had the opportunity to see Obamas' introduction speech to the State Department when he presented Hillary Clinton as Secretary of State and George Mitchell as Special Envoy to the Middle East, and they explained their intitiative, involvement, direction, and support .

Calm down-- they'll take care of you!

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 12:12 am ET

Beny.

Without Jerusalem as the capital of Palestine.
without the whole west bank 100%of it.
without the return or compensation for the refugees.
without the dismantling of all Jewish settlement on Palestinian land.
without the return of occupied Golan..

Israel will not see peace or security.
Israel will always be a pariah state in the region.
Israel will ultimately be defeated.

for Israel to have security, Palestinians must have their state and their security too.
solution is simple. GET OUT FROM PALESTINIAN LAND.

mooshy   January 24th, 2009 12:15 am ET

I WOULD LIKE TO SAY THAT hALA IS ONLY TRYING TO GIVE US A CHANCE TO AGREE ON SOME POINTS, NOT THE OPPOSITE.

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 12:27 am ET

Beny .

you are nothing but a mouthpiece for the criminal so called Israel..

your contribution here is nothing but lies and fabrication.

you will not answer Questions.

you want the Palestinians to agree to you or face the consequences
that reminds me of your masters the NAZIS.

as I said before the way things are going you will face the same fate as.

the French settlers in Algeria.
or the white settlers in South Africa.

I will give you a choice pick and choose..

mooshy   January 24th, 2009 12:35 am ET

i yhink obama will find a solution to this problem soon.

mooshy   January 24th, 2009 12:49 am ET

israelis and palestinians are both human beings for gods sake.

Itai   January 24th, 2009 1:53 am ET

This war is/was cruel!
I hope there will be peace soon.

I am against hate!
I hope the UN will bring peace very soon!

Thank's

Bill   January 24th, 2009 1:55 am ET

Gilligan (a.k.a. Professor) -

The whole world isn't wrong. It's you.

Solomon -

The real pariahs of the middle east are the Palestinians. The Arab countries have killed them, expelled them or put them in camps. Your attitude keeps them in this useless struggle against peace and tolerance.

The only Nazi's are those seeking the extermination of the Jews. That would make you are your terrorist buddies the only Nazi's around.

Your rhetoric, propaganda, and blatant disregard for the truth haven't changed. You are a credit to your people, defiant and ignorant until the end. You are not capable of learning or letting go of your blind hatred, and, as such, will never evolve to a higher plane of existence. You are trapped by your ignorance and arrogance, bound to constantly fight losing battles against knowledge and justice. Like the Palestinians, you need to choose to change, you need to choose peace and hard work. You constantly choose conflict and laziness instead. The Palestinians have been on welfare for 60 years. It's time for them to get a job other than attacking others.

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 2:18 am ET

Bill.

this is the view of a Jewish woman about Israel.

Emmy-award winning comedienne Roseanne Barr, herself of Jewish ancestry, has nonetheless blasted Israel for its recent attacks on Hamas targets in the Gaza Strip, calling Israel a "Nazi state" bent on torturing "the Jewish soul."

"The destruction of the Jews in Israel has been assured with this inhuman attack on civilians in Gaza," Barr writes on her blog. "Exactly as its Nazi mentors did to the Jews of Warsaw, Israel now bombs innocent civilians who have been imprisoned in concentration camps in Gaza!"

She continues, "The Zionists look German! The Palestinians look like the Jews of Poland! The Jewish people have destroyed themselves in Gaza."

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 2:22 am ET

Bill here is another Jew.

Jewish British Lawmaker Likens Israel to Nazis

SIR Gerald Kaufman, Thu 15 Jan 2009 compared the actions of Israel in Gaza to the Nazis who forced his family to flee Poland. Kaufman, a member of the Jewish Labour movement also called for an arms embargo against Israel.

Sir Gerald Kaufman was brought up as an orthodox Jew and Zionist.

"My grandmother did not die to provide cover for Israeli soldiers murdering Palestinian grandmothers in Gaza. The present Israeli government ruthlessly and cynically exploits the continuing guilt from gentiles over the slaughter of Jews in the Holocaust as justification for their murder of Palestinians."
He said the claim that many of the Palestinian victims were militants "was the reply of the Nazi" and added: "I suppose the Jews fighting for their lives in the Warsaw ghetto could have been dismissed as militants."

"They are not simply war criminals, they are fools."

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 2:31 am ET

Bill.
this is in an Israeli newspaper

A secret report from Israel's Foreign Ministry has warned that Israel could become a pariah state, akin to apartheid South Africa, if its relations with Europe deteriorate.

An excerpt of the report, printed in the Israeli newspaper Ha'aretz says a collision course with Europe "holds the risk of Israel losing international legitimacy and could lead to its isolation, in the manner of South Africa".

The report's leaking coincides with a European Union push to exert more diplomatic pressure on Israel in the Middle East peace process.

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 2:41 am ET

Bill.

of course I hate Israel as much as you hate the Palestinians.

I am proud to be a credit to my people, fighting for Justice and human decency .

it is you who need to change like for instance.
stop stealing land that does not belong to you.
stop killing women children and babies.
stop thinking that you are above other humans..
stop acting like the Nazis.

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 2:45 am ET

The 1976 Nobel peace prize laureate, Mairead McGuire from Ireland, recently suggested a popular movement demanding that the UN revoke Israel’s membership. The international community now needs to put tangible pressure on Israel in order to stop its war crimes.

Not once, during the past 60 years, has Israel shown any intention of living up to the requirements stipulated by the UN, in connection with the country’s membership in 1948, namely that the Palestinians who had been evicted from their homes should be allowed to return at the earliest possible opportunity. Moreover, Israel holds the hardly flattering world record of ignoring UN resolutions.

It can be questioned from the aspect of human rights legislation whether Israel is a legitimate state. Established practice between states usually requires borders that are legally maintained and a constitution, neither of which Israel has. These requirements are also named in the UN resolution (181) Partition Plan for Palestine, approved by the General Assembly in November 1947. The plan was accepted by the Zionists Jews in Palestine but rejected for excellent reasons as unjust by the Arab states. Only decisions made by the UN Security Council are mandatory. Later on, Israel unilaterally laid claim to a considerably larger portion of land than that suggested by the UN.

The eviction of eighty per cent of the Palestinians who lived west of the 1947 armistice line, and Israel’s refusal to allow them to return is the human rights argument for expelling Israel from the UN. Not only has Israel played the Partition Plan false but has, by its actions, thwarted the grounds – fragile from the start – for its UN membership.

Roscoe   January 24th, 2009 3:26 am ET

Solomon January 24th, 2009 245 GMT

The 1976 Nobel peace prize laureate, Mairead McGuire from Ireland, recently suggested a popular movement demanding that the UN revoke Israel’s membership. The international community now needs to put tangible pressure on Israel in order to stop its war crimes.

Not once, during the past 60 years, has Israel shown any intention of living up to the requirements stipulated by the UN, in connection with the country’s membership in 1948, namely that the Palestinians who had been evicted from their homes should be allowed to return at the earliest possible opportunity. Moreover, Israel holds the hardly flattering world record of ignoring UN resolutions.

It can be questioned from the aspect of human rights legislation whether Israel is a legitimate state. Established practice between states usually requires borders that are legally maintained and a constitution, neither of which Israel has. These requirements are also named in the UN resolution (181) Partition Plan for Palestine, approved by the General Assembly in November 1947. The plan was accepted by the Zionists Jews in Palestine but rejected for excellent reasons as unjust by the Arab states. Only decisions made by the UN Security Council are mandatory. Later on, Israel unilaterally laid claim to a considerably larger portion of land than that suggested by the UN.

The eviction of eighty per cent of the Palestinians who lived west of the 1947 armistice line, and Israel’s refusal to allow them to return is the human rights argument for expelling Israel from the UN. Not only has Israel played the Partition Plan false but has, by its actions, thwarted the grounds – fragile from the start – for its UN membershi
**********************************************

Soloman,

So what is your point here??

Israel should be evicted from the UN?

Israel should be declared a non- state?

What is your point??

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 3:47 am ET

Roscoe..why should Israel be a member?

1. Resolution 42: The Palestine Question (5 March 1948) Requests recommendations for the Palestine Commission
2. Resolution 43: The Palestine Question (1 Apr 1948) Recognizes "increasing violence and disorder in Palestine" and requests that representatives of "the Jewish Agency for Palestine and the Arab Higher Committee" arrange, with the Security Council, "a truce between the Arab and Jewish Communities of Palestine...Calls upon Arab and Jewish armed groups in Palestine to cease acts of violence immediately."
3. Resolution 44: The Palestine Question (1 Apr 1948) Requests convocation of special session of the General Assembly
4. Resolution 46: The Palestine Question (17 Apr 1948) As the United Kingdom is the Mandatory Power, "it is responsible for the maintenance of peace and order in Palestine." The Resolutions also "Calls upon all persons and organizations in Palestine" to stop importing "armed bands and fighting personnel...whatever their origin;...weapons and war materials;...Refrain, pending the future government of Palestine...from any political activity which might prejudice the rights, claims, or position of either community;...refrain from any action which will endager the safety of the Holy Places in Palestine."
5. Resolution 48: The Palestine Question (23 Apr 1948)
6. Resolution 49: The Palestine Question (22 May 1948)
7. Resolution 50: The Palestine Question (29 May 1948)
8. Resolution 53: The Palestine Question (7 Jul 1948)
9. Resolution 54: The Palestine Question (15 Jul 1948)
10. Resolution 56: The Palestine Question (19 Aug 1948)
11. Resolution 57: The Palestine Question (18 Sep 1948)
12. Resolution 59: The Palestine Question (19 Oct 1948)
13. Resolution 60: The Palestine Question (29 Oct 1948)
14. Resolution 61: The Palestine Question (4 Nov 1948)
15. Resolution 62: The Palestine Question (16 Nov 1948)
16. Resolution 66: The Palestine Question (29 Dec 1948)
17. Resolution 72: The Palestine Question (11 Aug 1949)
18. Resolution 73: The Palestine Question (11 Aug 1949)
19. Resolution 89 (17 November 1950): regarding Armistice in 1948 Arab-Israeli War and "transfer of persons".
20. Resolution 92: The Palestine Question (8 May 1951)
21. Resolution 93: The Palestine Question (18 May 1951)
22. Resolution 95: The Palestine Question (1 Sep 1951)
23. Resolution 100: The Palestine Question (27 Oct 1953)
24. Resolution 101: The Palestine Question (24 Nov 1953)
25. Resolution 106: The Palestine Question (29 Mar 1955) 'condemns' Israel for Gaza raid.
26. Resolution 107: The Palestine Question (30 Mar)
27. Resolution 108: The Palestine Question (8 Sep)
28. Resolution 111: " ... 'condemns' Israel for raid on Syria that killed fifty-six people".
29. Resolution 127: " ... 'recommends' Israel suspends its 'no-man's zone' in Jerusalem".
30. Resolution 162: " ... 'urges' Israel to comply with UN decisions".
31. Resolution 171: " ... determines flagrant violations' by Israel in its attack on Syria".
32. Resolution 228: " ... 'censures' Israel for its attack on Samu in the West Bank, then under Jordanian control".
33. Resolution 237: " ... 'urges' Israel to allow return of new 1967 Palestinian refugees".
34. Resolution 242 (November 22, 1967): Termination of all claims or states of belligerency and respect for and acknowledgement of the sovereignty, territorial integrity and political independence of every State in the area. Calls on Israel's neighbors to end the state of belligerency and calls upon Israel to reciprocate by withdraw its forces from land claimed by other parties in 1967 war. Interpreted commonly today as calling for the Land for peace principle as a way to resolve Arab-Israeli conflict
35. Resolution 248: " ... 'condemns' Israel for its massive attack on Karameh in Jordan".
36. Resolution 250: " ... 'calls' on Israel to refrain from holding military parade in Jerusalem".
37. Resolution 251: " ... 'deeply deplores' Israeli military parade in Jerusalem in defiance of Resolution 250".
38. Resolution 252: " ... 'declares invalid' Israel's acts to unify Jerusalem as Jewish capital".
39. Resolution 256: " ... 'condemns' Israeli raids on Jordan as 'flagrant violation".
40. Resolution 259: " ... 'deplores' Israel's refusal to accept UN mission to probe occupation".
41. Resolution 262: " ... 'condemns' Israel for attack on Beirut airport".
42. Resolution 265: " ... 'condemns' Israel for air attacks for Salt in Jordan".
43. Resolution 267: " ... 'censures' Israel for administrative acts to change the status of Jerusalem".
44. Resolution 270: " ... 'condemns' Israel for air attacks on villages in southern Lebanon".
45. Resolution 271: " ... 'condemns' Israel's failure to obey UN resolutions on Jerusalem".
46. Resolution 279: " ... 'demands' withdrawal of Israeli forces from Lebanon".
47. Resolution 280: " ... 'condemns' Israeli's attacks against Lebanon".
48. Resolution 285: " ... 'demands' immediate Israeli withdrawal form Lebanon".
49. Resolution 298: " ... 'deplores' Israel's changing of the status of Jerusalem".
50. Resolution 313: " ... 'demands' that Israel stop attacks against Lebanon".
51. Resolution 316: " ... 'condemns' Israel for repeated attacks on Lebanon".
52. Resolution 317: " ... 'deplores' Israel's refusal to release Arabs abducted in Lebanon".
53. Resolution 332: " ... 'condemns' Israel's repeated attacks against Lebanon".
54. Resolution 337: " ... 'condemns' Israel for violating Lebanon's sovereignty".
55. Resolution 338 (22 October 1973): cease fire in Yom Kippur War
56. Resolution 339 (23 October 1973): Confirms Res. 338, dispatch UN observers.
57. Resolution 347: " ... 'condemns' Israeli attacks on Lebanon".
58. Resolution 425 (1978): " ... 'calls' on Israel to withdraw its forces from Lebanon". Israel's withdrawal from Lebanon was completed as of 16 June 2000.
59. Resolution 350 (31 May 1974) established the United Nations Disengagement Observer Force, to monitor the ceasefire between Israel and Syria in the wake of the Yom Kippur War.
60. Resolution 427: " ... 'calls' on Israel to complete its withdrawal from Lebanon".
61. Resolution 444: " ... 'deplores' Israel's lack of cooperation with UN peacekeeping forces".
62. Resolution 446 (1979): 'determines' that Israeli settlements are a 'serious obstruction' to peace and calls on Israel to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention".
63. Resolution 450: " ... 'calls' on Israel to stop attacking Lebanon".
64. Resolution 452: " ... 'calls' on Israel to cease building settlements in occupied territories".
65. Resolution 465: " ... 'deplores' Israel's settlements and asks all member states not to assist Israel's settlements program".
66. Resolution 467: " ... 'strongly deplores' Israel's military intervention in Lebanon".
67. Resolution 468: " ... 'calls' on Israel to rescind illegal expulsions of two Palestinian mayors and a judge and to facilitate their return".
68. Resolution 469: " ... 'strongly deplores' Israel's failure to observe the council's order not to deport Palestinians".
69. Resolution 471: " ... 'expresses deep concern' at Israel's failure to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention".
70. Resolution 476: " ... 'reiterates' that Israel's claim to Jerusalem are 'null and void'".
71. Resolution 478 (20 August 1980): 'censures (Israel) in the strongest terms' for its claim to Jerusalem in its 'Basic Law'.
72. Resolution 484: " ... 'declares it imperative' that Israel re-admit two deported Palestinian mayors".
73. Resolution 487: " ... 'strongly condemns' Israel for its attack on Iraq's nuclear facility".
74. Resolution 497 (17 December 1981) decides that Israel's annexation of Syria's Golan Heights is 'null and void' and demands that Israel rescinds its decision forthwith.
75. Resolution 498: " ... 'calls' on Israel to withdraw from Lebanon".
76. Resolution 501: " ... 'calls' on Israel to stop attacks against Lebanon and withdraw its troops".
77. Resolution 508:
78. Resolution 509: " ... 'demands' that Israel withdraw its forces forthwith and unconditionally from Lebanon".
79. Resolution 515: " ... 'demands' that Israel lift its siege of Beirut and allow food supplies to be brought in".
80. Resolution 517: " ... 'censures' Israel for failing to obey UN resolutions and demands that Israel withdraw its forces from Lebanon".
81. Resolution 518: " ... 'demands' that Israel cooperate fully with UN forces in Lebanon".
82. Resolution 520: " ... 'condemns' Israel's attack into West Beirut".
83. Resolution 573: " ... 'condemns' Israel 'vigorously' for bombing Tunisia in attack on PLO headquarters.
84. Resolution 587 " ... 'takes note' of previous calls on Israel to withdraw its forces from Lebanon and urges all parties to withdraw".
85. Resolution 592: " ... 'strongly deplores' the killing of Palestinian students at Bir Zeit University by Israeli troops".
86. Resolution 605: " ... 'strongly deplores' Israel's policies and practices denying the human rights of Palestinians.
87. Resolution 607: " ... 'calls' on Israel not to deport Palestinians and strongly requests it to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention.
88. Resolution 608: " ... 'deeply regrets' that Israel has defied the United Nations and deported Palestinian civilians".
89. Resolution 636: " ... 'deeply regrets' Israeli deportation of Palestinian civilians.
90. Resolution 641: " ... 'deplores' Israel's continuing deportation of Palestinians.
91. Resolution 672: " ... 'condemns' Israel for "violence against Palestinians" at the Haram al-Sharif/Temple Mount.
92. Resolution 673: " ... 'deplores' Israel's refusal to cooperate with the United Nations.
93. Resolution 681: " ... 'deplores' Israel's resumption of the deportation of Palestinians.
94. Resolution 694: " ... 'deplores' Israel's deportation of Palestinians and calls on it to ensure their safe and immediate return.
95. Resolution 726: " ... 'strongly condemns' Israel's deportation of Palestinians.
96. Resolution 799: ". . . 'strongly condemns' Israel's deportation of 413 Palestinians and calls for their immediate return.

Roscoe   January 24th, 2009 3:56 am ET

Roscoe January 24th, 2009 326 GMT

Soloman,

Hey, one more time - I'm not going to spend my time reading your sciptures or the jewish sciptures or he chistian scriptures because I do not follow any of these beliefs!

So what is your point here??

Israel should be evicted from the UN?

Israel should be declared a non- state?

What is your point??

I think it's a simple question? No?

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 4:03 am ET

Roscoe.

If you dont understand my point after what I showed you then get lost I dont have time for you..

looks like all the pro so called Israel are vanishing from this blog.

gone until tomorrow.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 4:06 am ET

Solomon,
We did not leave the blog for any reason other than the discussion has
turned into a lot of bashing and name calling. Is that going to help?

Linda   January 24th, 2009 4:08 am ET

BTW, most of the people that has left are Pro-Peace

Roscoe   January 24th, 2009 4:30 am ET

Solomon January 24th, 2009 403 GMT

Roscoe.

If you dont understand my point after what I showed you then get lost I dont have time for you..

looks like all the pro so called Israel are vanishing from this blog.

gone until tomorrow.
**************************************

Tchiao- vou ver speat com você amanhã, mudos merda

Nona   January 24th, 2009 4:46 am ET

Well said, Linda.

Pro-peace people aren't vanishing from the blog. We keep tabs here, but we've just got better things than trade insults, which is what this blog has devolved into. See, people who have healthy productive lives never have enough time, so we must prioritize what activities and people are worth investing in as we work toward achieving our goals, providing for our families, and building secure futures for ourselves and our countries. I'm afraid that's the downside of living a life dedicated to building and contributing to peaceful society - you don't have endless hours to piss away on blogs ranting and raving.

On the other hand, an earnest discussion about peaceful coexistence between honest partners would be a very worthwhile use of our limited time. Both sides would have to be genuinely interested in compromise and solutions. Both sides would have to do some serious compromising and introspection, sacrifice some of their own pride and maybe even admit their own wrongdoing and apologize for it. Each side would have to care about what the other side wants, not just what their side wants. EACH SIDE would have to do that.

But you can't really have dialogue with people who are interested in doing all of the talking and none of the listening, or with those who value the lowest insults more than the honest facts.

We're ready to engage in honest dialogue when we find partners interested in doing the same. Meanwhile, we'll chime in when somebody says something worth commenting on.

DJ   January 24th, 2009 5:04 am ET

If you all talk the way you are on here, what do you expect from your people in Israel and Gaza! Look in the mirror!! Pakistan Pres. said, US don't give enough money to him to fight terrorism. We give them to much for no more than they do.

Itai   January 24th, 2009 6:35 am ET

peace to the middle east!

benyemen   January 24th, 2009 7:43 am ET

GOOOOOOOOOOD MORNIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIG PALESTIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIME

benyemen   January 24th, 2009 7:46 am ET

THE CLOCK IT TICKING TO THE END OF OCCUPATION..........AND END OF ZIONISM......TICK ...TICK....TICK....TICK ...TICK....TICK....TICK ...TICK....TICK....TICK ...TICK....TICK....TICK ...TICK....TICK....TICK ...TICK....TICK....TICK ...TICK....TICK....TICK ...TICK....TICK....BOOOOOOOOOOOOOM

benyemen   January 24th, 2009 7:51 am ET

“Hitler’s legal power was based upon the ‘Enabling Act’, which was passed quite legally by the Reichstag and which allowed the Fuehrer and his representatives, in plain language, to be what they wanted, or in legal language, to issue regulations having the force of law. Exactly the same type of act was passed by the Knesset [Israeli’s Parliament] immediately after the 1967 conquest granting the Israeli governor and his representatives the power of Hitler, which they use in Hitlerian manner.”
Dr. Israel Shahak,

benyemen   January 24th, 2009 7:55 am ET

Jewish history has been tragic to the Jews and no less tragic to the neighboring nations who have suffered them. Our major vice of old as of today is parasitism. We are a people of vultures living on the labor and good fortune of the rest of the world.” -
Samuel Roth, Jews Must Live.

benyemen   January 24th, 2009 7:58 am ET

The Jews have a disproportionate number of mental defectives, idiots, and imbeciles.” -
Dr. Maurice Fishburg.

benyemen   January 24th, 2009 8:01 am ET

“Let us not ignore the truth among ourselves … politically we are the aggressors and they defend themselves… The country is theirs, because they inhabit it, whereas we want to come here and settle down, and in their view we want to take away from them their country.”
– David Ben Gurion,

M Ariely   January 24th, 2009 8:15 am ET

IRLAND HAS WESTERN MENTHALITY

WESTERN MENTHALITY AND POLITIC SOLUTIONS ARE NOT APLICABLE TO THE ME
!!!!!!!!*************!!!!!!!!
Hams leader statement is correct!!

'THE WEST DO NOT UNDERSTAND THE ARAB OR MUSLEM MENTALITY"

!!!!!!!!*************!!!!!!!!

Hamas leader Khaled Mash'a Al-Jazeera TV on February 3, 2006 on Arabic language:

1:The Nation of Islam Will Sit at the Throne of the World, leadership of the world.

2:European countries: Hurry up and apologize to our nation, because if you do not, you will regret it

3:You are fighting against peoples that doest not tire, even after a 1,000 years of fighting , for whom death for the sake of Allah, and for the sake of honor and glory, is preferable to life

3:Pakistan popped up with Islamic nuclear weapons, and they are afraid of Iran and several Arab countries have some chemical weapons

4:We don't want conventional wars. We have imposed a new equation in the war

5:Western world, and in the American administration. Allah has come to them from where they did not expect him

benyemen   January 24th, 2009 8:34 am ET

M ARIETY,

I DON'T GET IT, IF MR. KHALED MESHAAL HAVE SAID THAT, WHAT DOES IT MEAN, LET THE GUY DREAM, OR IS SINFUL TO DREAMS ALSO FOR ARABS?

IF THEY DON'T WANT TO RECOGNISE WHAT IS CALLED ISRAEL AS AN ENTITY, SO LET THEM BE, THEY ARE NOT THE ONLY ONES, PLUS THE UN HAVE CREATED YOU AND YOU ARE A MEMBER THERE, ISN'T THAT ENOUGH, OR YOU WILL HAVE TO SHOVE THAT IN THEIR THROATS ALL PEOPLE WHO DOESN'T RECOGNISE YOU OR MAYBE BOMB THEM AS YOU DID WITH GAZA

WAKE UP PEOPLE OF THE WORLD AND SEE THESE REASONINGS FROM THE ZIONISTS

“Let us not ignore the truth among ourselves … politically we are the aggressors and they defend themselves… The country is theirs, because they inhabit it, whereas we want to come here and settle down, and in their view we want to take away from them their country.”
– David Ben Gurion,

benyemen   January 24th, 2009 8:37 am ET

“There is no such thing as a Palestinian people… It is not as if we came and threw them out and took their country. They didn’t exist.”
– Golda Meir, statement to The Sunday Times, 15 June, 1969.

benyemen   January 24th, 2009 8:42 am ET

“How can we return the occupied territories? There is nobody to return them to.”
– Golda Meir, March 8, 1969.

benyemen   January 24th, 2009 8:46 am ET

“The settlement of the Land of Israel is the essence of Zionism. Without settlement, we will not fulfill Zionism. It’s that simple.”
– Yitzhak Shamir, Maariv, 02/21/1997

benyemen   January 24th, 2009 8:50 am ET

“If we thought that instead of 200 Palestinian fatalities, 2,000 dead would put an end to the fighting at a stroke, we would use much more force…
.”
– Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Barak, quoted in Associated Press, November 16, 2000.

benyemen   January 24th, 2009 8:54 am ET

“When we have settled the land, all the Arabs will be able to do about it will be to scurry around like drugged cockroaches in a bottle.”
Raphael Eitan, Chief of Staff of the Israeli Defence Forces, New York Times, 14 April 1983.

benyemen   January 24th, 2009 8:59 am ET

I WILL BE BACK...........ZIONISTS

Mike   January 24th, 2009 10:37 am ET

It doesn't matter how good the negociator is;If he does'nt go the bottom of things he will not succeed.
I think the U.S. should stop propping up Israel and doing everything they want.Olmert bragged to the world that he forced Bush to back down on a U.N. proposition that would have forced a ceasefire on the Gaza Strip.
GO! Go! Wilson

Mike
Canada

dan perman   January 24th, 2009 11:47 am ET

none of you israel bashers even dared react to this, i wonder why? it is dangerous to post facts here, right?

The Connection between UNRWA and the Palestinian Terror Organizations in the Gaza Strip
14/01/2009

In recent years a vast amount of information has accumulated regarding the gradual takeover of UNRWA (United Nations Relief and Works Agency), the UN relief agency for the Palestinian refugees, by Hamas and other Palestinian terror organizations. Awad al-Kik, a teacher at the UNRWA school, who served simultaneously as the head of the engineering and weapons manufacture unit of Islamic Jihad serves as a prominent example.[1]

It has long been known that UNRWA and the Palestinian leadership are contributing to the perpetuation of the refugee problem and the attendant misery of the refugees. It has been noted that despite the fact that Israel in August 2005 retreated from the Gaza strip, the Palestinian Authority, and presently the Hamas government, did not lift a finger to rehabilitate the Palestinian refugee camps.

The reverse is true: the Palestinian leadership made it crystal clear that the government of the Palestinian Authority would not settle the refugees in the areas of the settlements that had been evacuated. This was done so in order to preserve their “right of return”.

This argument is completely disingenuous, because an amelioration of the refugees’ conditions does not weaken the demand for return or compensation in any shape or manner. It would appear that the interests of the Hamas government and UNRWA dovetail on this matter, namely preventing the dismantlement of the refugee camps, despite the severe privation existing there that promotes extremism, in order to nurture the dream of a return to Palestine, which means Israel.

In recent years a vast amount of information has accumulated regarding the gradual takeover of UNRWA by Hamas and other Palestinian terror organizations. In elections for the UNRWA employees Association on June 14, 2006, Hamas representatives won a resounding victory. Hamas took all 11 seats on the Association allotted to representatives of the 7000 teachers in UNRRA, all 9 of the seats allotted the service sector in UNRWA (physicians, engineers, pharmacists and nurses) and 3 out of the 7 seats allotted the balance of UNRWA employees.

Following the military coup during which Hamas seized power in the Gaza strip (June 2007), there were reports, including from Palestinian human rights organizations, to the effect that armed forces of the Hamas government had taken over institutions belonging to UNRWA in the Gaza Strip and had even housed forces of the Al-Qassam, Brigades, the Hamas military wing, in some of the buildings. Parents of students learning in the UNRWA schools sent a letter to a senior official in UNRWA where they claimed that thousands of teachers belonging to the Al-Qassam brigades were teaching in a UN agency’s school. They demanded that an emergency investigation be conducted on the matter.

One of the striking examples illustrating that UNRWA has become a hospitable organisation for Palestinian terror organisations was unveiled during the attack by the Israeli Air Force that targeted a weapons manufacture workshop in Rafah. Among those Killed in the attack was Awad al-Kik (Abu Mohammed), a teacher, educator and UNRRA school principal in Rafah who simultaneously served as the head of Islamic Jihad’s engineering and weapons manufacture unit in the southern Gaza strip.

Al-Kik was born in the Jebalya refugee camp and lived in the Rafah refugee camp. He studied at UNRWA schools and excelled in chemistry and physics. After he had completed his academic studies at Al-Azhar University, Al-Kik began a teaching career at the UNRWA schools and rapidly ascended the professional ladder. At a relatively young age he was appointed vice principal of the Ibn Sina elementary school and was subsequently chosen by UNRWA to serve as principal of junior high school “E” until he was killed in an Israeli air force attack.

Already as a high school student, al-Kik joined Islamic Jihad and was active in the high school and college Islamic Jihad student’s organization (Al-Jamaa Al-Islamiyya). He subsequently joined the Jerusalem Squads, the military wing of the organization.

Al-Kik’s technological training was fully exploited in the framework of his activity. Al-Kik was one of the senior operatives in charge of manufacturing and developing rockets for Islamic Jihad, preparing explosive charges and war materiel as well as training generations of “engineers” on the basis of the knowledge that he had accumulated.

In the summer of 2006 al-Kik visited China where he displayed an interest in light aircraft, possibly for the purpose of purchase/manufacture in order to commit a terror attack against Israel.

Al-Kik’s activity in the realm of terror was exposed in September 2007, when he escaped an Israeli assassination attempt. Nevertheless, he continued to serve as a teacher, educator and school principal for UNRWA and involved in educating children and youths in summer camps. It is not clear why after his terror activity had been exposed UNRWA refrained from sacking him from any educational and teaching post at its institutions.

There is little justification for UNRWA’s existence if the organization views its entire purpose as preserving the misery of the refugees in the camps. However beyond this the affair of the “terrorist educator” and the Hamas takeover of the UNRWA institutions and work staff should trigger a “warning light” with regard to the possibility that funds transferred to UNRWA by the donor states (including the United States and Canada) find their way to financing the salaries of Hamas and Islamic Jihad activists.

This matter requires an urgent investigation, and in any case, UNRWA would be well advised to channel hundreds of millions of dollars from its budget to clear out the refugee camps and rehabilitate their inhabitants in new and more spacious towns. The donor states should pose this as a preliminary condition to their continued assistance to UNRWA.

——————————————————————————–

[1] http://www.alquds.com/node/23120

benyemen   January 24th, 2009 1:47 pm ET

MIKE

Olmert bragged to the world that he forced Bush to back down on a U.N. proposition that would have forced a ceasefire on the Gaza Strip.
GO! Go! Wilson
***************************************************************************

THAT BUT IS ONE OF THEIR UNASHAMED WAYS OF PUTTING THINGS, THEY THINK THEY CAN LIE TO THE WHOLE WORLD ALL THE TIMES.

Debra   January 24th, 2009 2:16 pm ET

Where are you from? Where are you living now? Why did you leave?

Xavier   January 24th, 2009 2:19 pm ET

It doesn't matter. The Arab world doesn't want peace. In the words of Hassan Nasrallah "we will win because the Jews love life, we (the Muslims) love death".

Not too much talk of peace there. Perpetual war maybe. The Arabs need to come out of the middle-ages, drop the Salah-Adin imagery, and grow up.

Also, if you don't want to be bombed, don't shoot at Israel!!! Are you really that stupid? If you shoot at a country, there will be consequences.

Stop crying and take the consequences like men. If you want war, then shut-up and swallow it. If you want peace, which you don't then you have to stop shooting. Morons.

Beny   January 24th, 2009 3:42 pm ET

Thank you Xavier. Straight and simple.

Son of Yemen, TALKING IN BOLD LETTERS only illustrates the stupidity of someone who screams and yells rather than discussing.

dan perman   January 24th, 2009 3:45 pm ET

hey beny

i am waiting to hear from you

you notice how the israel bashers carry on serious discussins, by negating verifyable facts

dan perman   January 24th, 2009 3:46 pm ET

facts:

Since the beginning of the Israeli operation in Gaza:
- 53,647 tons of humanitarian supplies have been transferred to Gaza in 2,084 trucks as well as 3,162,351 liters of fuel.
- 3000 units of blood and 20 ambulances were donated.
- 681 dual nationals were evacuated from Gaza.
- 68 people were evacuated to Israel for medical treatment.

much of the supplies were hijacked by hamas and can now be bought for lots of money on gaza markets

Debra   January 24th, 2009 3:51 pm ET

It is really a shame people can't get along! Terrorists will be terrorist!! And if they are willing to die for their cause there is no hope. I wish there was hope for the people over there. Countries have been fighting back and forth between each other as long as I can remember. The governments of those countries have the say in the matter and generally what they say goes. We can voice our opinion and that 's about all. Not much, only one person can do!

dan perman   January 24th, 2009 3:52 pm ET

again:
A short film presenting visual evidence of the long-standing Hamas tactic of exploiting civilians as human shields, and civilians buildings as cover for terrorist attacks.

http://switch3.castup.net/cunet/gm.asp?ai=58&ar=HamasExploitationofCiviliansV&ak=null

Beny   January 24th, 2009 3:59 pm ET

Hey Dan,

I got your mail. Did Linda tell you what I asked her to? Sorry for the lack of response, one day I will beat my laziness. February is looming, and that's going to be a meat-grinding month.

Ah... the Israel bashers. Solomon called me a Nazi (for the 26th time), this time because I am not willing to give up my demand for ensuring 100% Israel's safety. Then he repeats the 60-year-old Husseini-PLO-Hamas mantra of giving up everything, including Jerusalem, non-negotiable.

Are negotiations (REAL ones, not like the one I described) even possible? Or are the Palestinians doomed to beating their heads against Israel's existence and whining about it to the world?

dan perman   January 24th, 2009 4:22 pm ET

linda said you'd write me when you have time

Tony Larue   January 24th, 2009 4:44 pm ET

About the Professor,

Regardless of how some of you deride and insult the Professor, he is well informed, fair and educated. Thank you for your blogs Professor .

Having said that, There are rational voices submitting blogs on both sides which makes for good reading.

My only concern, however, is that Mr Obama is going to find himself in the same "modus operandi' as previous administrations which may "fortell"another Gaza and that maybe too ghastly to contemplate.

Israel has to make some concrete, meaningful and lasting changes and so does Hamas.

When Jimmy Carter applied the same conditions in Gaza as in some created black home states in aparthied South Africa some diagreed but most agreed with him. Then again, he is no longer the President of the United States.

I am also reminded of Sam Cooke's 1964 balad "A Change Is Gonna Come" yes it wil yes it will. Please God let it come for all our sakes for
the world cannot afford to have another "Gaza"

dan perman   January 24th, 2009 4:51 pm ET

"the Professor, he is well informed, fair and educated."

especially when he disregards facts and calls anybody who does not agree with him "nazi"

get a life tony!!

benyemen   January 24th, 2009 5:20 pm ET

XAVIER

YES WE ARE WINNERS IN THIS WORLD OR THE LIFE AFTER, ANY OBJECTION? AND YES WE DON'T WANT PEACE WITH OUR OCCUPIERS, I THINK IT'S CTYSTAL CLEAR SO WHAT DO YOU WANT?

Beny   January 24th, 2009 5:21 pm ET

Tony,

If False Prof is so well informed and educated, then he should have no trouble describing the 'occupation' he accuses me of. So far all I've got is 30 repetitions of "Zionist Nazi Beny" (Thanks for the 'Zionist' compliment, btw, but why the Nazifying?) and three times the "it's the occupation, stupid".

Having said that, let's move on to the rest of your comment.

"Israel has to make some concrete, meaningful and lasting changes and so does Hamas."

Therein lies the problem. Hamas are nothing more than a military wing of Iran, paid to fight. An example of that is how, when they were severely beaten last month, part of Hamas that's in Gaza, for the first time disconnected from their Irani masters, agreed to a cease-fire (Haniya's bunker speech) while the part in Damascus, close to their Irani masters and distanced from the reality of Gaza, called to "keep up fighting until the bitter end" (Mashaal's Damascus speech).

Hamas were once a branch of the Muslim Brotherhood, but now they are exclusively paid, supported and operated by Iran. And Iran wants as much war here as possible.

The change from the Arab side needs to come in the form of electing and supporting a smart, pragmatic and cooperative government that actually CARES for them, and not Irani-operated terrorist groups.

Also, what changes do you say Israel should make?

"the world cannot afford to have another “Gaza”"
What do you mean? If what happened in Gaza, 400 civilians dead, must not happen to the world again, then should we not direct ourselves to places where it is happening daily for years, like Darfur?

Or do you mean that a city whose only infrastructure is weapon tunnels, whose education system relies on preaching hatred and sending 14-year-olds to blow up, whose religious places are little more than weapon storaging facilities, whose civilian population has only one purpose- to serve as human shields, that such a city cannot be allowed? True dat.

P.S. Please, don't talk to me about Jimmy Carter. He wrote a book about the mideast. Weeks after publishing a research paper came out showing explicitly, with proof, ALL of the lies he wrote. And he wrote a lot of lies. That man has absolutely no credibility when it comes to this place.

Tony Larue   January 24th, 2009 5:41 pm ET

Dan Perman,

You are a fine example why I read Professor's blogs even though I do not agree with him at all times.

I know one thing though, another "Gaza" and we are all screwed. Then if you and I are still around athen you can then tell me to "get a life"

dan perman   January 24th, 2009 6:05 pm ET

and this is what the "professor"s" handler had to say:

From interview with former Hamas foreign minister Mahmoud A-Zahar (21 Aug 2007): Rocket barrage of Sderot is Hamas strategy.

The interviewer asked why Hamas chose to stop suicide bombings two years ago.

A-Zahar: "Which do you think is more effective, martyrdom operations or rockets against Sderot? Rockets against Sderot will cause mass migration, greatly disrupt daily lives and government administration and can make a much huger impact on the government. We are using the methods that convince the Israelis that their occupation is costing them too much."

"We are succeeding with the rockets. We have no losses and the impact on the Israeli side is so much."

dan perman   January 24th, 2009 6:09 pm ET

Statistics of Kassam rocket and mortar fire from the Gaza Strip

Total rocket attacks:

Since the first rocket fell on Israel on 16 April 2001: 4,067
Since the Israeli withdrawal from the Gaza Strip in August 2005: 3,484
Since the Hamas takeover of Gaza in mid-June 2007: 2,046
Last year (2008): 1,571

Mortar bomb hits since April 2001: 4,183

alltogether:over 8200 projectiles

am I making this up, Tony?

dan perman   January 24th, 2009 6:16 pm ET

and what's your solution Tony?

the professo's solution, i.e. the disappearance of israel?

tough, but israel will not disappear

hamas solution, more rockets, more kidnappings, more suicide bombers?

and you think that israel will put up with this? think again!!!

Linda   January 24th, 2009 6:35 pm ET

Hi Dan!
I just mailed you!

Beny   January 24th, 2009 6:46 pm ET

Dan,

Hamas didn't stop the suicide bombers. They moved much of their strategy to rely on the rockets because they are cheaper and foolproof.

Nevertheless, Hamas do still keep sending suicide bombers. Not an organized way lkie the rockets, but still. What's stopping them?
a) Shabak and Intellingence work to stop them before they're sent (that's all the news about "a bombing has been prevented by the security services).
b) Soldiers at checkpoints looking for weapons and arresting upon finding.
c) (in the West Bank)- police operations.
Altogether, everyone is working overtime (and doing great) to stop the suicide bombers. Don't think they're gone. What happened in Dimona not long ago reminds us all that we still need to be careful of suicide bombers.

Beny   January 24th, 2009 6:49 pm ET

You probably know all that, I just wanted to reinforce a point that is blurred by your last comment. Nothing against you.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 6:53 pm ET

Hi Beny!

dan perman   January 24th, 2009 6:55 pm ET

beny

that was from an interview he gave and is from th misrad hachuz website, it's not my own

mooshy   January 24th, 2009 7:18 pm ET

hello everybody

Linda   January 24th, 2009 7:19 pm ET

Hi mooshy

mooshy   January 24th, 2009 7:21 pm ET

ok
I think that the israeli/palestinian conflict has to end in a way or in another.This has been a too long dispute over land.
The rationale behind enering this blog is to try to figure out solutions and dabate over key issue with a kind of widom.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 7:23 pm ET

Agreed Mooshy

mooshy   January 24th, 2009 7:24 pm ET

I think we should forget about points of divergence and focus on humanity.
As a starting point, we should first characterise the reason behind the conflict.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 7:26 pm ET

Mooshy,
It looks as though we have another person here with some common sense.
A lot of us on this blog feel the same way. We have left the blog because
of the trash talking and name calling.
I have just popped back in.
Good to have you.

mooshy   January 24th, 2009 7:28 pm ET

the conflict in this region has entered a new phase in an atmosphere of a palestinian internal conflict, an israeli unprecedented mass-killing, and an arab-arab disagreement.

all these variables further complicate an already complex issue.

mooshy   January 24th, 2009 7:31 pm ET

linda
good to have you too.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 7:35 pm ET

This entire issue has been such a complicated issue. There is not just one or two reasons that
all of this is happening. They have to give and take on both sides.
The killing one either side is unprecedented to me. I do not like to see
anyone killed or injured. Now we have to figure out what the international
community can do to keep this from happening, and for both side to be able to have
a peaceful life.
What is your plan, Mooshy?

mooshy   January 24th, 2009 7:37 pm ET

i really sympathize with Mitchell for the mission he has to manage. im an an optimistic person; thats why i will not say "mission impossible".

Linda   January 24th, 2009 7:40 pm ET

It is good to have another optimist on this blog, as you can see, the dicussions here really detriorate sometimes. It doesn't seem helpful to me.

Beny   January 24th, 2009 7:40 pm ET

Hi Mooshy,

Y'know, I was gonna go to sleep, but a rational voice enters this blog...how could I resist?

Now, "an israeli unprecedented mass-killing" never had, indeed, any precedent by Israel. But look at our neighbors and you will see things that if they were a precedent to this, Gaza would be gone.

As for the "Arab-Arab" disagreement, it's pretty mild a name for a civil war that is going on still (public executions) and claimed almost as many civilian lives as this attack has.

Anyway, you entering this blog means that you have some "magic solution" that if only people would listen to you! Don't try do deny it, everyone has it. That's how real solutions are made- by merging personal ideas.
So what;s yours?

Beny   January 24th, 2009 7:41 pm ET

Hi Mooshy,

Y'know, I was gonna go to sleep, but a rational voice enters this blog...how could I resist?

Now, "an israeli unprecedented mass-killing" never had, indeed, any precedent by Israel. But look at our neighbors and you will see things that if they were a precedent to this, Gaza would be gone.

As for the "Arab-Arab" disagreement, it's pretty mild a name for a civil war that is going on still (public executions) and claimed almost as many civilian lives as this attack has.

Anyway, you entering this blog means that you have some "magic solution" that if only people would listen to you! Don't try do deny it, everyone has it. That's how real solutions are made- by merging personal ideas.
So what's yours?

mooshy   January 24th, 2009 7:46 pm ET

Linda
im an expert on international politics, but according to the data i have, i should say that the views are too different .
Palestinians want israelis to give up what they occupied in 1967 by force and the return of the palestinians to their homes where they used to live in 1948 (for them "even to Abbas!!!", this is a red line).

Israelis may retreat back from the 1967 territory (colonies should be taken into consideration), but the question of the palestinians who were expelled by force from the 1948 land is out of question.

Linda
To me , the problem is too deep, and this explains the tempo and the anger in this blog.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 7:47 pm ET

Hi Beny!
Glad you came back

Linda   January 24th, 2009 7:49 pm ET

But Mooshy,
Israel is not going anywhere, and some say the land before 1948 and some say the land before 1968.
So, since Israel is not going anywhere, there had to be some other solution.

Beny   January 24th, 2009 7:50 pm ET

Mooshy,

So you are putting the return of the Palestinian refugees at the basis of all negotiations?

Nona   January 24th, 2009 7:52 pm ET

Hi Mooshy. Welcome.

Do you believe Israel has a right to exist? Because that's in many ways the starting point. Many here on this blog (and others, such as Hamas) talk about "the occupation," but they mean the existinence of Israel is an occupation and that "Palestinian" lands are no longer occupied when Israel no longer exists.

I think before anybody starts negotiating, everybody has to figure out what they agree on. There has to be a baseline starting point or both sides.

Do you believe Israel has a right to exist and to live in peace, unmolested by its neighbors, who would then in turn expect to live in peace unmolested by Israel?

Linda   January 24th, 2009 7:53 pm ET

Nona!

Nona   January 24th, 2009 7:53 pm ET

Oh, hi Linda, Beny, Dan!

mooshy   January 24th, 2009 7:57 pm ET

Beny
i always try to be an objective external observer.
in fact, i dont have any magic solution.i said to linda that the first sensible step to do is to characterize the real cause behind the conflict.
the palestinian-palestinian civil war (and i think you are right) is another problem that aggravates the mission of Mitchell.

i used the term mass-killing because of the international reports of humanitarian organisations, human rights organisms and media reports .these are not term that i use for personal motives.
we should be clear on these basics beny.
i try not to offend anybody; im for discussion, not disinformation.

Beny   January 24th, 2009 8:01 pm ET

Hey Linda,

Did you read my last mail from a few days back?

Mooshy,

Sh*t happens. People lose their homes. Even though it was all thanks to the war Husseini declared in 1947. People resettle. Hundreds of thousands of Jews lost their homes in Europe after the Holocaust and resettled. Hundreds of thousands of Jews were kicked out of the Muslim states like Iran, Iraq and Syria in 1948. They resettled.

We are offering the Palestinians a chance to resettle barely 20 km from where their grandparents used to live. We cannot accept them into our population, as it is both against the Law of Return (one of Israel's fundamental laws) and undermines the whole purpose of Israel- to create a state where the Jews are a majority, and not subject to someone else's whims.

Neigher can we cut out a neighborhood from Yaffo, for example, to be given to the Palestinian state.

And why do they need to be Israeli citizens anyway? When they haev their state alongside ours (and that will happen when they elect a peaceful, pragmatic and cooperative government), why can't they live there? It's not as if they have some kind of special connection to this place.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 8:04 pm ET

Beny, I mailed you today!

mooshy   January 24th, 2009 8:06 pm ET

nona
definitely yes, israel has the right to exist. no question about that.the problem in the region is where .
i think the territory before the 1967 war will be a good solution.

concerning the other question,yes all human beings deserve to live in peace.

Beny
when i said that the return of the 1948 palestinians is crucial, i was not talking about myself. i was just exposing facts as they are.
you mentioned the civil war between hamas and plo; you know beny that the two factions actually agree that the return of the above mentioned people is a red line for both sides.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 8:12 pm ET

Mooshy,
Since you are an expert in international studies, do you agree that the return of Palestianian people to Israeli land will never happen?
So where does it go from there? This land belongs to the Israeli's, so there has to be another solution.
I also don't understand why some people say "our land". It is not their land and never was.
Their ancestors my have lived there, but that does not mean that it belongs to them. Who know, for all we know, the grandparents of these
people may have sold that land if there had not been a war, so it would have belonged to someone else anyway.
Just my thoughts

mooshy   January 24th, 2009 8:12 pm ET

beny
would they accept what you say?
I know they will say no. this means the conflict will not end.

harvey   January 24th, 2009 8:17 pm ET

Guys,

Lovely to check in tonight and see that no one is hurling insults....I think the 2 state solution is one which works....and one which the Americans seem to be pushing too.

Beny   January 24th, 2009 8:18 pm ET

Hi Nona! Missed you here!

Mooshy,

I try to be as objective as I can under the circumstances, but I can never be an "external observer" for a very simple reason: I live here. Town of Rehovot (23km south of Tel Aviv), state of Israel. Nice to meet ya.

As for characterizing the "real cause" behind this conflict, I believe it is doomed for failure. This conflict has more causes than the times I've been called a Nazi.

Hamas's current war for our destruction is little more than Iran's external policies, feeding off the despair of the Palestinians. They have no goal but our destruction, and the Palestinians are for them naught but cannon fodder to be used as they will.

From the Israeli side, you see someone you tried to talk to for 60 years, and it always exploded in your face. No place is safe. We cannot turn our back on them, or the next bus bombing is a certainty. We're paranoid, and justly so.

The Palestinian side, after the 60 years of unimaginable suffering their leaders (and some stupidity by some of our leaders helped a bit too, I'll admit) brought on them, sees the soldier not letting him pass through the checkpoint, and hates him to the bones. They're desperate, and justly so.

I've already named three causes for this conflict, each illustrating one of the sides of this conflict, and there are many more.

Lastly, please note that I have absolutely no wish to offend you. When I'm aggressive in my comments, it's just because I'm an argument addict.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 8:21 pm ET

Harvey! Great to see you!
I'm keeping my nickname!

Nona   January 24th, 2009 8:21 pm ET

Thank you, Mooshy.

So, next question: how can good-faith negotiations realistically occur when one side (Israel) is negotiating for its survival with a partner (Hamas) that is committed to its (Israel's) destruction?

I don't find the "cause of the conflict" to be nearly as relevant to negotiating a lasting peace as finding some common ground in the both sides' vision of end results.

JMO.

Nona   January 24th, 2009 8:22 pm ET

:::::::::waving to Harvey!::::::::::::::

harvey   January 24th, 2009 8:23 pm ET

Beny,

Like you I live here. Like you I feel a little bit upset by continually having abuse hurled at me. Like you al I want to do is bring up my kids in peace and prosperity/ Like you I believe that the Palestinian people want the same thinmgs and should have the same things.

Before we can talk to anyone though we need them to recognise our right to exist.

We want a partner in a peace process not a neighbour who is dedicated to our total eradication and destruction.

Beny   January 24th, 2009 8:26 pm ET

Mooshy,

"I know they will say no. this means the conflict will not end."

And I know, or at least hope, that Israel will not agree to letting 2 million Palestinians inside. Doing that will be the destruction of Israel as a Jewish state. No thanks.

So basically, if we want to have this solved, someone's gonna have to give in on this issue. I explained why it should not be Israel.

harvey   January 24th, 2009 8:28 pm ET

Hi Nona....

As usual pleasure to read your views....

mooshy   January 24th, 2009 8:29 pm ET

Linda
you asked many questions at the same time, but ill try to answer according to what i know.
first, im not a future strategist to know whether they will return or not.
whether the land belong to israelis or palestinians is a matter of current and extensive debate.
whether they say "their land" or not is their business.
the question of selling lands is also a debatable issue.

linda
i told you that the problem is complicated.

harvey   January 24th, 2009 8:32 pm ET

I think if you believe in a 2 state solution you cannot then allow all fefugees to return. That undermines the 2 state solution as it means you will end up with 2 arab majorities, one in a Jewish run country. So defeats object.

As said happy for 2 state solution similar to precedent of majority Hindu India and majority Muslim Pakistan....

Beny   January 24th, 2009 8:34 pm ET

Hi Harvey! Can't agree with you more. Living in quiet is what two of the sides (not both because, like I said, there are at least 3 sides) want.

Like you, even though considering myself "Yemani", I support a 2-state solution. (I demand some harsh security arrangements with it).

That is what angers me most. I truly believe that most people in Gaza just want to live to see tomorrow, and to hells with the 'resistance'. And a bunch of Irani-paid warmongers are thrashing everyone's hopes.

mooshy   January 24th, 2009 8:35 pm ET

beny
its ok.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 8:36 pm ET

Mooshy,
You seem to think that I am uneducated. I think I know more than you are giving me credit for.
Of course, all of these issues are up for extensive debate. That is a big issue in itself.
There is not clear cut answers, but do we not have to start from today? You can not live your life looking back and trying to get something from someone that you THINK you deserve.
See, we can sit here and say what we want, be educated, and have our lives, but we are looking at it from an outsiders perspective.
Harvey, Benny, and Dan live it every day. It is their reality. And if the Palestinians say "their land" or not is a big part of the problem

Nona   January 24th, 2009 8:40 pm ET

What about the right of return for the 400,000+ Jews who were kicked out of Arab countries (where their families in many cases had lived for thousands of years) and whose property was seized in without compensation in 1948, who fled to Israel and were resettled by the land of Israel and not stuck in some "refugee camp" by their brethren to rot and cry for the next 5 decades?

Do those Jews have the right to go back to Iraq, Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Yemen, etc. and whip out the key to their great-grandfather's house and throw out whoever lives there 60 years later? Or whatever business or school or mosque is there 60 years later?

It's a rhetorical question and I don't really expect an answer. But the fact is that as Palestinians were fleeing Israel upon the partition, Jews were evicted from Arab countries in rather equal numbers. There was a remarkably equal exchange of populations and property. Why is only the Palestinian right of return an issue? (Again, rhetorical question.)

Linda   January 24th, 2009 8:41 pm ET

Nona,
You said that so well

harvey   January 24th, 2009 8:43 pm ET

Beny,

Funny that both of us who live here seem to see it the same way.

I constantly think why can't we just live and let live. When will the killing and the hatred and the blame game stop....????

Trying to explain to my little girl why her brothers and cousins have to go to fight, she comes out with, "Why can't we just share????" And you know what, she is right.....
It doesn't matter about who was here first, who has better claim,, who is right or who is wrong. What matters is what we do, how we treat one another and giving each other the respect that each side deseves.

I really believe that all of us want the same for our children....have to believe it, otherwise there is no hope, just destruction.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 8:44 pm ET

Call me crazy, but I do not understand why someone can call themselves refugees after 60 years. They do not have a good life in those welfare camps, but they could have gone out and made a life
for themselves. They chose to sit there and not better themselves.
Not to mention, they chose to spread their legs and have a lot of children that they could not take care of. There is no logic in that.
Everyone on the planet knows what causes pregnancy, and if you are a refugee, why continue that type of lifestyle for the next generation?
Of course people have the right to multiply if they want, but then you can't blame everyone else for your decisions.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 8:47 pm ET

Harvey,
Your little girl is very wise. I love to hear things from a childs perspective. It is so simple, but true.
I wish I could believe that all people want what you want for your children. I feel if that were true, this attitude of "kill your neighbor" would have been abolished a long time ago.
Just my thoughts again

mooshy   January 24th, 2009 8:48 pm ET

anyway, i see that killing all these civilians that way was very shocking to the international community.
this is not good for israel as a state.

harvey   January 24th, 2009 8:51 pm ET

Linda,

I also think that the Palestinian refugees were not helped and indeed were ignored by their fellow Arabs. The oil rich Arab nations did not channell their billions into helping the refugees. Instead the Arab nations preferred to keep them in a state of perpetual poverty as a kind of propoganda fodder to accuse Israel with.

Jewish refugees after the war were helped by their people to make new lives....

I think the opportunity exists now for us as Jews and Israelis to turn round to the Arab nations and say,... lets team together and help these refugees create a new State for themselves. New home with secure border next to us. And let us and the Arabs work to help them do so.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 8:51 pm ET

I wasn't shocked. I'm ex-military though. I said before, it someone fires rockets at you, you pick up a bigger weapon.
You make sure you think long and hard about doing it again. Hamas knew they were going to get a giant flyswatter brought down upon
them and the people of Gaza. It was more PR than anything on their side.
Israel had a clear enemy, and they dealt with them. I hated to see anyone
Die, but Hamas was the cause of it, not Israel

Linda   January 24th, 2009 8:53 pm ET

Harvey,
Agreed!

dan perman   January 24th, 2009 8:55 pm ET

hi everybody

are you sure this is the same blog? no bashing, no cursing only reasonable discussion? what happened :-)

mooshy

israel occupied the west bank and Gaza from jordan and egypt, who occupied it since 1948. the pre 1967 israeli borders existed only in the north (lebanon) and the south (egypt), the eastern line was the ceasefire line of 1949. According to the rhodes ceasefire agreements, signed by the arabs, the final borders should be determined by negotiations. we all know how much negotiations teh arabs did in the last 60 years with israel.

refugees forcibly kicked out of israel in 1948?

let's put some order into this mess. although it has now been established that some of the about 400,000 that left israel were kicked out, many heeded the calls of the arab leaders to make room for the arab armies throwing the jews into the sea and to return with the victorious arab armies. tough, it did not work out that way and israel has no reason to apologize for winning.

why is it that in the history of wars only israel is asked to give back land and accept refugees (the arabd want israel to accept 4 milluion, the original 400 000 as well astheir kids, and kids kids, cousins, uncles and boyfriends!!)

i neverv heard anybody asking to let the germans go back to danzig, breslau and koenigsberg. or the indians to manhattan? or the mexicans to california, new mexico and texas? why the israelis? why not the poles to all the territory russia took away? why the israelis, and only the israelis? can you explain, please? and linda, it's about 1 million jewish refugees from arab states that fled to israel

Linda   January 24th, 2009 8:56 pm ET

Dan! glad you came back, I wondered where you went!
yes, great debate, what a nice change

harvey   January 24th, 2009 8:57 pm ET

Mooshy,

You are right....but I would rather have the worlds condemnation and have my kids and family and people safe than the worlds sympathy as HAMAS wipes us all out.

Seriously do you think I want to send my boys into Gaza? Definitely not....but till the bombs stop raining on us, don't have much choice. I want to be left in peace. We are all tired of war and blood. Just let us be and we will let you be. But, if people seek to destroy us, wipe us out entirely, refuse to rcognise our right to live, what choice do I have other than send my boys to the army????

Nona   January 24th, 2009 8:57 pm ET

You're right, Mooshy. The civilian casualties that result from Operation Cast Lead are not good for Israel as a state.

Neither is letting 11,000 rockets fly across its borders with no attempt to stop them.

Israel's in a no-win situation from a tactical level, but it's in a must-win situation from strategic level. Its survival depends on it.

Israel is left with no good answers except to do what it must to survive amidst neighbors who are hell-bent on its destruction.

Linda - you are NOT crazy. I agree with your assessment of the refugee situation 100%. What IS crazy is that the "Arab brothers" who claim to be so concerned and so outraged on behalf of these people go to such extraordinary lengths to keep them in this very situation, and have done so relatively unchallenged for 60+ years.

Saudi Arabia and Kuwait alone just gave more than $1.5 billion to rebuild Gaza. Will be interesting to see how much of that goes to actually rebuilding Gaza, how much goes to arms and gun-running activities, and how much goes straight into the Swiss bank accounts of Palestinian "advocates" such as Meshaal.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 8:59 pm ET

Dan,
Yes, the jewish people fled to Israel, and that was my point about the Palestinian refugees, why did they not go and create a life, instead of
staying in a camp for all of these years. Who else has done that? They chose that life, and now they blame Israel for it.

dan perman   January 24th, 2009 9:01 pm ET

mooshy

now let's talk about "all that killing of civilians"

yes, civilians were killed. but i got news for you: war is hell.

CNN and all other news channels showed rockets being fired from gaza. did you take a good look from where they were fired? i did. it was crystall clear that they werev fired out of densly built up areas.

so what was israel supposed to do? suffer another 8 years of missiles and mortars and hope the un would help? try the terrorists in absentia? or execise their right to selfdefense?

civilians were killed, yes, but the numbers are in great dispute. the corriera de la serra reported that adoctor in a gaza hospital put the number of dead att aboou 600!!

even if they were double taht number, do you really think that if israel would have deliberately targeted civilians, as hamas do, the death toll would have not been around 50,000? after all, israel used helicopters and F16s and artillery. or could it be that israel tried to avoid civilian casualties as much as possible in a war? think about it for a moment

mooshy   January 24th, 2009 9:02 pm ET

linda
who said you were an uneducated woman?
Palestinians have never agreed to start from today, and as far as i know, they will never.this may seem upsetting for you, linda, but this is reality.
Israel has killed many civilians; this will only complicate the situation in the future.
harvey and the other decent israeli citizens live under continuous threat, but this is part of the overall structure of the conflict.that s why , i say that israrelis should be very careful about what they do.

Nona
i suggest they sue the people who expelled them and im sure they will return to the arab states where they used to live. besides, many jewish people left to israel because they wanted to.

Harvey
your kids are right, but sharing needs really painful concessions from israel.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 9:04 pm ET

I can tell you from a military point of view that Israel put their own soldiers in harms way to try and keep civilians deaths as low as possible.
Israel could have went in there in one fail swoop, from the air, and taken it all out.
So I do think Israel showed a lot of restraint when it came to executing their mission.

harvey   January 24th, 2009 9:05 pm ET

Mooshy,

The important thing now is where do we go in the peace process? How can we move forward?

I think there is a new dynamic in place with the new US administration...the "yes we can" principle can be transported to us here....

dan perman   January 24th, 2009 9:05 pm ET

"i suggest they sue the people who expelled them and im sure they will return to the arab states where they used to live."

what? are you serious?

Roscoe   January 24th, 2009 9:06 pm ET

Civilian casualties--

One thing has puzzled me throughout this recent conflict. Hamas continued to hide among the population, launch rockets from the rooftops of the homes, schools and Mosques. Yet the civilians allow and provide for this. They claim to have no place to go.
The fact is 1/3 of the Gaza Strip is uninhabited arable farmland. Why is it that the population has not left the urban areas and gone to the farm lands??? Why is it that the UN and the ICRC, if they are truly so concerned for the welfare of the civilian population, have not established refugee camps- tent cities- in the farmlands in the Gaza strip??? They do this all the time in African countries in order to provide a safe haven for those seeking refuge and fleeing violent conflict. They provide huge tent cities for refugees. The UN and ICRC have made no effort whatsoever to provide safe haven for these people.

Wonder why that is?? Maybe it’s because that would leave the militants unprotected??? No Shields?? What’s wrong with this picture??

Beny   January 24th, 2009 9:06 pm ET

Linda,

Technically, a refugee is someone who has no place to go. So they are refugees.

But blaming it on Israel is ignorance at best, propaganda at worst.

Israel had no problems with them living here.
Israel did not force them into that war for Israel's destruction that cost them their homes.
Israel did not force them to throw away all the resources they had on rockets instead of houses.
Israel did not force Jordan (majority Palestinian) to massacre them, nor does it force any other country to reject them.
Israel is the only one with a valid reason not to accept them as citizens.
When their own brothers-in-faith would nt accept them, what good will coming to Israel do?

Not every refugee has to return to the place his grandparents lived in, otherwise you would see Jews in waves of thousands over Europe and the Muslim countries.

People move. People resettle. Killing over a grain of sand when you can have the one beside it is inexplicable.

harvey   January 24th, 2009 9:07 pm ET

Mooshy,

Believe me we are happy to make those painful concessions. Just we need a partner to concede to, not an implacable enemy who wants to wipe us out.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 9:10 pm ET

Mooshy,
I said that you seem to think that I am uneducated. Just like this last post of yours. You seem very condescending to me.
I know that the Palestinians have never agreed to start from today, and that is what everyone needs to do to move forward.
The does not seem upsetting to me, and I know it is reality, but maybe they need to get out of the stone ages and create a new reality.
If the Palestinians do not change their way of thinking, the next time the rockets fly into Israel, Israel may not show as much restraint.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 9:12 pm ET

beny, I agree

mooshy   January 24th, 2009 9:12 pm ET

dan
ghazza is an overpopulated area; using artillery will undoubtedly kill civilians.
i totally disagree with hamas launching rockets ,too.

dan perman   January 24th, 2009 9:14 pm ET

so waht would be your solution to, say the hamas charter?

harvey   January 24th, 2009 9:16 pm ET

mooshy,

sounds like you too would be prepared to make painful concessions forpeace.

Nona   January 24th, 2009 9:16 pm ET

Mooshey, you say, "Nona ... i suggest they sue the people who expelled them and im sure they will return to the arab states where they used to live. besides, many jewish people left to israel because they wanted to."

Just curious, but why aren't you suggesting that Palestinians sue the people who expelled them? And many Palestinians left Israel because they wanted to - barely 30% ever encountered an Israeli soldier upon their departure. Many Israelis, in fact, urged them to stay, such as some of the workers unions.

I don't understand the double standard. Not trying to be argumentative but am trying to see the difference.

Beny   January 24th, 2009 9:23 pm ET

Mooshy,

"using artillery will undoubtedly kill civilians."

Not necessarily. Our artillery is very precise. We target specific buildings, most of them not even residential. We target Hamas facilities, which I believe the Gazans know exactly which building is stacked with Hamas weapons. Thus, before every attack, we notify the civilians, using brochures and phone calls, that the Hamas facilities in their neighborhoods (and sometimes give exact targets) are going to be bombed.

Certainly artillery kills some civilians, that's inescapable, but the numbers could have been much less if the Gazans were to heed our warnings (or is it Hamas forcing them in place?).

Besides, Hamas are using artillery too. The reason so few Israeli civilians are hurt is because our govt. built shelters and alarms for them. Ask Hamas why they didn't build shelters for the Palestinians (even though I know the answer- they don't care about them).

"i totally disagree with hamas launching rockets ,too"

Well, Israel totally disagrees with that too. But unlike you, Israel actually does something about it. If you disagree with something and someone works to stop it, why are you mad at them?

Goodnight, the week's starting and I want to get some sleep.
Au revoir

mooshy   January 24th, 2009 9:23 pm ET

it ha s been nice to talk to you , but i got to leave.
Anyway, as a first experience, this was beneficial as ill try to blog in whenever its possible.

i ll repeat myself , but the key issue in the future will be about the total withdrawal of israel from all palestinainan territory, and the return of palestinians to the places where they used to live.

I m sorry , buti heard some arguments that promote the agenda of forgetting because its been 60 years.for the international community, i dont think this wil be an argument. im sorry, but i gotta run. see you tomorrow.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 9:24 pm ET

Mooshy,
you wrote:
ghazza is an overpopulated area; using artillery will undoubtedly kill civilians.
That is why Hamas hid in Gaza, so that the Israel fire power would hit the civilians that they were hiding behind, for sympathy.

You also said:
i totally disagree with hamas launching rockets ,too.

What?

Linda   January 24th, 2009 9:26 pm ET

mooshy,
You may disagree with Hamas launching rockets, but you must see that the Israeli people were not going to stand for it any longer.
What do you think the Israeli people should have done?

dan perman   January 24th, 2009 9:26 pm ET

mooshy

where do you take the right to decide what the key issues are?

dan perman   January 24th, 2009 9:28 pm ET

linda

mooshy decided what needs to be done first:

isarel needs to withdraw (to where?) and take in 4 million refugees

then? he did not say

Linda   January 24th, 2009 9:30 pm ET

Of course not, that is what always happends.

harvey   January 24th, 2009 9:30 pm ET

Well good night guys...
To all the Americans...I say God Bless America,,,,only in that country could the forces of democracy elect a black president who could not have come to power without a white majority voting for him.

Last year I visited Atlanta and went to Martin Luther King museum. Found it a deeply moving experiece. Amazed by how many jews supported Martin Luther King.

Well his dream has now become a little closer to reality with the election of Obama. And if that dream which back in the 60"s seemed almost impossible is a reality now, why not peace in the Middle East, Palestinian and Israeli living in peace together also not become a reality...?

Good night and Shalom to all

mooshy   January 24th, 2009 9:31 pm ET

goodbye everybody

Linda   January 24th, 2009 9:32 pm ET

Good night Harvey,
We will miss you!
See you soon

Linda   January 24th, 2009 9:33 pm ET

bye mooshy

Linda   January 24th, 2009 9:35 pm ET

Beny,
I do believe the "refugees" do have a place to go. It is just not where they want to go. I have a different kind of idea when it comes to this subject.

Frans Wevers   January 24th, 2009 9:36 pm ET

I saw a website called harhoma.com. It's about a Palestinian-Israeli-Jordan Confederacy.Finally, some people are beginning to understand.I live in a sort of confederacy too.It's called the Benelux countries.It works for me.Hope they have the guts to go through with it,would be great.

dan perman   January 24th, 2009 9:40 pm ET

January 21, 2009
Media, UNRWA Silent on Attacked Aid Convoy

"Urgent humanitarian access for the people of Gaza is the immediate priority," declared Ban Ki-Moon, the Secretary General of the United Nations on Jan. 17, in a statement quoted by the Guardian and repeatedly by the Associated Press. Given the UN's prioritizing of this critical issue, one would think that any attempt to block the population's access to the much needed aid would be denounced by the international body and covered by the media. Think again.

The Jordan Press Agency yesterday reported that Jordanian aid destined for UNRWA warehouses was hijacked by armed men:

A number of armed men have seized on Tuesday a Jordanian aid convoy after entering the Gaza Strip via Karem Abu Salem Crossing Point, Petra was informed

The aid convoy, which was sent by the Jordan Hashemite Charity Organization (JHCO), was unloaded to non-Jordanian trucks driven by non-Jordanian drivers after crossing King Hussein Bridge.

The UNRWA was expected to receive the convoy and unload it into its warehouses in Gaza to be distributed later on civilians in the strip.

The armed men opened fire at drivers after crossing Karem Abu Salem crossing point and forced them to head to their own warehouses.

UNRWA has asked the transport company not to send the aid convoys scheduled for Tuesday and Wednesday until the issue of the seized convoy is solved.

Remarkably, neither the UN nor the UNRWA Web sites provide any reference whatsoever to the attack and the temporary suspension of aid to UNRWA. No denunciations. No calls for investigations. And, aside from the Palestinian Maan News Agency, the media has not covered this story.

Nona   January 24th, 2009 9:44 pm ET

Goodnight Beny, Harvey, Mooshy. Good talking to you all.

I don't understand Mooshy's last comment: "the key issue in the future will be about the total withdrawal of israel from all palestinainan territory." Hamas sees ALL of Israel as Palestinian territory, including Jerusalem, which was founded by King David. What exactly is "Palestinian territory" for the purposes of negotiations? So I'm not really following that comment - Mooshy I hope you'll come back and clarify some time.

Peace to all!

Linda   January 24th, 2009 9:45 pm ET

This is the problem with the media, Dan.
That is why I don't just "drink the koolaid" told on our news stations. I read and watch news from around the world.
And why is this not being reported on? I care about the people of Gaza, just like I care for the people of Israel.
This is an atrocity!

mohammed gharbawi   January 24th, 2009 9:48 pm ET

i see only zionists talking to themselves here. is this a kind of therapy you do to heal your souls from the kids you killed?

Linda   January 24th, 2009 9:53 pm ET

Well, Mohammed,
I don't see you doing anything constructive.

mohammed gharbawi   January 24th, 2009 9:56 pm ET

What you did is being recorded by history. I read what you said to an international agent about the past, the present, and the future. This is the view of the occupier. Surprisingly, my comments couldnt get through, at least as a third opinion.
well, as he said:
1- leave the 1967 land.
2-people should return to their houses.

this may get you nervous but we want more.
YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO EXIST, BUT LIVE WHER YOUR GRANFATHERS USED TO LIVE.

this is shalom

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 9:56 pm ET

this is in answer to a poster
Jews are welcome to come back to their original Arab countries.
every Arab country said that.

every Palestinian Arab should go back to his country Palestine..

Beny .
of course Jerusalem you will not have peace and security as long as Jerusalem is occupied.
as long as refugees are not. back in their homes.
as long as there is one Jewish settler on Palestinian soil.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 10:01 pm ET

Hi Solomon,
I don't know if I have asked you this, so here I go.
If Israel remains as it is, does that mean that there will never be peace for the Palestinians or Israelis?

Linda   January 24th, 2009 10:02 pm ET

Mohammed,
I don't really care what you think

Linda   January 24th, 2009 10:03 pm ET

bye dan!

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 10:04 pm ET

Linda.
the Answer is YES.
why should the Palestinians accept theft of their land by Jews.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 10:05 pm ET

Solomon,
I didn't say they should, I just wanted you point of view

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 10:06 pm ET

ant brain
you can not lie while I an here right.

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 10:07 pm ET

Linda.
point of view on what? .
I have just answered your question.

mohammed gharbawi   January 24th, 2009 10:08 pm ET

soolomon
i used to work in the my country's embassy in Rabat? Morocco. i can tell you that jews there are richer than the local population; they are in control of the econmy in the commercial apital "casablanca", and if you datre speak to a jew in a bad way, youll get to prison. once i was in Fes, i saw police officiers standing by a synaguogue where jeys are gathering.
this is the way jews are treated in the arab world.
ask the jews of Yemen , and they ll tell you they dont want to return to palestine.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 10:09 pm ET

Solomon,
I was responding to your answer, please see above.

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 10:13 pm ET

Linda.
well you did not give your point of view on that .
can you please?

mohammed gharbawi   January 24th, 2009 10:14 pm ET

solomon
their mission is lie to everybody, not us.
wallahi wallahi; we will kill your children as you did with our dear ones.

this will be under the heading "the price of occupation".

Nona   January 24th, 2009 10:18 pm ET

Yes, Solomon. The Arab states did invite their Jews back, in the 1970s, more than 20 years after they evicted them and they'd already rebuilt their lives. They did not offer compensation or restoration of seized property, and newspapers around the world condemned those invitations as insincere attempts to justify the refusal of Arab countries to absorb Palestininan "refugees".

Meanwhile, those same Arab countries continue to persecute the few Jews who still live there, continue to air and publish anti-Jewish propaganda in their state-run radio and TV stations, to incorporate anti-Jewish rhetoric into their school curricula, to incite anti-Jewish hatred at officially sanctioned rallies, and to make their countries as miserable for Jews (and often, for Christians) as possible. Many won't even give their Jews passports, so even if they decide to return, they can't travel or ever leave.

Fortunately, even the most objective outsiders recognized those "invitiations" for the ruse that they were - a lame attempt to save face as they refused to welcome Palestinians into their own countries.

Interesting how Arab countries would rather welcome their expelled Jews back than take in the Palestinians they claim to care so much about.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 10:23 pm ET

Solomon,
I think a lot of things have to be done. First, I think everyone needs to start working from the "now". I feel the international community has
dropped the ball on helping the Palestinians. We need to relocate the
people in the refugee camps. Now, that is a hot button issue for me.
Again, where? Well, that is the question. It depends on how far back in history you want to go to see who the rightful owner is of that specific property.
I think that is the most problematic issue. I think that a lot of homes, schools etc. can be built in Gaza, as well as other places. I would not agree with kicking anyone off of their land, whether it is in Gaza or Israel.
To me, what has happened, has happened and the international community needs to go in and help both sides.
But your answer to my questions says it all. So until every Jewish person is out of Israel, some people will want to kill them. So it really
doesn't matter if all of the refugees would move into Israel, they will
not allow the Israelis to live there, they will try to kill them or run them
out. Am I correct?

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 10:24 pm ET

mohammed gharbawi.

well I have no doubt in my mind that Zionism will be defeated in Palestine.
all throughout History Arabs and Muslims protected Jews while the Christian world persecuted them.
that is what we get back from these thieves.

be back latter.

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 10:26 pm ET

Linda..
I read you post before I left my answer to you is relocate the Jews in Palestine that might be easier

Linda   January 24th, 2009 10:28 pm ET

Solomon,
I think there will be a stale mate for a long time. What a shame!

Linda   January 24th, 2009 10:33 pm ET

Mohammed,
You are not suppose to associate yourself with women

Professor   January 24th, 2009 10:37 pm ET

Linda,

It can problematic if we want to be.... Or we can look at who has a title to the land or a key to the house... That is the rightful owner.... We do not need to go back 2000 years back and search who owned it then.

Why are you so stubborn when it comes to a Palestinian right?....

What about the Occupation?.... Gaza Siege is an occupation.... the West Bank is still under occupation.... The Golan Heights are still under occupation....

mohammed gharbawi   January 24th, 2009 10:39 pm ET

linda
you dont have the right to tell us where to go. personally, i will return back to my farm in jaffa; i keep telling this to my kids. yu know why? BECAUSE MY GRAND GRAND FATHERS USED TO LIVE THERE AND I HAVE THE DOCUMENTS. YOU WANT US TO FORGET JUST BECAUSE ONE DAY SOME SOLDIIERS CAME FROM POLAND AND RUSSIA AND KILLED MEMBERS OF MY FAMILY AND EXPELLED US BY FORCE?
NOW STUPIDELY YOU THINK 60 YEARS IS ENOUGH TO FORGET ONE'S HISTORY.
WE WILL NEVER FORGET. WE ARE PALESTINIANS.

LIVE WITH THAT.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 10:42 pm ET

Well solomon
I have a different idea of it because my family has lived it and they took a different path

Professor   January 24th, 2009 10:46 pm ET

Linda,

Shame on you.... you feel sorry for the Nazi baby killer Dan becuase his father was was a prisoner in Germany.... As if the Palestinians were responsible for his father's problem.... What would you say if Dan was living on Mohammed Gharbawi's farm?... And Dan's father was part of the killing machine that killed some Mohammed family memebers and kick the rest out of their home and occupied it?

Nona   January 24th, 2009 10:49 pm ET

Ask the Jews of Yemen? YES! Please do!

Ask the Jews of Yemen, whose ghettoes where they are forced to live are being relocated en masse because of continued attacks on them.

Ask Yemeni Jew Masha Ya'ish A-Nahari, a teacher. Oh wait. You can't. He was murdered December 11, before operations in Gaza even began.

Ask the group of Yemeni Jews that was attacked on Jan. 4 with sticks and rocks by Muslim schoolchildren in Raydah District. These same kids also attacked Jewish homes and did great damage to them.

Ask the Jews of Yemen, who are not allowed to possess guns or daggers, while their Muslim neighbors are allowed to.

Ask the Jews of Yemen, who until very recently lived under laws that decreed that fatherless Jewish children under age 13 must be taken from their mothers and raised in Muslim homes as Muslims.

Ask the Yemeni Jews what happens if they pray in public.

Ask the Jews of Yemen why there are only a few hundred of them there today, when in 1945, there were 60,000 of them. Ask them why, in 1949 and 1950, even though although most had never seen an airplane, 50,000 Yemeni Jews were joyously airlifted to Israel.

For once, I agree with Mohammad G. Ask the Jews of Yemen.

Or for that matter, ask the UN how great the Jews of Yemen have it: irinnews.org/Report.aspx?ReportId=82193.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 10:51 pm ET

Solomon,
What do you mean by shame on me? I feel bad for anyone who is a prisoner or war, no matter who they are. I did not say anything about
the Palestinian people being responsible for his father.
And as far as someone living on some else's farm, it is not their farm, it is their ancestors farm. Like I said, How far back in history do you want
to go to find the rightful owners?
You can't conveniently pick a year that helps your argument and ignore the rest.

Professor   January 24th, 2009 10:55 pm ET

Nona,

Israel is responsible for what happened to the Jews of Yemen and what is happenning to the Jews all over the world.

Its the actions of Israel that is causing them harm....

So you need to ask Israel to stop its criminal murderer actions... stop arming itself with Weapons of Mass distruction.

Maybe the Jews will have a better life then...

Its the occupation stupid.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 10:57 pm ET

Well Nona,
We are back to rhetoric and calling people names. Some people can not have a civil conversation. When presented with any facts or logic. they
resort to this behavior instead of intelligent discussion.

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 10:57 pm ET

Nona.
Jews pray in yeman freely.
there are not many Jews because Zionists made them leave to occupied Palestine.
you are talking about the Jew who was Killed lately.
tel me at the same time how many Jews are killed by Jews in occupied Palestine.
how Many Palestinians are killed by Jews at the same time.
the problem with you Jews is you think that you are more Important than others.
the same as the Nazis and all occupiers throughout history.

your Israel will meet the same fate.

Professor   January 24th, 2009 10:58 pm ET

Stupid Linda,

Have you heard of a Title or Deed?

Someone must have one.... If an Arab has it then the land is his and its not someone else's ancestors.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 11:00 pm ET

Solomon,
just like i said, my family has lived through this too. and yes we had a title and a deed. we moved on That doesn't mean we are stupid, we
have evolved from being barbarians.

Roscoe   January 24th, 2009 11:01 pm ET

Immitation Professor

Don't worry, you're in good hands!

Obama, Clinton and George Mitchell are all on board to see that you are treated fairly. I hope you had the opportunity to see Obamas’ introduction speech to the State Department when he presented Hillary Clinton as Secretary of State and George Mitchell as Special Envoy to the Middle East, and they explained their intitiative, involvement, direction, and support .

Obama said the cease-fire that recently ended the three week Israeli offensive in Gaza can only hold if Hamas stops firing rockets, Israel completes its withdrawal from Gaza and the U.S. and its allies support an anti-smuggling system that prevents the militant Palestinian group from rearming. "The United States will fully support an international donor's conference to seek short-term humanitarian assistance and long-term reconstruction for the Palestinian economy," Obama said Thursday that Abbas' Palestinian Authority should control the aid. "This assistance will be provided to and guided by the Palestinian Authority." Obama said Gaza's borders should be opened to allow aid to come in, with "appropriate monitoring." “Until such time that Hamas agrees to renounce violence and recognizes Israels’ right to exist, they will not be an active participant in the Political process.”

They’ll take care of you!

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 11:06 pm ET

Linda.

then go and claim your home where you came from.
dont ask the Palestinians to give their land to you.

I have my doubt that Zionist settlers have evolved from being Barbarians.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 11:09 pm ET

Solomon,
Why should I go claim something that is now gone to my family. We have worked to earn our own land and lifestyle. I'm not asking anyone to give
me anything. You see, I'm not lazy, nor a victim, We (Native Ameicans) have worked hard, bought new land, taught our families to have respect
and to make a good life for ourselves. Not sit around and try to think up
ways to kill other people.

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 11:11 pm ET

Linda .
I never said shame on you how did you came to that conclusion?

Linda   January 24th, 2009 11:12 pm ET

Oh, I make sense Professor, you are just not willing to look at anyone else's point of view. You can not except that everyone is not like you.
And that some people just want peace

Linda   January 24th, 2009 11:13 pm ET

Solomon,
you wrote:

January 24th, 2009 2246 GMT

Linda,

Shame on you…. you feel sorry for the Nazi baby killer Dan becuase his father was was a prisoner in Germany…. As if the Palestinians were responsible for his father’s problem…. What would you say if Dan was living on Mohammed Gharbawi’s farm?… And Dan’s father was part of the killing machine that killed some Mohammed family memebers and kick the rest out of their home and occupied it?

Linda   January 24th, 2009 11:14 pm ET

Solomon,
Sorry, it was professor, I meant to direct that to him, not you

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 11:16 pm ET

Linda.
I did not know that you are a native Indian/
so if you gave your right away should all do the same?
I will not give my right to any one I am willing to help in any way possible .
but I am not prepared to give my land to outsiders.

Nona   January 24th, 2009 11:17 pm ET

Professor,

Sorry, but the Jews of Yemen were treated just as horrifically, if not worse, long before the state of Israel came into existence.

The law decreeing fatherless Jewish children be ripped away from their mothers and raised in Muslim homes by Muslims predates the state of Israel by centuries - HUNDREDS of years.

The Jews of Yemen were subject to the most brutal interpretations of the Charter of Oman possible. Among the milder consequences was that the Jews were forced to clean public latrines and clear the roads of animal carcasses without pay on the their Sabbath.

Jewish women were forced to wear one black shoe and one white shoe as a form of public humiliation under this charter.

In the 1760s, 12 of Sana'a's 14 synogogues were torn down and Jewish homes were demolished.

In the 1800s, any Yemeni could confiscate a Yemeni Jew's belongings without compensation, even by force. A Jew accused of a crime would be held in chains and beaten, and the only way to escape was to convert to Islam. Guilt or innocence of the crime didn't come into play.

At the turn of the century, Yemeni Jews were prohibited from leaving the country. Systematically starvation of the Jewish community was enforced to the point that the Jewish population rate was

Sorry, but you have it backwards. The treatment of the Jews of Yemen isn't the result of the state of Israel. To the contrary, the state of Israel is NECESSARILY because of the treatment of Jews by countries such as Yemen.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 11:22 pm ET

Solomon,
We did not give our land away, It was taken by the government, then resold. So, My grandfather and his brothers decided not to live on a
reservation. Instead, they became fence builders, working their way across the country, until they found a place that they wanted to settle.
They built a life there, got married, had children, etc. They always taught us to love one another, to move on, nothing is worth killing or being killed
over except to protect yourself or your family, and that land is a thing.
People and they way you treat them is what matters.
Now, he did not have a lot of money, but he taught us the way to live a good life and work hard.
I have been to the land, I went with my father. The people that live there now are very nice. It is not their fault. They allow (yes, I said allow) us to see the property, the old cabin has fallen down, but is still there, and
we can come there anytime we want. I have found a really nice arrowhead there, and other things. But yes, they are things, not the
souls of others. It is not worth killing over.

Nona   January 24th, 2009 11:26 pm ET

This conversation is actually not devolving and I hate that I have to leave, but I would like to leave with a question. It's an honest question and not intended as an insult, but it addresses the heart of the matter as to why I have such a hard time agreeing with some of the people here.

Mohammad said his great-great-grandfather had a farm in Jaffa, and he teaches his children that they will get that farm back. So here's my question:

Is that farm more important than the blood of your children? The blood of your fathers? Were Solomon's cousin and nephew less valuable than that farm in Jaffa?

To Linda's ancestors, the people who lost their land were more valuable than the farm they lost. But you guys seem to think the farm is more valuable than the people expected to fight for it.

With honest and sincere respect and attempt to understand, I ask you this question: which is more valuable, the farm or the people fighting for it?

Thank you for any honest attempt to answer my question. I am trying to understand.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 11:27 pm ET

Professor,
Have you ever heard of the native american land deal? So the government owned it, no matter what you have in your hand.
maybe you should try to learn about our history, like I have been trying to learn about yours?

Solomon   January 24th, 2009 11:28 pm ET

Linda.
so you want six Million Palestinians to do the same?
do you think that is possible?
why dont you ask the 3 million Jews who came in the last twenty years to go back to their original.homes
that will solve the problem the Palestinians can return back to their homes then..
I just dont Understand why do you want the Palestinians to just forget their country.

Akiva Heifetz   January 24th, 2009 11:32 pm ET

hey :D

Linda   January 24th, 2009 11:33 pm ET

Solomon,
I have never said that they should forget their country. Like I said above, the international community should get in and help this situation.
Do something to help all involved. Just like I have said in the past, bring
in builder, build for everyone. and yes, there is enough land, build up.
Look at Hong Kong. So I am not saying walk away, but work towards
something instead of wanting to kill someone. It is everyone's personal
decision to do so, and work towards a common goal.
Attacking, fighting, and killing will not get either side anywhere. It is not a lasting solution.

Professor   January 24th, 2009 11:40 pm ET

Linda,

I studies the history of the Native Americans.... but what history of mine are you studying? How do you even know what am i? I told you time after time i am not a Palestinian and I do not even live in that region.... so which history of mine are you learning about?

See how you assume things into what you read?.... Focus Linda... Focus.

Its the occupation stupid.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 11:41 pm ET

Solomon,
In reading Nona's last post, I guess I am trying to understand the same thing. That is why I posted that initial question to you.
I know that everyone's history shapes their way of thinking. This is why I wanted your point of view. I think you and I have had respectful exchanges,
even if you have not always agreed. But I do respect your opinion and would like to hear your solution

Nona   January 24th, 2009 11:41 pm ET

Apologies in advance if my post about the Jews of Yemen shows up 2 or 3 more times. That was the post that got all glitchy on me.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 11:43 pm ET

See Professor,
You do not want a reasonable discussion, you just want to insult people. That is why it is clear that you are not really a professor.

Professor   January 24th, 2009 11:43 pm ET

Nona,

Why don't you ask your leaders that question.... They came to fight for a land they claimed their ancestors lived in it 2000 years ago?

Is that land more important than their childrens?

Its the occupation stupid.

Nona   January 24th, 2009 11:45 pm ET

No Professor. I'm asking you and your colleagues to speak for yourselves. I don't want my government's opinion: I know it. I want yours.

Professor   January 24th, 2009 11:48 pm ET

Linda,

And what would you like from the Palestinians to do until the International community decides that its time for them to get involved and help?.... Sit and wait until the Israel machine slotter more of them every few years without any resistance.....

I guess they figured they are getting killed anyway so they might as well take few Israelis with them before they go.

Its the occupation stupid.

Akiva Heifetz   January 24th, 2009 11:48 pm ET

CNN censoring leads to fascism!!!
why you support this?

keep the press free!!!
stop cenoring !
else people will begin to speak about !
stop it ;)

Nona   January 24th, 2009 11:48 pm ET

Yeah, Linda. I've gotta go but I'll check back later.

I am making an honest attempt to understand the point of view of people committed to a cause they insist on fighting for but the only one who has acknowledge it deflected my questions. I'm trying. I hope they will too.

*Peace* to all.

Linda   January 24th, 2009 11:51 pm ET

No professor,
That is exactly why I asked Solomon what I asked him. And I asked him because he will have a dialogue with me without name calling and insults.
I you don't want to give me your solutions in the same type of manner, then why are you surprised that I take what you say with a grain of salt?
I have not been hurling names and insults at you. I have been wanting to
learn someone else's point of view, and why it is such.
Like Nona said, we know our governments point of view, that is not what we are looking for here.

Professor   January 24th, 2009 11:51 pm ET

Nona,

If the land is more imprtant to the Israeli Jews than their children.... then i am sure its also as important the Palestinians....

I am not a Palestinians so my answer is not that important on this issue.

Its the occupation stupid.

Akiva Heifetz   January 24th, 2009 11:52 pm ET

did you people know

irael is the first country which is defending its self in a foreign country!
what kind of defence i that?

its not defence its a offence ... a attak !
defending is allway in the own country ;)
else its logical a offence !!!

stop talking about defence if this is nothing else then a stupid suggestion !!!

Akiva Heifetz   January 24th, 2009 11:57 pm ET

what did mark regev say today??

he is doing investigations about him self????
what kind of invetigation is this ??

and look hom other media is dealing with him
CNN take a example
get the rights for this video or the right parts of it !!!
hamas were fiering phosphours???
is mark sick???

thats a totaly new lie and totaqly crazy !!!!!!

you tube . com/watch?v=y3uYXWtd684
(fix the spaces take it before CNN must delete it because israel commands it)

Professor   January 25th, 2009 12:01 am ET

Linda,

When you want to honestly learn the point of view of other you do not start by attacking their right to their land.... and deny the occupation.... and feel sorry for the occupier instead of the occupied..... for the agressor instead of the victim.

If you do not know the history well then just ask questions and listen to the answers....

Don't come and ask the Palestinians to give up their country becuase you decided to give up your land.... Thats not how you come to understand someone else's point of view.

Its the occupation stupid.

Linda   January 25th, 2009 12:04 am ET

Yes Professor
That is exactly what I expected from you. Not one thing you just said has any truth to it because I have not said any of those things.
Since there is no one on this blog that wants to have a civil discussion at this time, I will leave you with this quote:
from the Elders of Turtle Island
"It is a great journey (life)
but you must do the walking
and have the willingness to change
and make the leap into
the next level of human evolution.

Become an inquisitive free thinking
individual that takes
responsibility for your life
and the spiritual accountability to live life to the fullest.

Professor   January 25th, 2009 12:05 am ET

Israhell is not defending itself.... Its occupying someone else's country.... and when you do that.... your people are ligitimate target to the resistance.... So, if you care about the your children more than the land that you are occupying then leave it to its people.... but it seams that this land is more important than your children... and you are willing to sacrifice more people while you are occupying it.

Its the occupation stupid.

Professor   January 25th, 2009 12:09 am ET

Linda,

Weren't you blaming the murders that Israhell was committing on the Palestinian Resistance? And you wanted the Palestinian resistance to stop resisting their occupyiers?

Or am I wrong here?

Professor   January 25th, 2009 12:13 am ET

Linda,

I did not see one comment from you condemning Israhell for using illegal weapons on women and children....

Where was your heart for the past three four weeks?

You want a civil discussion?....

You have to be civil before you can get a civil discussion.

Its the occupation stupid.

Akiva Heifetz   January 25th, 2009 12:20 am ET

If Americans Knew – A US project helping to convey alternative perspectives to Americans:
ifamericansknew DOT org

Video – Biased media reports on the Israeli-Palestinian:
you tube DOT com / watch?v=yOC1RReb6gc

Video – Media bias about the Israeli – Palestine conflict exposed:
you tube DOT com / watch?v=Kiyyp9cZdY0&NR=1

Jon Stewart's critique of media bias on Gaza conflict:
thedailyshow DOT com / video / index . j html ? videoId = 213380 & title = Strip-Maul

International Law Seldom Newsworthy in Gaza War – Israeli justifications often cited uncritically:
fair DOT org / index . php ? page = 3672

Palestine Media Watch report on op-eds:
pmwatch DOT org / pmw/mediocrity / displayCall . asp ? essayID = 336

Newsworthy and unnewsworthy deaths:
fair DOT org / index . php ? page = 3057

------
think about that USA ... think .. open your eyes !!!
fix the spaces in the links !!! replace DOT with a dot .

Take the links copy paste them to your text editor quick !!!

CNN will censore this .. the USA should not know this !!
they will try to full you :p
that is called free press ;)

Akiva Heifetz   January 25th, 2009 12:45 am ET

other quetion !!

Obama did say that USA will not use illegal interogation methods in future!

then the USA did say that they will stop this methods
but they cant show us which illegal methods..
because else terrorists will do a training against such methods

but why should they do a training against such methods if USA dont use them in future?

is this any king of logical????

so we must believe USA will use this illegal methods in future!
or USA is hiding the torture which they have done!
so waterboarding was only a joke!
they did use much more woerse methods which are illegal!

and they will use it hiden in future
then else they can discover the methods ;)
if they dont use such methods in future...
let the terrorist waste theyr time with trainings against methods
which will never be used again

so you see how you get fulled
and how they lie at US citizens!

some thing smells !!!!!!

GLeigh   January 25th, 2009 1:29 am ET

You know, I think some of you are about to bust because you have opinions that I need to know. I might be wrong. It feels that way to me. Experiences to explain your side of it. So I opened an account called GLeigh09@live.com. I'm not a patient email person, never have been. But, I do get that this is a deep subject. Write me Nona! Sometimes I am a little rude, my social skills need work I guess. Have a great weekend all. It's rainy and foggy here. Yuck! And my teen is in a car with a new driver. That's always comforting.

GLeigh   January 25th, 2009 1:58 am ET

p.s. Benyemen – I read back. I always read back. Big FYI. I'm not a paid blogger. What is that anyway since this my first blog? That was a goofing question for a goofing person.

GLeigh   January 25th, 2009 2:05 am ET

Okay, for personal reasons, I have really irrational fears about this car stuff. I need war stuff to distract me. My son has a truck sitting in the front yard. I think he's driven three times. It's been there awhile. That took some work. So distract me. Talk about missiles or something.

GLeigh   January 25th, 2009 2:17 am ET

Geeez guys. Men are all the same. Too polite. Any mom, and they go on polite mode. Well, sorry to mess up your blog. In a way, I am glad you are polite to moms. That is a good thing.

Bill   January 25th, 2009 2:29 am ET

Professor and Solomon -

Your rhetoric, propaganda, and blatant disregard for the truth haven’t changed. You are a credit to your people, defiant and ignorant until the end. You are not capable of learning or letting go of your blind hatred, and, as such, will never evolve to a higher plane of existence. You are trapped by your ignorance and arrogance, bound to constantly fight losing battles against knowledge and justice. Like the Palestinians, you need to choose to change; you need to choose peace and hard work. You constantly choose conflict and laziness instead. The Palestinians have been on welfare for 60 years. It’s time for them to get a job other than attacking others and build a life for themselves.

The Jews who were stripped of their possessions and expelled from Arab/Muslim countries aren't living in camps as refugees waiting for another handout. They got to work and built something for themselves and their families. The Palestinians should do the same.

Personally, I don't agree that the land was ever theirs, but, beyond that, they lost that disputed land in a war the Arab/Muslim countries started and lost (as usual) in 1967. It is no longer their land. When you attack another country and lose, you don't get a do-over. Get over it. You are now on israeli land. There is no more occupation. You lost! It is over!

It's long past time for the Palestinians to stop whining and build something, to do some real creation instead of constant destruction and violence. No wonder the other hypocritical Arab regimes won't allow the Palestinians to come back to their real countries of origin.

Bill   January 25th, 2009 2:41 am ET

There should be no more handouts for the Palestinian beggars. They produce nothing except more Palestinian beggars and, of course, Islamic terrorists . What other group of beggars has an entire UN Agency just to service them? What a foolish world to keep giving them handouts as long as they can periodically poke Israel in the eye.

I say do not give them food. Do not give them water. Provide them tools and training. Give them seeds, and non-explosive fertilizer. Teach them, if they are willing to learn. Trade with them if they make anything of value (other than weapons).

Let them live or die according to how much they want to work, not beg. It's time for tough love. The only ones that can fix the Palestinian situation are the Palestinians. They have to want to change. They need more incentive to change. Hunger and thirst are good motivators.

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 2:49 am ET

Bill.
who are you to say that you dont believe the land is theirs.?
it is like me saying to you I dont believe that you are human.
how would you like that?
there was no Jew that was stripped of their possessions.
as for the Jews working and building their families.
Sure it is free land backed by billions of American tax payer dollars.
any one can build on stolen property.

it is Israel that brought destruction not the Palestinians.
it is the Jews that came to Palestine not the Palestinians that went to Europe.

if what I say is propaganda then try and convince people with facts not fictions.

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 2:55 am ET

Bill
it is the Jews that have been living on handouts from American tax payers
it is the Jews that milked Germany billions of Dollars .
it is Jews who are blackmailing Europe about the Holocaust..
it is the Jews that stole Palestinian land.

Palestinians Arabs owned the Land when Jews were
scattered all over the world with hardly any history to talk about for two thousand years.

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 3:04 am ET

Bill.
in 1917 there was less than 15000 Jews in Palestine to over 500.000 Palestinian Arabs. jews owned 2% of the land 98% was Palestinian land.
any human being will tell you who that land belong to.

Denying History will not take you any where.
do you know the name of the Arab Village that was on the site of Sederot..
ask any Palestinian child and he will tell you the Name of the Arab village.is Najd.
we know the history of that land very well.

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 3:18 am ET

Bill the coward.

if you dont believe that the land belongs to the Palestinians.

read this.
"Let us not ignore the truth among ourselves
... politically we are the aggressors and they defend themselves.
.. The country is theirs, because they inhabit it,
whereas we want to come here and settle down,
and in their view we want to take away from them their country."
– David Ben Gurion,

Bill   January 25th, 2009 3:33 am ET

Solomon -

Your name calling, rhetoric, propaganda, and blatant disregard for the truth haven’t changed. You are a credit to your people, defiant and ignorant until the end. You are not capable of learning or letting go of your blind hatred, and, as such, will never evolve to a higher plane of existence. You are trapped by your ignorance and arrogance, bound to constantly fight losing battles against knowledge and justice. Like the Palestinians, you need to choose to change; you need to choose peace and hard work. You constantly choose conflict and laziness instead. The Palestinians have been on welfare for 60 years. It’s time for them to get a job other than attacking others and build a life for themselves.

The Jews who were stripped of their possessions and expelled from Arab/Muslim countries aren’t living in camps as refugees waiting for another handout. They got to work and built something for themselves and their families. The Palestinians should do the same.

Personally, I don’t agree that the land was ever theirs, but, beyond that, they lost that disputed land in a war the Arab/Muslim countries started and lost (as usual) in 1967. It is no longer their land. When you attack another country and lose, you don’t get a do-over. Get over it. You are now on israeli land. There is no more occupation. You lost! It is over!

It’s long past time for the Palestinians to stop whining and build something, to do some real creation instead of constant destruction and violence. No wonder the other hypocritical Arab regimes won’t allow the Palestinians to come back to their real countries of origin.

There is no occupation. The Arabs/Muslims lost the land in a war they started. It is Israeli land. Israel is willing to let Arabs/Muslims live on their land if they are willing to live in peace. Are you willing to live in peace?

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 3:34 am ET

American viewership of Al-Jazeera English rose dramatically during the Israel-Hamas war, partly because the channel had what CNN and other international networks didn't have: reporters inside Gaza.
"Having reporters in Gaza – which others did not have – that's what made Al-Jazeera stand out and that's important on the Internet," said Jeff Jarvis, who teaches journalism at the City University of New York and writes about media on his Buzzmachine.com blog.

Overall, the station's Web video stream saw a 600 percent jump in worldwide viewership during the Gaza offensive – and about 60 percent of those hits came from the United States, according to the station's internal numbers.

way to Go Aljazeera. the American must know what is going on in Palestine.

.
.

Bill   January 25th, 2009 3:46 am ET

Now that real journalists are in Gaza, they are finding the claims of death and injury to be vastly exagerated. That further destroys the extremely limited credibility that the Aljazeera Islamic terrorist TV network ever had. It is just more evidence that Muslims have no concept of truth or honor. That is why negotiating with them is futile. Until you decide to be truthful and honorable, nations will continue to treat you as pariahs.

cubfan   January 25th, 2009 3:52 am ET

The only response the Arab world understands is force and it is encouraging to finally see that the Israeli people have come together with a single purpose of defending their borders. Hopefully the message being received in Gaza and the rest of the Arab world is that Israel means business and will do whatever it takes bring its enemies to its knees. From now on the people of Gaza, Tehran and the rest of the cowards in the Arab world know the IDF will unleash hell upon its people if they continue to wage war on the State of Israel.

To all those people who are foolishly squeamish on going to war, the cease fire is holding as Hamas is reevaluating its foolish judgment over the past few months. War can be a means to peace.

Bill   January 25th, 2009 3:52 am ET

Solomon –

I wrote the post. I know it is different. Anybody who can read can see it it different. Can you read? This is exactly what I am sepaking of. Your name calling, rhetoric, propaganda, and blatant disregard for the truth haven’t changed. There is a question at the end that you are avoiding, as usual.

Why do you refuse to answer questions? Are you that afraid of the truth? Is your position so weak that you need to try to change the subject when you are asked a question or when your lies are exposed?

Do you dispute that the Muslims/Arabs lost Gaza and the West Bank to Israel in the 1967 war?

It is a simple question, one that even you can understand. Stop acting like a cowardly child and answer the question.

cubfan   January 25th, 2009 3:58 am ET

Great article in Time this weekend proclaiming the death of the peace movement in Israel and how the Israelis have seen the light that appeasement and turning the other cheek is not the road for future attacks on Israeli soil.
Overwhelming response and destruction is the new way to deal with the criminals of Gaza, Israel has seen the light.

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 4:00 am ET

"There has been Anti-Semitism, the Nazis, Hitler, Auschwitz, but was that their fault? They see but one thing: we have come and we have stolen their country. Why would they accept that?"

Ben Gurion.

Bill   January 25th, 2009 4:07 am ET

Solomon -

Come on. You are just proving my point about you being ignorant and arrogant.

Do you dispute that the Muslims/Arabs lost Gaza and the West Bank to Israel in the 1967 war?

It is a simple question, one that even you can understand. Stop acting like a cowardly child and answer the question.

There is no occupation. The Arabs/Muslims lost the land in a war they started. It is Israeli land. Israel is willing to let Arabs/Muslims live on their land if they are willing to live in peace. Are you willing to live in peace?

Bill   January 25th, 2009 4:11 am ET

Solomon -

Was that so hard?

So, the Arabs/Muslims lost the land. Therefore, it is no longer their land. So, by definition, there is no occupation! Israel is occupying its own land.

There is no occupation. The Arabs/Muslims lost the land in a war they started. It is Israeli land. Israel is willing to let Arabs/Muslims live on their land if they are willing to live in peace.

Thank you. See what being truthful for once can accomplish?

Now there is no longer a reason to fight, unless you need to make up another reason because violence and destruction is the only thing you understand. Are you willing to live in peace?

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 4:16 am ET

Bill .

this will be my last response to you.
the next war will be inside occupied Palestine and that will end all wars.
Jews will go back to their original countries.
and Palestinian will go back to their country Palestine.

remember that and tell your children and grand children that uncle solomon said that.

Bill   January 25th, 2009 4:27 am ET

Solomon -

There seem to be around 1.5 billion Muslims. I don't know how many Arabs there are. I imagine that after the world perfects alternatives to oil, the number of Arabs won't matter much.

To me that means the vast majority of the world is non-Muslim, a good sign. Islam could have been a real religion if not for its focus on violence, destruction, dishonor, and lying. I think Islam is the main reason for terrorism today. Muslims are just following in the footsteps of a prophet who was a murderer, a thief, a rapist, and a pedophile. Violence begets violence. They are just following his example.

If Mohammed had renounced intolerance, violence, hatred of Jews and Christians, killing all infidels, raping, slavery, pillaging, etc., and truly repented of his many, many sins, Islam could have been a viable religion.

Now Islam is perpetuated by fear and spread by the sword. If people truly had a right to choose without any fear, I doubt if there would be a million Muslims. Other religions offer far more in terms of spirituality, peace, harmony, and personal growth. Islam seems to offer threats, lies, violence against both Muslims and non-Muslims, weapons, jihad, martyrdom, and death. I think most people would prefer a religion based on life, not seeking death while murdering innocents.

Bill   January 25th, 2009 4:32 am ET

Solomon -

We've already proven that there is no occupation.

The Arabs/Muslims lost the land in a war they started. It is Israeli land. Israel is willing to let Arabs/Muslims live on their land if they are willing to live in peace.

Give it up! You lost. It is over. Keeping your hatred alive only dooms your children to futher violence and destruction. Is that what you truly want for your children?

Bill   January 25th, 2009 4:42 am ET

Solomon -

The war that will end all wars? Where have I heard that before? Oh yes, I think it was Saddam Hussein. He was another hero of the Muslim people, aside from all those he ruthlessly killed. And the use of poison gas on his own people must have left you filled with pride.

I remember the proud Iraqi Muslim warriors waving their underwear on sticks trying to surrender to helicopters.

I guess it wasn' the war that would end all wars... It was the world showing Muslim aggressors that they must stop their criminal actions.

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 4:44 am ET

When the Roman historian Tacitus pointed out 19 centuries ago that

.the Jews are unique among the races of man in their intense hatred

and contempt for all races but their own, he was only repeating what

many other scholars had discovered before him. For the next 1,900

years other investigators came to similar conclusions, either from a

study of the Jews' religious writings or from a study of the Jews'

behavior toward non-Jews..

Notable among these was the Great Reformer, Martin Luther, who in 1543 wrote in Von den JØden und Ihren LØgen :

Does not their Talmud say, and do not their rabbis write, that it is no

sin to kill if a Jew kills a heathen, but it is a sin if he kills a brother in

Israel? It is no sin if he does not keep his oath to a heathen.

Therefore, to steal and rob, as they do with their usury, from a heathen

is a divine service. For they hold that they cannot be too hard on us nor

sin against us, because they are of the noble blood and circumcised

saints; we, however, are cursed goyim. And they are the masters of

the world, and we are their servants, yea, their cattle...

Notable among these was the Great Reformer, Martin Luther, who in 1543 wrote in Von den JØden und Ihren LØgen :

Does not their Talmud say, and do not their rabbis write, that it is no sin to kill if a Jew kills a heathen, but it is a sin if he kills a brother in Israel? It is no sin if he does not keep his oath to a heathen. Therefore, to steal and rob, as they do with their usury, from a heathen is a divine service. For they hold that they cannot be too hard on us nor sin against us, because they are of the noble blood and circumcised saints; we, however, are cursed goyim. And they are the masters of the world, and we are their servants, yea, their cattle..

Bill   January 25th, 2009 5:06 am ET

Thank God the civilized people no longer believe such things. It's too bad Muslims haven't evolved to the stage where they cast aside such primitive beliefs and practices.

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 5:09 am ET

Jewish theft of Palestinian land must stop.
UN resolutions must be implemented.
Jewish leaders in Israel must be tried as war Criminals.

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 5:11 am ET

Israel is a racist state.
Israel will not be accepted in Arab Palestine.
refugees must return to their homes in Palestine.

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 5:19 am ET

A prominent Jewish MP has compared the actions of Israeli troops with Nazis who forced his family to flee Poland.

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 5:22 am ET

, the first Israeli neo-Nazi Internet site was launched. More precisely, it is an Israeli site in the Russian language.

Bill   January 25th, 2009 5:36 am ET

Solomon -

We’ve already proven that there is no occupation.

The Arabs/Muslims lost the land in a war they started. It is Israeli land. Israel is willing to let Arabs/Muslims live on their land if they are willing to live in peace.

Give it up! You lost. It is over. Keeping your hatred alive only dooms your children to futher violence and destruction. Is that what you truly want for your children? I guess so.

Your name calling, rhetoric, propaganda, and blatant disregard for the truth haven’t changed. You are a credit to your people, defiant and ignorant until the end. You are not capable of learning or letting go of your blind hatred, and, as such, will never evolve to a higher plane of existence. You are trapped by your ignorance and arrogance, bound to constantly fight losing battles against knowledge and justice. Like the Palestinians, you need to choose to change; you need to choose peace and hard work. You constantly choose conflict and laziness instead. The Palestinians have been on welfare for 60 years. It’s time for them to get a job other than attacking others and build a life for themselves.

The Jews who were stripped of their possessions and expelled from Arab/Muslim countries aren’t living in camps as refugees waiting for another handout. They got to work and built something for themselves and their families. The Palestinians should do the same.

Personally, I don’t agree that the land was ever theirs, but, beyond that, they lost that disputed land in a war the Arab/Muslim countries started and lost (as usual) in 1967. It is no longer their land. When you attack another country and lose, you don’t get a do-over. Get over it. You are now on israeli land. There is no more occupation. You lost! It is over!

It’s long past time for the Palestinians to stop whining and build something, to do some real creation instead of constant destruction and violence. No wonder the other hypocritical Arab regimes won’t allow the Palestinians to come back to their real countries of origin.

Nona   January 25th, 2009 6:14 am ET

Congratulations, Solomon. You found another famous Jew hater to quote, Martin Luther, who, like Mohammad, hated Jews because he couldn't convert them to his newfound religion. You must be proud, even though you apparently have a whole library of that stuff.

Martin Luther said false things about a lot of groups, including Catholics. Just because he said those things doesn't mean they're true. Your desperate need to repeat them doesn't make his words any truer today than when he wrote them in 1543.

The type of argument you present contains the fallacy known as "appeal to authority." A fallacy is, generally speaking, an error in reasoning - an "argument" in which the premises given for the conclusion do not provide the needed degree of support.

"Fallacy by appeal to authority." Look it up.

Bill   January 25th, 2009 6:24 am ET

Hi Nona!

Since I got Solomon to admit that the Arabs/Muslims lost Gaza and the West Bank by attacking Israel in 1967, he has said that he won't talk to me anymore. I hope that is true.

It totally shows that this "occupation" he keeps blathering about doesn't even exist. They attacked Israel. They lost as usual. Now they are on Israeli land. If they want peace and are willing to act as human beings, then all can be well.

They choose otherwise, not because this excuse of an occupation that doesn't really exist! They choose evil over good. They seem to worship and understand only violence and destruction. Sad, really.

I think they need 50 more generations to evolve.

Nona   January 25th, 2009 6:38 am ET

Hi Bill!

I've been following your comments and agree with most of what you say - especially that the West Bank and Gaza are not Palestinian territories under any scenario since they're unquestionably the spoils of war. The Sinai Peninsula (pre-handover back to Egypt) and Golan Heights fall under that same no-brainer, but we won't go there ...

I have great respect for Solomon for acknowledging that the West Bank and Gaza became Israeli territory through military defeat. I know that was a really difficult thing for him to do, and he has a new level of respect in my eyes because of it. I hope it sets a precedent for people on both sides to admit things that are difficult. It's a huge step forward to finding a peaceful resolution, assuming that's the goal for all. I know that's the goal for the overwhelming majority - and for a weary world that looks on at this conflict with an increasingly less patience.

I just posted something pointing out a fallacy in logic that Solomon frequently employs, but I do think it's only fair to applaud him for doing something really, really difficult and really, really important. My respect for him has gone up immensely and I hope his brave act sets a precedent.

Bill   January 25th, 2009 6:45 am ET

He will deny it later and go back to his occupation tripe. He has little respect for the truth and even less for logic. I think the non-existent occupation is just an excuse for evil people to practice violence and destruction.

Time will tell.

Good night, Nona. Sweet Dreams!

Nona   January 25th, 2009 7:01 am ET

Goodnight, Bill. It was great talking to you.

I am hopeful about Solomon and am reluctant to agree with your prediction until he gives me a reason to. I prefer to think we've had a breakthrough. I think Solomon loves his children and grandchildren immensely and would prefer them to live peacefully with their neighbors than die a young and bloody death for the sake of an age-old grudge instigated at the whim of Iranians who stay safely in the comfort of their palaces 1,000 miles away.

We'll see. Let's give him the benefit of the doubt.

Goodnight!

Professor   January 25th, 2009 9:39 am ET

Although I do not like gernarlizations and sterotypes but I found this website and its interestingly funny

http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message285564/pg1

Some Common Psychological Characteristics of Jews
Quote

While humans vary in their personalities and behavior, Jews often display distinctive behavior patterns. Listed below are their more well-known behaviors:

Jews often have a superiority complex, believing that they are superior to gentiles.

Jews are known to complain about life's daily hardships more than gentiles.

Jews are known to be more paranoid than gentiles, often believing that gentiles are "out to get them simply because they are Jewish."

Disloyalty towards non-Jewish persons and governments is a frequent feature among Jews.

Jews are often obsessed with scatological [fecal] subjects, e.g., human fecal- and urine-based humor. Further, Jews do not value "moral" behavior as Whites do, since their ancestors and relatives did not embrace the Christian socioreligious concept of "moral vs. immoral" behavior.

Jews, due to their unique history, have an uncanny ability to manage money and financial resources. Indeed, Jews seem obsessed with money and finance, and further, Judaism is a very materialistic religion that obsesses over valuable commodities.

Jews see themselves as physically unattractive; indeed, Jewish women often reduce the size of their noses via plastic surgery.

Jews seem to have an inborn dislike of anything culturally "European" or "White," be it art, literature, music, film, etc., and further, Jews seem to delight in criticizing such White cultural features.

Jews have a predisposition to thinking and acting in human "group" terms, i.e. "which social/political action is best for Jews?" This is an opposing feature as compared to Western gentiles, who have been trained to think as "individuals."

Jews seem to have an inability to believe that Jews might engage in any wrongdoing. Any gentile accusing any Jew of criminal or unethical behavior is automatically wrong in the eyes of Jews. Jews can never be guilty of anything, according to most Jews.

Mordechay Ariely   January 25th, 2009 1:27 pm ET

MODERN GERMANY CORRECTED THE NATZI CULTUTE!

WHEN THE ARABS WILL CORRECT THEIR?

Arab empire emerged 1300 years before Nazism
Despite the time different between the two many similarities can be traced

The difference between Germany and Arabs is that;
The German elite reexamined its culture and found it full of poison and correct it by lows and teaching

****But not the Arabs****

Following a list of partial similarities between Arabs and German Nazism

1; Arabs voluntiered to Natzi army -aproximately 40000 in Blacan divisions
2; Many Arab leaders ( example Abdul Natzer) try to contact Natzi Germany
3:Only one culture ruling the world
5; Fight all cultures until accepting the suprem ideilogy"
6: Blaming others for their situation
7: Terrorizing civilian population a major war tactic
8:Lie to infidels -The doctrine of taqiya, permiting Arabs double lenguage
9: Claiming that territories ever conquered by Islam belong to Islam forever (From Paris to Mumbay- From Viena to China gates)
9: Arab media usued similar tools to Natzi Der Stürmer propaganda
10: 99% of Jews from Arab countries have been expelled
10;Kill homosexuals
12: Discriminatory tax on non-Muslim, known as al-jeziya
13: No human rights,freedom of speech,tolerance to non Islam and one worldwide ethereal government
14: Slaught all Jews
15: Prepared to burn books
16: Based on the Arab dhimma low Syria imposed -red marked ' jew" identity cards-word JEW to be displayed on shops-could not obtain driver's license, telephone,sell or buy property
17:Hate indoctrination of children
18: The leader is always wright
19;Critic leader is punished by jale or death

Most likely i forgot many similarity points
Eveybody is free to add additional points

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 2:36 pm ET

British Bishop Richard Williamson .
said that historical evidence is hugely against six million Jews
having been deliberately gassed by the Nazis during the Holocaust.

if there is no Israeli occupation ,then there is no holocaust..
way to go freedom of speech. actually millions of people agree with the bishop. it is a big fabrication.

Akiva   January 25th, 2009 3:53 pm ET

The "massacre" lie
Almost every battle wherein terrorists are killed, is called a "massacre".
Jibril Rajoub (March 30, on MAHAD TV, a local television station in Ramallah) accused Israel of carrying out a "massacre," executing 30 Palestinians in Ramallah. The announcement was also broadcast on Al Jazeera and other stations.
The reality, of course, is different: in battles which took place on that day in Ramallah, 9 Palestinians were killed – all of them armed.

The "several priests were killed" lie
Palestinian television reported on April 2, on the basis of an official announcement by the Palestinian leadership, that a priest named Jacques Amathis had been killed and dozens of monks wounded in an IDF action in Bethlehem. The announcement was published prominently in the Italian and French media and prompted a storm of protest.
The following day the 'late" priest was interviewed by the MINSA agency and confirmed that he and the monks in the monastery were safe and well.

The "attack on holy places" lie
Arafat, in an interview to Al Jazeera television on April 3, claimed that Israel had "burned the mosque" opposite Santa Maria Church in Bethlehem and "destroyed many churches and mosques." He called upon the Christian and Muslim world to take action. MAHAD TV reported that a fire had broken out in the Omar el-Hatib Mosque in Bethlehem and that the IDF was preventing the fire brigade from reaching the site to extinguish the flames.
None of these charges has any factual basis.
The WAFA (Palestinian News Agency) Internet site reported on April 2 that the IDF had shelled the new mosque in Tulkarm after the muezzin called people to noon prayers. In fact, no such incident took place.

The "wanted terrorists are innocent civilians" lie
Jibril Rajoub claimed, in an interview with Syrian television network ANN on March 30, that the only people in the compound of the Preventive Security Services in Betouniya were people working for the service, women and civilians, and that there were no wanted terrorists there.
The truth, of course, is somewhat different. On April 2, a number of wanted terrorists were captured in the building, including senior members of Hamas involved in many terrorist activities.

The "attack on ambulances" lie
On the WAFA Internet site, it was reported on April 2 by the Palestinian Minister of Health, Riyad Al Zanoun, that the IDF had taken control of five Palestinian ambulances in Ramallah, forced their teams to strip, and taken them to an unknown site, in order to prevent them from treating the wounded.
In reality, ever since an explosive belt was discovered in a Palestinian ambulance underneath a stretcher on which a small child was lying (end of March, at the A-Ram check post), the IDF has been forced to act with extreme caution.
A similar charge, incidentally, was made on April 5 by Al Kuds newspaper, which reported that a Red Crescent ambulance was seized in El Bireh, and that IDF soldiers attacked its driver and the paramedics traveling with him.
No such incident has ever taken place.

The "attack on international aid workers" lie
In an interview with Abu Dhabi television on March 29, Arafat claimed that "there was also that incident in Hebron, that insolent and criminal incident; they even attacked and killed in the Hebron area three members of the international force: two from Turkey and one of the nurses from Switzerland."
In fact, in the incident in question, one of the Turkish members of the force was rescued, and he said, in a radio interview, that the attack was carried out by an uniformed Palestinian.

The "systematic torture of prisoners" lie
The Al Kuds newspaper reported on April 5 that the prisoners in Ofer Camp, near Givat Ze'ev, undergo torture, including breaking their fingers.
This allegation too has no basis.

Accusing Israel when terrorist actions fail
Two examples:
The WAFA news agency reported on April 6 that a person named Ali Mustafa Abu Razek, aged 30, was shot and killed by the IDF close to the Sufa Crossing. In fact, Abu Razek was a terrorist who was trying to place an explosive device and was blown up together with the device.

The WAFA agency reported on April 5 that the IDF shelled the Um Nasser neighborhood, the Al Udeh towers and the residential areas near the Salah a Din road in the northern Gaza Strip. The reality was somewhat different – the mortar shells were fired by the Palestinians themselves, but landed in their own territory.

The "spreading of pornography" lie
At the beginning of the events, IDF soldiers were accused of broadcasting pornographic films on Al Watan television in Ramallah.
This claim was thoroughly investigated by the IDF and found to be baseless.

The "use of radioactive weapons" lie
Arafat has accused Israel several times of using radioactive shells. Never was any radiation measured.

The "forging of documents" lie
On April 5 Nabil Sha'ath claimed in the Saudi 'Okaz' that Israel had forged the document seized from Arafat's office in Ramallah indicating that the Palestinian Authority was funding the Al Aksa Martyrs Brigade.
The document is of course authentic, and in the meantime other documents have been found indicating the involvement of the Palestinian Authority and of Arafat in terrorism and in its funding.

The "Jenin massacre" lie
The most famous Palestinian lie of the year 2002 (up till now!) is no doubt that on the number of Palestinian casualties as a result of the fighting in the Jenin refugee camp during Operation Defensive Shield. After the capture of the Jenin refugee camp in April 2002, Palestinians claimed a massacre had occurred in in the camp, with up to 3000 deaths. Also Arafat's Chief Liar Saeb Erekat accused Israel of a "massacre" and published the number of 520 deaths, a lie happily repeated by the media.
Israel claimed that about 52 Palestinians were killed, of whom the majority were terrorists. Afterwards, independent teams of the United Nations, Human Right Watch, Cordaid and Amnesty International confirmed the Israeli estimations and concluded that no massacre had taken place. The UN reported that the number of Palestinian fatalities can be estimated at around 55. Of those, a number were civilians, four were women and two children.
This did not prevent BBC and CNN to continue repeating these claims.

The "total devastation of Jenin" lie
The damage and destruction of buildings in the Jenin refugee camp in April 2002, as a result of the fierce fighting between Palestinian terrorists and Israel Defense Forces, was described by the Palestinians as "total destruction of Jenin". Western media used terms like 'Hiroshima', 'moonlandscape' etc. The Israel Air Force published aerial pictures proving that about 6 % of the Jenin camp was destroyed.

Organizing fake funerals
Pictures have been taken by remote cameras of Palestinians organizing fake "funerals" in preparation for the UN committee's visit to Jenin. It is not difficult to guess how the UN committee's conclusions could have been influenced by these lies.

mohammed gharbawi   January 25th, 2009 4:29 pm ET

zionism and nazism is the same.
palestinians have become the victims of the victim.
history has turned full circle.
this is historical irony.

i think the circle should turn another time to see the zionists burnt again.

benyemen   January 25th, 2009 4:31 pm ET

AKIVA,

LETS SAY WE SOMEHOW AGREE (IF WHAT YOU POSTED IS TRUE)THAT THE PALESTINIANS ARE NOT ANGELS AND THEY LIE SOMETIMES.

CAN WE AGREE TO THAT EXTENT THAT THE ZIONISTS JEWS ARE THE SATAN TEACHER IN THIS GAME.

KINDLY REPLY HONESTLY

mohammed gharbawi   January 25th, 2009 4:40 pm ET

we feel like zionists rely heavily on the notion of forgetfulness.they keep telling us we should forget about the past and focus on the present.
we agree, but give us what you took from us and we will have no problem in focussing on the present.
right?

mohammed gharbawi   January 25th, 2009 4:50 pm ET

The zionist discourse relies on many techniques. Among these strategies , we find the following:
1-they try to make you forget the past and focus on the present.
2-they try to make you forget about real issues and focus on ancillary ones.
3-they try to make you believe that effects are causes and causes are effects.
4-they try to make you ignore logic and focus on false feelings.
5-they try to make you forget that they are killers and give you the illusion that they belong to the west and its values. 6-they try to make you sympathize with the aggressor and hate the oppressed.
etc.......................................................................................................................

mohammed gharbawi   January 25th, 2009 4:54 pm ET

this is what we call colonisation.

Akiva   January 25th, 2009 5:11 pm ET

benyemen

No, they are still learning from the Palestinians.

mohammed gharbawi   January 25th, 2009 5:17 pm ET

you know i try to be as objective as i can, but with the pressure of the news and the irritating comments of the zionists , i find it necessary to insult back. may be this is the reason that they ban my replies, benyemen.

mohammed gharbawi   January 25th, 2009 5:23 pm ET

well
i m palestinian and i intend to keep being palestinian. for me there is no palestine if there is no return of its refugees.
our relatives still live in jaffa and they tell me that there are huge pressures on them to leave their homes under the pretext that they dont have a building permit.
see the irony: these houses were built long long long long long................................................................................................................................. before the coming of the early colonizers.

relly really colonization is stupid.

side lines   January 25th, 2009 5:24 pm ET

Question: Which country alone in the Middle East has nuclear weapons? Answer:Israel.

Q: Which country in the Middle East refuses to sign the nuclear non-proliferation treaty and bars international inspections? Answer:Israel.

Q: Which country in the Middle East seized the sovereign territory of other nations by military force and continues to occupy it in defiance of United Nations Security Council resolutions? Answer:Israel.

Q: Which country in the
Middle East routinely violates the international borders of another sovereign state with warplanes and artillery and naval gunfire? Answer:Israel.

Q: What American ally in the Middle East has for years sent assassins into other countries to kill its political enemies (a practice sometimes called exporting terrorism)? Answer:Israel.

Q: In which country in the Middle East have high-ranking military officers admitted publicly that unarmed prisoners of war were executed? Answer: Israel.

Q: What country in the Middle East refuses to prosecute its soldiers who have acknowledged executing prisoners of war? Answer: Israel.

Q: What country in the Middle East created 762,000 refugees and refuses to allow them to return to their homes, farms
and businesses? Answer: Israel.

Q: What country in the Middle East refuses to pay compensation to people whose land, bank accounts and businesses it confiscated? Answer: Israel.

Q: In what country in the Middle East was a high-ranking United Nations diplomat assassinated? Answer: Israel.

Q: In what country in the Middle East did the man who ordered the assassination of a high-ranking U.N. diplomat become prime minister? Answer: Israel.

Q: What country in the Middle East blew up an American diplomatic facility in Egypt and attacked a U.S. ship, the USS Liberty, in international waters, killing 34 and wounding 171 American sailors? Answer: Israel.

Q: What country in the Middle East employed a spy,
Jonathan Pollard, to steal classified documents and then gave some of them to the Soviet Union? Answer: Israel.

Q: What country at first denied any official connection to Pollard, then voted to make him a citizen and has continuously demanded that the American president grant Pollard a full pardon? Answer: Israel.

Q. What Middle East country allows American Jewish murderers to flee to its country to escape punishment in the United States and refuses to extradite them once in their custody? Answer: Israel

Q. What Middle East country preaches against hate yet builds a shrine and a memorial for a murderer who killed 29 Palestinians while they prayed in their Mosque. Answer:
Israel

Q: What country on Planet Earth has the second most powerful lobby in the United States, according to a recent Fortune magazine survey of Washington insiders? Answer: Israel.

Q. Which country in the Middle East deliberately targeted a U.N. Refugee Camp in Qana, Lebanon and killed 103 innocent men, women, and especially children? Answer: Israel

Q: Which country in the Middle East is in defiance of 69 United Nations Security Council resolutions and has been protected from 29 more by U.S. vetoes? Answer: Israel.

Q. Which country in the Middle East receives more than one-third of all U.S. aid yet is the 16th richest country in the world? Answer: Israel

Q. Which country in the Middle East receives U.S. weapons for free and then sells the technology to the Republic of China even at the objections of the U.S.? Answer: Israel

Q. Which country in the Middle East routinely insults the American people by having its Prime Minister address the United States Congress and lecturing them like children on why they have no right to reduce foreign aid? Answer: Israel

Q. Which country in the Middle East had its Prime Minister announce to his staff not to worry about what the United States says because "We control America?" Answer: Israel

Q. What country in the Middle East was cited by Amnesty International for
demolishing more than 4000 innocent Palestinian homes as a means of ethnic cleansing. Answer: Israel

Q. Which country in the Middle East has just recently used a weapon of mass destruction, a one-ton smart bomb, dropping it in the center of a highly populated area killing 15 civilians including 9 children? Answer: Israel

Q. Which country in the Middle East routinely kills young Palestinian children for no reason other than throwing stones at armored vehicles, bulldozers, or tanks? Answer: Israel

Q. Which country in the Middle East signed the Oslo Accords promising to halt any new Jewish Settlement construction, but instead, has built more than 270 new settlements since the signing? Answer: Israel

Q. Which country in the
Middle East has assassinated more than 100 political officials of its opponent in the last 2 years while killing hundreds of civilians in the process, including dozens of children? Answer: Israel

Q.. Which country in the Middle East regularly violates the Geneva Convention by imposing collective punishment on entire towns, villages, and camps, for the acts of a few, and even goes as far as demolishing entire villages while people are still in their homes? Answer: Israel

benyemen   January 25th, 2009 5:47 pm ET

MOHD G.

I AM A YEMENI AND STILL I STICK TO THE WHOLE OF PALESTINE TO BE FREED AND THE JEWS TO BE DEPORTED, BUT I BELIEVE ALSO IN THE LAST WAR WHERE TREES WILL TELL MUSLIMS THERE IS A JEW BEHIND ME COME AND KILL HIM. AS FOR CNN WHEN I POST INSULTS THEY PRINT THEM AND WHEN I POST AN HISTORICAL FACT THEY CENSOR IT. DO YOU THINK THEY ARE IMPARTIAL?

Libra   January 25th, 2009 5:48 pm ET

@sidelines

You forgot the most important question.

Q. Which country doesn't belong in the Middle East? Answer: Israel.

The 52nd state of the United States should be somewhere in North America. Does Texas fill that spot, like next to Bushs' ranch?

side lines   January 25th, 2009 5:57 pm ET

Israeli hasbara (public advcacy)is so sophisticated that there is still no adequate word for it in English; that some of Israel's spokespeople could take the hind legs off a donkey and then persuade the donkey to dance the hora, and that the Palestinians barely even know what a spokesman is, let alone be able to provide one who is available when he needs to be and knows anything about what is actually going on.
The question the foreign media really wants answered is invariably not "who's in the right?" but "how will this round of fighting improve the overall situation?" And on that point, Israel never has a convincing argument. Given the country's long history of engaging in wars that kill many more of its enemies than its own citizens but only buy a few months or years of calm, it's a tough call to explain how this latest escapade will change the strategic balance, bring peace and prevent the need for another such bloodbath further down the line.

benyemen   January 25th, 2009 6:06 pm ET

Q. Which is the only country in the world without defined borders?Answer: Israel.

Q. Which is the only country in the world which was created by UN resolution?Answer: Israel.

side lines   January 25th, 2009 6:08 pm ET

It is enough to look at the pictures coming from Shifa Hospital to see how many burned, bleeding and dying children now lie there. History has seen innumerable brutal wars take countless lives.
But the horrifying proportion of this war, a third of the dead being children, (over 350) has not been seen in recent memory.A thousand propagandists and apologists cannot excuse this criminal killing. One can blame Hamas for the death of children, but no reasonable person in the world will buy these ludicrous, flawed propagandistic goods in light of the pictures and statistics coming from Gaza.

One can say Hamas hides among the civilian population, as if the Defense Ministry in Tel Aviv is not located in the heart of a civilian population, as if there are places in Gaza that are not in the heart of a civilian population. One can also claim that Hamas uses children as human shields, as if in the past zionist organizations fighting to establish a country did not recruit children.

A significant majority of the children killed in Gaza did not die because they were used as human shields or because they worked for Hamas. They were killed because the IDF bombed, shelled or fired at them, their families or their apartment buildings. That is why the blood of Gaza's children is on Israeli hands, not on Hamas' hands, and we Americans will never be able to escape that responsibility.

Beny   January 25th, 2009 6:12 pm ET

Mr Sidelines,

Your so-called questions-answers are half-truths at best, complete lies at worst.

a) Iran now has nuclear weapons too and is progressing towards mounting them on ballistic missiles. Something Israel doesn't do. Even CIA agrees.

b) You talk of those who signed the treaty. Well, Syria signed it and violated it. Iran signed it and violated it. Or do you only care for those who signed?

c) "seized the sovereign territory by military force". Well, which country has repeatedly DECLARED war on a sovereign country with the objective of destruction?

A: Egypt. Syria. Saudi Arabia. Iraq. Lebanon. Jordan. And now the Palestinian Autonomy.

c) Who signed the Oslo agreement promising the end of suicide bombings and violated it only a few months after?

d) Instead of the "smart bomb" you complained about, YOUR country would have used normal ballistic bombs, that would have killed hundreds in one explosion.

d) "Sells the technology to China"?!! HUH! LIES LIES LIES. STUPID, IGNORANT, BLATANT LIES.

That is only a fraction of the ignorance you displayed.

Here are some of my questions?

Q: Which ethnic group is the only one in the world to be called "refugees" after more than 60 years and when most of them were born in Egypt or Jordan? Moreover, they get a special refugee organization (UNRWA)!
A: Palestinians.

Q: Which government is the only one in the world to have only one agenda in its official charter and that is the destruction of another state?
A: Hamas.

Q: Which government gets billions of UN, Irani, and Saudi money and still complains that they can't pay wages, then gets the money from Israel?
A: Hamas.

Q: Which governments are the only ones in the Middle East NOT to sign the Geneva convention resolutions?
A: Hamas and PLO.

Q: Which army is the ONLY one in the world to drag around children for the purpose of using them as human shields, in direct violation of the 1st Geneva protocol?
A: Hamas.

Q: Which government repeatedly bombarded hospitals until 1967?
A: Jordan.

Q: Which country massacred 25,000 Palestinians in ONE month in 1979?
A: Jordan.

Q: Which country massacred thousands of regime-opposing Sunnis in 1982?
A: Syria.

Q: Which side of the Palestinian-Israeli negotiations never receded even one bit from their insane demands?
A: The Palestinians.

I can go on and on about the Arabs, but here is something for Israel.

Q: Which country is the ONLY ally you (you're American, right?) have in the Middle East, promoting your foreign policies like obedient puppies?
A: Israel.

Q: In light of the recent Hamas-Fatah civil war, which claimed almost as many innocent lives as Israel has in this attack, which country is the ONLY reason the Arabs don't kill each other off?
A: Israel.

Q: Which country has held and not reacted for 8 YEARS of being bombarded by rockets, where anyone else would have nuked Gaza back in 2001?
A: Israel.

And now for something different.

Q: Which country is the ONLY one to accept Sudanese refugees, fleeing from the Muslim-commited genocide in Darfur?
A: Israel.

Q: Which country was the ONLY one on the medditeranean to accept a ship of Vietnamese refugees, escaping the US war only to be rejected by EVERY European country they came to?
A: Israel.

Q: Which country is the source of the most technological innovations in the Middle East?
A: Israel.

Q: Which country is the only one in the Middle East to send medical aid to every major disaster zone, from Hurricane Katrina, to the Bombay bombings, to the many tsunamis and earthquakes in south Asia?
A: Israel.

Q: Which country has the MOST Nobel Prize winners in the Middle East per capita?
A: Israel.

I can give a lot more examples, but that's enough for your puny brain for now.

benyemen   January 25th, 2009 6:13 pm ET

Q. Which is the only country in the world which is based on faith (Jewish) and not Nationalism ? Answer: Israel.

side lines   January 25th, 2009 6:16 pm ET

Israel's actions have dealt a serious blow to public support for the state. While this does not always translate itself into an immediate diplomatic situation, the shockwaves will arrive one day. The whole world saw the images. They shocked every human being who saw them, even if they left most Israelis cold.
This goes beyond the profound moral failure, which is a grave matter in itself.Israel gained nothing in this war but hundreds of graves, some of them very small, thousands of maimed people, much destruction and the besmirching of Israel's image
This proves again that Israel is a violent and dangerous country, devoid of all restraints and blatantly ignoring the resolutions of the United Nations Security Council, while not giving a hoot about international law. The investigations are on their way.

benyemen   January 25th, 2009 6:32 pm ET

BENY,

WHAT AN UNASHAMED LIAR THIS IS WHAT SIDELINES CALLS A HASBARA.

1- IRAN IS TRYING TO HAVE NUCLEAR FOR NON-MILITARY USE – AND ALL THE WORLD IS AGAINST THEM – DID ANYONE OBJECT FROM THE WEST WHEN ISRAEL HAVE DEVELOPED ITS MILITARY NUCLEAR PROGRAM -NO? SOISRAEL IS THE ONLY ONE WHO HAVE THIS CAPABILITY.
2- WHERE DID SYRIA VIOLATE THE AGREEMENT – AND IRAN IS FOR NON-MILITARY USE – SO ISRAEL IS THE ONLY VIOLATOR.
3- ISRAEL IS NOT A SOVEREIGN COUNTRY AND YOU HAVE TAKEN PALESTINE BY MILITARY FORCE – HAVE WE TO REMIND YOU EVERYDAY – THEY DON'T EVEN KNOW WHICH COUNTRY THEY HAVE TAKEN BY FORCE – READ BEN GURION COMMENTS.

“Let us not ignore the truth among ourselves … politically we are the aggressors and they defend themselves… The country is theirs, because they inhabit it, whereas we want to come here and settle down, and in their view we want to take away from them their country.”
– David Ben Gurion,
4-

side lines   January 25th, 2009 6:35 pm ET

The straw that broke the camel's back was the Red Cross report from Gaza that small children had been found wounded, near the corpses of their mothers, under the ruins of their homes, and other reports of civilians on the verge of dying in places ambulances could not reach because of the fighting. Israeli action is brutal and they don't realize how much damage this is causing in the world. This is not only short term. It's damage for years. Is this the real Israel .
American diplomats have said "You have the right to self-defense, but what is happening in Gaza is beyond all proportion. I am telling you, Mr. President, Israel's image in the world has been destroyed". A senior Israeli diplomat who serves in a delegation on the East Coast of the United States described how he is repeatedly asked in media interviews about Israel's war crimes in Gaza, or about the disproportionate response to the Qassams. "The harm to civilians in Gaza is causing huge damage that will only increase each day the operation continues," the diplomat said.

This is not a problem of public relations. It is difficult and impossible to explain the harm to civilians. The Foreign Ministry's efforts to emphasize that Hamas is using civilians as a human shield have only slightly contained the short-term damage. This is damage control at its best...

benyemen   January 25th, 2009 6:39 pm ET

Q. Which is the only country in the world without a written constitution? Answer: Israel.

side lines   January 25th, 2009 6:40 pm ET

Our callous disregard for the lives of ordinary civilians in Gaza shows that this country has completely lost its moral compass. It is relevant what other countries have done in other places. IDF are behaving like barbarians, egged on by a political leadership more concerned for its own electoral chances than for statesmanship. This campaign will damage Israel longer and deeper than anyone can possibly imagine – not only in terms of jewish standing in the world but also in terms of their direction as a nation. While our mainstream media may refrain from showing us the death and destruction Israeli forces are unleashing, sooner or later we will have to face the facts, and at that point only crisis can ensue.

benyemen   January 25th, 2009 6:49 pm ET

THE MAIN QUESTION IS WHY ISRAEL, UNITED STATES, EUROPE, EGYPT AND MOST OF THE WORLD DENY PALESTINIANS WEAPONS RO DEFEND THEMSELVES, ISN'T RESISTANCE FORCE A LEGAL RIGHT FOR ANY OCCUPIED LAND? CAN SOMEONE PLEASE TRY TO ANSWER THIS QUESTION?

side lines   January 25th, 2009 6:49 pm ET

Shelling a United Nations facility is something not to be done at any time, but doing it on the day when the UN secretary general is visiting Jerusalem is beyond lunacy.
Israel is not Russia and Gaza is not Chechnya. Israel cannot deal with its enemies the way belligerent superpowers deal with theirs. Wars must be just and proportional. What the world has seen is a riotous rampage in populated areas.
The level of pressure the Israel Defense Forces has been exerting on Gaza may be squeezing Hamas, but it is destroying Israel. Destroying its soul and its image. Destroying it on world television screens, in the living rooms of the international community and most importantly, in Obama's America.

Tom   January 25th, 2009 7:00 pm ET

The Mitchel appointment is a waste of time. Nobody can make peace betwen Israel and the Palestinians. That is absolutely 100% certain! Obama's best way forward is the Bush plan. There is no middle ground between good and evil. Take the side of Israel and fight the terrorists at every level. That is the best for the middle east and the best for the world. Israel will prevail in the end regardless what Obama does, because Israel is God's chosen nation. God will never, never let Israel be defeated completely. As for the Muslim terrorists, they are doomed and all that support them. The only Palestinians who have a chance are those who renounce the moon god and worship the true and living God, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob - that is the Lord Jesus Christ. Amen!

harvey   January 25th, 2009 7:07 pm ET

Benyemen,

Sorry to burst your baloon dear boy, but Great Britain doesn't have a written constitution....

So when you make sweeping statements check your facts....

harvey   January 25th, 2009 7:11 pm ET

Just for Benyemen's information...education dear boy is terribly important when it comes to being taken seriously....

Please see below....

Constitution of the United Kingdom
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
(Redirected from British Constitution)
Jump to: navigation, search
United Kingdom

This article is part of the series:
Politics and government of
the United Kingdom

--------------------------–

The constitution of the United Kingdom is the set of laws and principles under which the United Kingdom is governed.

The UK has no single constitutional document comparable to those of other nations, such as the United States. It is therefore often said that the country has an "unwritten" or de facto constitution.[1]

harvey   January 25th, 2009 7:34 pm ET

Oh my goodness... Benyemen's rhetoric has poor old moi quivering in my carpet slippers with fear. Will he unleash the hounds of HOUMOS
upon us , poor jews, driving us oin to the sea (yawn, yawn).

Benyemen, I'm here in Israel...

In fact we've been here for over 60 years. The threats, the nasty rhetoric, the sworn oaths of vengeance....It's all old hat. We're here. We've made the desert bloom, dear boy, while you've been trying to destroy us and kill our children. There are more trees in Israel now than there were 100 years ago (and we are the only country with that record).

So please, chnge the record. Lets make peace....its ever so much more challenging...but really all this needless hatred is very tedious.

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 7:41 pm ET

Beny questions and answer.

Q: Which country is the ONLY ally you (you’re American, right?) have in the Middle East, promoting your foreign policies like obedient puppies?
A: Israel.

this particular question and the answer to it.says it all.

Israel is a creation just for the interest of the west.
Israel does not belong in the Arab middle east.
Israel is a puppy and that puppy will be useless soon.

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 7:46 pm ET

Tom.

that is the way it was for the last 60 years America always take the side of Israel.

failed policy it will not succeed.

Isee you believe in your lord Jesus.

so are the Christian Palestinians who are under occupation .
maybe you should ask your lord to help them.

harvey   January 25th, 2009 7:49 pm ET

Solomon,

I would much rather that kids both Palestinian ones and Jewish ones play with puppies together rather than be taught to hate one another.....

Enough!!!Put aside needless hatred.

Let the descendants of Abraham's sons Ishmael and Isaac dwell in peace as neighbors.

Us Jews are here to stay as are you Palestinians. We have to find a way to live together not destroy one another. The challenge is putting aside the bitterness and hatred. Stop threatening to destroy our state and start building your own state.

Wishing you and yours peace

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 7:54 pm ET

Jewish groups denounced the Vatican for having embraced a Holocaust denier and warned that the pope's decision would have serious implications for Catholic-Jewish relations as well as the pontiff's planned visit to the Holy Land later this year.

"I do not see how business can proceed as usual," said Rabbi David Rosen,

Maybe the Israeli airforce should go and bomb the house of that terrorist bishop.
or may be they should send the army to occupy the Vatican.

Jewish arrogance and stupidity will bring the end osf Israel.

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 7:56 pm ET

harvey.

these are Beny words he is talking about puppies.
may be you should direct the questions to him.

harvey   January 25th, 2009 8:02 pm ET

Please see below on persecution of Christian Arabs...

The International Fellowship of Christians and Jews (IFCJ) strongly condemns the oppression of Christians in Bethlehem by Islamic extremists, which has risen sharply since Israel turned over control of the town to the Palestinian Authority in 1995. At the time of Israel's withdrawal, Christians made up 62% of Bethlehem's population. Today, that figure stands at approximately 15%, a historic all-time low.

The persecution of Christians by hard-line Islamists is common in Palestinian-controlled areas and indeed throughout the entire Middle East. In Gaza, where 3,000 Christians live among 1.5 million Muslims, it is particularly violent and sometimes deadly. Just recently, Rami Khader Ayyad, owner of a Christian bookstore, was murdered by extremists. Following Hamas' violent take-over of Gaza in June 2007, numerous attacks against Christians were also reported, including the ransacking of a convent.

IFCJ has decided to highlight these human rights violations and call attention to the persecution of Christians occurring in these areas. In addition, the organization is providing funds for a special holiday program to feed underprivileged Christian Arabs in Bethlehem. The assistance is being extended through the First Baptist Church of Bethlehem, headed by Pastor Naim Khoury, and will help provide food aid to hundreds of Christians, many of whom have been harassed and threatened by Muslim radicals because of their faith. Pastor Khoury has survived three separate assassination attempts in recent years, while his church has reportedly been bombed by Islamic extremists fourteen times.

"The oppression of Christian Arabs by their Muslim brethren has caused thousands to flee Palestinian-controlled areas over the past decade. The U.S. and the international community need to pressure the Palestinian Authority and its leader, Mahmoud Abbas, to reverse this deplorable trend and ensure the safety and prosperity of its Christian population," said Rabbi Eckstein, IFCJ President and Founder. "Through this gift, IFCJ is providing material support to the needy and saying to Bethlehem's Christians that they are not forgotten – that both Jews and Christians stand with them in their time of need."

Founded in 1983, IFCJ has a dual mission to foster better understanding and cooperation between Christians and Jews and to build broad support for Israel and the Jewish people around the world. The Fellowship works to help Jews immigrate to Israel from the former Soviet Union, Ethiopia, Iran, Argentina, India and other troubled countries; fight poverty and aid victims of war and terrorism in Israel; and extend aid to poor elderly Jews and orphans in the former Soviet Union. For general information about the IFCJ, please visit http://www.ifcj.org. http://www

harvey   January 25th, 2009 8:06 pm ET

OK Solomon,

Simple question do you have kids or grandchildren?

If so wouldn't you rather teach them to live in peace rather than to hate?

What sort of world do you want to leave behind for them....?????

Compromise is painful....but if we don't do it and keep hating what life for our kids. Do you really want your kids to become suicide bombers or suicide bombers victims?

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 8:10 pm ET

Harvey.

if you could not find a way for over twenty years of negotiations
between Jews and Palestinians.

if you are still building illegal settlements on Palestinian land.

if you are building the wall of hate and apartheid on Palestinian land.

if you have 700 check points in the west bank harassing Palestinians
.
if you have 43 elected members of Palestinian parliaments in your prisons.
if you have a blockade against 1.5 million people in Gaza.

if you just finished a killing and destruction rampage in the Gaza.

if you are denying that there is an occupation.

if you do not listen to over 65 resolution of the UN.

if you only believe in military power and dictating your agenda on Palestinians.
can you please tell me how do you propose peace between Jews and Arab Palestinians?

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 8:16 pm ET

Harvey .
yes I have grand children like any decent humans I like the best for them.
but I refuse for them to be under occupation.

I refuse for them to go to school through Israeli check points.

yes I want them to live in peace but that peace must be with Justice.

Jewish children are not more precious than Palestinian Children.

harvey   January 25th, 2009 8:21 pm ET

By small steps. By finding things that we do agree on...by people showing that they care.By acts of kindness towards one another.

For every argument and point above that you have given me, I can find a reason, valid or otherwise.

This blog is full of those arguments.

Those are all excuses both sides, mine and yours use to perpetuate this deadlock.

When we start to see eachother as people rather than statistics and nameless faces perhaps we can move forward.

Martin Luther King did not take the attitude that just because Black and white were seperated and institutional racism existed that it could not be changed.

He did not see his promised land.

But now an African American is the President of the White House.

Solomon, do you have children or grandchildren?

If so what kind of world do you want to leave behind?

Would you let your children play with mine?

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 8:21 pm ET

Harvey.
I Know Christian Palestinians more than you do.
they are more Adamant in liberating their land than the Muslims.
I will give you the names of their religious and Political leaders. and you pick any name that do not say that Christians are more hated than Muslims in Palestine by the Majority of Jews.

harvey   January 25th, 2009 8:23 pm ET

I agree with you 100% that jewish children are not more precious than Palestinian ones.

That is why we owe it to both to seek peace.

See something that we agree on and can build on together. We both love our kids.

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 8:25 pm ET

Harvey.

What do we agree on .
I want you to tell me.

Tom   January 25th, 2009 8:26 pm ET

The vast majority of Palestinians are Muslims. They are so filled with hate that all they want to do is kill everybody else – Jews, and Christians. There is justice in the universe to prevent these miserable people from succeeding at anything. Even though the international community has given the Palestinians millions of dollars and many, many chances to live in peace, all they ever do is make war. They don't deserve peace and they will not get it. They will ultimately be destroyed. The Islam religion is the scourge of the earth. This has been made abundantly clear since 9/11. The world must resist them at every point.

harvey   January 25th, 2009 8:33 pm ET

Solomon,

Hopefully we agree that all kids lives, Palestinians and Jews are precious. That we must find a better way to relate to one another other than suicide bomb and check point. That a hand held out in peace is better than a hand holding a gun.

Solomon, God forbid, if one of your grandchildren needed a kidney transplant and my kid was a match or I was, I would be delighted to let my kid or myself donate....hopefully you would be happy to accept...we have to perpetuate life rather than kill it.

And Tom, living here in Israel, I can say hand on heart that there are many amazing ,beautiful Palestinian Muslims who feel the same way we do, that peace can be achieved. And we all deserve Peace, Muslim, Christian and Jew.

Hunk   January 25th, 2009 8:34 pm ET

"Any Israeli soldiers accused of war crimes in the Gaza Strip will be given state protection from prosecution overseas, the country's PM has said."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7850085.stm

Tom   January 25th, 2009 8:35 pm ET

Solomon,
I'd say the American policy in Israel has been very effective. It has kept the evil Palestinians from making any gains. It has aided Israel, the only good guys in the region. I think the Bush plan has been the best plan possible. Personally, I think the Palestinians should get out of Israel. They are illegally occupying someone Israel's land.

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 8:35 pm ET

Harvey.
you want to talk about peace these are my questions.

under International law and UN resolutions.
the West bank is occupied territory.

Gaza is occupied territory.

Jerusalem is occupied territory.

refugees must return to their homes

No Illegal settlements on Palestinian land

that is according to the whole international community including the US.
tell me where do we agree on that ?

the Arabs are willing according to the Arab peace initiative of 2002.
to recognize Israel if these resolutions are respected and implemented.

Solomon   January 25th, 2009 8:39 pm ET

tom..
you and your Christian Zionist movements. are the best tool for the destruction of Israel.
I am sure that the next Holocaust against Jews is going to be from neo con like you.

Hunk   January 25th, 2009 8:41 pm ET

Tom,

Somebody here is really off the line
either you are blind and you seem to agree
or you you are stoned, which you don't seems that
you not aware of.

keep switching your mind off

Tom   January 25th, 2009 8:42 pm ET

Harvey,
Glad to hear it. We agree on a lot, perhaps everything. We are so glad for people like you. Of course, there are some Muslims who don't take their religion too seriously. They are not the danger. But the most devoted Muslims are the threat and they control the Gaza strip and many other places. The Koran teaches the muslims intolerance towards all non-muslims. That is why the most sincere, devoted muslims become terrorists. It poses a real threat to peace at every level, personal and national.
Israel has every right to defend its citizens with lethal force.

harvey   January 25th, 2009 8:48 pm ET

Solomon,

I am not a politician to agree or not to agree. I am just a guy who wants to find allies in making the world a safer place for our children.

I don't think Oslo was too far away from your stated demands (rather than questions).

However...you asked me what we agree on. I answered love for our children. That should be the basis of a just peace that works for both sides, not just yours or just mine. Do you agree with me?

Do you agree with me that jewish children and Palestinian children are just as important as one another?

If the answer to my question is yes then peace has a chance...

Tom   January 25th, 2009 8:52 pm ET

Hunk, Solomon and other Muslims,
Trying to reason with you is like trying to reason with a charging bull. None of your hate speech will change anything. You are sure to fail, because you are intolerant, filled with bitterness and every evil thing. You can't fight against God and win.
I found it amusing to hear Hamas claim victory in the Gaza strip and see that they lost 100 to 1 in the fight with Israel. If that is victory, what is defeat? But like brut beasts they will continue to fire rockets on civilian Israeli targets until Israel has to come over and kill a few hundred more of them. That is how foolish you muslims are. You never learn anything. All we ever hear is more hate speech.

side lines   January 25th, 2009 9:25 pm ET

The Palestinian Representative's Speech at the UN ,
"Before beginning my talk I want to tell you something about Moses. When Moses struck the rock and it brought forth water, he thought, 'What a good opportunity to have a bath!"
He removed his clothes, put them aside on the rock and entered the water.
When he got out and wanted to dress, his clothes had vanished.
An Israeli had stolen them.'

The Israeli representative jumped up furiously and shouted, 'What are you talking about? The Israelis weren't there then.'

The Palestinian representative smiled and said:

"'And now that we have made that clear, I will begin my speech.'"

Its an ingenious example of speech .

mohammed gharbawi   January 25th, 2009 9:34 pm ET

tom
we will never forget our land. we are there and we will die there.
we will wipe your species from the globe inshallah.

mohammed gharbawi   January 25th, 2009 9:42 pm ET

zionists try to persuade people that we dont have any logic. if you conceive logic as defeat, then we are agaist logic.
colonization is colonization.
whether you like it or not, 60 years of occupation seems to us like yesterday.live with that because we will have our land back by all means.

mohammed gharbawi   January 25th, 2009 9:46 pm ET

could anyone here tell me whether the legal procedures against israelis are on the way in the penal court?

American Jew   January 25th, 2009 9:49 pm ET

I'm impressed, folks! Dialog here seems more sane and respectful–Congratulations!

Akiva Heifetz   January 25th, 2009 9:55 pm ET

BBC gets blamed
they were not willing to brodcast a appeal for human aid in gaza
now they got a lot of protests
also the brithish MP was not happy about that¨
as the red cros and other organisations

they say that BBC shows how they already have taken a side

now BBC have to think a bit about :D
now they have to think if they realy dont wanna support human aid in Gaza
and if they wanna make a joke of it self

english DOT aljazeera DOR net/news/europe/2009/01/2009125185514535196.h tml

--–

will this happen maybe once to CNN too
because the world thinks they have also coosen a side
and are not a free press or political neutral

maybe its a point to think about in the house of propaganda ;)
better to hink before its to late

mohammed gharbawi   January 25th, 2009 9:59 pm ET

Akiva
we used to be mistaken about BBC, we used to think that there is free press in the world. this war has unveiled the ugly face of the european press.that 's all. we used to doubt; now we are sure who is humane and who is not. i think we approximate the End of Times. lol.

mooshy   January 25th, 2009 10:04 pm ET

?????????????

mohammed gharbawi   January 25th, 2009 10:13 pm ET

israel is a disgrace to humanity. it is a nation that was founded by a UN resolution. it has been declared as a de facto state .Britain, which is playing now the role of the spectator, is the imperialist state that has oppressed palestinians and their arab supporters to create a bastard state without any history in the region. the colonizer has implanted another colonizer for strategic reasons. i refer you to history to see the how , the when ,and the why of the problem. just press the key word Nakba and youll see the proportion of the injustice palestinians have suffered and still do.
i suppose that gordon brown (the sleepy ) , should have congratulated olmert for the mass -killing of kids in gazza during his dinner in the muslim capital jerusalem. blessed is salah ddin alayouby.

Professor   January 25th, 2009 10:17 pm ET

Tom,

Are you here for a fruitful discussion or you are here just to insult others?

Because as you know we can insult back... and we are very good at it too... ;)

You can pull out text (out of context) from any religious book and show that it teaches hate against others....

Do you agree with that?

mooshy   January 25th, 2009 10:24 pm ET

i think palestinians and israelis should be wiser.

mooshy   January 25th, 2009 10:26 pm ET

this is funny
i think everybody is tired here from this long conflict.

Akiva Heifetz   January 25th, 2009 10:31 pm ET

CNN's i-report is also a point to think about

we see first some pictures of gaza
everything is demolished they city is a total ruin
you see woundet people injusred very badly
you see theyr real sufferning

so we cant say CNN brings only one side

then after that we see pictures from israel

we see how people move downstairs to their bomb shelter
the camara man is doing some hysteric moves whyle they walk downstairs
so it looks very dramatic
down in the bomb shelter we see how the people looks
a bit boring they do theyr own videos with expensive digiCams
they laugh to each other and do some jokes
then a blonde good locking girl tells us a bit
about the psycological stress under which they have to life

its interessting how CNN is measureing the
physiological suffering in Gaza (suffering with let them cry)
with the psychological stress in israel (stress which let them laugh)
physical damage of poor people
against stress of rich people

its a good try to cover the the fact that Gaza is a poor state
under occupation demolished by a israelian highTec army
supportet by USA
whit the stress of rich israelians laughing in a bomb shelter
supportet by USA

so we will keep in mind the poor victims in israel
and we will forget the poor suffering "terrorists" in Gaza
which have to live under a woesrse occupation
and which have to suffer because israel did bomb them
in a largest concentration camp by israel

thats a good psychological trick
used by the CNN propaganda machine
its very great how you measure facts
and how CNN is trying to suggest things
and how they try to let us forget real facts

go on ... this will make CNN very more trustfull!
this will let us think that CNN is very neutral !
great i-report :D

Roscoe   January 25th, 2009 11:22 pm ET

Akiva Heifetz January 25th, 2009 2231 GMT

CNN’s i-report is also a point to think about

its we see first some pictures of gaza
everything is demolished they city is a total ruin
you see woundet people injusred very badly
you see theyr real sufferning

so we cant say CNN brings only one side

then after that we see pictures from israel

we see how people move downstairs to their bomb shelter
the camara man is doing some hysteric moves whyle they walk downstairs
so it looks very dramatic
down in the bomb shelter we see how the people looks
a bit boring they do theyr own videos with expensive digiCams
they laugh to each other and do some jokes
then a blonde good locking girl tells us a bit
about the psycological stress under which they have to life

go on … this will make CNN very more trustfull!
this will let us think that CNN is very neutral !
great i-report :D

*****************************************************************

They're simply trying to make a point of how stupid the Hamas is that they don't care enough about their people to provide the bomb shelters!

The Hamas prefer to see their people die.
The Israelis prefer to protect their people.

That's all!!

Get it!

That's why Hamas is in the prison in Gaza!

Roscoe   January 25th, 2009 11:39 pm ET

Akiva Heifetz January 25th, 2009 2115 GMT

Fatah to take Israel to The Hague

********************************************************************

The International Criminal Court at the Hague has already ruled that they will not consider any cases against Israel unless they are requested and presented by the UN Security Council.

So, these people are simply wasting their time!

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 1:14 am ET

I didn't read back far enough. How dare you attack Linda. Mo did, and Akiva. I remember the chemo thing. Nasty stuff. Well this is like a broken record. Live. Get over it. Move on. Let your children have some peace. You are higher beings – work it out. Strapping bombs on and blowing up people is not great. Silly. The Bishop Solomon? He was in trouble with the Vatican long ago. Weird and radical.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 1:27 am ET

I could quote all the nuts in the world, post nude videos, or radical ones, and write anything. Use your minds. Think. How do we co-exist and let our next generation grow and have a better future. Tunnels? They look dirty to me. The world is in crisis mode. If the U.S. really goes there, and stops all aide, just lives on what we grow and produce, I'd not be unhappy. So how, fairly, do we co-exist and move on for the next generation?

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 1:30 am ET

I've told you a few times, attack me but not my friend. She's too nice. I really don't have that problem. P.C.B. I do have a terribly dry sense of humor so I struggle to be nice. It's not easy. I really don't care about your stupid disagreements, in general.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 1:47 am ET

I'm still waiting for the LHC in CERN to restart. Potentially that could change mankind. I guess wars can too. Sadly. Look up LHC in CERN. Be amazed. Get over the small junk. Work it out.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 2:15 am ET

The world will either go forward, read about sub atomic particles and quantum physics, or go back to sheep herding. Personally, I hope we go forward. I hope everyone hopes for forward. It's a little dangerous maybe, there are protestors, but so was sailing a ship back when folks thought the world was flat and it would fall off. We laugh now.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 2:27 am ET

Just to be clear, I do consider Israel almost a state here. Like that or not. I care why? Most people in the U.S. do. 911 confirmed the playground rules for most of us. We got it. Sadly, we are nice people in general. Good and bad of course. It's not about being human though. It's about destroying. There are always creators and destroyers. Hard truth time. Which are you? My hubby works everyday, hard, to produce. I do too. What are you producing that helps the world?? Or not.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 2:30 am ET

I prefer to be nice, sweet, funny and loving. Sometimes you can't be that way. Tough life time. I like everyone. I'm pro-peace. You want to wipe someone else off the map? Exterminating Darfur was bad enough. Let people just live.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 3:11 am ET

Also, since I seem to have the floor, to anyone considering blowing yourself up with a bomb – Get help and deal with tough "Planet Earth." It's not easy to live. Or blow yourself up which is childish. Go stand in a desserted field to do it. Don't take someone's beloved child, grandchild, or great-grandchild with you in your childishness. I don't consider such people brave or admirable. Living is much tougher. Some can't deal with it.

Nona   January 26th, 2009 3:37 am ET

You're right, GLeigh. Suicide bombers are the most twisted, lowly and demented scum of the Earth. They're of the same school of wretched twistedness as child molesters. That a whole society is raising their children to believe that those who commit such acts are "martyrs" is completely sick. I can't think of a greater atrocity that a people could commit upon their own children.

Debs   January 26th, 2009 4:25 am ET

Hey Nona and GLeigh,

Sorry I havent been on blog lately. To busy with people who throw hate and blame around...How are you??

Nona   January 26th, 2009 5:12 am ET

I understand. I've been pretty busy and tired too. You're right about being too busy to bother with people who just want to throw hate and blame around - I've been feeling the same way!

Rest up and have a great week.!

Debra   January 26th, 2009 5:48 am ET

I don't understand! I watch on tv the protests taken to the street by Mid East people. Be it in other countries or the US. I wonder, why are they here. Did these people come here to get an education, fancy clothes, house, car....to have a better life. Are these people really happy or do they feel guilty? I wonder why these people of many faiths and backgrounds, don't go back to their country and make a difference with their people, teach what they have learned. Is the danger of going back to much of a threat for them?

Rod   January 26th, 2009 5:49 am ET

A Stark Reminder of the Holocaust – Thanks to Israel
Secrets of the Gaza Holocaust have been hidden by the media. Hundreds of people dead in Israel’s secret archive. This is where tax payer’s money is going. Be prepared for very graphic content and forward to your family and friends so they know what our Tax money is used for.

http://www.elfarra.org/gallery/gaza.htm#

(see it all to the end) I am shocked and saddened by the similarities.
I am sure someone will come up saying "propaganda pictures!" then go on and blame the victims.

My reply: "I feel sorry for you cause you have a Dead Heart"

Nona   January 26th, 2009 6:03 am ET

Rod, I agree that you do have to have a dead heart to not feel heartbroken and overwhelmed with sadness by those images.

However, the difference between Operation Cast Lead and the Holocaust is that the Jews of Europe were not sworn to the destruction of Germany, firing rockets into German civilian populations, and breastfeeding their kids on the twisted ideology that suicide attacks on German citizens was a form of "martyrdom" and service to Gd. The Jews of Europe did nothing more than try to build peaceful and productive lives, much like the people of Israel are trying to do.

I know we don't see eye to eye on this, but I think we CAN agree that peace is a better answer than any of this.

Rod   January 26th, 2009 6:25 am ET

Sorry this is not an excuse for all the Crimes that Israel did.

The Israeli propaganda machine cannot Justify these Images! and these Criminal actions.

All these are children. Call them Hamas children then it is easier to kill them. I am sure there are many smart people who are out there who do not want their Tax money used to kill children and do not believe the Israeli lies.

look at it again.

http://www.elfarra.org/gallery/gaza.htm#

Debra   January 26th, 2009 6:33 am ET

I feel what is happening now and what has happened in the past, with the hatred and killing of other people stems from the day Jesus was cruicified on the cross. Was it due to the people (of origin and faith) that yelled out to kill Jesus or was it due to the (origin and faith) of Jesus, or both? Until we figure out what started this, nobody will be happy and there will be no ending! I am just an old woman of her faith trying to understand what is being said by you good people. Thank you.

Rod   January 26th, 2009 6:46 am ET

Debra,
since you are a woman of faith. I do not believe Jesus will be happy with killing these children. the website I posted shows how Israel's criminal actions have resembled the Holocaust. the germans claimed the jews were destroying the whole world and now Israel kills children then blames Hamas an entity Israel itself has created.

The Israeli propaganda uses Hamas as an excuse to do what has been an Israeli mission since its creation based on religious beliefs:

"All of the Palestinians must be killed; men, women, infants, and even their beasts." This was the religious opinion issued by Rabbi Yisrael Rosen, director of the Tsomet Institute, a long-established religious institute attended by students and soldiers in the Israeli settlements of the West Bank

Nona   January 26th, 2009 8:29 am ET

I don't think Jesus would be happy with the killing of any children, whatever their faith, race or religion. And I"m pretty sure he'd frown on suicide murderers too.

Debra, I don't really get the point of your argument. Are you suggesting that Jesus was not put here to die for our sins? That when Jesus foretold his fate to his disciples, and when Peter tried to talk him out of going to Jerusalem to meet that fate, that Jesus should have listened and not gone? That Jesus wouldn't expect us to be forgiving of whoever killed him, when, on the cross, he cried, "Forgive them Father - they know not what they do?" Are you suggesting he wouldn't expect the same forgiveness from us toward whoever killed him? Are you suggesting that Jesus shouldn't have been crucified in order to redeem the followers of his teachings? That whoever killed him was not fulfilling their assigned role in part of a divine plan? Whatever your point is, I don't get it.

Rod, you cannot claim that Israel's actions in self-defense against incessant rocket and suicide attacks is a not legitimate defense for Operation Cast Lead while claiming that Hamas's official stated goals of eradicating the state of Israel and exterminating all Jews - along with its use of rocket and suicide attacks - IS legitimate, unless you don't expect anybody to take you seriously when you call yourself a "humanitarian."

The images are horrible, the destruction is horrible, the human toll is unspeakable, and both sides have innocent blood on their hands. Your choice of gory photos is curiously selective - as is your ridiculous incindiary quote, which is from an extremist and certainly not state policy, unlike the official state policy of Hamas, which is to reject all peaceful solutions and advocate genocide of all Jews, Israeli or not.

And why do you conveniently overlook Hamas's treatment of the children of Gaza instead of condemning it for the "propaganda" and child abuse that it is?

BOTH sides have victims, and BOTH sides have plenty of blood on their hands.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 11:59 am ET

benemen – I'm amazed. You actually expressed an opinion without a lot of curse words or name calling. I personally think that God expresses himself to other people the way he wants. Native Americans believe in God the way they see him and have learned. So do the people in Tibet. There are different shades of brown skin. Mine is light. I'm Baptist. I speak English. Some of my good friends have darker brown skin or different languages or different religions. Does that mean they are wrong? I doubt it seriously. Is a tiger wrong because it's not a bear? I would never tell anyone their religion is wrong. Not my place to do that. I do think using God as a reason to destroy is wrong. It's been done a lot thoughout history, but it's never right. Right and wrong are constants.

Professor   January 26th, 2009 12:10 pm ET

GLeigh,

So, you do agree using religion to establish the "Jewish only State of Israhell" by destroying everything that is Palestinian is wrong?

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 12:15 pm ET

Yes. I think there should be two separate states, monitored so no one shoots at the other.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 1:31 pm ET

Debs and Nona, everyone – Ran back on to say hi, if you are anywhere out there. Didn't see your posts to me till this morning. Sorry. I wrote my say and dozed. The weather is getting warmer, always a good thing in my book, and I'm in a good mood. Doing my spring cleaning the next few days and need a break from the death and destruction deal too. Nice to you to say hi though! Have a good one!

Debra   January 26th, 2009 2:08 pm ET

Yes, Nona, what you say is true. Jesus died for our sins. Yes, forgive them, they don't know what they do. You are right! I guess what I was trying to say and didn't was.....People are only human and take things out on other people. Them, maybe, thinking...You killed Jesus, so I am going to kill you or Jesus is not like me so I am going to kill him, that sort of thing. I don't know how to say what I mean sometimes. And if all is forgiven why does this torture and killing go on and who is going to stop it?

dan perman   January 26th, 2009 2:11 pm ET

GLeigh

you fell in the trap they put up for you and agreed to call the State of Israel "israhell"

read back and see!

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 2:28 pm ET

Dan – I had a feeling that I needed to come back here. I don't care what they call anything. Words. I thought it was bad spelling. I just want them to find real solutions and move on. Debra – Jesus was the Prince of Peace. That's really about it. Truth. He was just here to help us see God.

Debra   January 26th, 2009 2:42 pm ET

Yes, scary stuff. I agree!

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 2:45 pm ET

As humans, we have a need to place things in compartments to understand them. Baptist, Southern Baptists, Lutheran, Muslim, on and on and on. In the end, we just struggle along, trying to understand and we bicker. I must be right. In the end, God just wants our attention. He made us for it.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 2:54 pm ET

I still think strapping a bomb on and blowing myself up is about the silliest thing that I can think of doing. I hear these things on the news. Reminds me of Japan fighter pilots and their death dives in WW II. I can't even imagine them. My oldest decided at 19 to become a licensed pilot. He stopped after the paper, but he wanted it. I was shocked because he's like me and doesn't really like heights. My other two love them. Odd. Well, on one of his advanced lessons, he was told to shut down the engine because a plane can glide to a landing. Scared the whatever out of him and he did it. He landed fine in a field. "Planet Earth is a hard place to live." That is a quote. Hard lessons. I won't even go there on who told me. So, I try to be patient. The rest I won't quote.

Tony Larue   January 26th, 2009 2:55 pm ET

Gleigh,

Thanks for bringing some civility to this forum. It seem as though some on here strive on directing insults at others who do not agree with them or share their views.

I have read the Professoirs blogs and for the most part agree with him on many of his blogs.

I think he is well versed but that said, I have also agrred with others. A few days ago Dan replied to my blog by saying "get a life' for agreeing with the Professor. This person does not what life I have and who I am.

Let us face it, the people who are responsible for the carnage in Gaza will go before the world court one day. It was a crime against humanity. I hope this happens sooner than later.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 3:03 pm ET

Tony – I have kiddies. I saw, on the news, an Israeli elementary school with a concrete arch over it in case a Hamas missile struck. The children might have a chance of surviving. Well, as a mom that really rocked my boat. I do understand why people in Israel are upset. It's been going on 8 years. That's a long time. I know the missiles are poor and home made. They won't kill a lot of Israel's people. I find it hard though to put a value on one life. If that one life was my baby, I would be upset. Is it wrong for a country to protect its citizens? I live in the U.S. If some other country, over eight years, sent 11,000 plus missiles into my neighborhood, with schools, home made or not, I would want action. If not, I'd be upset. Now, I think that those missiles should not have been in populated areas. And I think that instead of tunnels there should have been bomb shelters. I can't even image not doing that for my own people. Explain that to me please?

benyemen   January 26th, 2009 3:08 pm ET

GLEIGH
January 26th, 2009 1159 GMT

benemen – I’m amazed. You actually expressed an opinion without a lot of curse words or name calling. I personally think that God expresses himself to other people the way he wants. Native Americans believe in God the way they see him and have learned. So do the people in Tibet. There are different shades of brown skin. Mine is light. I’m Baptist. I speak English. Some of my good friends have darker brown skin or different languages or different religions. Does that mean they are wrong? I doubt it seriously. Is a tiger wrong because it’s not a bear? I would never tell anyone their religion is wrong. Not my place to do that. I do think using God as a reason to destroy is wrong. It’s been done a lot thoughout history, but it’s never right. Right and wrong are constants.

GLEIGH I AM THE ONE AMAZED HERE, INSTEAD ADDRESSING YOUR COMMENT TO TOM, YOU ARE ADDRESSING IT TO ME.

WHY IS THAT?

(SEE TOM'S COMMENT WHICH A REPLIED TO) BECAUSE YOU READ THE COMMENTS BEFORE ARGUING OR OBJECTING.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 3:08 pm ET

I was as ignorant as a rock on this subject. But I am learning. The more I learn, the more I realize what this is about. Destruction. Lovely.

benyemen   January 26th, 2009 3:21 pm ET

GLEIGH
January 26th, 2009 1454 GMT

I still think strapping a bomb on and blowing myself up is about the silliest thing that I can think of doing.

JUST IMAGINE WHAT WILL PUSH YOU TO DO SUCH SORT OF A TERRIBLE THING!!!!!!!! AND GIVE ME A REASON.

CS   January 26th, 2009 3:28 pm ET

GLeigh. Me and Prof were just agreeing that Brandon is angry at the Catholic church for...personal resons. But it appears the CNN has removed his nasty comment, so you're kinda late, but we still love you.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 3:29 pm ET

I view life as a miracle. I see them everyday. As a mom, I worry. Life here is not long, but still I worry. That's not smart, but emotional. If you are missing the miracles, ask yourself why. I don't judge people. Just one of those cosmic questions. Figure it out for yourself.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 3:32 pm ET

I read Brandon as he wrote. He's just radical. They happen on every side. Fired up. Thanks for the love word. I often wonder if it really exists. Love should be the first thing.

CS   January 26th, 2009 3:33 pm ET

GLeigh, Professor. I think this guy Mitchell was a decent appointment for Obama to make. He seems to be about fairness. I previous years, CNN says he pushed for dismantleing Israeli settlements in Gaza, AND a cessation to Hamas terror attacks. Seems to be right down the middle, something this conflict needs very badly.
What do you think?

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 3:40 pm ET

In most arguments, the truth is down the middle. Not always. As a truth person – this can really mess up because they don't expect it. I do think that this envoy has some knowledge and experience. I do think President Obama is serious and doing what can be done. The U.S. is not there. Most don't care or want to get involved in this "small war." Who can blame them. Other countries, like us, are dealing with global economic crisis. The "small war." That was also a quote. Shocked me a little because it's important to me. Not sure why.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 3:46 pm ET

CS – When my kids were fighting, I seperated them. It seemed a good thing. I've dealt for years with kids. What do you think? I'm a little opinionated, I admit, but doesn't that seem the best way?

CS   January 26th, 2009 3:55 pm ET

GLeigh. No question. I just keep going back to what Christ said;
"LOVE THY NEIGHBOR AS THYSELF" I'm sure other religions have similar codes of ethics, but it seems that people (in every religion)
get so radical, that the principals of their faith are pushed aside, and their own CULTural ideals and traditions take over. I am no Islamic scholar, but I'm sure the Koran makes no mention of suicide bombing, or any other such thing. My problem is that the media knows that there are radicals from every religion, but they choose to only show the radicals of Islamic faith, which makes it seem that all Muslims are radical, and this, as you know, is wrong.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 4:09 pm ET

CS – there are radicals from every religion so we agree. Most are just not so "radical." There was peace there a long, long time. Most just co-existed. We don't have that now. Now, ask Darfur, it's extermination. Very sad stuff. Read about it. Knowing it exists, it's hard just to be happy really. I cannot imagine strapping on a big bomb, hoping to blow away someone's beloved grandchild. Call me stupid. Down through history, cultures have dealt with hardships. None were so intent on killing.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 4:11 pm ET

911 was tough. Most channels won't even show it. Too hurtful.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 4:18 pm ET

I think the Koran says that anyone not like them is the enemy. Never read it. That is not the way they spell it either. Quar'an. Off. If you write, "Koran" you will get a rear end chew out. I did. That was about my second sentence here and I apologized a lot. I should remember. CS this is not about peace. It's about winning. But, in the end, I do think God might get angry again. I hope not. Peace to all.

Nona   January 26th, 2009 4:26 pm ET

CS -

I am glad to see you, because I've been looking for an opportunity to say directly to you: You and I have exchanged heated words in the past and have not seen eye to eye, but I want you to know how much I respect and admire your genuine efforts to direct this conversation into a productive dialogue. I also want to thank you for those efforts. You and I may well disagree in the future, but I want to say that I'm afraid I may have misjudged you in the past, and for that, I apologize. I really applaud your efforts to hold everybody accountable to contributing to productive dialogue.

I agree with your comment about going back to "Love they neighbor as thyself." It's a principle that directly reflects Jesus's Jewish education and upbringing, because he's quoting Hebrew scripture (Leviticus 19:18), upon which he built his ministry and used for the source of his ethical teachings. "Love thy neighbor as theyself" is actually a foundation of Jewish law and religion to this day. In these discussions, I also frequently think of Jesus's words: "Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you." I especially think of this teaching when I see the videos of Hamas teaching young Palestinian children to kill every Jew they see, or to strap on suicide belts and detonate them amidst as many innocent people as possible is an act of "martyrdom." It makes me sad. How tragic, how self-destructive, to never learn to love your enemy.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 4:27 pm ET

Really – I hope he does. I like animals. Why are there so many people interrupting the animals? If I was God, and be grateful that I am not, there would only be a few people. He likes them more than I will ever like them. Peace.

CS   January 26th, 2009 4:36 pm ET

Well, I have never read the Quar'an, so I can't say what I think might be in it. As to your comment about separating the children. I disagree. I think when siblings fight, the parents should make them stay in close quarters together, until they can learn to live with eachother, and love eachother. Separation of children (or Palestine/Israel) is an easy, temporary fix in my opinion. As my friend the Professor said a few days ago, we should bring them closer. I think that boarders should be removed, and Palestinians and Israelis should be living, LITERALLY, side by side. This way, both have an interest in security, balance, and peace. Just as it once was. Arab Christians, Jews, and Muslims all lived together in peace before the U.N. went in and screwed with things in 1948. I think we should learn from history, and go back to it's ways...for this matter anyway.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 4:46 pm ET

CS – I do know that the Prof is a Palestinian Christian Brother. He told me in his cry for acceptance. I do think there comes a time when it is best to seperate siblings. I've seen and done it. Time out and more. If I were Jewish and someone had been hitting my country for eight years with missiles, and I had young children, those same people would not be my ideal neighbors. That must sound odd to you.

Nona   January 26th, 2009 4:47 pm ET

Debra –

Thank you for clarifying what you were trying to express. I don't think the teachings of Jesus or his death really are reasons for what's going on between Israel and the Palestinians, but the whole situation could probably be handled a lot more effectively and less bloodily if some of Jesus' teachings were used to resolve it.

Have you seen the interviews with Masab Yousef, the son of a Hamas founder who fled to the USA so that he could practice Christianity? If not, you can find them on youtube, and you'd probably be really interested in them. Just search his name and a bunch of videotaped interviews with him come up. They're really fascinating.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 4:48 pm ET

Prof – What Christian are you? Baptist? Southern Baptist? Where in Palestine? I am the questioner.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 4:51 pm ET

When I write, there is always silence from the dark side. Why is that? I like answers.

CS   January 26th, 2009 4:52 pm ET

Nona. Thank you for the nice comments. I try to see things for what they are, a good deed, or intention is just that. No matter who it comes from. That's why you have seen me heatedly disagree, but also praise the constructive, and good ideas others have made her. I have disagree with Muslims, Jews, and Christians in here. I'm trying to be righteous, and deal in an upright manner with my neighbors, so to all...please do not be offended if I agree with you about some issues, and disagree about others...as we are all individuals, and should not be followers.
In trying to be fair, I noticed that you made mention of Hamas' teaching young children to strap on, and blow up. This may be true in some cases. But many democratic nations use brainwashing tactics to get it's countrymen to do horrific things to.
Perhaps you missed what I siad a week or so ago about the Palestinian woman who was abused by the Israeli security forces at the airport. Forced to remove her sanitary napkin, and board the plain dripping with blood, becaus they took all the ones she had left.
Maybe you missed the fact that Israel (PRIOR TO AND DURING THE CEASE FIRE) instigated this issue, by cutting off Gaza's electricity, and running water on a daily basis, cutting the import of food/medical supplies/daily necessities, and many other opressive acts.

I know that you have valid points on Hamas' misconduct as well. Really, I do. Because, as I have always said, I am for the every day people. In this conflict, I tend to support Palestine a little more, because of the unfair treatment by media/U.N. I have also said that I sympathize with Palestine, but disagree with the way Hamas does things. But going into every single past misdeed (form BOTH sides) will get us nowhere.

Nona   January 26th, 2009 4:55 pm ET

Hi GLeigh!

Embrace the computer! The internet is a limitless way to explore new cultures, visit new places, ask those pesky questions you've always wondered about. It's good to see you and to have you around!

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 4:59 pm ET

CS get real. I have three kids. Two are grown, one almost. I have helped raised a few friends. I have yet to see kids learning to strap on bombs or shoot anyone. Where did that come from? I do agree with the middle road. I don't agree with sticking my head in the sand and choking too death. My kids know happy, fun, secure, sunshine. Not bombs. I doubt that any of the three would recognize one. Perhaps. They are good at learning things. They learned to shoot deer and turkeys. We have many guns here. We stress safety and taking out bullets and cleaning the guns. You never point a gun, even unloaded, towards a person. That's a big difference I would say.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 5:03 pm ET

The deer and turkey thing bothered me until I learned how many were hit by cars each year. I don't like cars either. I stopped fishing a long time ago. I still eat meat. Not sure how. Childhood thing I guess.

CS   January 26th, 2009 5:04 pm ET

GLeigh. I REALLY hate doing this, as I wish and pray for progress in this matter, but if you want to got into the past, then here we go.

Do you really think that Palestine just, all of a sudden started bombing Israel 8 yrs ago for no reason at all? It amazes me that people cannot distinguish between the every day market owner/famer/fisherman/handyman, of whatever, who is Palestinian...and the terrorists Hamas. JUST BECAUSE SOME TERRORISTS HAPPENT TO BE PALESTINIAN DOES NOT MEAN THAT ALL PALESTINIANS ARE TERRORISTS OR WISH ILL UPON JEWS. OPEN YOUR MIND! The Jews (Worldwide), and western culture have don e a terrible thing by connecting the two.
I pray, and read the bible at home..because I've been to several chusrches who buy into this US vs. THEM crap. I've been directed by pastors to feel disdain for arab people, and to vote for a president who will be their scorn. This very talk has driven me from organized church.
This is what I meant by people adding THEIR issues to religion, instead of sticking to the scripture. This is how people use religion as a tool to fuel wars, separation form eachother, and separation from God. The Israelis have not been saints in the past either. If you can't admit that BOTH sides have iniquities, than you are either a lier, or an enabler.
And this goes to anyone who blindliy supports a movement, regardless of it's statutes.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 5:08 pm ET

Nona – Thank you. I'm trying my hardest to be neutral. It's challenging. I like the internet. I'm a science person. I just cannot wait until Cern is back a few years. I have high expectations. Most stuff on here is garbage though. I have a teen son and friends, not my first time around, who find it all.

Professor   January 26th, 2009 5:10 pm ET

GLeigh,

If said what of Christian i am then the Zionists on this blog will find a reason to attack me.... If I said what type of Muslim i am then will find another reason to attack me.... If I said what type of Jew I am then will find another reason to attack me.... Here is my few of religion.... Judaism, Christianity and Islam are from the same one God... you can call him in whatever name you prefer but he is the one creator. He sent all the profits we all believe in from Adam until Mohammad...

To make a logical analogy you have to look at it like the shcool system.... in Elemntary school you learn math.... when you graduate and move to High School you also learn math there.... (is it any different from the math you learn in Elemntary School? No but its expanded more.... but the principals are the same. Then you graduate to College.... in College you also learn some math.... are the basic theories any different from what you have learn in Elementary and High School? No but it goes into more details.

Some of us are still in Elementary School (Jews) they believe in the prophits mentioned in the old testament but not in Jesus nor in Mohammed. Some of us are in High School (Christians) the believe in all the prophets up to Jesus. Some of us are in College (Muslims) and the believe in all of them up to Mohammed.

Now some humans who have a political agenda twist the words of God to make them fit their political agenda and use agression and killing others in His name a way of life.

If we put those people aside we can see that we are all brothers and sisters in God. But, we make ourselves our own enemies by our own deeds.

American Icon   January 26th, 2009 5:11 pm ET

Its just that we all have to understand that Pro Palestinian DOESNOT mean Pro Hamas, just like if you are a Republican, it doesnt mean you are Pro Bush...

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 5:17 pm ET

Prof – you are a bit full of yourself. I knew that early on. I even remember writing it, here. So you, the Muslims, are college. I'm basically a learning person, open. I could tell you stories that would make the hair fall from your head. I think you are wrong in your story. Every story is subject to its storyteller. I need to quit calling you my Palestinian Christian Brother though. It's rude to quote you. You would make a good politician though.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 5:20 pm ET

p.s. Prof – I admire your typing speed. Most would just cut and paste. I know you don't go there.

Nona   January 26th, 2009 5:22 pm ET

CS –

Thank you for your kind response. You are certainly right that both sides have innocent blood on their hands. I tend to sympathize with Israel, because they do subscribe to the philosophy of loving your neighbor as yourself and of loving your enemy, and there is no doubt in my mind that Israel would like nothing more than to live in peace with its Arab Muslim neighbors; that Israel would like nothing more than to "live and let live," and that humiliating acts like the one you describe at the airport are BECAUSE of repeated suicide attacks on Israeli infrastructure and citizens - they're self-defense measures, not random acts of horror.

You rightly point out that many democratic cultures use brainwashing
tactics. It's just my opinion, but when children are encouraged, rewarded and applauded to murder and commit suicide in the name of a poltical cause, well, to me, that's a bright line of demarkation between a cause and a toxic ideology. When a political cause becomes more important than the value system in which you raise your children and the importance you put on their lives and the values in which you raise them, then I have no choice but to question the righteousness of the political cause. I hope you understand that Hamas's indoctrination of hate and "martyrdom" isn't something that "may be true in some cases." It's fully entrenched society-wide by Hamas, much like First Amendment rights are in the USA. Genocide and "martyrdom" prevade that society's TV programming (including children's programming), school curricula, religious teachings, etc. It's not an occasional occurrence. We have issues in the USA with illegal immigrants from Mexico, but can you ever imagine Sesame Street and Mickey Mouse on US tv preaching, "Kill all Mexicans, wherever they are. When the tree says to you, 'There's a Mexican hiding behind me! Kill him,' then you slay him.' Mexicans are apes and pigs, and when you kill them, you will please Gd and live in paradise forever?" Well, that's what Mickey Mouse and Sesame Street are like in Gaza.

I don't know if you caught Hillary Clinton's press conference where she addressed Hamas children's TV. I can't find the whole thing, but here's what I could find: youtube.com/watch?v=YIBNRVgq59Y

American Icon   January 26th, 2009 5:22 pm ET

A thousand propagandists and apologists cannot excuse this criminal killing. No reasonable person in the world will buy these ludicrous, flawed propagandistic goods in light of the pictures and statistics coming from Gaza.
Well said.....

Linda   January 26th, 2009 5:23 pm ET

Well, hello everyone!

Professor   January 26th, 2009 5:24 pm ET

GLeigh,

What story? I was not tell you any story.... I did not say if I am a Muslim or a Christian.... see how you can ready into someone's writing whatever you please....

I defend Palestinians regardless if they are Muslims or Christian because they bother suffer the same under this occupation.... They even deal with each other like brothers regardless if they are a Hamas leader or a father in the church.... so why should I take sides?

I am against any occupation regardless what religion it holds... because any occupation is a political conflict that has no religion.... humans like you and me who are not chosen by God try to make it look as if its a religious conflict and I do not belive nor trust them.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 5:25 pm ET

Prof I am waiting.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 5:28 pm ET

Hey Linda! How are you smart one! I'm listening.

Linda   January 26th, 2009 5:29 pm ET

I'm listening too. I'm siting in pain today, bad day. thought I would check my email and the blog. Ordered some Yoga DVD's from Amazon.

Professor   January 26th, 2009 5:31 pm ET

None,

Those same hate teachings are certainly exist in Jewish books towards Arabs and that is also documented...

So, that love is mutual I guess.... eh?

Its the occupation stupid.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 5:32 pm ET

Linda – I hope you got my last e-mail. If you did, I apologize. My sense of humor is really bad. You will understand that. I listen in silence here quite a bit. It's bad here too. Still waiting on my PCB to respond.

Linda   January 26th, 2009 5:33 pm ET

Gleigh,
Yes I got it and mailed you back

Professor   January 26th, 2009 5:34 pm ET

GLeigh,

I am sorry did I miss one of your comments or questions?

What are you waiting for?

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 5:37 pm ET

Prof – your email made no sense. No offense. It just didn't. I've heard its the occupation and stuff, so many times from you, but this? We are all chosen by God. That is first. From there, find your own way to him. I have mine.

Linda – sorry it's a bad day for you. I don't understand these things, never have. I hope you feel better.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 5:42 pm ET

Prof – do you really want my focus? I will go there.

Linda – I think that you are fine. We all have bad days. I had one not long ago. When you are better, I promise, I'll fly there to see you. I hate flying, use to love it. Now I know how fragile we really are. That changes me, always.

Nona   January 26th, 2009 5:42 pm ET

Hi Linda! Great to see you.

Professor, you're lying (again). Israeli TV does NOT air children's programming (or adult programming) encouraging the suicide or murder of anybody, Palestinian or otherwise. Nor do the school books and curricula. Israelis do not teach their children that killing themselves in the course of killing Palestinians (or anybody else) is a brave heroic act for which they'll see eternal paradise. Israelis don't teach their children to aspire to be killers; they teach them to aspire to be doctors and teachers and poets and engineers. Israeli streets are not lined with posters of suicide bombers. Israel doesn't even call its soldiers "martyrs." To the contrary, Israeli society holds that any killing is tragic, including Palestinians killed in the course of self-defense.

Professor   January 26th, 2009 5:43 pm ET

GLeigh,

I think you really are having hard time understanding me.... I never said anyone is chosen by God.... go back and read my comment slowly and focus on it please.... :)

I was simply going in chronologcal order.... It would not make sense to say that College comes before Elementary School. The oldest revelation from God is the Torah.... The latest is the Quran.... Get my drift?

Linda   January 26th, 2009 5:43 pm ET

Good to see you too, Nona!

Linda   January 26th, 2009 5:45 pm ET

Professor,
Why do you think the latest is the Quran?

CS   January 26th, 2009 5:45 pm ET

Professor. Although I disagree with the system of levels you used, as I am a Christian, and believe Jesus is God's son,
What you said at 1710, about us all being from one God, and brothers and sisters, was briliant and beautiful brother. Thanks.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 5:46 pm ET

My personal opinion, strap on your bombs and blow yourselves up. Right now, I really don't care beans. Go for it. Just leave my kids out of it. God should be happy. Maybe not, but I would be. I'm not as patient.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 5:47 pm ET

Some fight to live and some fight to die. Guess who I'm rooting for? I do have connections. Time to use them maybe.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 5:50 pm ET

CS I'm glad you like the Prof. I don't see it. Give me an explantion. I think that he is mean.

Professor   January 26th, 2009 5:51 pm ET

None,

You are a liar too.... :)

You can call me liar all what you want.... that does not negate the fact that it does exist and its documented by third party organizations....

Palestinian parents also aspire their children to be Doctors and Engineers and the proof is available if you just look at the rate of Palestinians professionals all over the world.... But that does not mean they will not teach their children that they need not to forget to what happened to Palestine and Palestinians on the hand of Israehll.

Just like you teach your children not to forget the holocaust. Like I said its mutual.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 5:53 pm ET

I am leaving to read Linda's email. But, I will be back. To me, everything starts out personal. Why bother if not.

Professor   January 26th, 2009 5:55 pm ET

Thank you my brother CS... :)

Professor   January 26th, 2009 5:57 pm ET

Linda,

You just like to argue simple facts or what?...

You do not know which one is the oldest from God's revelations and which one is the latest?

I am sorry but i do not know where to go from here with you....

Linda   January 26th, 2009 5:59 pm ET

Professor,
Do you think that God stopped giving revelations at the Quran?

Professor   January 26th, 2009 6:02 pm ET

Linda,

The only monothiestic faiths I know about are Judaism, Christianity and Islam.... there are other but they are not monothiestic (they believe in multiple gods).

Do you know of any others?

Linda   January 26th, 2009 6:03 pm ET

Yes, What about the Mormons?

Nona   January 26th, 2009 6:04 pm ET

Professor.

I am not a liar at all, but it's nice to see you finally admit that you're one.

If this fact exists, show me proof. Post a clip of Israeli TV urging its citizens to exterminate Palestinians.

You are correct that Palestinians would like their children to be doctors and engineers, and that many are. I should have pointed that out in my earlier comments. But that doesn't negate the fact that if they never have the opportunity to do so because they die in a "martyrdom" operation, that they are equally proud.

Nobody is suggesting that Palestinians forget their history. Many are suggesting that Palestinians work to rebuild their history instead of working so hard destroy their children, their society, and their neighbors.

CS   January 26th, 2009 6:08 pm ET

Nona. I understand that Hamas is what Hamas is. Let it go. Hamas is Hamas, Palestinians civilians are Palestinian civilians. If you or anybody else wants to move forward, we need to stop picking at every thing done in the past, we will go nowhere. In fact, what you are doing is no different than what Hamas does when they go back to 1948 (accept they have a point), you're digging up the past. And I refuse to allow you to paint Palestinians as the tyrants here. The U.S and Israel have bombed and attacked other nations w/o warning before. This would be an obvious act of war for someone else, but business as usual for these two.

And as for the woman at the airport. Give me a break. You, and other enablers cannot go about using Hamas' rocket fire for every thing that happens. They physically abused a woman, and the only response you can come up with is that it's a response to rocket fire? PLEASE!

And Hamas may be wrong about their tactics, but they are out muscled, and out gunned by Israel, so don't cry when they use unorthodox methods for fighting, when it's people are being opressed.

I will leave you alone now, as I see you have an excuse for every misdeed the Israeli govt does. I mean, I'm American, and I can admitt when my country is wrong. I give credit where it's due, but I will just as quickly condemn a cowardly act, like picking on a lesser nation.

Professor   January 26th, 2009 6:09 pm ET

Linda,

Mormons are a Christian sect... some christians do not consider them so but they certainly consider themselves as such.

Linda   January 26th, 2009 6:12 pm ET

But they feel as though they were given a Prophet, like Mohammed, and like Jesus (accroding to the muslims), so doesn't it really depend on what a person thinks is a revelation and who is their Prophet? Not only Prophet, but a lot of people still feel that God gives revelations each day.

Professor   January 26th, 2009 6:12 pm ET

None,

Freedom is not given it is earned and most of the time you have to pay its price with blood... All those who gained their freedom value those who gave their blood to protect and their freedom.... Even white americans.... they value the soldiers who are fighting in Iraq and Afghanistand to protect the American freedom.

CS   January 26th, 2009 6:15 pm ET

GLeigh.

1. He makes factual points.

2. He backs them up with the source from which they come.

3. He is for peace, but still tells the frank truth of how we got in this mess.

4. He tells good one line jokes that crack my sides every now and again.

GLeigh. You sometimes make good points too. Sometimes you say things that are sarcastic, and hurtful too. Do I isolate, and hate you? No. I accept you the way you are.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 6:16 pm ET

Prof – my God makes stars. He makes time. How do you "earn" anything? That is limited thinking. You cannot even imagine that other place much less go there. Imagine nothing, then something because he said so. Then go from there.

Professor   January 26th, 2009 6:18 pm ET

Linda,

I did not think I was talking about prophets and who believe which one is their prophets... I guess you just like to find something to argue about.

You still did not get the heart of my message.... Good luck to you in whatever you want to believe about me.... ;)

Linda   January 26th, 2009 6:20 pm ET

CS,
I think that you are partly correct in your asessment. However, when someone uses foul language, calls names, and acts as though they know everything and is never wrong, it undercuts their argument. Sometime everyone is wrong, and they should concede that. Also, adding 'it's the occupation stupid" as a tag line just makes the person look like a juvenile.

Linda   January 26th, 2009 6:21 pm ET

No, you just do not want to say that you were wrong. Mormons are as ligit as any other religion. Why do you not think so?

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 6:23 pm ET

CS you are me on the other side. I have never ranted like you, I read that, but you did rant. Balance. Jesus was the Prince of Peace. I try to go there. As a person only, I won't be able to do it. He was physical, flesh and blood, and strong. The Koran talks more about Mary, his mom, then our Bible. I have never read it but it was on the Discovery Channel. My Muslim friend, years ago, told me there was a blending. I should have looked it up then. Now it's all about hate and violence. Well, Americans do know violence. Ask us. I have seen it. In fact, I think we get bored if there is not violence.

Professor   January 26th, 2009 6:23 pm ET

GLeigh,

What are you talking about? God the creator (mine and yours) is the one who makes the stars and time..... and everything.

So, whats the point here?

Linda   January 26th, 2009 6:23 pm ET

Professor,
Why do you keep telling everyone that they are not getting your point when they point out something that you did not think of. Everyone else
is not wrong, you are just not always right

Bill   January 26th, 2009 6:24 pm ET

Hamas bears full responsibility for the war in Gaza, a top EU official said Monday in the Strip, calling the group "a terrorist movement."

"At this time we have to also recall the overwhelming responsibility of Hamas," Louis Michel, European Commissioner for Development and Humanitarian Aid, told reporters.

"I intentionally say this here – Hamas is a terrorist movement and it has to be denounced as such," Michel said as he visited the town of Jabalya in northern Gaza.

"Public opinion is fed up to see that we are paying over and over again – be it the [European] commission, the member states or the major donors – for infrastructure that will be systematically destroyed," he said.

Reuters quoted the EU official as saying that the Islamic group had used civilians as "human shields" by placing operatives in residential areas, and said that the years of terrorist rocket-fire on southern Israel served as a "provocation."

The report also quoted Michel as saying that, "When you kill innocents, it is not resistance. It is terrorism."

I.B. Wright   January 26th, 2009 6:24 pm ET

C.S.- Well said.

Nona   January 26th, 2009 6:25 pm ET

CS - I respect your right to disagree with me, but I don't have to allow you to take my comments out of context or distort them.

1. Hamas's TV programming and advocacy of "martyrdom" is not the past. It is the present. I am not digging up the past when I point to it as an abomination. In fact, the methods are in direct violation of UN conventions on the rights of children. Unconventional, yes, but not justified, no more than kamikaze pilots of WWII were justified.

2. I never said the incident at the airport was a response to rocket attacks. It occured in the course of security measures that are a direct response to suicide attacks. Yes, it was awful and horrid. Nobody should have to be subjected to that. But nobody should die from a suicide attack either. It was not random humiliation with no objective. There are plenty of female suicide attackers. For that matter, the metal detectors and searches at airports around the world are humiliating (although the one you mention was indeed extreme). We can all thank the Palestinians for those, inventors of the airplane hijack.

3. I’m American, and I can admitt when my country is wrong. I give credit where it’s due, but I will just as quickly condemn a cowardly act, like picking on a smaller nation, committing crimes against children whatever their nationality, committing crimes against innocent civilians. And I also will hold people of all nations, religions and races responsible for their own actions and decisions, including suicide bombers and their advocates.

Professor   January 26th, 2009 6:27 pm ET

Linda,

I never mentioned anything about Mormons, or Catholics or Baptist, or any sect within the Christian faith... I was sticking to the main three monothiestic faiths.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 6:30 pm ET

Prof – If you cannot get the point, I just can't tell you. I'd like to. But how do you show someone the stars. You just can't. I would like to show everyone much more. Some of it is funny. Most of it is learning. Get over yourselves. You want to ask me something, do it. It's all about going beyond and not wasting time killing and blowing ourselves up. Take that as you will. I know you still want to do it. Seems really childish to me.

Linda   January 26th, 2009 6:31 pm ET

But Mormons are something different than just Christians. Do you Agree. The Jewish faith has the Torah, The Christians have the Torah and the New Testament, The Mormons have the entire Bible, and the Book of Mormon, and the Muslims have the Quran. So God did not stop his revelations at the Quran, there is also the Book of Mormon.
You stated that God's first revelation was the Torah and the last was the Quran. I am pointing out that the book of Morman came after the Quran.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 6:33 pm ET

Linda they are a fun group, in a way. At least they say what they think.

Linda   January 26th, 2009 6:35 pm ET

Professor,
I have never tried to insult you. I have also pointed out facts. You have insulted me and called me names on many occasions. So you are not
just using that language to stand up for yourself, you are trying to intimidate people. It makes your points seem less valid. I'm not sure
why you would not use them in real life, but you so use the insults here.
I have seen you blog when you do not act that way, and it comes across more sensible.

Professor   January 26th, 2009 6:39 pm ET

Linda,

When you want to address any problem or a conflict you have to get to the bottom of it... the root cause.

If you study conflict management they will teach you that...

When I was pressing on the phrase "Its the occupation stupid" becuase that is the root of the conflict... if this is not addressed then we will never get anywhere.... we will be spinning our wheels and we will be right back here in few years from now.... I know becuase I've been there few years ago.... :)

People don't wake up in the morning and decide that it will be good to blow themselves up or go kill an Israeli or a Palestinian.

Look at Iraq.... have we eaver heard of a car explosion before the occupation? NO...

Its the same in Palestine.

Professor   January 26th, 2009 6:44 pm ET

Linda,

If I have insulted you without you insulting me first I do apologize.... I usually try to respond to the one writing to me.... but I am sure sometime i do make mistakes and address someone else... sometimes its the heat of the moment that you are trying to respond to several people at the same time... it will create confusion.

Linda   January 26th, 2009 6:44 pm ET

Professor,
I believe in getting to the root cause also. But that depends on who you talk to, and a lot of people see it differently.
As for using that phrase to get to the root, you can write it all you want, but when you put the word stupid on it, that is exactly my point.
And what do you know what I have studied and what I have not. See, when you do that, it lessens your argument because you are acting like
you are so much more educated than everyone else.
And education is not the end all, some people have lived this, so reading it, studying it, and taking a test on it is not all there is to people's viewpoints.

Linda   January 26th, 2009 6:45 pm ET

Professor, Apology accepted

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 6:45 pm ET

Linda is the smart one Prof. I'm the Questioner. Or so I've been told. I crack jokes and question. Most of this seems funny to me, in a weird way. The posts? I scold my teen for reading them. Especially the naked women ones. You can posts about anything. You want a real challenge? Go for women. We are use to being nice, but we don't have to nice. We can really overwhelm men on many levels. I don't know why. I guess God thought we were the nicer ones. Then guys came along. Suck that in your pipe.

Linda   January 26th, 2009 6:46 pm ET

Professor,
I'm not sure what you mean by the car explosion. Do you mean in Iraq? aimed towards Americans?

Linda   January 26th, 2009 6:49 pm ET

Gleigh,
You are smart too! We all are in different ways

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 6:50 pm ET

Prof – It's good you were nice to Linda. I do appreciate that. Not satisfied, but that was good. Good is a constant. Want to shoot to appease me? I'm harder.

Professor   January 26th, 2009 6:50 pm ET

Linda,

This is the problem with this media.... you try to create an image of that person you are talking to based on how your interpret their writing....

I interpreted your writing and GLeigh and None as being very hatful females.... maybe you are not.... but thats what I read in your writing.

You did the same to me...

But, I am not hateful... I am very humble.... but i will not allow someone to silcence me by insulting me. I will always say what I think is right. And I know what is right from what is wrong. I am not prefect... and I do mistakes and if you can prove me wrong then i will apologize.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 6:54 pm ET

Linda – we are so funny and such opposites. I like that. The Prof seems like a dipstick to me but you read him. Balance. It is so nice to have you as a sounding board. Men are just guys who get taller. I know you listen better, but that's how they sound to me.

Professor   January 26th, 2009 6:55 pm ET

GLeigh,

Thank you... :)

I am nice to all women.... but sometimes I will come out harsh... ask my Israeli female friends.... hehe

Linda   January 26th, 2009 6:56 pm ET

Professor,
I have never once said that you were hateful. I said that writing in that language hurts your argument, makes it seem less valid.
I don't try to create an image of who I am speaking to. I take it at face value.
I'm not sure why you think I am a hateful female. What have I ever said to sound hateful to you or anyone else, with the exception of Akiva. And that
was after days of hounding me. I have been for peace, I have cried for the innocent people on both sides of this conflict, and other people that
are going through the same types of things around the world. I have blasted the EU, UN, and everyone else that has let the Palestinian people go through all of this horror. I have been for the international
community going in and helping these people and rebuilding. This
situation should have never gotten this way in the first place, so how
am I a hateful person?

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 6:58 pm ET

Linda – did you read the Brad Pitt thing? I was rolling to be honest. It was very odd. I do have a bad sense of humor. I knew it before and now really know it. Life can be sweet though. That was my main thing.

Linda   January 26th, 2009 6:59 pm ET

Gleigh,
Yes, I got a big kick out of it. You are a riot!

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 7:01 pm ET

Prof – shaking in my boots. lololol I did have sweet dreams last night. Speaking of shaking in your boots.

Professor   January 26th, 2009 7:03 pm ET

Linda,

I did not say that you are a hateful person.... I said you came across to me from reading your comments....

I never read a comment of yours blaming Israhell.... but I've read several of your comments blaming the Palestinians.

Thats maybe why. Hey you did not want to blame the root cause even... which is the Occupation. :)

Bill   January 26th, 2009 7:04 pm ET

Weren't Gaza, the West Bank, and Jerusalem lost when Muslim/Arab aggressors attacked Israel in 1967? Doesn't that mean that the land is now Israeli land? The Muslim/Arab countries attacked and lost the land. That means it is not theirs anymore. You don't get a do-over when you start a war and lose. That would be like the British claiming the 13 original colonies back from the USA and forming a "resistance group" to attack the US occupiers until they give it back. Sound ridiculous? Yep.

That means THERE IS NO OCCUPATION. The Muslims/Arabs in Gaza, the West Bank, and Jerusalem are now on Israeli land. Period. If they are willing to live in peace, all the better. If not, they are subject to the Israeli criminal court system.

But look whay happened when Israel gave Gaza over to the Palestinians! What a mess! They elected an Islamic terrorist government, raped the land, and started a war on the very people who gave them the land that they had lost in a previous war that they had started! Wow. I don't think Israel will make that mistake again.

Professor   January 26th, 2009 7:06 pm ET

GLeigh,

You were shaking in my cowboy boots?.... LOL

What are you talking about?

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 7:06 pm ET

Linda – thanks. When I am ready, I'll ask to fly there in a plane. For a day or two. I have too much to learn to do it now. I can be really funny. I realized that when a 18 yr older person coming out of surg was waking up and saying my name and laughing. Her family told me. I was shocked. The last night thing was really, really funny too. I'm getting use to them.

Linda   January 26th, 2009 7:07 pm ET

Professor,
I have never once blamed Palestine. I think you may have read someone else's post. And the root cause to the Palestinians is the Occupation.
And on the Israeli side, they do not see it as an Occupation. So that is the reason why I asked Solomon what I did yesterday. I think it was a
very good question, and I wanted to understand his point of view. Since this is what he lives, I wanted his opinion.
I haven't blamed anyone

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 7:13 pm ET

Prof – I never wear cowboy boots. I use to have a pair, from a gal in Puetro Rico as a thanks gift. I put them on and kept staring at my feet. I gave them away after telling her. She was second runner up for Miss Peuro Ricdo. I thought she was nice. She watched cartoon to learn English a lot. The infection thing from Miss Brazil really bugged me. I got a urinary tract infection. My doct was scared too death. My temp, when I drove myself to his office was 105. I got a chew out. I told the hubby that she was happier now. I have no doubts.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 7:23 pm ET

It happens. A couple of times after you have left, I have come on asking if you are still here. The things that disappear are prob just not important enough. I do hope you are feeling better. I do think that last night was enlightening. And funny. We do have interesting conversations. I do think think that if anyone else is mean towards you, I won't be quite so nice. Hint, hint. I do think my nice days are over now. Questions, anyone? I hate the silence after that question.

harvey   January 26th, 2009 7:43 pm ET

Homosexuality and Hamas?

Considering many of the left wing support Hamas, what is Hamas's attitude towards homosexuality and gay rights? Would homosexuals be welcome in Hamas run Gaza? I noticed that many of those supporters of Hamas in Europe and in the USA are very pro-active in their pursuit of "gay rights" Ken Livingstone, George Galloway, Annie Lennox etc?

Would they be allowed to march for Gay rights in Gaza?

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 7:51 pm ET

Harvey -gay rights? Where did that come from. Not me. I don't think from Hamas either. What???????

Nona   January 26th, 2009 7:57 pm ET

Hi Harvey! Good questions. How bout religious rights? Would Hamas be for those?

Hi GLeigh. Sorry to slip out unannounced. I went for a snack and it turned into lunch. I was starved. I'm sorry I missed Linda leaving without saying goodbye. And CS.

harvey   January 26th, 2009 7:58 pm ET

My point is simple. The left is extremely vocal in its support of Hamas. Many of those advocates are gay rights activists. How would they be treated in Gaza?

The left (who are very pro gay) and Hamas make for strange bedfellows....unless of course Hamas are tolerant of gay rights...????

Whats your opinion GLeigh?

I.B. Wright   January 26th, 2009 8:03 pm ET

Bill- Your logic about no occupation because Israel "won" it in a contest kinda re-inforces Hamas' postion that those lands will never be returned without an armed struggle doesn't it? So if you want peace you know what it's going to take; if you don't, then keep insisting those lands belong to Israel.

And your statement "look what happened when Israel gave Gaza over to the Palestinians" is either a poor choice of words or at best, misleaeading because it wasn't theirs to give in the first place. Does Israel not have recognized boundaries?

harvey   January 26th, 2009 8:06 pm ET

Ahhh Professor,

Love it when I ask a serious question and you get all upset with me....???

Debate???I asked a question....yet as usual like a rabbit stricken in the head lights of an oncoming car you gasp an obscenity or two and then try desperately to change the subject....pathetic, but amusing.

So tell me Prof....I know you want to bring back those cute little yellow stars for us jews...you shopping at Walmart for some nice pink ones too. Is it death to the Jews and the Homosexuals (but meantime while we are fighting the jews we will be nice to the the gays).....

Oh Prof....enough of the frightened rabbit. Be a real man!!!!

CS   January 26th, 2009 8:11 pm ET

Nona. Now this is the type of racist remark I speak of. What proof do you have that the Palestinians origionated the airplane hijack. How about the hijacking in the late 70's to 80's. Were they not committed by others?
I never hear people complaining about canibalism (Dahmer) and saying they can thank white Christians for that.

I never hear people complaining about angry children in schools with their parents guns shooting masses of people, then attributing it to white Christians. And no gun regulation changes due to these events either.

I never hear people talking about cults, blaming Jim Jones, David Koresh, Hitler, KKK, and Skinheads, saying "we can thank THEM for tightened security"

Why do you blame all the ales of society on the acts of a few?
This thing you do is desturbing, and offensive. It is irresponsible to blame an entire race of people for the acts of a few. It's plain racist, and you should be ashamed of yourself.

And GLeigh. Yes, when I hear people around me saying evil terrible things about entire races of people, I ranted in the past. You on the other hand make silly sarcastic jokes that never make a punchline.
Sometimes you make a sympathetic notion, but for the most part, you're sarcastic, and just not funny.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 8:24 pm ET

prof – who really cares. You are just so funny. No offense, I'm sure that we are too in some way. Peace. Let's just all shoot each other and get it over with. People really should go back to sheep herding. I don't thing quantum physics is ready for us. LOLOL

Bill   January 26th, 2009 8:29 pm ET

I.B.Wright -

It wasn't a raffle, it was a war started by the Arabs/Muslims who attacked Israel to eradicate it in 1967. That means that the land belongs to Israel now, because the Arab/Muslim aggressors lost. Which part of this recorded history do you not agree with or understand?

Israel doesn't need to return the land anymore than the USA needs to return the 13 colonies to England. You fought, you lost, game over.

It certainly was Israel's land to give away after obtaining the land in a war from the losing Egyptian aggressors. That is also part of recorded history. Regardless of who they got it from, the Palestinians destroyed Gaza and turned it into a terrorist encampment. They elected an Islamic terrorist government to attack Israeli civilians. This government took control in a violent coup. Do you dispute that also? There are a lot of dead and kneecapped Fatah party members that would disagree with you if you don't believe it.

What does Israel's boundaries have to do with the argument? The West Bank, Gaza, Jerusalem, and other land was obtained by Israel is a war started by Muslim/Arab aggressors. As it now stands, it is Israeli land. The Muslim/Arab aggressors have as much right to the land as England has on the original 13 American colonies – None.

Being the peace-loving people that the Israeli's are, they are willing to let their Arab/Muslim brothers lives there, if they will live in peace. Note that this is far more than the other Arab countries will do for the Palestinians. In the other Arab countries, Palestinians have been killied, expelled, or put in camps to minimize their impact on the populations of those countries, much like Israel has built a wall to protect its citizens from crime and suicide attacks. Do you deny that too?

It really can be easy. Live on the land in peace with the Israelis. Or, you can choose to go to war again and try to get the land back that you lost in 1967. The Arab/Muslim track record on going to war to try to crush Israel has been defeat after defeat... The Arabs/Muslims will probably lose even more land; certainly more lives. Why not take the easy, peaceful path this time? Is that somehow against your nature or your religion?

Nona   January 26th, 2009 8:30 pm ET

CS - You make some good points. My remark about thanking Palesinians for hijackings was uncalled for.

This is emotional stuff,and the conversation does get heated. i respect your attempts to promote civility and fairness here, but if you're going to take on the role as fairness cop, you need to be policing yourself too. You told Dan that "nobody liked him," and when I said it wasn't very Christian, you justified it by saying something like, "Doesn't Jesus say to rebuke somebody who offends you?" Well, maybe, but Jesus never advocated personal attacks, and he certainly never told anybody that "nobody likes him," as you did. A few minutes ago, you said that I "have an excuse for every misdeed the Israeli govt does." Another unfair and personal attack.

People are going to say things here that upset other people. We agree that we should all be trying to keep a fair and civil discourse here. And that includes you. You don't get to tell everybody how unfair they're being and then turn around and be unfair to others. Sorry. I respect what you're trying to do but I expect you to hold yourself to the same standard.

I.B. Wright   January 26th, 2009 8:38 pm ET

harvey- I don't understand the point you're trying to make. Notwithstandig the fact that being right wing or left wing has nothing to do with the Palestinian/ Israeli conflict, your conern about gay rights is confusing to me. By criticizing the left wing liberals for supporting Hamas (which I don't think they do) you are saying they should be more conservative (right wing) thereby supporting Israel. How does that fit in with your concern about gays since generally it's the conservatives who are against gay rights?

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 8:42 pm ET

Well I just had to see the truth for myself, especially since 911. I had to understand. I'm a questioner I guess. Guys in my neck of the woods would never hide missiles among the women and children. They wouldn't blow themselves up or ask young ones or women to do it. I don't judge people. I'm just a person. But all the bull seems really messed up. I think people have to learn to be responsible, to my country and whoever else. I'm not here to pay for food stamps for someone's child or buy peace. I'm not here to listen to stupid stuff. My husband told me stupid was a bad word. It is stupid to me though. Strapping on a bomb and blowing up? That is like the ultimate stupid thing to do Who do you listen to for guidance? I told my kids long ago, Have a spounse and a job and insurance before you have a baby. I won't feed it. Neither should some poor taxpayer who is ordered to do it. So far no boo-boo's. The world is just nuts to me. I don't like it a lotl It's funny though. In general. Put that up your peace pipe. Or not. Native Americans were probably smart in ways.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 8:59 pm ET

well I can start spring cleaning today, tomorrow, or in two months. Never if I want. It has been interesting reading though. This really is like a broken record. I suggest we just smash the thing and move on.

Solomon   January 26th, 2009 9:03 pm ET

By Henry Siegma

*You cannot just land blows, leave the Palestinians in Gaza in the economic distress they’re in, and expect that Hamas will just sit around and do nothing.’

*It cannot be said that Israel launched its assault to protect its citizens from rockets. It did so to protect its right to continue the strangulation of Gaza’s population.

When Hamas unexpectedly won the election, Israel and the US immediately sought to delegitimise the result and embraced Mahmoud Abbas, the head of Fatah, who until then had been dismissed by Israel’s leaders as a ‘plucked chicken’.

, Hamas brought to Gaza a level of law and order unknown in recent years, and did so without the large sums of money that donors showered on the Fatah-led Palestinian Authority. It eliminated the violent gangs and warlords who terrorised Gaza under Fatah’s rule.

In other words, when Jews target and kill innocent civilians to advance their national struggle, they are patriots.

When their adversaries do so, they are terrorists.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 9:04 pm ET

Harvey – you are so bad.....of course they don't allow tolerence. There are no gay people in Iran. We heard that.

harvey   January 26th, 2009 9:05 pm ET

Anyways its late at night here in Israel....

Wishing you all much peace and still hoping we can find a way o live together. 2 state solution bring it on.

Shalom and of course especial love to my favorite lady Nona!!!!

Goodnight!!!!

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 9:06 pm ET

Even in intolerant places there are one or two just to be different. That is really intollerant.

I.B. Wright   January 26th, 2009 9:08 pm ET

Bill- At the risk of repeating myself, you have just re-inforced Hamas' reason to exist. I really don't care if you think Israel "won" this land or not. You have a conflict that won't end until you return it so either you do that or you get more rockets. Israel has proven time and again it cannot break the will of the Palestinian people so why continue to bash your head against the wall too?

You don't think Israel's boundaries have anything to do with this argument? They have everyting to do with this argument if there is ever going to be peace. It's funny, you believe the land never belonged to the Palestinians from day one yet you think its Ok for Israel can keep land it occupies as a result of wars? Sooner or later the Palestinians are going to win one of these wars and if that happens I doubt they are going to stop after they "win" these lands back. With any luck the world isn't going to wait for that to happen.

Solomon   January 26th, 2009 9:08 pm ET

By Henry Siegma

Why then are Israel’s leaders so determined to destroy Hamas? Because they believe that its leadership, unlike that of Fatah, cannot be intimidated into accepting a peace accord that establishes a Palestinian ‘state’ made up of territorially disconnected entities over which Israel would be able to retain permanent control. Control of the West Bank has been the unwavering objective of Israel’s military, intelligence and political elites since the end of the Six-Day War.[*] They believe that Hamas would not permit such a cantonisation of Palestinian territory, no matter how long the occupation continues. They may be wrong about Abbas and his superannuated cohorts, but they are entirely right about Hamas.

Middle East observers wonder whether Israel’s assault on Hamas will succeed in destroying the organisation or expelling it from Gaza. This is an irrelevant question. If Israel plans to keep control over any future Palestinian entity, it will never find a Palestinian partner, and even if it succeeds in dismantling Hamas, the movement will in time be replaced by a far more radical Palestinian opposition.

CS   January 26th, 2009 9:14 pm ET

Nona. If you have not noticed, I am not Jesus...just thought I'd throw that out there so you could stop trying to make me live up to his standards. As I recall...no other man could.
And Jesus absolutely did make personal attacks. In fact, he stormed angrily into the temple, and called the money changers "Hypocrites!"

What I find amusing, is that far right and left people from Palestine supprters, and Israel supporters seem to want to go into history to try to lay claim to something. And it is good to debate these things, becasue I beleive that what's in the books, aint always the truth. The winner of the war writes history books.
But I just find it amusing that I point out that Nona and GLeigh said something foul, and imply that all Palestinians are suicide bombing hijackers...and Nona comes back with something that I said to someone else about their ignorent comment...which happened last week.

I'm giving facts, and Nona is trying to justify security forces for cavity searching a woman at an airport, then robbing her of her feminine products. What a joke. I could have said they were raping people, and you blind obediants would find an excuse for their behavior. GLeigh...you said your govt doesn't hide bombs behind children, but it aint perfect either. I would be here all day if I told you of all the terrible things this govt have done. And that'ts just the stuff that was written.

That's not what were here for. The title is talking about Obamas peacekeeper apointment, and how it might positively impact the region. But everybody wants to walk around trying to hide the obvious hatred for another culture. Most of whom probably never even been to this part of the world. Now, by no means am I a world traveler, but I won't turn on the TV and let it brainwash me into hating a race of people because of the way a few behave. That's the fashion inwhich I'm descriminated against every day, and damn if I will do the same to someone else. But the problem with racism is that the racist thinks they are sooo superior, that they don't have to be accountable. They don't even know that they're being racist.

Example: When at a rally, John Mccain was told by a supporter that Obama was an Arab. His response was quick and decisive, as though he knew he was right to say it.

His response was "No ma'am. He's not an Arab. He's a good American."

I guess there are no good Arab Americans.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 9:14 pm ET

Hi Solomon. Aren't you tired of all the polical mumbo jumbo yet? People need to think on their own. There would be a lot less death if that happened. I don't know if it will ever happen, I'm a just a pro-peace person, but maybe.

Logan   January 26th, 2009 9:18 pm ET

GENOCIDE IN SRI LANKA

the whole world including the UN and the HRW, are keeping a blind eye to a systematic genocide in Sri Lanka against the minority Tamils, something they also did with Rwanda.

Later they apologised for not doing anything in time !

The issues in Israel are about 6 million against 1 million Palestinians, but in Sri Lanka 21 million against over 2.5 million Tamils.

Perhaps this is because Tamils don’t have, green eyes , blond hair and white skin nor a oil well !

http://eurotvlive.com/download/20090124/20090124_UDAYAR_KATTU_SUTHENDRA_PURAM_SHELL_ATTACK.wmv

mooshy   January 26th, 2009 9:22 pm ET

Now israelis have to think twice before buying a plane ticket. History never forgets the crimes that are committed against humanity.
you may talk about the suicide bombers who sacrifice themselves for the the sacred cause of liberation, but you will never fool the world about the essence of your "state" and who you really are, criminals.

I.B. Wright   January 26th, 2009 9:23 pm ET

harvey-no I don't see your point, whatever it is. You are assuming most of the gays and the left wing support Hamas when in fact it could be the other way around. Besides, what you don't seem to understand is that people (left wing or right wing) are all against the killing or maiming of innocent women and children (not to mention the use of internationally banned weapons) and has nothing to do with supporting either side.

CS   January 26th, 2009 9:24 pm ET

I.B Wright. It's like beating your head against the wall trying to plead a case of fairness to obvious racist people. But I know it's hard to resist. I mean, you give them facts, and they give you "Muslims are all terrorists." Really sad when you think of it. I have met many many racist white people in my day. But I dare not say that they are ALL evil racists. I just wont. But I guess that's the power of the Matrix. It got'em.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 9:24 pm ET

IB – if we go back far, no one is where they once were. No one. Perhaps the Jews but that was a long time ago. We all knew they would go back eventually, according to ancient documents. No one else kwew where they would end up though.

Solomon   January 26th, 2009 9:27 pm ET

GLeigh.

I am sure if you lose your house and some of your family members are killed by the person who took the house from you.you will not send him a Rose thanking him for what he did to you.

I just have a question for you.
are you here to pass time or to talk about the problem of the middle east?

if you are passing time it might be a good Idea to email some of your friends and talk to them about your life story.

CS   January 26th, 2009 9:27 pm ET

GLeigh. Why does it matter what I look like? True racist...:(
Shame shames shame.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 9:29 pm ET

CS – I'm white. I've never heard a white person say that Muslim people are terrorists. The 911 was really terrible. Moms jumping from tall buildings. How sad was that. But no one I know is racisist. Preaching peace and putting away all missiles and gun fire seems really peaceful to me. I want to see it.

Akiva Heifetz   January 26th, 2009 9:31 pm ET

Jews at war with Zionism – documentary very interesting and to the point.
.you tube.com/watch?v=SjRe2zgVcIk

Jewish Rabbi exposing Zionists and Zionist state of Israel.
you tube.com/watch?v=N8dXA7Z-F-0

---------------
think about !
Jews think about
pro-israel / pro-zionist means anti-Semite, means anti-Jew's
wake up and resist the zionists which have infiltrated your holy land israel!

stop the zionists!
they force hate against the Jews they force up a new fascism a new hate against Jews
stop this! stop suupporting the zionists

get back what is yours get back israel ...
stop the abuse of the land israel by zionists
stop the abuse of the word "jew" and "jewish"
israel is under control of zionists !
stop this!
go back to your believings
support your people but not the zionists which only force the hate against Jews

stop israel and its criminal doings!
save your self stop israel !

please !!!!!
please !!!!!!
in the name of human beings please !!!

Professor   January 26th, 2009 9:31 pm ET

GLeigh,

OMG... you do not know what are you talking about.... LOL

"We all knew they would go back eventually, according to ancient documents" What documents are you talking about? Some secret scrolls?.. hehe

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 9:35 pm ET

Prof – My Palenstinian Christian Brother – you know. The ancient ones. The Bible ones. Remember??

Bill   January 26th, 2009 9:37 pm ET

I.B.Wright –

It only re-inforces Hamas reason to exist if they constantly choose war vs. peace. They do have a choice, don't they? Or are they too far gone to consider living in peace with their neighbors.

From what I can see, the aggressors have almost always been the Arabs/Muslims and the defenders have been the Israelis. I understand that some people see it differently, but the facts remain that the Arabs/Muslims attacked another sovereign country and tried to push its people to the sea. They lost badly. They lost not only their respect, but they lost land. Get over it. It is done.

The conflict can end when the Muslim/Arab aggressors admit their mistakes and stop attacking Israel. You're right, I think it's perfectly fine for Israel to keep the land won from the Muslim/Arab aggressors who tried to eradicate Israel in 1967. I also think that it is perfectly fine for the US to keep its 13 original colonies won during the revolutionary war. The West Bank, Gaza, and Jerusalem, should be considered as much a part of Israel as Massachusetts, New York, and New Jersey are considered part of America. I think it is perfectly logical and just.

Had the Arabs/Muslims not attacked Israel in 1967 they would need another excuse to keep attacking today besides an occupation which technically does not exist. The only real occupation from a logical sense is the Arabs/Muslims on Israeli land. That is what people should think about when Arabs/Muslims kill their and other's children in the name of the "occupation". They kill because they are there, on Israeli land. Such a charming people.

Solomon   January 26th, 2009 9:41 pm ET

Professor.

actually I have heard lots of Israeli Jews calling this Criminal state Israhell.
is that where you get it from? or it is your creation?
actually I think we should use it more often.

Professor   January 26th, 2009 9:41 pm ET

GLeigh,

Why you people insist on asociating me with one religion or another.... some call me Muslim terrorist and some call me Christian Palestinian brother...

Can you just call me Professor or just brother.... I am not even Palestinian but I would be honored to be called Palestinian. :)

mohammed gharbawi   January 26th, 2009 9:41 pm ET

the first thing an israeli asks you is whether israel has the right to exist. well, every human being has the right to exist ; the question is where.

Professor   January 26th, 2009 9:44 pm ET

Solomon,

You are right... thats where I got it from.... some of my friends who happened to be Israeli Jews against the Israeli occupation and treatment of the Palestinians.

Bill   January 26th, 2009 9:45 pm ET

Since when did Muslims become a race? When I fill out a form that asks me my race, I never see Christian, Hindu, Buddist, Jewish, or Muslim as any of the choices.

mohammed gharbawi   January 26th, 2009 9:45 pm ET

Bill
we have never seen a nation that defends itself by killing huge numbers of kids and women. is this self defence in israhel?

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 9:46 pm ET

Well I'm a pretty basic person.

Israel wants to exists. Some want it wiped off the map.

The missiles over eight years, 11,000 or so from Gaza are home made and only kill a few Israel people so they should not count. Stopping them is wrong since they are so pitiful.

Anyone who supports Israel should have planes hit large buildings, such as 911. Those 3000 or so don't count either. Let them jump.

Darfur isn't even a question. It will be exterminated in the end. No one seems to care. Who backs it? What religion or group?

Strapping on bombs and blowing up yourself, along with someone's little child, is an act of bravery. Use to, people were braver. They swallowed pills and just left. Now they take kids with them. I do no admire them. Not even a discussion topic. Childish.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 9:50 pm ET

Prof – I call you my Palestinian Christian Brother. That seems right.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 9:53 pm ET

I just never realized you were Christian, or the others, Solomon, and your pals. But after hearing your pleading for these brothers....I changed my mind. That was really sweet. Nice to know another Christian cares.

Professor   January 26th, 2009 9:55 pm ET

GLeigh,

Wow that is what basic for you?... You just proved to be a liar SOB.

I would say what is basic for Peace in my opinion is that all countries who have weapons of mass distruction should get rid of them.

Countries should stop invading other countries.... Imperialist powers need to stop dividing counries into smaller pieces so they can conquer them easier.

We (human beings) are borrowing this earth for a short period of time we need to learn to live on it in peace with each other.... Criminal who murder babies have no room amongst us.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 9:58 pm ET

Mo – I can only speak for myself. I have kids. If their elementary schools had concrete arches to prevent hamas missiles from killing them, I'd not like it. One or a thousand. I would expect my country to defend me. I don't care if they bulldozed down a town. And how many bomb shelters did hamas build its people? I've asked that a dozen times? You hide missiles in populated areas, you have to protect your people. Any? One? Two hundred? My men are much more protective. Mo did you ever wonder if that was wrong?

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 10:11 pm ET

Prof – You copied what I wrote in the past. about being here a short time. Not that I care. It just struck me as funny to be copied. And, who are you to tell any country how to exist? You were appointed the keeper of weapons, any, by who? Just curious. No one in my country, that I'm aware of, has ever killed a child in the name of religion. There are the sickos who do it, but not in some religions name. I don't see planes from my country hitting high rises or my fellow citizens wear bombs and killing innocents. Anyone who doesn't want to live takes pills. It's less messy and saves the kids.

Bill   January 26th, 2009 10:12 pm ET

mohammed gharbawi -

We have never before encountered such a group of cowards that are proud to hide among their children while attacking Israeli children. The brave Islamic terrorists of Gaza hid beneath the skirts of women, in mosques, in hospitals, in UN buildings. They wore civilian clothing. All these war crimes led to a higher death toll. That is exactly what Hamas wanted – to sacrifice the Palestinians so they could stay in power. In that, they succeeded, so far.

From today's news:

Hamas bears full responsibility for the war in Gaza, a top EU official said Monday in the Strip, calling the group “a terrorist movement.”

“At this time we have to also recall the overwhelming responsibility of Hamas,” Louis Michel, European Commissioner for Development and Humanitarian Aid, told reporters.

“I intentionally say this here – Hamas is a terrorist movement and it has to be denounced as such,” Michel said as he visited the town of Jabalya in northern Gaza.

“Public opinion is fed up to see that we are paying over and over again – be it the [European] commission, the member states or the major donors – for infrastructure that will be systematically destroyed,” he said.

Reuters quoted the EU official as saying that the Islamic group had used civilians as “human shields” by placing operatives in residential areas, and said that the years of terrorist rocket-fire on southern Israel served as a “provocation.”

The report also quoted Michel as saying that, “When you kill innocents, it is not resistance. It is terrorism.”

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 10:18 pm ET

Prof and Solomon – Of course you are of no particular religion. I believe you. Some call you Muslim and some Christian Brother. I read your posts. I don't really care who calls who what. I just want two separate states with monitors who will take action if called for. Someone with guts. If such men exists. I don't think they do honestly. Women have to step in. Solomon – the evil is killing. You're so use to it, you don't even know it. How sad is that.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 10:27 pm ET

By the way, name calling is easy. A baby killer? I've only raised them. I was the one who suggested it stop. Separate the two and have world monitors to keep them from shooting anyone. This seems a bad idea I guess if you goal is to wipe someone off the map. I really doubt that Israel will go down like Darfur. Bummer for you. I really think you are all evil. I use that term seldom. It has special meaning.

Bill   January 26th, 2009 10:32 pm ET

I.B Wright -

How do you know that billions of people don't already support my views against Islamic terrorism and imperialism? If you believe that the world supports you, then who came to your aid when Israel started defending itself against Hamas aggression? I'm sorry? Who? Sure there were demonstrations on both sides, but who actually came to help out your freedom fighters, fighting for the resistance of the non-existent occupation?

It seems the world does not think much of your non-existent occupation of land you lost while trying to eradicate Israel the last time. The world just wants peace – the peace that comes when Arabs and Muslims stop attacking Israel and each other and learn to live in peace. Almost all other peoples in the world have learned how to do this – just not Arabs and Muslims. Why is that? I don't mean this sarcastically. I really want to know why you think Arabs and/or Muslims are at the center of almost all the armed conflicts or terrorism on planet earth? People going through airports are generally not afraid of Jews, Hindus, Buddists, or Baptists blowing up their planes or flying them into buildings.

GLeigh   January 26th, 2009 10:35 pm ET

Solomon – Killing from anywhere is wrong, Solomon. Aggressors must assume that the person they are attacking might at some point attack back. Building at least one bomb shelter is Gaza might have been nice since the missiles were being launched from populated areas. NO ONE is in disagreement there.

Professor – I asked you specific questions. You answered none. Bummer. Since you are Chrisitian and Palestinian, I'll let it go. I have popped on day and night and 2 in the morning. You're always here. Odd. I really, really have nothing to say to you. Live with yourself. Strap on a bomb and take out someones beloved child with you. You do seem to understand that. Sadly.

Nona   January 26th, 2009 10:45 pm ET

CS –

Trust me. I am extremely aware that you are not Jesus.

Once again, I urge you to stop twisting and distorting my words. There's no reason for you to be doing that if you actually have facts with which to build a good case for your own beliefs. I NEVER said or implied that "all Palestinians are suicide bombing hijackers," as you accuse me of. Those are words that you twisted and put into my mouth.

You can call me a racist if you want, but it says more about your willingness to jump to conclusions about somebody you've probably spent all of two hours exchanging comments with on a blog than it says about me. I do not owe you an explanation or a defense, but for the record, I am a white Southerner who comes from a long line of prominent civil rights workers who, trust me, have suffered immensely - physically, emotionally and financially - for their activities on behalf of human justice and civil rights. From the riots of Memphis after MLK's assassination to the desegregation of the University of Alabama to the Memphis garbage workers strike to the desegregation of businesses, schools and public facilities throughout the South - we were on the front lines of ALL these events, have played an active and often dangerous, frightening role in fighting for equality, and we have been recognized by prominent civil rights organizations and leaders for our contributions and sacrifices. These activities continued right up through and including the campaign and election of President Barak Obama. I personally have been active in civil rights activities and events throughout the South, sometimes at great personal danger and despite threats and intimidation.

If you think my position on the MidEast has to do with anything other than the cause of justice and fairness, you are flat-out wrong.

You certainly have every right to be wrong. You have every right to your own beliefs. You have every right to keep talking out your ass about things you don't know about. But you DON'T have the right to distort the words or positions of other people, or to make false charges about their motives or beliefs. You simply do not.

To accuse me of racism is simply a reflection of your own ignorance and eagerness to jump to conclusions based on a few weeks of reading a blog. It pisses me off. But I take great comfort and satisfaction in knowing that I've been called plenty of dirty names by self-righteous bullies who are a hell of a lot smarter and louder than you.

Libra   January 26th, 2009 10:55 pm ET

If people would come to realize that the west is intentionally targetting Islam as its enemy since before the rise of terrorist oraginizations, this world would be a much better place. The west sees Islam as a threat. Not vice-versa. Politicians won't admit it. This is the New World Order. The west has a problem with the Koran and Muslims. The west wants to control the people who believe in the Koran. The west, with its freedoms, won't let Muslims live as they choose. The west who writes their own laws daily accordingly, decide how they want to treat Muslims in their country. They decide how Muslims should act in their worshipping. They make their man-made laws for Muslims. They feel the need to control Muslims. The rise Islamic terrorism came after the Islamic world felt this unfair treatment by the west.

NOTICE:
1) New World Order after the cold war
2) the strong Jewish lobby in the U.S. that perpetrates its influence on U.S. policy in Middle Eastern Affairs, particularly with respect to Palestine and Iraq.
3)Western mind has failed to understand the meaning of Islamic belief and the deep conviction that it creates in the true Muslim. This value system is hardly appreciated by the West.

mooshy   January 26th, 2009 11:21 pm ET

gleigh
the protection of your kids can never be justified by the killing of other kids.
the day you decided to settle in israhel, you should have known that occupation has a price. lets be frank, this is not your land; it will never be.

Solomon   January 26th, 2009 11:23 pm ET

Zbigniew Brzezinski, a former national security adviser, said that the pro-Israel lobby in the US was too powerful, while the slur of anti-Semitism was too readily used whenever its power was called into question.

Presenting a solution for the Middle East, he listed historical compromises that had to be made by Israelis and Palestinians but accused the American Israel Public Affairs Committee (Aipac) – the largest and most influential Jewish lobby group – of obstructing peace efforts.

mooshy   January 26th, 2009 11:29 pm ET

Bill
there is no regular army in gazza; there are simple fighters who use gerilla tactics.
they dont hide behind women; they just hide and attack. all liberation wars foLlow the same strategy; see vietnam and mao as an example.
lets be clear: they manAged to kill 80 israeli soldier (the number of civilians killed in israel is almost null).
comparing this with what you did is appalling. hamas won at the ethical level. now your official figureS should think twice before leaving israel; lahaye is waiting for them.
see the number of petitions signed all arOund the globe and you ll realize that you are in trouble.
who won?

Libra   January 26th, 2009 11:29 pm ET

Terrorism has become a predictable and growing Islamic response to the outside world. The fault lies specifically with the United States that has tried to use Islamic terrorism as a tool to defeat the Soviet Union, not realizing that it had created global movement that would eventually turn on it in the long run. The US ignored Islamic terrorism when it was not used against the US or its allies, as in the cases of Chechnya and Kashmir, which only allowed it to grow to global proportions. It did not heed warnings from leaders like the Indian Prime Minister Vajpayee when he told them that Islamic terror could also strike on US soil. This shows failures on the part of Western intellectuals no less than political leaders who felt they could control Islamic terrorism for their own ends. Now the same terrorists have struck New York City itself. Why?

Bill   January 26th, 2009 11:33 pm ET

mooshy -

Weren’t Gaza, the West Bank, and Jerusalem lost when Muslim/Arab aggressors attacked Israel in 1967? Doesn’t that mean that the land is now Israeli land? The Muslim/Arab countries attacked and lost the land. That means it is not theirs anymore. You don’t get a do-over when you start a war and lose. That would be like the British claiming the 13 original colonies back from the USA and forming a “resistance group” to attack the US occupiers until they give it back. Sound ridiculous? Yep.

That means THERE IS NO OCCUPATION. The Muslims/Arabs in Gaza, the West Bank, and Jerusalem are now on Israeli land. Period. If they are willing to live in peace, all the better. If not, they are subject to the Israeli criminal court system.

But look whay happened when Israel gave Gaza over to the Palestinians! What a mess! They elected an Islamic terrorist government, raped the land, and started a war on the very people who gave them the land that they had lost in a previous war that they had started! Wow. I don’t think Israel will make that mistake again.

From what I can see, the aggressors have almost always been the Arabs/Muslims and the defenders have been the Israelis. I understand that some people see it differently, but the facts remain that the Arabs/Muslims attacked another sovereign country and tried to push its people to the sea. They lost badly. They lost not only their respect, but they lost land. Get over it. It is done.

The conflict can end when the Muslim/Arab aggressors admit their mistakes and stop attacking Israel. You’re right, I think it’s perfectly fine for Israel to keep the land won from the Muslim/Arab aggressors who tried to eradicate Israel in 1967. I also think that it is perfectly fine for the US to keep its 13 original colonies won during the revolutionary war. The West Bank, Gaza, and Jerusalem, should be considered as much a part of Israel as Massachusetts, New York, and New Jersey are considered part of America. I think it is perfectly logical and just.

Had the Arabs/Muslims not attacked Israel in 1967 they would need another excuse to keep attacking today besides an occupation which technically does not exist. The only real occupation from a logical sense is the Arabs/Muslims on Israeli land. That is what people should think about when Arabs/Muslims kill their and other’s children in the name of the “occupation”. They kill because they are there, on Israeli land. Such a charming people.

mooshy   January 26th, 2009 11:38 pm ET

GLEIGH
The'my kids argument' is disgusting.

Libra   January 26th, 2009 11:42 pm ET

On July 12, 1948, Israeli soldiers battling the Arab Legion and local irregulars in the towns of Lydda and Ramle, just south of Tel Aviv, were ordered to empty the two towns of their Arab residents. Over two days, between 50,000 and 60,000 inhabitants were driven from their homes. Many were forced to walk eastward to the Arab Legion lines; others were carried in trucks or buses. Clogging the roads, tens of thousands of refugees marched, shedding their possessions along the way.

The expulsions, conducted under orders from then-Lt. Col. Yitzhak Rabin, were an element of the partial ethnic cleansing that rid Israel of the majority of its Arab inhabitants at the very moment of its birth. Earlier, in the 1930s and 1940s, a near consensus had emerged among Zionist leaders on the necessity of "transfer." They believed that it was critical to buy out or drive out the Arab inhabitants from the areas destined for Jewish statehood, both to make way for Jewish immigrants and to remove the Arabs who opposed, often violently, the establishment of such a state.

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 12:03 am ET

bill
suppose china attacks taiwan tomorow and wins will this mean its over? THIS IS THE SAME LOGIC YOU USE: we attacked you in 1967 and took your land , its over. this is the logic of the occupier.

liberators have a different logic.

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 12:10 am ET

bill
you won because of egypt. and now egypt has done its best to make you win in gazza. we should learn from history.

build a shrine for the dictators who sold the cause: nasser, sadat, and mubarak.

egypt is behind all this mess.

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 12:15 am ET

i sincerly think that htere are two cause berween the rise of islamic extremism:
1-the usa intervention in afghanistan and iraq.
2-the injustice that is taking place in palestine.

i think obama will finf a solution to the first. the second will have to be resolved by force.

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 12:29 am ET

i have always said that the conflict will end if two conditions are satisfied:
1- at least the withdrawal of israel from the occupied territory in 1967.
2- the return of the refugees.
without these two conditions, there will be war when arabs and muslims are ready.

unfortunately, these two factors are in the hand of the agressor.
in other words, the choice between peace and war is up to them.

Linda   January 27th, 2009 12:29 am ET

Hello All!
Did you miss me while I took my afternoon nap?

Linda   January 27th, 2009 12:34 am ET

CS,
I don't know if you are still here, but if you are, I wanted to comment on something you said. You wrote:
I never hear people talking about cults, blaming Jim Jones, David Koresh, Hitler, KKK, and Skinheads, saying “we can thank THEM for tightened security”
I just wanted to say that you must not live in Texas. Especially about David Koresh. and let's not forget about Ruby Ridge. I guess we are a different bread down here, but we do blame them, and Timothy McVeigh also.
I just wanted to let you know that there are a lot of Americans do

Linda   January 27th, 2009 12:35 am ET

*that do blame them*

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 12:35 am ET

roscoe
palestine is a different case. its an occupid territory according to the UN. ALL the things you see now are the effects of one cause :the injustice of Balfour. but here i dont know whether you know this from your distorted history.

Linda   January 27th, 2009 12:36 am ET

Hi roscoe

Linda   January 27th, 2009 12:38 am ET

Let me add that our government was wrong on Koresh, they could have arrested him off of the compound, and Ruby Ridge was one of our governments all time screw ups! And we had some of our rights taken away, because they were wanting to exersice their second Amendment rights

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 12:38 am ET

roscoe
the palestinain cause may feed islamic extremism but its a wr of liberation per se.

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 12:43 am ET

roscoe
trying to link the palestinians to islamic extremism is a desperate case; many have done so before and it was in vain. in palestine we have many factions: the communists, the moderate islamists, the maoists, etc.....we are educated and we know what is at stake.keep your fallacies for yourself.

Linda   January 27th, 2009 12:47 am ET

My 2 cents!
There are extremists in every race, color, creed, and orgin. That is why blanket statements are counterproductive.

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 12:48 am ET

akiva
good diagnosis. i agree.

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 12:50 am ET

akiva
now bush in the dustbin of history. humanity always win.

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 12:51 am ET

mooshy January 27th, 2009 035 GMT

roscoe
palestine is a different case. its an occupid territory according to the UN. ALL the things you see now are the effects of one cause :the injustice of Balfour. but here i dont know whether you know this from your distorted history.
******************************************************************

There really is quite few variations of distorted history-- everyone has their own. Even you!

The bottom line is, your situation was made official in the eyes of the civilized world as a result of the British Mandate and the UN and all member nations. If you really expect to change the situation, I suggest that the entire Arab world comes together with one voice and convinces the UN and all the member nations that things need to change. Anything less than that on the part of the Arab nations will simply result in continued failure-- just as it has since 1948.

You can't keep doing the same thing over and over again and expect to get a different result! It's simply insanity!

Linda   January 27th, 2009 12:52 am ET

Mooshy,
you said "we in Palestine", If you don't mind me asking, where do you live?

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 12:52 am ET

Hi Linda!

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 12:52 am ET

linda
your extremism is equipped with a mighty army.this is a basic difference.

Linda   January 27th, 2009 12:53 am ET

So Roscoe,
You like Einstein too!

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 12:54 am ET

linda
if you dont mind me asking, who are you?

Linda   January 27th, 2009 12:54 am ET

Mooshy,
What do my mean my extremism?

Linda   January 27th, 2009 12:55 am ET

mooshy, to the above post, I meant where are you?

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 12:57 am ET

ROSCOE
WE DONT BET ON YOUR FRIENDS IN THE ARAB LEAGUE. WE BET ON RESISTANCE AND THE FREE WORLD.

Linda   January 27th, 2009 12:58 am ET

Hey Roscoe,
I didn't know that, Where are you?

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 12:58 am ET

Linda January 27th, 2009 053 GMT

So Roscoe,
You like Einstein too!
**************************************

what are you talking about???

Linda   January 27th, 2009 12:59 am ET

Mooshy.
WE DONT BET ON YOUR FRIENDS IN THE ARAB LEAGUE. WE BET ON RESISTANCE AND THE FREE WORLD.

So how's that working for ya?

Linda   January 27th, 2009 1:00 am ET

Roscoe,
your last line comes from a quote from Einstein.

You can’t keep doing the same thing over and over again and expect to get a different result! It’s simply insanity!

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 1:01 am ET

Linda January 27th, 2009 058 GMT

Hey Roscoe,
I didn’t know that, Where are you?
***************************************

Portugal

Linda   January 27th, 2009 1:03 am ET

Roscoe,
Portugal, excellent. I love to travel and learn about different cultures. Not on the tourist track, but from the real people. I have never been to Portugal though. Would love to come there sometime.

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 1:04 am ET

Linda January 27th, 2009 100 GMT

Roscoe,
your last line comes from a quote from Einstein.

You can’t keep doing the same thing over and over again and expect to get a different result! It’s simply insanity!
**************************************************

Ah!!!!

Now I see- for a minute I thought maybe it was a new rock band or something!

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 1:04 am ET

LINDA
You know what is exttremism since you are among those who vehemently support it.
but if you like to know the similarities between tour extremism and alqaeda, i refer you to the postings of mohammed gharbawi.
there is no nedd to repeat what is known to everybody.i guess you know about the discussions taking place in international courts like lahaye. this will give you a hint.

Linda   January 27th, 2009 1:07 am ET

Mooshy,
I do know what extremism is, you said I was an extremist. I was asking you why you thought I was extreme.
You seem to think that I am uneducated because I am a women. Well, I will put my 4 degrees up against you anyday.

Linda   January 27th, 2009 1:08 am ET

I don't know why you say I support extremism. You don't know me or anything about me, Mooshy

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 1:08 am ET

roscoe
for einstein, it means stupidity. this is really what israelis are doing .

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 1:13 am ET

mooshy January 27th, 2009 057 GMT

ROSCOE
WE DONT BET ON YOUR FRIENDS IN THE ARAB LEAGUE. WE BET ON RESISTANCE AND THE FREE WORLD.
******************************************************

You don't need to get worked up and start yelling!!!

I was simply pointing out that here is a safe, civilized, respectful and lawful way of gaining the attention and help from the law abiding countries of the world.

But if you'd just prefer to through rocks and shoot rockets and wear explosive belts and kidknap people, then I guess thats your choice. But it's been 60 years now. Don't you think maybe that approach isn't giving you good results? In fact I think you've actually lost ground because of that approach! You just don't seem making headway to your objective.

Don't you think it's time to change your tactics-– or are you just going to keep on trying the same thing for another 60 years or so???

Linda   January 27th, 2009 1:17 am ET

Mooshy,
Who ever said that I supported Israel? and why do you keep referring to Mohammed? Do you not have anything to say for yourself?
BTW, I put my degrees to good use, and I don't drink.

Linda   January 27th, 2009 1:19 am ET

Mooshy, as far as relaxing, you are the one using all caps. Like we can hear you any louder. We are reading, you aren't louder because you use the caps lock. You need to relax.

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 1:20 am ET

roscoe
we dont rely on international hypocricy , i mean community; we rely on ourselves and the free world (not the one of bush). justice will prevail.
by the way , i dont yell, may be you are afraid because you have stolen something and you feel m gonna take it from you soon.

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 1:21 am ET

mooshy January 27th, 2009 104 GMT

i guess you know about the discussions taking place in international courts like lahaye.

***************************************************************

No-– explain, i can't find anything on it!

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 1:24 am ET

linda
if you think you are using your "degrees" to god use, then you should undergo an ideological revision: you are defending war criminals and the blod of our beloved ones is still a witness. live with that.

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 1:26 am ET

roscoe
wake up to reality.
ask politely for links, and ill give them to you.

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 1:27 am ET

mooshy January 27th, 2009 120 GMT

roscoe
we dont rely on international hypocricy , i mean community; we rely on ourselves and the free world (not the one of bush). justice will prevail.
by the way , i dont yell, may be you are afraid because you have stolen something and you feel m gonna take it from you soon.
***************************************************************

So Mooshy,

Tell me who in the free world is supporting you-- the ones that you rely on??? Iran? Syria? Hezbollah? Is there anyone else???

Linda   January 27th, 2009 1:28 am ET

Mooshy,
Live with what? I'm not using my degrees for anything you are accusing me of. Why are you accusing me of supporting Israel? Why are you calling me an extremist? Why won't you tell me instead trying to hurl insults? Why don't you tell me anything that I have said that even suggests that I support war criminals? Where are you getting your ideas of me from? I most certainly haven't expressed any of that at not time.

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 1:29 am ET

Linda
i refer to mohamed gharbawi because he zmailed me that he was censored here. this is what we call free press in the western world.

Linda   January 27th, 2009 1:29 am ET

*no time*

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 1:30 am ET

Roscoe January 27th, 2009 121 GMT

mooshy January 27th, 2009 104 GMT

i guess you know about the discussions taking place in international courts like lahaye.

***************************************************************

No—– explain, i can’t find anything on it!

Please!!!!

Linda   January 27th, 2009 1:30 am ET

yes Roscoe,
Ask nicely! hahahahahahahahahhahahahaahhahhaa

Linda   January 27th, 2009 1:32 am ET

Mooshy,
What does that have to do with me? Free press? Mohammed? None of those things have anything to do with me? Why are you accusing me of things? Free press has nothing to do with me. Free press is a myth.

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 1:34 am ET

roscoe
this is the first time you give the right answer; good boy. yes iran , syria, hezbollah.
conduct a survey in the arb world and the statistics will strike you. we all support them. i think you saw the demonstrations and the flags.
som of them are up a,d others like yours and egypt's are burnt.

Linda   January 27th, 2009 1:34 am ET

mooshy,
Why won't you answer my questions above? Where you are getting you information about me? Why do you think I stand for such things?

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 1:35 am ET

mooshy January 27th, 2009 129 GMT

Linda
i refer to mohamed gharbawi because he zmailed me that he was censored here. this is what we call free press in the western world.
***********************************************************

Free press only goes so far-– when it gets to profanity and verbal abuse there's a limit. Mohammed Ghrabagi crossed that line lots of times!

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 1:35 am ET

linda
its time for your medication.

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 1:38 am ET

eoscoe
what about the others from israel who used to insult the prophet mohamed. at least gharbawi insulted common mortals.

Linda   January 27th, 2009 1:40 am ET

Mooshy,
I have already taken it, but thank you for reminding me. What is wrong, you don't have your own thoughts? You can only accuse people of things, with no facts to back it up. The only thing you have to contribute to the blog is to keep saying, "see what Mohammed said". I think you are a kid that is about 16 years old, and your brain has not fully formed, so you just repeat what you hear.

and Roscoe,
yes, they burn flags, ohhhhhhh, we laugh at them burning flags. In Texas, we say, "wrap yourself in it first" We think it is funny when they think that bothers us!

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 1:42 am ET

all this discussion results from one cause.
you occupy our land; w want to be free.

this is the title of this long serial.

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 1:42 am ET

mooshy January 27th, 2009 134 GMT

roscoe
this is the first time you give the right answer; good boy. yes iran , syria, hezbollah.
conduct a survey in the arb world and the statistics will strike you. we all support them. i think you saw the demonstrations and the flags.
som of them are up a,d others like yours and egypt’s are burnt
*******************************************************************

Are there no others?????? Only Iran, Syria and Hezbollah???

But that's only 2 sovereign states and one terrorist organization!

You're going to bet your future and your childrens' future and your grand childrens' future on these guys??

They haven't been able to deliver for you in the past 60 years- why do you think that will change?

Also-- I asked nice!!! And you didn't answer

i guess you know about the discussions taking place in international courts like lahaye.

No—– explain, i can’t find anything on it!

Please!!!!

Linda   January 27th, 2009 1:45 am ET

Roscoe,
I agree with you when you said:

Free press only goes so far—– when it gets to profanity and verbal abuse there’s a limit. Mohammed Ghrabagi crossed that line lots of times!

Some people want to get on here and actually learn something. Have an educated discussion, and maybe find real answers. A lot of people have crossed the line. And it is funny, because when you make an intelligent argument, they either spew propaganda, use foul language, call names, or quote someone else. I guess their employers did not give them a script on how to respond to meaningful discussions.

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 1:45 am ET

Linda January 27th, 2009 140 GMT

and Roscoe,
yes, they burn flags, ohhhhhhh, we laugh at them burning flags. In Texas, we say, “wrap yourself in it first” We think it is funny when they think that bothers us!

**********************************************************

Bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!! Bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!

Linda   January 27th, 2009 1:50 am ET

Roscoe,
Don't bother waiting for explanations from Mooshy. He kept saying that I was one thing or another, but could never explain why he thought that way, nor could he back it up. I think he uses this forum to do his spelling lesson every night before bedtime.

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 1:52 am ET

Linda

Isn't that the truth

I wonder what happened to mooshy???' He must be trying to find something on "the international courts like lahaye."

Do you think maybe he means "The Hague"???

Linda   January 27th, 2009 1:56 am ET

Roscoe,
He doesn't even know what he is talking about, so how can we speculate what he is referring to. I just have to shake my head. Uneducated and uninformed. What a waist of time!

Linda   January 27th, 2009 1:57 am ET

Roscoe,
He is looking for his script!

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 1:58 am ET

mooshy January 27th, 2009 150 GMT

linda
since you are so ill, why dont be afraid from your creator and ask for his pardon to avoid his eternal fire instead of defending war criminals who massacred kids ,women, doctors, journalists for no convincing reason.

close your eyes and imagine those kids yelling in your ears . they dont want to stop; they are tuning you crazy; im a magician and im going to make you mad, linda
linda the killer.

***********************************************************

Mooshy-- are you out of meds???? Is there no one one here tonight to help you keep both oars in the water??

What about "lahaye"? Please, Please??? I've asked nicley 3 times now!

What about "lahaye"?

Linda   January 27th, 2009 2:01 am ET

So Roscoe,
It looks like it is you and I having an intelligent discussion tonight. So what to you think about this entire ME situation?

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 2:03 am ET

roscoe you see hezbollah as a terrorist organization, we see them as heroes. and yes we bet on them. we dont have any problem with that. keep betting on abbas and mubarak.

linda
you used to distract us with your low-level psychology tactics like the chemo thing; it did not work. now we see that you are more aggressive.you know why? BECAUSE YOUR BASTARD STATE IS IN PERIL. this is the existential crisis everybody is talking about.
once again, if you really have four degrees, then your country must be in trouble. i dont have any outstanding degree, and i see that you suffer here.
bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa, bwaaaaaaaaaaaa

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 2:10 am ET

linda
What a waist of time!
******************************************************************
bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

Linda   January 27th, 2009 2:10 am ET

Mooshy,
You just cut and pasted what someone else said to me several days ago. I'm not the one mentioning the chemo, you are. You seem to think that by you mentioning it, it should hurt my feelings. Well, it doesn't, the jokes on you. It keeps me alive, But you wouldn't know about that since you are one of the extremist that want to blow yourself up.
You think you are going to get 72 virgins. I wonder though, if you think if is so great to blow yourself up and kill people, then why haven't you don it yet. Ummm not quiet sure of your convictions?
I'm discussing the issues, but since you buddies aren't here, you have nothing to say. You just want to talk about my health. Well, Thank You for your concern.
Once again, using caps lock does not make you louder.
Why do you see that I suffer? You see nothing. I and now you are using Roscoes bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa because you can't have your own thought.

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 2:13 am ET

Linda January 27th, 2009 201 GMT

So Roscoe,
It looks like it is you and I having an intelligent discussion tonight. So what to you think about this entire ME situation?
******************************************************************

What do I think????

I think that any concflict can be resolved. But in order to do that, the radical elements like Mooshy, Immitation Professor, Mohammed Gharbagi, Solomon and the rest of those types need to minimalized by their own people. Because it's the moderates of the Arab world who will continue to pay the price for the actions of the radical few. The rule of law needs to enforced and then everyone else can sit down at the bargaining table. As long as the radicals are out there causing death and destruction, no else can sit down at the bargaining table!

CNNI is broadcasting an interview between Obama and Al Arabiya right now.

Linda   January 27th, 2009 2:14 am ET

Mooshy,
The only reason why you say I am a waist of time is because you can not keep up with me, or any reason for that matter. It shows how juvenile you really are.

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 2:14 am ET

linda and roscoe
you are pathetic.
bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa bwaaaaaaaaaaaa
see the killers defending themselves
bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

i wa a paramedic
bwaaaaaaaaaaaa bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

Linda   January 27th, 2009 2:17 am ET

Roscoe,
Shucks, I just missed the broadcast of that. Thanks though, I will keep a look out for it.
I agree that the radicals are causing the problem. And until that is dealt with, I don't think anyone will be able to move forward.
Maybe Mooshy needs some chemo to kill some of the hateful cells that he has circulating in his bloodstream!

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 2:17 am ET

linda
i dont need 72 virgins; i need you instead to rape from the back.

Debra   January 27th, 2009 2:19 am ET

Roscoe, Linda......what you say to them, is the truth and the truth hurts.

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 2:19 am ET

mooshy January 27th, 2009 208 GMT

Roscoe
lahaye is in vogue these days; just go to the net and read. dont wait for me to help you.

********************************************

Translation:

Mooshy said "I must have made a mistake because I can't find it. I must have forgotten how to spell it"!

Sick joke you are!

Linda   January 27th, 2009 2:19 am ET

Mooshy,
Like I believe you. You are just trying to be like me. Funny how that you being a paramedic never came up about you until I told you I used to be one. You need to create your own life story, not steal from everyone else.
Now you want to take on my life story. Just like you try to take on everyone else's quotes and ideas. Go to bed, it is past your bedtime. You have school in the morning

Linda   January 27th, 2009 2:20 am ET

Hi Debra,
Nice to see you again!

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 2:22 am ET

linda
we dont say waist of time ; we say waste of time.
this is not a typographic mistake, this is a systematic error. 4 degrees

bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

Linda   January 27th, 2009 2:22 am ET

Mooshy,
You want to rape me from the back? That just shows how really in the dark ages you are. I didn't know that you were a homosexual until now. I had no idea you liked to do it and get it in the back door. Well, maybe you are progressive.

Linda   January 27th, 2009 2:23 am ET

Oh I see Mooshy,
and you have never made a typo. Well now, aren't you educated?

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 2:25 am ET

rascal
occupation is stupid. you are one of its ingredients.

Debra   January 27th, 2009 2:25 am ET

Hi! It sure is getting heated up in here. Thanks, nice to see you, too!

Linda   January 27th, 2009 2:25 am ET

you see Debra and Roscoe,
He has nothing really to say, so he wants to hurl insults. And he thinks we should listen to anything he has to say. Do these type of people really think that they seem intelligent to the rest of us? What a WASTE of space

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 2:27 am ET

Linda January 27th, 2009 217 GMT

Roscoe,
Shucks, I just missed the broadcast of that. Thanks though, I will keep a look out for it.
I agree that the radicals are causing the problem. And until that is dealt with, I don’t think anyone will be able to move forward.
Maybe Mooshy needs some chemo to kill some of the hateful cells that he has circulating in his bloodstream!

***********************************************************

Yea, but the chemo only works on cells that are growing, I don't think there's anything of mooshy that shows any signs of life.

I didn't catch most of the interview. But, when Obama was asked about Gaza and wgat he thought about Hamas-- He said, " I think they are morally bankrupt, I don't believe that the Palestinian people can honestly say that their children are getting a better education because of their leadership. I don't believe the Palestinian people can say that they have better healthcare because of their leadership,..........

Linda   January 27th, 2009 2:27 am ET

Yes Debra,
I came on to have a real discussion. But this is what I ran into. No real substance, just a bunch of insults.

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 2:28 am ET

i made typo; you made an error.
since you have four degrees, can you explain to us, ignorants, what is the difference between a mistake and an error. a question for the intelligent rascal too.

Linda   January 27th, 2009 2:29 am ET

Roscoe,
since you like in another country, can I ask you a question?

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 2:30 am ET

roscoe
obama is with you; be happy
bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 2:33 am ET

linda four degrees
there is never a real discussion between the oppressed and war criminals. this is "mission impossible". call abbas and mubarak and discuss with them. they will make you more optimistic in addition to your anti depression pills.
bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 2:34 am ET

mooshy January 27th, 2009 225 GMT

rascal
occupation is stupid. you are one of its ingredients.
***************************************************

Mooshy Translation--- Gaza is blockaded because there are terrorists running loose with stick, rocks, rifles and rickets from Iran.

The terrorists aren't smart enough to figure out that if they give up the weapons and takea vow of peace they can be free like everyone on the outside!

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 2:36 am ET

Linda January 27th, 2009 233 GMT

Roscoe,
I meant *live* not like
*******************************************************************
bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaa bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

she is now self-conscious.
bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaa bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

Linda   January 27th, 2009 2:44 am ET

Roscoe,
Ok, I wonder about one thing. A lot of people in other countries (I'm not saying you) always look to the US for help. But when the US takes a side, people get up in arms. Like in this situation. People have hated Bush for his stance. But they are looking of Obama to have a different attitude. Why do people want the US to be on their side one minute, and hate them in the same breath? Maybe not in Portugal (or maybe so) but I just wonder.
One reason why I ask this is because they don't like what the US does, but if something happens, they want us on their side. And now they think Obama will do something much different. There is no American President in recent history that has not supported Israel.
So they hate us for that, but then they cry and want the international community to come in and save them. Can you explain? Maybe you hear something different in your country?

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 2:44 am ET

mooshy January 27th, 2009 239 GMT

roscoe
are you talking to me (you know i know you), or are you playing the propaganda stuff. hey, stupid guy, we are only three in this blog right now. there is no one to fool here.
bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

*************************************

I'm still waiting for you figure out what "lahaye" is-- moron!!

Debra   January 27th, 2009 2:47 am ET

Linda, All I hear from these people is the same thing over and over, like a broken record. I am not an educated person, but I do know enough, that what is being said is not accomplishing anything and never will. I believe the people in the Middle East made there own destiny when they cruicified Jesus on the Cross. I know what you are going to say and you are right, about the after life and all. They have their own beliefs and so do we here in America. To each their own!

Linda   January 27th, 2009 2:51 am ET

Debra,
Yes, broken record indeed. And you are educated! Everyone is educated in their own way. We are all different, but we have an opinion based on our own personal history.
I also believe they the people in the ME made their own destiny. I think sometimes, some of these people forget about that.
And the afterlife, well, as we all can see, some people are not worried about an afterlife. They just want to create as much destruction while they are here as humanly possible. What a shame that this is the world we live in.

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 2:53 am ET

linda four degrees
you are a disgrace to the academia. everything you utter is wrong.
who told you we are waiting for anything from obama?
we read signals chemo.
the first signal: he said he is for jerusalem as an eternal jewish state.
the second signal: his pro-israeli staff.
i told you there is nobody to fool here , you and your little dog, rascal.
by the way, we have never relied on the us and we will never do.
we leave you your obama. enjoy the scene.

Linda   January 27th, 2009 2:55 am ET

Mooshy,
I was not talking to you, and once again, you quoted me wrong. I did not say you were waiting on Obama.
Roscoe is in Portugal, it was directed at him. I suggest you stay out of the adult conversation.

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 2:56 am ET

Linda January 27th, 2009 251 GMT

Debra,
Yes, broken record indeed. And you are educated! Everyone is educated in their own way. We are all different, but we have an opinion based on our own personal history.
I also believe they the people in the ME made their own destiny. I think sometimes, some of these people forget about that.
And the afterlife, well, as we all can see, some people are not worried about an afterlife. They just want to create as much destruction while they are here as humanly possible. What a shame that this is the world we live in.
**********************************************************************
is this an autobigraphy?

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 3:01 am ET

linda four degrees
education is a relative term.
karadzech , the serb butcher, was a shrink (a therapist). he had a real degree.
see the irony.
take him as your role model , four degrees.

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 3:03 am ET

Linda:

It's somewhat different here than what you might think. Portugal has been a neutral country in nearly all 20th century conflicts that the US has been involved with. So, people just don't follow the US involvement that closley. We've been too involved with cleaning up the past messes with our own colonialism in Africa to be too concerned or critical about what misques the US has made with respect to international involvement. So, we really don't get too excited one way or the other about US Foreign policy, ecept as it pertains to the EU.Being a small country with virtually no Jewish population, most Portuguese don't follow what is going on in the ME. The biggest interest we have with respect to the US is the state of the economy. It affects us tremendously because we have significant industrial trade tied to the US as well as the rest of the EU. So when the US ecomomy tanks and the EU follows– it kills us.

I, personally don't expect Obama to carry a differnet torch with respect to the Israeli issue

Linda   January 27th, 2009 3:12 am ET

Roscoe,
Thank You for your answer. I often wonder if a lot of the situation with people's attitude towards the US is media hype. Or just someone wanting to have something to complain about.
Yes, the economy is a mess. It has been for years. It just now bit us in the butt. This started around 1997-1998. I most certainly has caused a ripple effect around the world. But this has been a long time coming.
And Africa, boy that is a terrible situation isn't it? I stay up at night worrying about the people in such turmoil there. That is a lot to be on your plate.

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 3:12 am ET

mooshy January 27th, 2009 245 GMT

rascal
your state is a case of terrorism. your father is terrorist; your mother is terrorist; and your dog is terrorist.
bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

*******************************************************

One more time-- without anyone asking you anything-- you manage to jump right in and show your ignorance!

mooshy   January 27th, 2009 3:22 am ET

ill let the floor to zionists to convince each other that they havent stolen anything as usual.
its the occupation stupid
bad night kids' killers and to hell tfooooooooooooooooooooo

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 3:27 am ET

Linda January 27th, 2009 312 GMT

Roscoe,
Thank You for your answer. I often wonder if a lot of the situation with people’s attitude towards the US is media hype. Or just someone wanting to have something to complain about.
Yes, the economy is a mess. It has been for years. It just now bit us in the butt. This started around 1997-1998. I most certainly has caused a ripple effect around the world. But this has been a long time coming.
And Africa, boy that is a terrible situation isn’t it? I stay up at night worrying about the people in such turmoil there. That is a lot to be on your plate.
***************************************************************

Fortunately our involvement now is really minimal. Our colonial empire Angola, Mozambique, Guinea-Bissau, Cape Verde, etc, was quite vast but primarily in the south central parts of the continent-- far away from today's mess in the north, but still had it's problems. Trade relations with most of those countries are currently flourishing.

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 3:34 am ET

Linda January 27th, 2009 318 GMT

bye mooshy,
night night, sleep tight, don’t let the bed bugs bite.
********************************************************

wow, is he really gone?????

On your question-- I think that I can honestly say, from the perception of the Portuguese.

We really don't believe it's prudent to critgue and or critisize another countrys' foreign policies, considering our own historey of colonialism and slave trade!

I beleive that's why we continue to keep such a low profile in these modern times:

Linda   January 27th, 2009 3:37 am ET

Roscoe,
I also take that position. I don't question other countries politics. I see what is broadcasted on the net and news, but when you are really there, it is a different story

Roscoe   January 27th, 2009 3:44 am ET

Linda January 27th, 2009 337 GMT

Roscoe,
I also take that position. I don’t question other countries politics. I see what is broadcasted on the net and news, but when you are really there, it is a different story
******************************************************************

Well got to go- it's nearly 04:00 here! Fortunately I work from home so I have what's called "flex time" !!

a te manhá

Dennis Junior   January 27th, 2009 3:49 am ET

I hope that Mr. Mitchell as the envoy for the Middle East, will finally bring some peace in the Middle East...

Beny   January 27th, 2009 8:16 am ET

NEWSFLASH FROM THE FRONT:

I have absolutely no doubt that when the next round of fighting comes between IDF and the terrorists, everyone will once again spread lies as if Israel broke the cease-fire. Well, here it is:

Today, 27th January, a Hamas bomb was detonated to explode on an IDF borderside patrol. Luckily no one human was hurt (a terrorist caught major burns, but it doesn't count).
Immediately after that, Hamas snipers opened fire on the aforesaid patrol. IDF returned fire. One soldier was wounded and several Hamas terrorists were killed.

So who broke the cease-fire?

dan perman   January 27th, 2009 8:57 am ET

Beny

what else is new, the israel bashers will say that it is Hamas right to atatck israel, but israel is not allowed to defend its citizens.

judyinjerusalem   January 27th, 2009 11:15 am ET

Two things to draw your attention to...

(1) if you want to read a serious analysis of what awaits George Mitchell, take a look at http://www.jcpa.org. Scroll down tothe second article on the page (lots of other good Mid East stuff there too..) and

(2) For a window into the life of a returning Israeli soldier, visit http://jerusalemdiaries.blogspot.com

CS   January 27th, 2009 12:12 pm ET

I have tried to be fair to both sides since my following of it. I just heard on NPR, that Hamas has killed 2 Israeli soldiers. NPR is normally pretty unbiased, and the only media outlet that I've ever known to be honest enough to make retractions, or corrections of it's own misreporting, which is why I like them so much.
Now, unless there's something I don't know about the details of this, Hamas is totally out of control. I am still a supporter of the Palestinian people. The majority of whom want peace, and prosperity. They deserve better than Hamas can give. It is obvious that Hamas is hell bent on death and destruction. I DO think that INITIALLY, Israel gave Hamas a reason to retaliate, and to behave this way; and I DO beleive that Israel broke the first cease fire. But I condemned Israel for it's misdeeds, and I will do the same for Hamas.
If Hamas is allowed to remain in power, Gaza will continue to suffer. I do not wish to see a puppet string govt for Gaza, or Palestine. I do not wish to see a govt in place who is insubordinate to the will of the people, nor do I pray for that govt to be controlled by some other govt from behind the scenes. But If Palestine is to live up to her true potential, Hamas must be VOTED out by the people. Fair elections must be held, and it must be the will of the majority.
I'm so disgusted with them right now. They can't even behave for a couple of weeks. What did they think...that they would win independance by killing 2 Israeli soldiers? So stupid. Now more civilians have to die because they're stupid. They've got no military strategy, they just do stupid stuff to attract attention.

harvey   January 27th, 2009 12:55 pm ET

CS

You and I have not seen eye to eye on this blog many times...but I echo your sentiments with regard to this latest act. by Hamas.

I believe in the two state solutionas you know...I just hope that sense will prevail in the end.

So thank you for calling it the way you see it. I may disagree with you passionately but at least I feel we can have a constructive dialogue.

I am really fed up with the insults that have been hurled at me by others...fine not to agree with me, but calling me a nazi I find particulalry offensive as my grandmother was a sole survivor of our family thanks to Nazism.

So thank you CS and respect.

dan perman   January 27th, 2009 2:00 pm ET

CS
congratulations

however, there is evidence that hamas broke the first ceasefire, if you are interested

CS   January 27th, 2009 2:15 pm ET

Dan perman. Congrats are not necessary. I have accomplished nothing. If I were a participant in the helping of this situation, than I could humbly accept, but this is not the case. I just wish this peace envoy (Mitchell) could jump right in, roll his sleeves up, and get things rolling. If the people of Palestine (civilians) were offerd better living conditions, this would be to Hamas' undoing, as considerably less people would care to join their ranks with a new prospect of better life. People would happily vote against them. This is the way to beat these guys. Not by force.

And I have provided sufficient proof from Haaretz, and CNN's Rick Sanchez intervies, that the cease fire was breached twice (June/November) by the Israeli. But I don't expect many people to admitt that. Most will just try to place all the blame for the history of conflicts on Hamas, and other arabs. This is false. I was honest enough to stand by my principles, no matter WHO did what...the rules should apply to all. Can you do the same? Doubt it.

harvey   January 27th, 2009 2:22 pm ET

Its so sad....when are we all going to give peace a chance????

Kids on both sides Palestinian and Israeli this past week have been able to go to school as normal without hearing sirens...We managed one week.

Enough with the killing.

I suppose the brave professor and his motely crew will be masturbating over this latest act of violence gleefully looking forward to the next terrible round of killing. Of course the Prof and his gang aren't here in Israel or Gaza to witness the despair and the tragic consequences of the senseless murdering they support.

harvey   January 27th, 2009 2:39 pm ET

CS

With regard to George Mitchell I agree. Wish he would get stuck in. I also second your opinion on wanting to improve living conditions for Gazans. However I do think Hamas is not interested in the people it purports to represent. Sadly they are more interested in bloodshed. The losers are the kids on both sides Israelis and Palestinians who managed one week of school without interruption of rockets.

CS   January 27th, 2009 2:41 pm ET

And to those who call me an Israel basher, you are wrong. I am not here to "bash" anyone. The truth needs to be told. Unbiased, so that emotions can hopefully be left aside, and justice can be done.

I support Palestine. The real Palsetine, not the radical (and the minority) Hamas.

You guys support Israel.

Although I support Palestine, I will say what is right ad what is wrong. More of this honesty needs to occur if things are to work in the future. We can't go on saying "Israel can do no wrong, and Palestinians have all the blame, and are all terrorists." This is simply untrue. Israel has fault in the build up to this, and Hamas has fault in the buld up to this.
Although, I will admit that Hamas is the latest instigator. They are foolish to ask for a ceas fire, then attack more. (If it is Hamas) Just as early in the conflict, other groups commenced to bomb and or fire on Israel from different positions, haste to kill all Palestinians because another wishes to instigate, is wrong too.

dan perman   January 27th, 2009 2:44 pm ET

CS, look at the date!!!

From Times Online

June 27, 2008

Gaza rockets threaten ceasefire

As more rockets were fired from Gaza into the Jewish state, both Israeli and Palestinian officials expressed doubt over the likelihood of the truce surviving its intended six-month span. The total number of mortars launched at Israel now numbers seven since the week-long Egyptian accord began.

The truce had seen Hamas pledge to stop cross-border rocket fire and for Israel gradually to ease its embargo on the Gaza Strip, imposed after Hamas militants drove out President Mahmoud Abbas's Fatah in a military coup last summer.

After increasing the amount of humanitarian aide into Gaza by 30 per cent this week, Israel resealed the border crossings when the first mortars violated the truce on Tuesday, causing infrastructure damage and slightly injuring two Israelis.

Solomon   January 27th, 2009 2:44 pm ET

I t was live on TV three days ago Israeli boats were firing at Gaza city days after the ceasefire was announced.

I posted it here on this blog then so people know who broke the cease fire.

harvey   January 27th, 2009 2:45 pm ET

This latest development is very sad. Real losers are the kids on both sides, Palestinians and Israelis who have managed one week without sirens and rockets.

dan perman   January 27th, 2009 2:50 pm ET

They are foolish to ask for a ceas fire, then attack more. (If it is Hamas)

and if it is not hamas?

who rules gaza? the same way NOBODY can fire rockets out of lebanon at israel without hizbullah knowing, approving and controlling, nobody can do anything in gaza without hamas

Rabbi Stern   January 27th, 2009 2:53 pm ET

CS,

A couple of days ago Israeli soldiers killed and a Palestinian farmer and injured a couple more.

harvey   January 27th, 2009 3:06 pm ET

The real losers in all of these acts of violence are the civilians on both sides. The kids in Gaza and the kids in Sderot, Ashquelon (and Israel within range of rockets) managed one week without shelling, sirens and rockets....

We don't need a meaningless cease fire, we need an agreement to live side by side. I echo CS's opinion re making living conditions better for Palestinains (and he and I agree on very little). But I think both of us want a way forward from now and to stop harking back to who is to blame...Come on George Mitchell....

GLeigh   January 27th, 2009 3:10 pm ET

According to my news, the missiles continued. Figured they would. Today a bomb went off killing more. Same old stuff. I'm certain that for some, that's an accomplishment. For me, it's horrible and inhuman. Well, I had hoped for a stronger peace agreement. Since we are all in a world economic crisis, this is not a big focus right now. I have stuff to do. The real losers are those who want to co-exist and raise their families in peace – in both countries. Have a good day all.

harvey   January 27th, 2009 3:12 pm ET

By the way senior EU official Louis Michel stated "Hamas bears an overwhelming responsibility for the destruction of Gaza". He denounced Hamas as a terrorist movement . Reuters quoted him as criticizing Hamas for use of civilians as "human shields". He said that Europe is "tired of paying for same infrastructure only to have it destroyed".

His words not mine. So CS, maybe we need to get the agreements into place before the building starts.

harvey   January 27th, 2009 3:18 pm ET

Guys....

Take care...

Have to check out....and yes G Leigh. I am one of the real losers here as there is nothing more I would like than to raise my kids in peace here in Israel and let the Palestinians do the same....

PEACE!

CS   January 27th, 2009 3:29 pm ET

Since I beleive Dan perman wants to argue, and committ to a go-nowhere stalemate about who started what when, I will continue to try to committ myself to speaking constructively about this thing. He, and others beleive what they beleive, I beleive what I beleive. Neither really matters. Neither of us have control over what already happened, so why bother?

Harvey. I noticed that President Obama went on his first interview as president...to an Arabic language network, to tell Muslim nations, that we are not your enemy, and don not intend to continue the failed posture of the past administration. I like this.
Twice now, he has spoken with conviction to say his plans. The first couple of days, he denounced terror, and basically told terrorists that we will not tolerate them. But he said, "terrorists". He later said he would extend a hand to other nations, if they were willing to unclench their fists.

Then today, I read how he speaks directly to those who are level headed, and want to build, rather than destroy. He wants to mend relationships. This will (if it occurs as both sides need to participate) definately help stop some violence in the region. Hope he stays on top of it. And I hope leaders (civil, level headed leaders, not Hamas)
will take the opportunity.

harvey   January 27th, 2009 4:17 pm ET

CS,

I am getting a little worried. We seem to be agreeing more than we are disagreeing.

I too am hopeful that Obama has the necessary gravitas and credentials to bang our heads (the Israelis) and the Palestinian heads to gether to make peace. I too was impressed with his message of unclench the fist and shake the hand.

I sincerely believe that peace in the middle east is a possibility. Both sides must make painful concessions.....but in answer to those who say impossible we must say "yes we can"!

harvey   January 27th, 2009 4:24 pm ET

Rabbi Isaac Stern?

Are you the Rabbi Stern who organised the dolls for Darfur campaign?????

Akiva Heifetz   January 27th, 2009 6:58 pm ET

Israeli rights group calls for dismissal of chief army rabbi
Rabbi told troops to show Gaza no mercy: report
alarabiya.net/articles/2009/01/26/65029.html

its alveard vertified by israel ti slelf
rabbis in israel are shocked
they feel untertaken
they say the IDF is inviltreted by a foreigen ideooligy!

israel is its own enemy !!!

brenda douglas   January 27th, 2009 8:11 pm ET

whoa, all these educated people and not one a humanbeing...no heart, no compassion, nothing..
no one wants to see their families killed, their homes destroyed, to live in fear...it amazes me how religious zealot are the most dangerous species on the planet...never read a book that said one species was better than another..if so i doubt God actually wrote it.
people will just keep on doing what natural, hating each other and justifying any act of destruction.. i.don't belong to any organized religion..so i don't have to make up excuses for any of my bad behavior..
so back to the unproductive dialogue on who's the most political correct..we have another thousand years at best.

Libra   January 27th, 2009 8:26 pm ET

No country will say they are wrong in their decisions of actions because each country says their decision is politically right for them making politics a dead-end street for peaceful solutions.

The only way to end conflicts is for each country to ask what may be good for the country in which they are having the conflicts with.

Like a baby,
when given a nice warm bath,
will sleep for hours.

That is extremism at its best.

A personal thought.

I.B. Wright   January 27th, 2009 8:49 pm ET

Bill- Go back and read my post again. When I said billions of people may not agree with your position, you and I both know that I was talking about the issue of Israeli occupation. To somehow twist into a sign of supporting terrorsim or violence is beyond rediculous on your part. And why do you ask who came to "my" aid in the last conflict? You are calling me a terrorist because I happen to disagree with you on the issue of Israeli occupation of Palestinian lands (yes- the OCCUPATION) and the murder of thousands of innocent women and children? If that is your definition of terrorism then I guess I'm in good company because whether you like it or not, they make up the majority of the people in the world.

Kovic   January 28th, 2009 2:17 am ET

Hi people....

i was reading your comments about Mr. mitchelle been appointed as ME envoy.... I hope he could bring a ' solid ' peace plan that would benefit all nations in the ME....

M Ariely   January 28th, 2009 5:17 am ET

Part of the west media guided by the principles of:
Freedom of ideas- – Freedom of expression–Human rights– Democracy-Multicultural rights –Life is desired

Has been intensely USED TO MISSLEAD people believing in the above ideas by doctrines guided by the principles of:
Only 1 through–Oppressing people with different ideas–One culture worldwide–Terrorize civilians–Death is desired

The time has come for The West media to STOP BEING USED FOR SPREDING TERRORIST PROPAGANDA
And start publishing demands to

****CHANGE THE DOCTRINE OF WORLDWIDE DOMINATION BY ONE FAITH******

to a

!!!!!!! MULTICULTURAL ACCEPTACE !!!!!

On the long run this will save much life's regardless culture around the glob

Steve Canada   January 28th, 2009 11:02 pm ET

Poor Mr. Mitchell!

He has to sit with Arab leaders that he knows won't budge on practical peace initiatives in Gaza because these so called 'moderate' Arab leaders, even though they know its the right thing to promote peace, are too wimpy to move ahead in case their 'brothers' think they are caving in to the Americans

Of course this is BS

At this jucture leaders in the Arab world are still collaborating in creating continuous conflict in Gaza so that they can 'smokescreen' their own wrongdoing

Hopefully Obama can achieve a shift in these 'moderates'

Filipe   January 30th, 2009 12:52 am ET

Linda-- If you see this post

Eu tua amigo na Portugal***** the other guy had to leave for some reason, I don't why. Maybe because he spoke badly to Mooshy or the Immitation Professor. Just say how or where to connect with you!

Ate manahá

Batooln Bonfiglioi   July 26th, 2012 10:27 am ET

Hi there, I just wanted to mention, you're wrong. Your article doesn't make any sense.


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