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French President Says France Is at War; Governors: No Syrian Refugees in My State; CIA Chief Warns More ISIS Attacks in the Pipeline. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired November 16, 2015 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[13:30:00] FRANCOIS HOLLANDE, FRENCH PRESIDENT: We will eradicate terror because the French people want to live together without fearing anything from their neighbors. We will eradicate terrorism, because we are attached to freedom and the influence of France around the world. We will eradicate terrorism so that the movements of people and the enrichment of cultures, one of another, can continue. We will eradicate terror so that France can continue to show the path. Terrorism will not destroy France because France will destroy it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Our chief international correspondent, Christiane Amanpour, is joining us live from Paris.

Christiane, it looks like President Hollande is saying what so many people believe now, that what happened in Paris is a game-changer, a turning point in the war. The geostrategic initiative and the landscape has clearly changed, right?

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know, that is what people hope, I think, and particularly the people who come out here now night after night where we are here at the site of two of the restaurant massacres. Just behind me are two of the restaurants that were attacked on Friday night, and dozens of people were killed. There was a drive-by shooting at a one of the restaurant, and was a terrorist who blew himself up. And this is a truly horrific series of days that the French people have gone through. And from the very beginning, the French president, echoed by his prime minister, his minister of interior, and all of the major ministers, have said that this country is at war, because war has been declared against it. You heard the fighting words that we will eradicate it. And we have heard it for three days. And people expect that to actually happen.

But we have also heard to today that President Obama in his press conference at the G20 in Antalya said essentially that nothing will change, the strategy is working, and they may redouble the air strikes or redouble the effort, but that fundamentally he believes that, in the terrain, ISIS is being contained, although, many strategists believe it is not because of the reach overseas over and over again in the last week culminating in what happened here Friday night. And that he said that the strategy is working, and many don't believe it is working because this is still going on. So it is going to be very important to see in the next few days how this resolve that the French president has verbally translates on the ground against these terrorists -- Wolf?

BLITZER: He says, President Hollande, that he is going to extend the state of emergency for France for three months. Practically speaking, what does that mean?

AMANPOUR: Well, practically, there will many more security officials, police, special police, paramilitaries, and elements of the military on the street. There are already over 1,000 military personnel deployed around the country, around the country. The raids that we saw last night, or rather in the early hours of the morning, 150 or so, in 19 departments as they call them all over the country. In other words, across much of the country. The 23 arrests that they made, and the 104 house arrests, and the weapons, including 19 heavy weapons, among which was a rocket launcher in somebody's house, and these types of things. They need to have the powers to be able to conduct, they say. They also say -- a Senator told us last night that the French people deserve a safe and happy Christmas.

And remember, I have been talking to the strategists for much of the day and including the U.S. military strategists, and one of the CNN military analysts, basically put this in perspective. In terms of strategy, in terms of the ability to conduct these assaults, the distance between "Charlie Hebdo" in January of this year, and Paris this last Friday, is strategically non-existent. There is no distance. They are so close together in terms of the planning an operations. That means thse people are capable, and they can plan the operations, and they can carry them out. This is incredibly dangerous, and difficult. And many of the law enforcement and intelligent forces are saying that because of how much communication they make, some encrypted and some secret, and some even, in the past, looking at the game, you know, game station or whatever they are called, Playstation communications. So in other words, so much communication that is not available and not immediately obvious to intelligence who are used to being able to gather intelligence, voice and all the rest. So it is a very major change in the direction for these terrorists -- Wolf?

[13:35:06] BLITZER: It certainly is.

Thanks very much, Christiane Amanpour, on the streets of Paris for us.

Many in Europe and here in the United States, they are deeply worried right now that migrants from Syria could pose a threat. The White House has tried to downplay that concern. We heard that from President Obama today, but fears clearly persist. And in the United States, some governors are now putting their foot down, demanding they not allow refugees in their states. We will talk about that when we come back.

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[13:39:54] BLITZER: Paris investigators are now looking into the possibility that one of the attackers came into Europe as part of the refugee wave coming out of Syria. That news has lead to a quick reaction by some governors in the United States to block the states from taking in more refugees. Ohio and Mississippi just became the ninth and tenth state to make that announcement.

Our Martin Savidge is joining us now.

Martin, how many states are we talking about? It is clearly escalating, thus desire to avoid allowing more Syrian the refugees into the United States.

MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, it's escalating as the day goes on. It started off with three and now at 10. I know the states where we are at so far, and the governors said no more refugees, Texas, Louisiana, Alabama, Arkansas, Indiana, Michigan, Illinois and Massachusetts. On the fence is said to be Iowa. The governor is asking for more transparency. And the governor of North Carolina has set up a press conference later today to talk about the very subject, and he may go on the list as well.

The number of Syrian refugees in the country so far, at least according to the Department of Health and Human Services that tracks the refugees, says that, in 2014, they were roughly 132 Syrians, but the numbers have gone up some in 2015. But it's the president of the United States that has committed to accepting 100,000 Syrian refugees. Keep in mind there are roughly four million that are said to have fled the fighting in Syria. So it is that number that is clearly alarming to many of the governors in light of what they have seen going on in Paris this past weekend. And it should be noted that all of the governors in the states are Republicans -- Wolf?

BLITZER: Good point.

Thanks very much, Martin.

And I want to bring in two specialists to help us to appreciate what is going on, and joining us from London, the former United States ambassador to NATO, Nicholas Burns; and in Washington, our chief political analyst, Gloria Borger.

Gloria, the president says it is un-American to turn away the refugee, and America has welcomed the refugees and immigrants into the United States. Ben Carson, one of the presidential frontrunners, is weighing in, saying this is not a time to allow the Syrian refugees in because ISIS could be infiltrating the waves. Where do we go from here?

GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: It has become a political issue that clearly divides the Republicans and the Democrats. Saturday night, at the debate, the Democrats did not say anything about slowing down the refugees from Syria. And Dr. Carson wants to block funds for programs that allow for Syrian refugees. You have, as Martin was saying, these 10 Republican governors, and the list is going to grow. There are some presidential candidates who want to only allow in Christian refugees, which is something that the president also made reference to today. So this is a bone of contention in a presidential campaign in which immigration is already a very big issue -- Wolf? BLITZER: Nick Burns, you were once the undersecretary for political

affairs. Can the governors do this? Let's say the president of the United States says we will accept 20,000 refugees in the next few months, can the governors say, you won't send them to Ohio or some of the other states?

NICHOLAS BURNS, FORMER UNITED STATES AMBASSADOR TO NATO: Well, this is an issue for the president and the speaker of the House to work out. Congress controls the purse strings. The administration proposes refugee number.

By the way, I think what the administration's position is, is that the U.S. should take 10,000 and not 100,000 Syria refugees--

(CROSSTALK)

BLITZER: 10,000 by the end of this year.

BURNS: And 100,000 refugees from all over the world, just to correct that number. But we have a long tradition of Republican presidents, as well as Democratic presidents standing up to take the refugees. And as Secretary Hillary Clinton said the other night in the Democratic debate, of course, job number one has to be security. You have to vet the people. It does take time. You have to establish who they are. You have to put their name through criminal databases and international security bases. We have to do all of that. But this nation, our nation has never shut its doors in the last 70 years, since the close of the World War II, and we should not begin now when you have 12 million Syrian homeless, when the Europeans are doing so much more than the United States.

BLITZER: Gloria, the president spoke out at the news conference in Turkey at the end of the G-20 summit, and I want to play a clip and hear your reaction to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: We have always understood that it is a long-term campaign. There are going to be setbacks, and there will be successes. The terrible events in Paris were obviously a terrible and sickening setback.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: And now, the critics say it is a lot more than a setback. They are pounding on him right now that his strategy has not worked.

BORGER: Right. And what the president spoke about was an intensification of his strategy, and not a rethinking of his strategy. I think that this needed to be in some ways, Wolf, a larger moment than it was. If you are in Paris, this is your 9/11, and this is not a setback. And when you are president of the United States, he spent a lot of time today talking about his political opponents, and talking about how the strategy needed time to work, and talking about the intensification, and not talking a lot about resolve or American leadership, which is what I think that people wanted to hear. He talks about leading a coalition often, with France, with Arab allies, and that is what I wanted to hear more from him about today.

[13:45:] BLITZER: Nick Burns, this is clearly a turning point what happened in Paris the other night, and I assume that you agree, right?

BURNS: I very much agree with that. The U.S. has had a policy in place to essentially contain the Islamic State. It is not going to work. And we have to transition to a defeat strategy. That does not mean American combat troops on the ground. But what it does mean, Wolf, is I think Gloria is exactly right, the world is looking for the United States to lead a huge coalition. And we need to do that. We have that opportunity. The president, to his -- in his defense, needs some help. In Britain, today, I was reminded by a British friend that the British government is not conducting air strikes in Syria because the parliament has not given permission. You know, Wolf, some of the Arab states on the front line, Saudi Arabia, United Arab Emirates and Kuwait, no longer on the front lines with us against the Islamic State. Turkey, where the president is now, they are the most complicated of all. They have been bombing the one group that is fighting the Islamic State, the Syrian Kurds. So the president needs help from the allies, but he needs to lead in a more assertive way. He is obviously capable of doing that. And that is where the focus of the United States should be right now.

BLITZER: And I spoke recently with Philip Hammond, the British foreign secretary, and asked him why the British is not involved. He said politics basically. They don't have political authorization to do so.

Nick Burns, thanks very much.

Gloria, thanks to you, as well.

As France steps up its campaign against ISIS, we're ask the question, are the air strikes actually working and can the coalition change the dynamics in the war against the terrorists to prevent another tragedy like we witnessed Friday night in Paris? We'll talk about that, get new information when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:51:37] BLITZER: The Paris attacks coupled with a new video from ISIS threatening an attack on Washington, D.C., raises the question of what's next for the terror group. Listen to what the CIA director, John Brennan, said today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN BRENNAN, CIA DIRECTOR: It is clear to me that ISIL has an external agenda, that they are determined to carry out these types of attacks. This is not something that was done in a matter of days. This was something that was deliberately and carefully planned over the course of several months in terms of making sure that they had the operatives, the weapons, the explosives with the suicide belts. And so I would anticipate that this is not the only operation that ISIL had has in the pipeline.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Let's bring in CNN military analyst, retired Lieutenant Colonel Rick Francona; and CNN terror analyst, Paul Cruickshank, joining us from Paris.

Colonel, what's your reaction to that warning from the CIA director?

LT. COL. RICK FRANCONA, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: I think we need to take this to heart. Several months ago we were talking about ISIS and their capabilities and the possibility that we might see these kinds of operations. In the intelligence business, we deal with intentions and capabilities. If you're a traditional state actor, you know the capabilities and you can't discern the intentions. Here, it's different. We know what ISIS wants to do. What we have to figure out is what are their capabilities. And I think the director was right. I think we were surprised by how effective they have been over the last few weeks.

BLITZER: When he says, Paul, that this is not the only ISIS operation in the pipeline right now, ISIS releases this video saying Washington, D.C., is next. How likely is that? Do they have that capability?

PAUL CRUICKSHANK, CNN TERROR ANALYST: Well, if they have these operational masterminds, ring leaders who are capable of putting together operations of recruiting Western recruits, providing them training, and sending them back to the West to launch strikes, they are gaining that ability quickly, just like al Qaeda gained that capability with Khalid Sheikh Mohammad and Rashid Ralf (ph) in Pakistan. They were sending operatives back to launch attacks. In this case, it appears the ring leader was Abdel Ahmed Abuhud (ph), a Belgium national who has risen into a senior position in ISIS, apparently has been the ear of Abu Bakr al Baghdadi, and someone who is able to corral and recruit these Belgium and French fighters to come back and launch attacks. The intelligence suggests that he is plotting a string of terrorist attacks against Europe, particularly against France. This is in a way just the beginning. He is also responsible for that plot back in January. We talked about a lot, Wolf, that major plot in Belgium where they were beginning to go after targets, they had TATPs, weapons, but they were arrested in a commando raid by the Belgium security services. Abdel Ahmed Abuhud (ph) was communicating with them from Greece. The Belgiums brought in the CIA to try to locate him. But he escaped the dragnet. He was thought to be back in Syria. So it's figures like this that are giving ISIS a new capability to get into international terrorism -- Wolf?

BLITZER: Colonel, can this war really be won against ISIS without thousands of U.S. and other coalition ground troops there battling in addition to air power?

[13:55:11] FRANCONA: I think it's going to have to be, because obviously the president is not of a mind to put American boots on the ground in significant numbers in either Iraq or Syria. But there is a possibility that we could leverage the indigenous troops. I'm talking about the Kurds. Although we'll have to work that out with the Turks. But if you look at how the air campaign has been going since we began over a year ago, the air has been effective only when it's been in conjunction with an effective ground force. Kobani and Sinjar, two perfect examples of how we use American air power and local troops. That's how we're going to have to do this. The problem is, inside Syria, we're going to have to rely on the Syrian Kurds for that. That's where our advisers come in. So --

(CROSSTALK)

BLITZER: Yeah. I was going to say, hold your thought, because we're out of time, unfortunately.

But we'll continue the breaking news coverage right here on CNN.

The news continues next, right after a quick break.

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